Advice please....... (be warned its a long story)

Thanks again for the good advice, Its good to see this from other peoples objectives.

I am trying really hard to be level headed throughout this whole situation but its very difficult cos each time it looks like i am gonna see the light so to speak it actually ends up comming to another impass.

Am taking my Dad`s advice at the mo which is to just let them get the car actually fixed and then we can work out who is responsible etc at that point. The only problem with that is just how long will it take them to sort it??

Still fingers crossed
 
Sorry - I disagree with your Dad. I think you should get in there now and initiate discussions with them. Senior management needs to know what's going on. Leave it until the car's been fixed and it will be too late.
Felon
 
Much sympathy for you also Bob.

Personally, I think it is a massive coincidence that your car returns from having some major work done (I would certainly call 'gearbox out' major work) only for a totally unrelated fault to be present. This HAS to be related to the work done, but there still remains a remote chance that it IS coincidence.

It is probable that the MVT carrying out the work has damaged a sensor, trapped a cable/wire, not reconnected a plug etc etc etc, who knows? I have heard of lesser quality marques frying the ECU due to the main engine earth not being reconnected properly causing the engine to find another earth through the ECU! I'm not saying this IS the problem, it could be anything but highlights how these things happen.

I think the garage taking the 'swapping parts till problem solved' approach just highlights the lack of their expertise at your expense.
This approach can be tolerated to a certain extent if you are happy with the standard of workmanship and professionalism in respect of how they treat you and your car.
I certainly tolerate this approach if a garage :-

1. Handles me with kid gloves, like I am their most valued customer
2. Keeps the costs competitive
3. Are open and honest about their level of expertise
4. Take great care over my car whilst in their 'custody'.
5. Go to great efforts to resolve any resultant problems

However, there is a limit to the tolerance that a customer such as yourself can reasonably be expected to be put to. Personally I would have been 'creating' about seven weeks ago!
I took my S3 to JBS and watched the MVT change my clutch, TIP, adjustable rear tie bars in just over 4 hours! Including a laser alignment! I drove home a happy customer with no resultant faults whatsoever.

You probably still want to maintain a relationship with the garage after this saga is finally put to bed but I would be pushing for a negotiated settlement that YOU are happy with, not the garage. You are NOT the person at fault here in any way so 'customer satisfaction' is the watchword, don't take the usual easy and well trodden British route of bending over and being shafted without so much as a whimper.

I would suggest that some of the parts replaced did not need replacing and once the new ECU is installed I would be asking for the old parts to be replaced (with you supervising) to keep the cost down and prove that they were not the cause of the fault...

As suggested, a cool, confident, business like and documented approach to this will certainly have the best chance of resolving the situation in a way that may sweeten the whole sorry tale...
 
I agree with both Felon and Stewart and think that i have been patient enough with this whole fiasco. I will now start looking into taking the matter higher in the company as suggested by Felon and explaining the situation in full to whoever this might be.

Stewart : i think the point you made about the MVT making a small mistake somewhere whilst the work on the clutch etc was being carried out is most likely the case although as you quite rightly say it also might be coincidence.

I am also under the policy that i am the customer and that i have already paid them a large amount of monies. So it should be that they are trying to make me happy not stressed out to the point where i want to just shout at them.

Plus as pointed out i am not at fault here, i took my car to a VAG specialist to get work done that should be reasonably easy with the correct tools and knowledge (the bits i lack). Yet during the process something has gone wrong the garage must have some sort of insurance policy that if say they did accidently damage a car they are working on it will cover the costs.

Time to get business like then and start writing some letters etc...
 
Their trader policy should cover them against this kind of situation.

Try and keep your cool when dealing with them, keep as much evidence as you can.

The best way with letters is to make sure that they are recorded so that there is proof that they have received them, of course though, a problem at the moment with the postal strike.

A fax should be sufficient though as long as you keep the confirmation print out. The best type is those that print a shrunk version of the 1st page of the fax with the confirmation details.

I would try and discuss it first of all with the MD, but take all the salent facts with you on a piece of paper, you could even take a copy for him to refer to whilst you discuss it.

