Fuel choice (Octane levels)

craigpanthercrystal

craigpanthercrystal

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So my S3 has just hit 35K and every mile has been covered with Shell Vpower. I was speaking with a mate with a Golf R and he only ever uses the cheapest fuel he can find - never had a n issue....
Who uses 95 ron on here? was thinking that I could be ok on poverty fuel for commuting and using decent stuff when I expect to go for a blast... interested to see who uses what.
 
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craigpanthercrystal said:
So my S3 has just hit 35K and every mile has been covered with Shell Vpower. I was speaking with a mate with a Golf R and he only ever uses the cheapest fuel he can find - never had a n issue....
Who uses 95 ron on here? was thinking that I could be ok on poverty fuel for commuting and using decent stuff when I expect to go for a blast... interested to see who uses what.
Click to expand...

Pandora's box .

Quite a few threads on this specific subject. My take on this, which is a copy/paste from one of my posts from another thread is that if you car isn't tuned then Shell Unleaded or any fuel which is 95RON is fine and which is what your fuel cap would refer to as well.

On my S4 standard fuel required is 95RON, which means that the ECU timing is set for that fuel type. The ECU will act on knock sensors to allow the timing to ****** for lower octane fuel, but not to advance for higher octane.

However, if your car is tuned then and depending on which tuner you use and the fuel it gets remapped to you should that specific fuel.

Personally, I have used Momentum and BP only on my diesel cars in the past and that too was on few occasions. Shell is and has always beeny first choice.

A few threads on this subject:

https://www.audi-sport.net/xf/threads/fuel-question.379773/

https://www.audi-sport.net/xf/threads/which-fuel-supermarket-or-not.370722/

https://www.audi-sport.net/xf/threads/supermarket-fuel.333009/

https://www.audi-sport.net/xf/threads/which-fuel-supermarket-or-not.370722/
 
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Wow thanks. Ill do the recommended and search. I guess I am just programmed to use High octane on boosted cars since my Mitsi evo days which were imports and 98+ only fuels. I guess things have come along since then....
 
audi upgrades
On the facelift S3 the pops and bangs are much more pronounced with 100RON vs 95RON. One thing is what your butt dyno tells you power-wise but there is a noticeable difference in the sound where the 100RON pops a little more and makes one or two very loud pops on downshifts once in a while whereas the 95RON is quiter and doesn't make any loud pops.
 
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On the fuel cap of my s3 it has both 95 and 98 ron fuels so assume that the factory map can take advantage of both. I’ve been using a mix of Tesco momentum 99 Ron and shell vpower since I’ve had the car. Turbo cars and high revving cars generally will benefit from higher octane as ignition is technically more precise. Saying that your average joe isn’t gonna notice that few bhp difference.
Main thing is to avoid pinking as when the ecu has to ****** timing it’s after the event so any potential damage is already done.
Like you I’ve had jap cars/imports and they have 100 ron fuels over there and my last one ran like a pig with 95 ron and flagged the management light.
 
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I used Asda cheap 95 for ages, only moved to Momentum because I got the MTM box and that's what they recommend (99)... not like there was any problems though at least over several months using Asda.
 
I use 95 since the beginning and get very loud exhaust pops (they depend on how high in the rev range the car is at). I don't think there is any noticeable difference between the fuel types. It's kinda the same situation where people will feel better if you give them a fake pill, it's all in your head...
 
It's a long running source of debate. Personally I don't think 98/99 makes any difference in performance compared to 95 for the driving I am ever likely to do (and the car does not require anything higher than 95). However, I looked into this in quite some detail and I'm much more convinced that there may be advantages for VPower in terms of engine deposits (i.e a cleaner engine). For a car I intend to keep for a significant time this does actually matter. I can't remember where I found it but I looked at some results of engines taken apart after running on bog standard 95 vs premium fuels and there was actually a lot of difference in terms of inlet port/valve contamination. Even so, I don't know whether the extra costs in running on premium fuel would outweigh the eventual repair costs (which would only occur at fairly high mileages). Perhaps I am gullible to marketing but I do mainly use VPower (but I don't fret if I can't get it).
 
