DSG playing up?

[rob_s]

Hey all, just picked up a 2004 3.2 and am getting used to the DSG...sort of. Its fine that there is a half second delay on setting off as it goes into neutral when stationary (annoying, but fine) but there are some quirks that make me wonder if it is doing what it should be doing....done a fair bit of searching, but there seem to be a few different issues, not quite what I am getting. All help welcome

When sitting in traffic (so getting fairly hot), in D and at idle, the revs drop to ~700 as normal, but then rise up to a little over 1000 and 'bounce' gently as if straining against clutch. When I take foot off brake it does jerk forward. This gets tiresome in traffic jams and the delay before properly engaging first is longer - even though it is 'creeping' I can accelerate but just gets revs (before being launched forward with a bang)

If I shift into N there is a noticeable vibration, but only in N. This happens most of the time, not tried it on a cold engine, but definitely does it when in traffic as above.

When plodding along at 30mph in D (~1200 revs) it sometimes gets confused and downshifts a gear, sits at ~1800 revs for a second then shifts back to 1200 and repeats this until I get annoyed and put it into manual, but all the time I haven't moved the accelerator.

So, since I only picked it up from a dealership (Honda/Skoda, but comes with 12 month complete warranty) on Friday, I am keen to highlight any issues with them early on, but could do with some advice on what these boxes are really like

Cheers
Rob

 

[Brett Butler]

well I have DSG, and it sits at like 700 rpm, and never changes, so that to me is a problem though that could be engine, mine is an S3 though 2.0TFSI
I get the delay also when you take foot off brake to when the car starts to move. You get used to it.

 

[sub39h]

None of that sounds normal to me. My car is a 2006 A3 2.0T DSG with 30k on the clock and it's smooth and progressive. Changes up a little quick for my liking, but it's clearly been designed that way rather than being faulty.

How many miles has your car done? Has it had it's gearbox serviced?

 

[Ads]

Its fine that there is a half second delay on setting off as it goes into neutral when stationary (annoying, but fine)

For a start mine doesn't do this. I only get the delay if I am in 'N' and then select 'D'. But if I am in 'D' then there is no delay when pulling off from standstill.

When sitting in traffic (so getting fairly hot), in D and at idle, the revs drop to ~700 as normal, but then rise up to a little over 1000 and 'bounce' gently as if straining against clutch.

Mine doesn't do this. The revs stay constant at about 700-800rpm.

When I take foot off brake it does jerk forward. This gets tiresome in traffic jams and the delay before properly engaging first is longer - even though it is 'creeping' I can accelerate but just gets revs (before being launched forward with a bang)

Mine doesn't do this either. Taking my foot off the brake it gradually creeps forward, gently accelerating to a slow creep. If I then press the gas it pulls off smoothly with no bang of power.
The bang of power only happens if I am in 'N', put it in 'D' and press the gas before 1st engages.

If I shift into N there is a noticeable vibration, but only in N. This happens most of the time, not tried it on a cold engine, but definitely does it when in traffic as above.

'N' for me there is no vibration at all. If I put it into 'D' I can feel a slight vibration. Putting it back into 'N' and the vibration goes again.

When plodding along at 30mph in D (~1200 revs) it sometimes gets confused and downshifts a gear, sits at ~1800 revs for a second then shifts back to 1200 and repeats this until I get annoyed and put it into manual, but all the time I haven't moved the accelerator.

Mine doesn't do this. It only shifts down a gear if I slow down or accelerate considerably hard.


All of what you have listed here is definitely not how my DSG acts. Yours sounds a bit confused if you ask me.

 

[A3_Rider]

There is a massive difference between the 3.2, the 2.0T and the TDI DSG boxes.

Coming from a TDI im used to much more torque and got used to it, moving on to the 3.2 I find similar symptoms to you.

I think if you look harder its possible something is wrong, the problem with these boxes is so much can go wrong. The way I felt a bit better is, well, putting my foot down a bit

The throttle is very sensitive and sometimes mine jumps when crawling if I gently press the pedal.

 

[rob_s]

Thanks all

There is 62k on the clock and it has had 2 full oil changes (haldex etc etc, the normal one at around 40k and then the last owner requested another 8k ago before he bought it)

I am not liking the vibration in N, so that alone is worth getting it back to them and it does sound like there shouldnt be an issue where I just get revs when it is in D (or Manual) before 1st is engaged

 

[TQS]

Definitely sounds like a problem that needs looking at. Mine is a 55 3.2 DSG albeit lower mileage at 13k. I was having issues over jerkiness when i first picked up the car however the ecu upgrade that Audi kindly charged me £100 for has completely sorted out the problem.