It might be worth seeing if you can get any kind of advice from your local Audi dealer, if you ask nicely you might even get to talk to a tech about the problem (he may for example know that an earth issue on an S3 will blow the ECU). Might even be worth seeing if your breakdown service (if you have one) has a technical advice line that you can discuss the issue with to arm yourself with knowledge.

Try and resolve it face to face with the MD and make sure you either record the meeting (with their permission) or make notes as you discuss.

Document every thing you can, he (or she) will see that you are serious and it will be better to have as much info as possible if you need to take it further (i.e. Solicitor). If it goes further it would be worth checking to see if the legal expenses would be covered by your home or motor insurance.

Hope it all gets resolved to your satisfaction.

Paul
 
Holy ****!!

ABTech have just contacted me to tell me that the new ECU has not fixed the problem with my car and basically they now give up!! They cannot fix the car or put it back in its original state as whaen i dropped it off to them with its slipping clutch.

What do i do???
My parents are suggesting that i now get legal help as i should not accept the car back in its non working state but should now claim to either get the car repaired elsewhere or to replace it (which is very unlikely as they will not just write me a cheque for £10,000 to get a replacement S3).

I am also being told that i should buy a temporary car so that i can return the courtesy car they have given me (only for the last week or so) so that i can leave my car at ABTech as i will not accept it back in its faulty state.

I am really stuck now i don't know what to do or where to go, My Dad is going to try to get me an appointment 2moro with a solicitor friend of his to discuss the situation.

Any other advice would really be appreciated as this is it now they can't fix the car and i don't want it back unless it is fixed!! Plus of course as a have already paid out £1700 i don't wanna pay anything else to get this sorted. Infact with the whole almost 11 weeks of this heel i think i should be getting compensation or something.
 
Is this some kind of joke, they can't fix it and want to give it you back in it's normal state!?
That's the kind of reply you get from muppets, and they call themselves specialists?
How's the costs going to be resolved now? are they saying they are going to waste time and reverse all the work they have done, give you a full refund and be done with you, whilst your car is dead, when it was fully up and running when you gave it to them??!?
Obviously not for me to judge, but they have had your car for the best part of 11 weeks, something is definitely not right here, hope it all goes well with your solicitor appointment, as I can see this episode being dragged on for quite a long time....

Goodluck with it all.
 
I don't think you have any choice. IMO, I would NOT accept the car back until it is fixed, do NOT under any circumstances accept any kind of culpability on your part. You're in a particularly awkward and inconvenient situation so you might as well go the whole way and insist on nothing but complete satisfaction.
The garage is going to have to swallow a pill, how big that pill is only time will tell. Stick it out and they will pay out in the end.

Good luck.
 
The bottom line is that they are saying there is nothing else they can do to fix the problem with my car they sort of know whats wrong but not how to rectify it!!

Now i am in complete agreement with you Stewart and i will not accept my car back unless it is either fixed of this new problem (at the garages expense) or put back as it was originally when i gave it to them with a slipping clutch and i get my £1700 back.

It does look like i am now in for the long haul on this one and its not gonna be resolved for a while which is why i might have to get a cheapish car in the meantime to get to work etc...

Gonna have to take it to the next level and go for legal advice as i dont know what else to do i am just gobsmacked that this routine maintenance has managed to get to escalate into this!
 
vrbob said:
Now i am in complete agreement with you Stewart and i will not accept my car back unless it is either fixed of this new problem (at the garages expense) or put back as it was originally when i gave it to them with a slipping clutch and i get my £1700 back.
Click to expand...

No, do not accept it back even if they return it back to how it was before they started the work, because that's the whole point, by their own admission they CANNOT return it back to the state it was prior...

They have no alternative but to fix it at their expense, if it means sending it to a proper specialist then that's what has to happen.
 
my mate with a TT went to a garage and had his cambelt done but the engine light kept coming on after 50 or so miles so he kept on sending it back and eventually spoke to the head honcho and they had to send it to Audi for it to be sorted which they agreed and the garage paid the bill for them to fix.
the car going in working and coming out being pushed is a big no no.
hope this mare ends for you mate
 
Stewart i understand exactly, i want the car back fixed. There is no way that ABTech could put my car back in its original state now as most of the bits they took out would be long gone. The only option for ABTech is to fix my car but they say they are unable to do this.