Svenedin said:
It's a long running source of debate. Personally I don't think 98/99 makes any difference in performance compared to 95 for the driving I am ever likely to do (and the car does not require anything higher than 95). However, I looked into this in quite some detail and I'm much more convinced that there may be advantages for VPower in terms of engine deposits (i.e a cleaner engine). For a car I intend to keep for a significant time this does actually matter. I can't remember where I found it but I looked at some results of engines taken apart after running on bog standard 95 vs premium fuels and there was actually a lot of difference in terms of inlet port/valve contamination. Even so, I don't know whether the extra costs in running on premium fuel would outweigh the eventual repair costs (which would only occur at fairly high mileages). Perhaps I am gullible to marketing but I do mainly use VPower (but I don't fret if I can't get it).
Click to expand...

Agree to some extent, but lower octane fuels have no more "contaminants" (for want of a better word) than higher octane fuels. I will not go into details on this forum, but suffice to say I fronted a government laboratory some years back (for 5 years) and we tested fuel and oil samples from around the world for all UK armed services and have experience on passing out the information to the relevant agencies/departments.
It is impossible to deny or verify the port/valve contamination over a very long period of time because there are so many variables that come into play under so called "controlled testing" regimes.
 
Han4mi said:
I use 95 since the beginning and get very loud exhaust pops (they depend on how high in the rev range the car is at). I don't think there is any noticeable difference between the fuel types. It's kinda the same situation where people will feel better if you give them a fake pill, it's all in your head...
Click to expand...

Sorry mate, but that’s just like saying you don’t like the food you haven’t tasted when you have not been running a full tank of 100RON on the car.

There might be a significant difference here, mine has a res delete (can’t see if yours has) which might make a difference since the very loud bangs will not be damped by the resonator. So IF you have tried 100RON on your car and can’t hear a difference that may be the reason.

I can’t say I feel a difference in my butt dyno but I trust my ears ;)

If you want I can also give you an scientific based hypothesis to why the higher octane fuel should make a louder pop once in a while but that’ll be when I’m in front of a computer and not on my phone :hi:
 
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Peter123 said:
Agree to some extent, but lower octane fuels have no more "contaminants" (for want of a better word) than higher octane fuels. I will not go into details on this forum, but suffice to say I fronted a government laboratory some years back (for 5 years) and we tested fuel and oil samples from around the world for all UK armed services and have experience on passing out the information to the relevant agencies/departments.
It is impossible to deny or verify the port/valve contamination over a very long period of time because there are so many variables that come into play under so called "controlled testing" regimes.
Click to expand...

This. I used to work at a gas station for 2 months when I was younger and I came across a spec sheet for the fuel that just arrived. They were identical. No difference at all between the vpower and standard 95. It's all marketing ********. However, I'm not going to judge anyone, you can do whatever you want with your $$$.
 
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Sorry but not having that.... they may not be any different as far as a non tuned car is concerned but for a tuned car they are like chalk and cheese. my concern was initially will the S3 deteriorate anyway by not using the V power, Would seem that there could be a coking issue long term but generally not much of an issue if I didn't use V power all the time, I do like 25K a year so the difference in fuel cost is more an issue now than before.
 
Lehn said:
Sorry mate, but that’s just like saying you don’t like the food you haven’t tasted when you have not been running a full tank of 100RON on the car.

There might be a significant difference here, mine has a res delete (can’t see if yours has) which might make a difference since the very loud bangs will not be damped by the resonator. So IF you have tried 100RON on your car and can’t hear a difference that may be the reason.

I can’t say I feel a difference in my butt dyno but I trust my ears ;)

If you want I can also give you an scientific based hypothesis to why the higher octane fuel should make a louder pop once in a while but that’ll be when I’m in front of a computer and not on my phone :hi:
Click to expand...
Lehn said:
Sorry mate, but that’s just like saying you don’t like the food you haven’t tasted when you have not been running a full tank of 100RON on the car.

There might be a significant difference here, mine has a res delete (can’t see if yours has) which might make a difference since the very loud bangs will not be damped by the resonator. So IF you have tried 100RON on your car and can’t hear a difference that may be the reason.

I can’t say I feel a difference in my butt dyno but I trust my ears ;)

If you want I can also give you an scientific based hypothesis to why the higher octane fuel should make a louder pop once in a while but that’ll be when I’m in front of a computer and not on my phone :hi:
Click to expand...

Even if it makes the sound louder with a res delete, I'm not going to pay a premium over drawing more attention to my car. There's no difference in performance so it makes no sense to me. Each to their own though!
 
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My personal opinion has always been to only use V-Power.

When I had my Subaru Impreza STI PPP, I had to use BP Optimax for a few weeks (shell garage closed for refurbishment) and I could detect a difference in the performance. On Optimax the engine seamed to have less top end.