You should be enjoying the perks of the dsg box rather than having to think excessively about what gear the car is in or how it's setting off. There's a long thread on here regarding dsg hesitation (do a search!) which should be of interest

 

[TAC]

Def something not right, could be just the sw upgrade needed or could be the CAM chain issue that paddy had check out his A3 3.2 thread.

 

[rob_s]

Thanks for the replies. I have seen the software update and would be happy to throw £100 in that direction anyway.

Not sure about the cam chain stretch, the symptoms would be lumpy idle and fault light surely (or nothing until snap)? There is a rhythmic rattle from around where the oil filler cap is - which side are the chains on?


ETA: Having said that, I can hold it at 2k revs, but it isnt smooth going from idle to 2k when trying to do so.

 

[rob_s]

Just did a quick google and the rattle at oil filler cap does indicate cam chain - I take it they are meant to be silent?

The dealers are fine for me to drop it round for diagnostics and I explained the rattle and that it didn't smoothly build revs from idle to 2k which confuses the gearbox

Video of me trying to smoothly build revs from idle to 2k...

 

[TAC]

This is the Thread you want to have a good read of and maybe quote to the dealership when you take it back in.

http://www.audi-sport.net/vb/new-a3...needed-3-2q-dsg-hesitant-engine-~-2k-rpm.html

Tom

 

[smudge_don]

Hey all, just picked up a 2004 3.2 and am getting used to the DSG...sort of. Its fine that there is a half second delay on setting off as it goes into neutral when stationary (annoying, but fine) but there are some quirks that make me wonder if it is doing what it should be doing....done a fair bit of searching, but there seem to be a few different issues, not quite what I am getting. All help welcome

When sitting in traffic (so getting fairly hot), in D and at idle, the revs drop to ~700 as normal, but then rise up to a little over 1000 and 'bounce' gently as if straining against clutch. When I take foot off brake it does jerk forward. This gets tiresome in traffic jams and the delay before properly engaging first is longer - even though it is 'creeping' I can accelerate but just gets revs (before being launched forward with a bang)

If I shift into N there is a noticeable vibration, but only in N. This happens most of the time, not tried it on a cold engine, but definitely does it when in traffic as above.

When plodding along at 30mph in D (~1200 revs) it sometimes gets confused and downshifts a gear, sits at ~1800 revs for a second then shifts back to 1200 and repeats this until I get annoyed and put it into manual, but all the time I haven't moved the accelerator.

So, since I only picked it up from a dealership (Honda/Skoda, but comes with 12 month complete warranty) on Friday, I am keen to highlight any issues with them early on, but could do with some advice on what these boxes are really like

Cheers
Rob

This is what what wrong with my DSG box after only 23k miles

Luckily my car was under warranty but it was definately a fault with the box

 

[rob_s]

This is the Thread you want to have a good read of and maybe quote to the dealership when you take it back in.

http://www.audi-sport.net/vb/new-a3...needed-3-2q-dsg-hesitant-engine-~-2k-rpm.html

Tom

Thanks Tom, already had a good read of that. Mine is ok to hold at 2k, but getting there the revs keep dipping @ 1250 and 1750 - hence the box gets confused and kicks down when it doesnt need to

This is what what wrong with my DSG box after only 23k miles

Luckily my car was under warranty but it was definately a fault with the box

Nice (I think) what was the problem and what was the fix mate?


Anyway, the car is very nice, but I am starting to think that it isn't a good one & the cam chain is noisy as well as the box needing attention. Thanks to the insurance company not covering me until I had purchased the car (Admiral policy & was due to my last car being a total loss the other week) I was not able to test drive it myself to figure these things out prior to putting a deposit down!!
No matter, full dealership warranty. Live & learn.

 

[-Ju-]

The timing chain should be silent mate, when I first got mine it rattled from that area. The supplying dealer paid for mine at a cost of £3400. That was over 12 months ago and is fine now. As for the hestitation, get the software checked as it could still be causing your issues and be the root cause of the chain stretch.
My DSG box is butter smooth, although I do sometimes get a very slight hesitation on cold start/setting off.

 

[smudge_don]

The fix was a new box matey, can't remember what the problem was in the end. They just told me it was a mechanical fault with the box

 

[rob_s]

well, many thanks both. Not a great story and the first time I have bought a car with issues, but I didn't have much choice given the time & weather I did take this into account and went with a proper dealership though.