Got some legal advice today and its not good news, Looks as if you need physical proof by an independant source to confirm what was wrong with the car and to link it to the work ABTech have done. From this i went to my local AUDI dealer to see if i could get any advice out of them. They told me that i could book the car in with them to get it checked out and they would charge £450 for a 4 hour diagnosis session.

Gonna go back to Abtech this afternoon to see what they actually propose to do now. Hopefully i can go down the Head Honcho route and get them to take it to AUDI and get it sorted from there.
 
Ok here is the update :

The **** has really hit the fan now, Went back to ABTech to basically say i was not accepting the car and that they should take it to AUDI to get it sorted and then we can settle the outcome once the car is sorted. They point blank refused to do this, They told me n my Dad face to face that they cannot fix my car and the only thing i can do is take it to AUDI my self and get it fixed at my own expense. If AUDI can fix the car and say that the fault was caused by the work ABTech has done they will cover the costs.
I told them once again that the car was perfect except for the slipping clutch when i brought it to them originally to which Rory replied we don't know that because we (as in ABTech) did not test the car at all before fitting the clutch etc... All they did was drive it into their workshop and pull it apart, so it could of had that fault already!!

I asked if could have the name of the owner of the garage and it turns out that ABTech is owned by the 2 guys who i have dealt with from day 1 Rory and Mike so there is no-one higher i can write/talk to.

So i reluctantly handed back the polo they had lent me and tried to drive off in my car to find first off that the car had no petrol at all in it the DIS said 0 miles they told me they had put at least a gallon in it but i am hard pushed to believe this. So drove straight to a petrol station so at least i could limp home.

The car is awful to drive, the revs are up n down like a yoyo and the ESP light is off as normal to start with and you can turn it on off via the button but after about 5 mins of driving it comes on all the time and the button will not switch it off.

Once home of course i wanted to have a look under the bonnet to see if it looked ok. First thing i spot is that the rubber trim that sits above the headlights is now missing on one side of the car and that the battery cover was not even fitted correctly (if this is their standard of work i would hate to see what else might be wrong). The last annoyance that ABTech have left me with is the fact that when they arranged for the new ECU to be fitted they neglected to ask me for my spare key to get that reprogrammed so now my spare key does not start the car!! so i have had to ask AUDI to sort that when it goes to them on tuesday for its 4 hour £450 diagnostic.

Anyway thats as far as i have got. I know you all said that i should not accept the car back unless its fixed but i was unable to get them to do this and i need a car so i can't just leave it there forever. So will have to bite the bullet pay AUDI to get the car sorted out of my own pocket and then try to sue ABTech for the money. Its gonna be crap but as far as i can tell i have no other choice.
 
that is un-acceptable.. i am very old school when it comes to this sort of thing, but that really would'nt resolve anything... i hope audi can get this sorted and the two guys who own the garage realise there woes and cover any cost incured by there poor workmanship... i cetainly wont be using them thats for sure.
 
Funnily enough if i ever get my car back to working again i won't be using them again ever either!! i now wouldn't trust them to adjust the rearview mirror in my car let alone anything mechanical!!
Maybe other people have had an alright experience from ABTech but in my honest opinion if you even slightly like your car never take it to them for anything.

Just to confirm this even more my Dad (who at this moment in time has his head under the bonnet of my car) has just spotted that the little orange clip that hold the dipstick in place has been snapped in 2 peices so the dipstick is now just wobbling about. How the ****** hell could they break that?? this just gets worse and worse, i will have to start a list of other things that ABTech have screwed up on my car now so that when i go back with the bill from AUDI i can tell them all the other things that they have broken or not put back together correctly.
 
List of crap ABTech has done that i have found so far:

1. No petrol in car at all when i was forced to take it back.

2. The rubber trim over the headlight under the bonnet is missing on one side.

3. The spare key does now not work as they neglected to get it reprogrammed when fitting the ECU.

4. The clip that hold the oil dipstick in place is now snapped.

5. The actual Dipstick tube is cracked at the bottom.

6. The sump guard under my car is now missing completly (i think a bit was already missing but now there is nothing).

As and when i find anything else i will add to this list. The problem i am going to have is proving that any of this stuff was either on the car or not broken before giving it to ABTech.
 