Fuels like V-Power have additives that help clean your engine, and thus help the engine produce maximum power. Now, if you only keep the car for a few years from new, why should it bother you what state the engines in once you sell it on? But for me, I want my engine running the best it can, for me. And that means sticking the best fuel in it. I even stick V-Power in my Twingo RS.

I don't understand why anyone would spend £30-40k+ on a performance car, and then stick the cheapest sh**est fuel into it. For what? To save £2.56 per tank. If you need to save money that way, then maybe you bought the wrong car to start with.

For me, fuel and Tyres are the same thing. I don't scrape on either. Always the best fuel and tyres.
 
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wab172uk said:
My personal opinion has always been to only use V-Power.

When I had my Subaru Impreza STI PPP, I had to use BP Optimax for a few weeks (shell garage closed for refurbishment) and I could detect a difference in the performance. On Optimax the engine seamed to have less top end.

Fuels like V-Power have additives that help clean your engine, and thus help the engine produce maximum power. Now, if you only keep the car for a few years from new, why should it bother you what state the engines in once you sell it on? But for me, I want my engine running the best it can, for me. And that means sticking the best fuel in it. I even stick V-Power in my Twingo RS.

I don't understand why anyone would spend £30-40k+ on a performance car, and then stick the cheapest sh**est fuel into it. For what? To save £2.56 per tank. If you need to save money that way, then maybe you bought the wrong car to start with.

For me, fuel and Tyres are the same thing. I don't scrape on either. Always the best fuel and tyres.
Click to expand...

Well put, V power it will remain. If that's the excuse I needed lol
 
Han4mi said:
This. I used to work at a gas station for 2 months when I was younger and I came across a spec sheet for the fuel that just arrived. They were identical. No difference at all between the vpower and standard 95. It's all marketing ********. However, I'm not going to judge anyone, you can do whatever you want with your $$$.
Click to expand...

V-Power is better than 95 Ron. It would be highly illegal for Shell to claim there is a difference is there isn't. We have marketing laws for a reason.
 
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wab172uk said:
My personal opinion has always been to only use V-Power.

When I had my Subaru Impreza STI PPP, I had to use BP Optimax for a few weeks (shell garage closed for refurbishment) and I could detect a difference in the performance. On Optimax the engine seamed to have less top end.

Fuels like V-Power have additives that help clean your engine, and thus help the engine produce maximum power. Now, if you only keep the car for a few years from new, why should it bother you what state the engines in once you sell it on? But for me, I want my engine running the best it can, for me. And that means sticking the best fuel in it. I even stick V-Power in my Twingo RS.

I don't understand why anyone would spend £30-40k+ on a performance car, and then stick the cheapest sh**est fuel into it. For what? To save £2.56 per tank. If you need to save money that way, then maybe you bought the wrong car to start with.

For me, fuel and Tyres are the same thing. I don't scrape on either. Always the best fuel and tyres.
Click to expand...

This^ :thumbs up:

But it's like religion and politics, each to their own and it's very difficult to change peoples opinion (I do however respect peoples opinion and won't say that they're wrong I just like to explain why I do as I do ).

People just seems to forget that 100ron V-Power is not some marketing stunt (VS 95ron), there is evidence that V-Power makes more power (however, it's very vehicle dependent) and even though the formula of V-Power is a highly kept secret the stuff/additives we do know Shell uses are also proven to clean your engine (or at least not making the combustion chamber as dirty as regular 95ron fuel). No, it's not night and day and I'm sure I can't tell a difference between two cars neck to neck with different octane rating but a difference of 0.01% is enough for me to use the best fuel possible in my car, which btw is a £100k+ car where I come from.
 
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I believe on most/all modern high output petrol engines the ecu is set up to run on either as the sensors detect and make the adjustments required. I do not know what specific effect this has on the performance.
What is the biggest concern to me is supermarket fuel. A good friend was a chemist for a large petro chemical company [BP if I recall correctly] for many years and another close friend worked as a senior maintenance engineer at a local refinery. Neither would put supermarket fuel in there cars. The set-up was the tanker would be filled at the refinery out of the same main tank no matter where it was going to, but then the additives required by the individual retailer were added.

Colin
 
I have a a 1.4TFSI/150. On Tesco 99RON compared with Shell's standard 95RON it definitely idles more smoothly. I notice no increase in power. I suspect I get an improvement in fuel consumption, but there are too many variables to be sure.
 
