Mild 48v hybrid system problems and fried installations.

[c3ll]

I came across a disconcerting info, that the 48v generator system has a somewhat widespread failure, causing the whole electrical system to fry and stop even during movement.

It seems that 90+% of the reports I found were in the USA, but non the less it spooked me, because it seems to be out of the blue - some cars reporting it around 20k miles, others - around 40k. My car is now around 48.75 (78k km), but I am a bit worried.

Searched the forums here, though, and found nothing. Does anyone know anything about that?

I am attaching a couple of technical service bulletin sheets I found about the issue, and some photo from reddit stating the affected model range.

View attachment MC-10181815-0001.pdfView attachment MC-10178442-0001.pdf

Cheers,
G.

 

[elan2s]

It is the 48v Starter/Alternator that is the issue and Audi has a programme on place to replace all of those that are affected by the issue, ideally of course it gets replaced before the original one fails. I think the issue is more prevalent in the US (I have seen very few mentions of this issue on this or other European forum) because the majority of A6s shipped there have the 48v system (in the A6 for instance most sold are 55TFSi models) and therefore more likely to see the issue occur. Here in Europe the majority of A6s sold are 40TDi and 40TFSi which have the 12v system. Likewise the other Audi models with 48v systems have lower sales volumes. in Europe. The early 12v cars also had a similar problem and my own 2019 40TDi had a replacement as part of the recall.

Beyond the actual failure the secondary issue is that Audi has struggled to get sufficient supplies of the revised starter/alternators to both satisfy the demands for new vehicle production and also to replace those that need replacing, leading to long times of cars being off the road when it fails. Again I suspect being in Europe and therefore closer to the centre of the supply chain means it is easier for Audi to provide replacements when one fails than it is for the US.

BTW one of the attachments you have included relates to trim discolouration not the starter/alternator issue

 

[c3ll]

It is the 48v Starter/Alternator that is the issue and Audi has a programme on place to replace all of those that are affected by the issue, ideally of course it gets replaced before the original one fails. I think the issue is more prevalent in the US (I have seen very few mentions of this issue on this or other European forum) because the majority of A6s shipped there have the 48v system (in the A6 for instance most sold are 55TFSi models) and therefore more likely to see the issue occur. Here in Europe the majority of A6s sold are 40TDi and 40TFSi which have the 12v system. Likewise the other Audi models with 48v systems have lower sales volumes. in Europe. The early 12v cars also had a similar problem and my own 2019 40TDi had a replacement as part of the recall.

Beyond the actual failure the secondary issue is that Audi has struggled to get sufficient supplies of the revised starter/alternators to both satisfy the demands for new vehicle production and also to replace those that need replacing, leading to long times of cars being off the road when it fails. Again I suspect being in Europe and therefore closer to the centre of the supply chain means it is easier for Audi to provide replacements when one fails than it is for the US.

BTW one of the attachments you have included relates to trim discolouration not the starter/alternator issue

So I can go to audi and demand an inspection, to see if my alternator has been changed, and if not - to change it as part of a recall? How can I defend if they decline to do it?

Cheers,
G.

 

[elan2s]

You can definitely go to the dealer and ask firstly if your car is affected by the recall (probably is) and then has it been changed (also check the MyAudi app as that will show any work undertaken on your car). If not then ask what is their programme for changing. If you get no luck from the dealer, try another or escalate it to Audi in Bulgaria.

 

[c3ll]

You can definitely go to the dealer and ask firstly if your car is affected by the recall (probably is) and then has it been changed (also check the MyAudi app as that will show any work undertaken on your car). If not then ask what is their programme for changing. If you get no luck from the dealer, try another or escalate it to Audi in Bulgaria.

They told me no recall was issued for EU... They told me they were expecting it, because truly many vehicles were being affected, but no official recall... Idk who I should contact, and how I should go about that

Cheers,
G.

 

[RosermanDrin]

I also had the same problem with the alternator, the vehicle being still under warranty, the car service refused to pay for the warranty and kept the car in service for over a month. I had a hard time finding the alternator because they are not really in stock and I ordered it online. If it helps someone, I leave here the link from where I ordered https://autoteilemhev.de/en/17-alternators. The problem is a general one at Audi with these alternators. I recommend deactivating the start-stop from the button.

 

[StuffedAudiA8]

Hi, did you get any further with this? I have a 5 year old A8 that broke down just over a week ago. I had a new 12 volt battery installed after some minor electrical issues and 2 days later the whole system went within 30 seconds of the warning lights coming on. It’s now with Audi who say both the new 12v battery and the 48v battery are showing faults and need replacing. The warranty only ran out in May and we had it serviced under a service plan to make sure there were no issues. It’s my 3rd A8 and 5th Audi generally and this has never happened before. The car only has 30k miles on it and is immaculate. Any help would be gratefully appreciated as well as any insight into any recalls. I’m a bit suspicious as the 48v battery is on a back order - is this due to ongoing issues/demand that might indicate a recall issue? Many thanks.