Decided today to have a look at securing the dipstick so that it doesn't wobble all over the place as the clip is now snapped see pic :

[URL="http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa285/vrbob/My%20S3/Damage%20caused%20by%20ABTech/damage3.jpg"][/URL]


Whilst this was being looked at i noticed that the dipstick is also now cracked at the bottom of the tube too!! so gonna have to get the whole part replaced whilst at Audi on Tuesday.

Here is a pic :

[URL="http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa285/vrbob/My%20S3/Damage%20caused%20by%20ABTech/damage4small.jpg"][/URL]

Just more expense caused by ABTech this is gonna get ugly.
 
Todays update :

Dropped car of at Southampton Audi, explained my whole story to the nice service manager and he is going to spend 2 hours 2moro in diagnosis and then contact us to let me know how they got on and if they need more diagnosis time.

fingers crossed Audi can sort the problem plus fix the crap ABTech have broken.
 
I just hate reading this thread, really feel for you.
I'm now completely losing faith in ABtech and am wondering whether they also caused the recent issue with my TDi. They replaced the turbo a few months ago and all was well, then a few weeks afterwards the car became undriveable, no power, firing on about 2 cylinders, ESP light permanently on, limped it into my local VW garage and they fixed it saying it was loose and broken wires going to the injectors (apparently they weren't secured either).
I think I'll be using JKM in Portsmouth from now on, very impressed with their service fitting the Milltek to my 2.8Q, a bit further away but easier to get to.
Really sorry I ever recommended ABtech. Can't say I envy you having to deal with Soton Audi, parts dept are excellent but I'd never let them near either one of our cars. But they are apparently a lot better now since they changed hands.
 
I think the situation that has happened to me is a bad series of events but they way ABTech has dealt with the problem since taking my money has been rubbish.

After visiting their website and their premises they seemed very proffesional and they seemed knowledgeable but experience has proved otherwise. No-one could of predicted it would end up like this so i just have to ride it out till the conclusion and hope it turns out ok.

Audi should be diagnosing the car right now so maybe i will have some answers later today. I have no experience of them as a garage but my car had to goto them so i can try to get the costs back from ABTech.
 
I've bought 3 Audis from Southampton Audi in the last 3 years and rate them very highly - their service department particularly. No they're not cheap, but if anyone can, they should be able to work out what's going on with your car.

Good luck!!!
 
Spoke to Audi earlier and they have done their first 2 hour diagnosis and as yet have come to the same conclusion. It says it has a MAF error, they have tried a new MAF (number 5 now i think) and once again still got the problem. Thay want to carry on diagnosing and now looking for physical leaks etc.. so i have agreed to let them carry on. So 2moro is a new day and maybe we will get to the bottom of this craphole.
 
auroan said:
As anyone tested the actually cable linking the MAF to the ECU ?
Click to expand...

Not sure to be exact but Audi should be on the case as i post this. What i will do is when they contact me later today i will ask how they are getting on and then suggest that to them.
 
That is awful. Feel really sorry for you. I had a similar problem with a corrado I had. I took it to a well know 'specialist' garage in Fife. Told me he would have it going in a couple of hours. 3 weeks later and nearly £500 bill it was supposedly fixed. Following week I got same fault again. Had it towed back to garage who wouldn't even look at it. I had to take it to volkswagen. They had it for an hour and a half, which cost me £150.
I asked them what was wrong and it was exactly the same thing the said 'specialist' he had fixed.
I went back to him to see what he had to say. No money back or even an apology. These guys are fine for bolting things on. But when it comes to faults I think the stealers take some beating. And i hate to admit that.

Best of luck
 
just spoke to Audi and they have been looking at the car since 3pm and are currently doing air leak checks. I suggested the probablility of an issue with the connection between the MAF and the ECU (as suggested by auroan) and he said they would check that infact it was on the technicians list of things to do.

They may not be able to look at the car 2moro as they are busy but he said they have another 2 hours booked for me on friday so they should be able to tell me more before the weekend.
 
vrbob.. I just read your thread, its terrible what has happened to you and your car!

My A3 still has problems after having the lambda sensor changed twice, throttle body potched about then changed, radiator changed, and ECU changed... its still idling and leaking coolant.

I've been to so many garages, I can't be bothered anymore. The money that is spent on my car is scandulous! I understand what you're going through, even though our circumstances are slightly different, the stress is immense. I feel for you mate.