V-Power all the way for me
Rule of thumb for me after advice from a mate in the vehicle petro chemicals industry
(I'm talking petrol engined cars here)

Normally aspirated cars - Normal fuel
All turbo cars - V-Power
Supercharged - Normal

From my experience -

My old B8 A4 2.0 petrol turbo ran really well on it
The wife's old 5 door MINI Cooper S petrol turbo also ran really well on it
Ran my old B8.5 supercharged S4 on Shell 'normal' as I didn't think there was any benefit of V-Power on the supercharged engine
I run my Cupra on V-Power
& I also run the wife's new Captur (899cc petrol turbo) on V-Power which is does seem to agree with (Trying to squeeze any extra power out of this lol)

The rider is we don't do a lot of miles so using V-Power is no more expensive when you use the Shell loyalty card TBH
 
eribaMotters said:
I believe on most/all modern high output petrol engines the ecu is set up to run on either as the sensors detect and make the adjustments required. I do not know what specific effect this has on the performance.
What is the biggest concern to me is supermarket fuel. A good friend was a chemist for a large petro chemical company [BP if I recall correctly] for many years and another close friend worked as a senior maintenance engineer at a local refinery. Neither would put supermarket fuel in there cars. The set-up was the tanker would be filled at the refinery out of the same main tank no matter where it was going to, but then the additives required by the individual retailer were added.

Colin
Click to expand...
Ahhhhh....that old wives tail....got to laugh.:smile new:
 
And yet without doubt the biggest sellers of fuel in France are the supermarkets......I have always run my 35k mile stage1 S3 on supermarket 98 and runs lovely, good economy and good performance. And we all know French registered cars are the fastest, particularly their small white hatchbacks.

Some cars and motorbikes can adjust their timing but in reality you are unlikely to make any noticeable difference in performance, certainly won't do any harm running on 95. If the motor is tuned it makes sense imo to give it a higher octane fuel.
 
I’ve ran my 310 s3 on normal unleaded for the first 4k Miles and I’ve done the last 1000 miles on Tesco 99. I’ve got to admit I cannot feel any difference in performance, idling, sound or fuel consumption. I’m due a fill up next time I’m out so will try normal Sainsbury’s unleaded again see if I can notice anything different. I’ve no issue paying a £3/4 extra per tank if it makes a difference...
 
I use Tesco 99 and can’t say I notice any performance increase but I’m pretty sure I get an extra few miles out of a tank (not scientifically calculated), which kinda pays for itself, so figured it can’t do any harm!
 
Lehn said:
On the facelift S3 the pops and bangs are much more pronounced with 100RON vs 95RON. One thing is what your butt dyno tells you power-wise but there is a noticeable difference in the sound where the 100RON pops a little more and makes one or two very loud pops on downshifts once in a while whereas the 95RON is quiter and doesn't make any loud pops.
Click to expand...
Lmao
So because it pops louder it goes faster?? Lol
 
FULLBORE said:
Lmao
So because it pops louder it goes faster?? Lol
Click to expand...

No, you misunderstood me. I'm not saying the octance rating makes a difference power-wise but it does make a difference to the sound of the pops and bangs IMO.
 
Peter123 said:
Ahhhhh....that old wives tail....got to laugh.:smile new:
Click to expand...

Its true, well for Scotland & northern England anyway. All the tankers fill up from the same holding tank of a basic mix to the industry standard then what ever retailer its going to ads their own mix of additives. Higher octanes stuff is usually run in smaller batches & tanks due to less demand. I have run all my cars on the supermarket stuff and my zed is tuned to the momentum from tesco. Your more likely to suffer from contaminated fuel due to poor condition of storage tanks at the petrol stations.
 
Lehn said:
And now you’re making me look like an over sensitive **** that takes everything too serious, thank you! ;)
Click to expand...
Lmao... i will let you off.... english sarcasm jokes are hard to read on the interweb.

All for a chuckle
 
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Thread revival - controversy incoming.

There is interesting new news in the 8L section confirming that Shell is reducing Vpower in the UK from 99 RON to 97 RON, though keeping it at E5 in terms of bioethanol (apparently committed E5 till 2025).

This mainly affects S3/RS3 owners.

Looks like it’s Tesco Momentum or CostCo super unleaded if you want to stay 99 RON going forward.



www.audi-sport.net

E10 Petrol

A topic for debate.... So they’ve announced that from beginning of next year they are going to introduce E10 Petrol. This is already available in some EU countries. You will still be able to buy good old E5 but it’ll come at a premium, as if we don’t pay enough for Shell 99. We can assume this...
www.audi-sport.net www.audi-sport.net
 
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