 

[elan2s]

If you have had the car regularly serviced by Audi then there is a good chance that the dealer/Audi will show a degree of goodwill on this, especially as there are known issues regarding the 48v hybrid system

 

[EssexJohn]

My 2019 3.0TDi suffered a complete electrical failure on the motorway 2 days ago. 1 hour into the drive I had a yellow battery warning light appear then a few miles further on a red message saying I should stop the car. As I was on my way to the airport to drop my passenger, I decided to continue as I had only 20 miles to go. Soon after however I had several system failure messages appear then the car lost power. I coasted to the hard shoulder and stopped safely. Then engine was still running at that point but the car would not move.
I turned it off, hazards on, spoke to the recovery services and while I was doing so my passenger suggested locking the car then trying to restart it. I did exactly this and amazingly everything came back to life. I completed the journey normally, dropped him at the airport (without turning the engine off) and continued home. The only warning which remained was "Start/Stop system fault. Function unavailable". When I got the car home I turned off the engine, restarted and this message too had disappeared.

I used the car yesterday for a few miles and all appeared normal. The car has done 48k miles and was bought my me as an ex Audi management car at 8k miles. I have had no issues with this car (or any of my 3 previous Audis).

Obviously I am concerned reading this thread (and others elsewhere on a similar topic of problems with the starter/generator) that I might be heading for a very expensive repair bill not to mention the uncertainty of this happening again. I am out of warranty.

As it happened on the first frosty morning we've had and the car had been sitting outside all night, my initial thoughts were a battery problem but having read about others experiences of the "Christmas tree of warning lights" I am concerned. Does anyone have any further thoughts or updates on this topic or indeed any idea as to how common this type of problem is?

Many thanks
John

 

[elan2s]

It sounds like a starter generator issue. I would get it to a dealer for them to at least look at the fault cases to confirm if this is the case. If it is then I would expect Audi to contribute most if not all of the cost as it is a known and very well documented fault. From reports on other `forum it seems Audi now has a new starter generator from Continental so hopefully that will avoid the "what if it happens again" worry.

 

[StuffedAudiA8]

My 2019 3.0TDi suffered a complete electrical failure on the motorway 2 days ago. 1 hour into the drive I had a yellow battery warning light appear then a few miles further on a red message saying I should stop the car. As I was on my way to the airport to drop my passenger, I decided to continue as I had only 20 miles to go. Soon after however I had several system failure messages appear then the car lost power. I coasted to the hard shoulder and stopped safely. Then engine was still running at that point but the car would not move.
I turned it off, hazards on, spoke to the recovery services and while I was doing so my passenger suggested locking the car then trying to restart it. I did exactly this and amazingly everything came back to life. I completed the journey normally, dropped him at the airport (without turning the engine off) and continued home. The only warning which remained was "Start/Stop system fault. Function unavailable". When I got the car home I turned off the engine, restarted and this message too had disappeared.

I used the car yesterday for a few miles and all appeared normal. The car has done 48k miles and was bought my me as an ex Audi management car at 8k miles. I have had no issues with this car (or any of my 3 previous Audis).

Obviously I am concerned reading this thread (and others elsewhere on a similar topic of problems with the starter/generator) that I might be heading for a very expensive repair bill not to mention the uncertainty of this happening again. I am out of warranty.

As it happened on the first frosty morning we've had and the car had been sitting outside all night, my initial thoughts were a battery problem but having read about others experiences of the "Christmas tree of warning lights" I am concerned. Does anyone have any further thoughts or updates on this topic or indeed any idea as to how common this type of problem is?

Many thanks
John

My fault ended up being the alternator that cost me £2300 to fix. I’ve sold the car now back to Audi as I had no confidence in it. Watching for a recall though so I can claim my money back.

 

[EssexJohn]

My 2019 3.0TDi suffered a complete electrical failure on the motorway 2 days ago. 1 hour into the drive I had a yellow battery warning light appear then a few miles further on a red message saying I should stop the car. As I was on my way to the airport to drop my passenger, I decided to continue as I had only 20 miles to go. Soon after however I had several system failure messages appear then the car lost power. I coasted to the hard shoulder and stopped safely. Then engine was still running at that point but the car would not move.
I turned it off, hazards on, spoke to the recovery services and while I was doing so my passenger suggested locking the car then trying to restart it. I did exactly this and amazingly everything came back to life. I completed the journey normally, dropped him at the airport (without turning the engine off) and continued home. The only warning which remained was "Start/Stop system fault. Function unavailable". When I got the car home I turned off the engine, restarted and this message too had disappeared.

I used the car yesterday for a few miles and all appeared normal. The car has done 48k miles and was bought my me as an ex Audi management car at 8k miles. I have had no issues with this car (or any of my 3 previous Audis).