Anyway, good luck on Friday! Be strong!
 
It does suck balls big time!!

But am in for the long haul now n just wanna see the car fixed, although there will have to be a point where if it gets too expensive i will have to pull the plug and write it off somehow.

Gotta hope Audi can fix it and give me the proof to point the finger at ABTech.
 
Update :

Spoke to Audi and they have been working on the car and its air leak issue. They have diagnosed that the fault is not form the air box side of the MAF but the other side. According to the computer the car is geting 5.5% air intake rather than the 3.5% it should get. They have replaced the DV valve and got it down to 4.5%. They have also clamped another valve on the back of the crank case (near the gearbox) which got it down to 4% so they will replace this valve 2moro and fingers crossed it will get it to 3.5%. So will have to just hope n pray.
 
hmmm i know how you feel!! i.m at the top of a very slippery slope myself, i've got random warning lights coming on my a4 2.5 tdi, air bag light won't go off, engine slightly surging (third injector fault?) abs, esp, glow plug, brake lights sticking on, passenger side brakelight saying blown when it is'nt.............it's tricky knowing where to start, like yourself i'm **** scared of main dealer prices
 
Once the airbag is lit it won't go off until its reset via VAGCOM.
Brakelight saying blown when it isn't is quite a common issue, seems to be the type of bulbs. Mine goes on & off intermittantly.
 
Update :

Audi are still working hard on my car (at £100 an hour i would hope so too). they have replaced the crank seal valve thingy and its still getting too much air, The car should get 2% -3%max and mine is still 4.7%ish. i spoke to the technician working on my car directly and gave him the short sweet version of the whole fiasco so he has as much background as possible. He has checked the timing and that all seems good so he is now gonna check the valve timing next. He sounded quite confident that he would be able to solve it but its just a matter of time (n money). he also understands that i am looking at why this happened so that i can go back to ABTech and get them to pay for this work if they are at fault.

Still sucks not having my S3 to drive though!
 
Thanks for the update.

Keep us posted and I hope that it you get your money back.

Paul
 
It's been a fair few hours now, and @£100 an hour, I hope it's not yourself who will be footing the bill in the endBob, goodluck anyhow.
 
Just got off the phone with Audi, They think they have located the problem which they think is now turbo related. This is a bit concerning as ABTech should not of been touching the turbo but i will have to wait n see what the final diagnosis is. So far Audi have spent 8 hours labour on the car and they think it will be 2-3hours more 2moro so thats at least £1100 :scared2:
will have to pay Audi out of my own pocket and then go from there. Will just be happy to have the car sorted first off then can worry about how much i have forked out in the past few months!
 
The story goes on!!

Audi have taken apart the turbo system of my car and benchtested it today and it all comes back within the correct limits they should be so its not that. Anyway Southampton Audi now seem to be at the point where they do not know what to look at now so they have contacted Audi HQ (not sure where that is) to see if they can tell them what else might be causing this problem. So won't hear anything aelse till Monday now, Bit worrying though that Audi have spent a good 10 hours on my car and are no closer to finding the problem.
 
What a nightmare you are having! Cant believe AUDI are struggling to locate the problem. Keep us updated and good luck!
 
Update :

This sucks, Audi have just contacted me, They have spoken to Audi HQ and they had no other suggestions to give that Southampton Audi have not already tried. At the moment the have spent aprox 16hours on the car but they have agreed to only charge me for 8 hours labour so far, parts will be ontop of that. So i would guess my bill is in the £1100 region so far.

The only suggestion Audi can now give me on how they can fix the car is by taking it apart piece by piece and testing each n every wire etc.. They estimate this will be 10-20 (or more) hours worth of work which would equate to £2000 plus. This is now getting to the point where i will be spending almost £5000 to fix a car worth at best £9000.

I do not know what to do now as originally i did not mind too much about the costs as i was 99% sure the fault was caused when the clutch etc was done but if i cannot prove this i will have to foot the bill, and i do not have that kind of money to spend. I can't claim on insurance as that only covers accidents etc..

I need advice if possible as i am now so ****** off n depressed about this whole thing its actually affecting my state of mind n health. If i tried to sell the car with this fault any ideas how much i might get or if i sold it for parts??

or any other sugestions please
 
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