Decision to make. Advice needed

scotty_24

scotty_24

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So

The cars been smoking on start up. Ive read that this can be stem seals or a cracked head.
Today its thrown the code
16395/P0011/000017
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16395/P0011/000017 - Bank 1: Camshaft A (Intake): ****** Setpoint not Reached (Over-Advanced)
Possible Symptoms
  • Power Loss
Possible Causes
  • Camshaft Adjustment Valve 1 (N205) faulty
  • Fuel Pump Relay (J17) faulty
  • Mechanical Timing not correct, including Chain and/or Belt timing.
Possible Solutions
  • Check Camshaft Adjustment Valve 1 (N205)
  • Check Fuel Pump Relay (J17)
  • Check Mechanical Timing
Special Notes
  • When found in Engine: 4.0l W8
    • Check TPL 2010059(RoW)
      • Check/Replace Oil Sieve in Timing Case (Camshaft Adjuster)
Retrieved from "http://wiki.ross-tech.com/wiki/index.php?title=16395/P0011/000017&oldid=5425"
Category:






It sounds like the VVT Tensioner has gone. Rough idle and rough running.

I can get a BAM Cylinder head for £200 that's only got 65K miles on it.
Im skint, so would just be doing basic head swop with new head gasket and head bolts

Would the Bam head be plug and play with my AMK?
 
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Cheers Tuffty

Yeah im going to get new stem seals fitted to the head before I fit it they are cheap enough and may as well do them to avoid this situation again.

Is Elring what VW use as OEM? I work for VW and so Get discount at TPS.

Never rains it pours with this car, but hey ho once its done its done and lets face it its only £300 in parts, ive spent £260 on tyres this month.....
Just another fun weekend with the S3.
 
Ah in which case just get OE gear then... Bill uses elring stuff on builds and yeah they are a gasket supplier to VAG

<tuffty/>
 
Brilliant Tuffty thank you for your help!
To be honest sometimes EURO works out just as good as TPS with discount, as long as they are the same manufacturer I couldn't give a monkeys where they come from as long as they are OEM parts.

So Just priced it up.

Head £200 (mate)
Elring Gasket set £52.86 (euro - head gasket exhaust mani intake mani cam cover etc included)
Elring head bolt set£19.85 (euro)

Stem seals OEM are £5+vat each so £120
Found Supertech ones on ebay fo £35, are they ok / any good?
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/291205429739?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT
 
The ECP head set includes stem seals mate... they should be around £1.20 each tops for decent brands... £5+vat is far too much to pay IMO

Supertech ones are ok I believe but never used them personally

<tuffty/>
 
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Ahh now I thought I saw them on the photo for the part but I thought it may be a generic image, now that is a steal for all the gaskets for £52.86 !
Literally going to cost less than £300 for this repair in bits im well happy now, plus some beer tokens to my mate to fit the lot.

Thanks again as always and hope this thread may help someone in the future!
 

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OK so Im having a "Go big or go home moment" @<tuffty/>
While I have new stem seals fitted to the donor BAM head, do I fit new valves? If so which ones and can @badger5 supply them?

Just to remind you on Bill, mine made 310 on your rollers BBT k418T and you advised me to do the cooling mods to try and battle the timing pull.

Could the leaky stemn seals be effecting the timing pull? oil in cylinder effecting the mixture?

Recent logs show 270gs airflow and 0 degrees timing pull across all cylinders now that the second meth nozzle, 82 degree 'stat and alloy radiator have been fitted.

Cheers
 
Last edited:
oil in the combustion charge can indeed affect the engines ability to tolerate timing... if oil is getting in this way then its plausible that new seals will sort it... worst one I have seen is where enough oil was being drawn through on idle to cause the engine to misfire...

Bill can supply supertech stuff, valves and springs etc...

Head wise the problem areas are exhaust guides, stem seals and exhaust valve springs... generally need to get the guides checked as they start wearing at fairly low mileage (60/70k by all accounts)

Check exhaust valves for pitting as they are prone (obvs check all valves and seats)... goes without saying you need to lap all the valves in...

If the valves are ok then you can get away with a set of Cat Gold springs on the exhausts (Bill sells those)... a full supertech setup is knocking on £800 iirc but Bill can confirm prices and availability

<tuffty/>
 
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Yeah I think the car wouldnt accept any more timing due to a mixture of the cooling mods needing to be done and a stem seal leak.

I remember him saying the 1.8T are notorious for exhaust valve float especially with the pressures of the hybrid?

Il wait and see what Bill comes back with for costs.

The cheapest way to do this is to fit the gasket and stem seal kit above and just swop the heads.
Stem seals fixed and as long as the donor heads cam chain tensioner is good this will be sorted too.

If he recommends other Supertech goodies I may have my arm twisted :tonguewink:, or maybe as you say fit the cat gold exhaust springs.
The valves (be it the old ones or some new supertech valves) will obviously be lapped in after the stem seals are replaced.