Obviously I am concerned reading this thread (and others elsewhere on a similar topic of problems with the starter/generator) that I might be heading for a very expensive repair bill not to mention the uncertainty of this happening again. I am out of warranty.

As it happened on the first frosty morning we've had and the car had been sitting outside all night, my initial thoughts were a battery problem but having read about others experiences of the "Christmas tree of warning lights" I am concerned. Does anyone have any further thoughts or updates on this topic or indeed any idea as to how common this type of problem is?

Many thanks
John

Quick update on this breakdown. My local independent VAG specialist (who over the last 10+ years looking after our cars have always been brilliant) did a full diagnostic check and in the end found it to be a failing battery. No faults showing on the starter generator thank goodness. Replacement battery put in and we're fully up and running again - 300 miles later no issues.
Bizarre that a 4.5 year old battery fails on a motorway an hour into a journey...but hey, that's the complicated electrics of a mild hybrid system I guess.

 

[Halcs]

Hi. I'm new to this forum but I am having precisely this issue right now with my 2019 A7 (30,000 miles).
It is currently with the dealer for the third time in the space of about 9 months and they are adamant that there is no fault - which is ridiculous, because it wouldn't keep breaking down if that were true.

I intend to pursue this vigorously as I am extremely unhappy with the response I have been getting - any advice, information, support, etc., would be gratefully received.

I will keep an eye on the page and will update if I get anywhere (which I doubt!).

Any good leads for me to escalate this would be appreciated.

 

[EssexJohn]

Further to Halcs post above, an update to my previous update is that my car broke down a second time again with a complete electrical meltdown, exactly as before, despite the new battery. It is currently back with my local independent specialists who are trying to get to the bottom of the issue.

It would seem there is a more widespread problem going on here!

 

[Halcs]

Further to Halcs post above, an update to my previous update is that my car broke down a second time again with a complete electrical meltdown, exactly as before, despite the new battery. It is currently back with my local independent specialists who are trying to get to the bottom of the issue.

It would seem there is a more widespread problem going on here!

I wish you well with it - my dealer insists that they've done all possible checks and nothing is showing up, but the car has displayed precisely the same symptoms 3 times so it is no coincidence, I am going to inform them that I will escalate this and I'll report back if this has any positive effect on their response at all - though I wouldn't hold my breath!

 

[Halcs]

Hi, did you get any further with this? I have a 5 year old A8 that broke down just over a week ago. I had a new 12 volt battery installed after some minor electrical issues and 2 days later the whole system went within 30 seconds of the warning lights coming on. It’s now with Audi who say both the new 12v battery and the 48v battery are showing faults and need replacing. The warranty only ran out in May and we had it serviced under a service plan to make sure there were no issues. It’s my 3rd A8 and 5th Audi generally and this has never happened before. The car only has 30k miles on it and is immaculate. Any help would be gratefully appreciated as well as any insight into any recalls. I’m a bit suspicious as the 48v battery is on a back order - is this due to ongoing issues/demand that might indicate a recall issue? Many thanks.

My situation is almost identical to yours - they replaced the 12V battery but it's gone wrong again since then and it is clear that they either done have a clue what's really wrong, or they do know and they are trying to sweep it under the carpet.

Keep an eye here and/or message me directly if you want - I think this needs digging into....

 

[Samurai_75]

Hi, just reading through this thread and thought I'd add my own situation. I've a 2019 A6 3.0 Tdi with 30K miles that had a full shutdown 2 weeks ago. First the yellow light, then a couple of minutes later a red warning followed by total shutdown. Lost steering, brakes and everything else. Not even enough power left to lock it and a 3 mile hike home on rural roads in freezing temperatures. I was lucky enough to coast it into a position of relative safety or it could have been much worse. My local VAG specialist diagnosed the infamous 48v 'smart' alternator and suggested that I get Audi to look at it, as it should not fail at that mileage or age. I've spoken to the Audi dealership and Audi head office, neither of whom admit any sort of known fault despite a 7 year warrenty extension in the US as well as an ongoing class action lawsuit!

My car is still waiting for transport to the Audi dealership - the nearest one is 70 miles away - after which I am expecting a fight as it is out of warranty. The best bet is Consumer Rights Act 2015, Motor Ombudsman and ultimately small claims. This is a dangerous, potentially deadly known fault and Audi should be issuing a recall or at the very least paying for it when it fails.

If enough of us in the UK and wider EU make enough noise maybe it will make a difference!?

The attached Audi complaints procedure andMotor Ombudsman info might also be of use.

 

[Danq8]

Hi Everyone, it looks like I have the same problem. I've had all of the symptoms reported i.e. the dash lights etc. The car has now been relayed to a specialist who have diagnosed the generator issue (like everyone else). The car is late 2018 Q8 50 TDI 40k miles. I have an RAC warranty so the garage is trying to deal with this on my behalf.
I'll put any updates here incase it helps anyone else. Dan