****** car. But all is good, itll come back stronger with a freshened up 65k miles BAM head :grimacing:
 
30nm and go round twice (to compensate for gasket compression as you work out fro the centre of the head), 60nm and go round twice (again same reason... you will find you can get an 1/8 to a 1/4 turn on the inside bolts when doing the 60nm step) then 90 deg + 90 deg

Head


<tuffty/>
 
So the donor head is stripped, all looks good and time to rebuild it, replacing the stem seals and lapping the valves in.
No cracks, no signs of excessive wear. Result.
Does anyone know the torque settings for bolting down the cam caps (the 32 bolts)?

Decided to just lap the standard valves back in, I don't plan to go for any more power and have ran out of time to order them now.
Didn't get a reply from Bill but I know hes busy :(

Its all coming together nicely, she will be back better and stronger!
 
scotty_24 said:
So the donor head is stripped, all looks good and time to rebuild it, replacing the stem seals and lapping the valves in.
No cracks, no signs of excessive wear. Result.
Does anyone know the torque settings for bolting down the cam caps (the 32 bolts)?

Decided to just lap the standard valves back in, I don't plan to go for any more power and have ran out of time to order them now.
Didn't get a reply from Bill but I know hes busy :(

Its all coming together nicely, she will be back better and stronger!
Click to expand...

Need to ring him mate...

<tuffty/>
 
Yeah I thought so as I know he's mental busy. Its all good though im happy with the power im at and don't want to plough much more into the engine side of things.

Would you know the torque settings for the cam bolts?
 
Image
Image
So the donor heads fully stripped, All looks good!
Now to clean the head and de coke as much as possible before the valves get re lapped in and the whole thing gets rebuilt with the new stem seals :)
Slow progress but we're getting somewhere
Hopefully the donor head is good to go next week ready to be swooped over :)
 
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The "valve seat" part of the exhaust valves are corroded and generally carboned up.
Tried to lap them in and not getting the greatest of finish, so I don't want to use them and cause compression issues.
The valve seats on the head are perfect. I think its just that the head has stood a while before it has come into my possession.
 
scotty_24 said:
The "valve seat" part of the exhaust valves are corroded and generally carboned up.
Tried to lap them in and not getting the greatest of finish, so I don't want to use them and cause compression issues.
The valve seats on the head are perfect. I think its just that the head has stood a while before it has come into my possession.
Click to expand...
I cleaned mine up by putting cloth tape on the stems, putting them in a drill, and using the finest emery cloth available, this polished them up and made lapping a piece of ****
 
audi upgrades
To be honest, do you really hear of valve failures on these cars? Especially at hybrid levels. I know it's a temperature thing and hybrids are hotter than most setups when pushed, even ones with more power. But in my not very experienced opinion, I'd say the springs and retainers are more important to upgrade than the valves themselves.
On that basis, if I were you, new oem valves, new guides and seals, and a set of cat gold springs and retainers which I believe can be had for around £200.
 
Supertech are inconel... they seem more capable then the sodium filled OE valves... Bill cut an OE exhaust valve open... there wasn't much sodium in it (dunno if thats good bad or indifferent) but more concerning was the cavity for the sodium...

12036438 10153348070263183 5694589035432180962 n


Not sure how far up the stem the cavity goes but not sure I like the idea of a hollow valve like that..

Cat Gold springs are a good shout though

<tuffty/>
 
Right. ******** to that. Ive emailed Bill to sort a set of Supertech out through him. The last thing I need is a cheap exhaust valve melting or dropping and smashing about in my engine after this second build of the year.
At least I know that these Supertech ones are neuclear holocaust proof.
 
What's the benefit of gold springs then?
 
Dunno about nuclear holocaust proof but they survived enough after my 'gearchange incident' to hit unmentionable speeds on a private test track once I had found fourth again...

Engine ran so well I only realised there had been contact after using the bore scope..

<tuffty/>
 
daz-20vt said:
What's the benefit of gold springs then?
Click to expand...

Stiffer... keeps valves closed with the high back pressures K04's seem to have... VAG fitted shims to K04 turbo's heads to up the spring rate a bit because of it

<tuffty/>
 
superkarl said:
To be honest, do you really hear of valve failures on these cars? Especially at hybrid levels. I know it's a temperature thing and hybrids are hotter than most setups when pushed, even ones with more power. But in my not very experienced opinion, I'd say the springs and retainers are more important to upgrade than the valves themselves.
On that basis, if I were you, new oem valves, new guides and seals, and a set of cat gold springs and retainers which I believe can be had for around £200.
Click to expand...

well yes they do
failed-exhaust-valves-1.jpg
 
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So, the replacement head has 8 shiny supertech inconel exhaust valves.
Removed the old head tonight, cracked between the exhaust valves cyl1 and I think possible hair line cracks on other cylinders it's hard to tell.
Stem seals ****** evidence of burnt oil on every crown.
Turbos being posted to @badger5 tomorrow for hot side porting.
Hopefully get the turbo back and the engine rebuilt next weekend :)
 
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Just to close this thread up
The BAM head is on, the turbo got ported by badger5.
So far so good.
Compression test to do but I suspect all is well. Heading back to badger5 soon hopeful for a map tweak now all the cars issues have been addressed
 
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