Dealer is fine to check it all out and they can't deny the chain noise (who thought to put the chains at the 'wrong' end anyway) and I will also get them to investigate the box mechanics. They supplied me with an unlimited value warranty, so they might be covered with an excess-only policy themselves and be happy to sort it out.
Even if I get the chains done now & do the software update myself, if the box then goes I am still covered, so hopefully they will fix rather than offer me a refund.

 

[-Ju-]

Well done to you for buying the car properly in the first place, a decent warranty is a must on a second hand Audi, as you can see, repair costs can be frightening.
At one point I thought I would never get mine sorted, but since the chain and hesitation issues were cured, the car has been a pleasure to own and brings a broad smile everytime I go out in it.
Best of luck getting it sorted it will be worth it!

 

[rob_s]

:thumbsup:

 

[rob_s]

Given I am now able to drive to/from work, I have been finding the problem is that the gearbox decides to engage/disengage the clutch when it doesnt need to. (not getting confused and down-shifting as I previously thought)

It disengages and re-engages the clutch (sometimes violently) at 1100 revs, right when I am trying to get going. [That got me stuck in the snow/ice this morning as it went 'bang' and tried to take off at 20mph backwards into my parking spot. Instant fail. Queue the digging and swearing. FYI quattro is ****, no way on earth my CRV would have had any issues getting back out.]

It also does it at around 2200 revs, meaning I am bouncing along the road (revs going from 2200-2800-2200-2800-2200...you get the idea) with minimal throttle at 55mph or so, until I put it into Manual and change down to 5th. Nightmare. It does like to do it at 1700 ish revs sometimes, perfect for a 40mph zone.

It also does this in Manual, although did seem worse when in D.

And yes, I have had a bad day and no amount of putting my foot down helped - unfortunately this car is a sensible slower choice than my last few

 

[rob_s]

cant live with it, booked in for Weds and the dealers have it booked in with Audi Edinburgh (Sighthill) to get looked over, so at least they are doing it properly.

 

[rob_s]

Well Audi have diagnosed mechatronic failure and the car is being taken back to the dealers for their mechanics to see if it is fixable LOL

Need to wait and see what they say in taking this forward, but at least Audi have pointed them in the right direction

 

[sub39h]

i vaguely remember reading somewhere that the mechatronic unit is right in the middle of the gearbox somewhere and if that's true i'd imagine it'd be cheaper to replace the whole thing rather than trying to take the entire gearbox apart and get to it if it needs replacing

glad you're getting it sorted tho, an as above well done for getting a warranty. i got my 2.0T from an main dealer and i had it less than 24hr and a coilpack went. would have cost me £300 in labour alone because they spent 3 hrs trying to figure out what was going wrong so i've definitely made my money back already paying a little more for a car from a main dealer.

 

[rob_s]

Well...dealers just said they will have to give me a full refund, just too expensive to put it right.
Not a clue what to replace it with (although, it sure won't have DSG LMAO)

 

[-Ju-]

That's a bummer!, on a positive note at least your not stuck with the problem and you get to look for a new car all over again.
Don't write off the dsg so quickly though as you've just been unlucky this time.
Will you be stuck without a car, it happened to me while I was looking for my present A3 after I got a refund on an R32 that was faulty. I ended up buying the A3 without seeing it (or hearing the noisy chain lol!), worked out for me in the end though

 

[rob_s]

not looking forward to looking for another car, I wanted a Lotus or something similar, but with the weather as it is I can't justify getting one then getting stranded. Hence the audi

the dealers are letting me keep the courtesy car over the xmas period - I assume till I can get in and get the refund & my stuff out the audi - but they dont have anything in stock I would want instead, so might be stuck without a car for a bit.

 

[sub39h]

well that's good of them. yeah you've been unlucky with DSG. i wouldn't write it off so easily. i've had mine for 10k-ish miles or so now and i'd never go back.

 

[paddy]

The boxes are sealed and there is no fix for them, instead its just a case of an exchange unit. the cost of exchange and fitting is approx. £5k. I find it staggering the amount of times i have come across 3.2's with problems that in effect write the car off because the cost of repair is prohibitive. To this end Audi have a serious problem that will only get worse as their labour costs and parts increase. I recently had some work done at my local independent BMW garage and they are charging £49/hour. Audi Guildford are now charging £160/hour ! This is fast heading towards Private dentist rates to get your car serviced.....lol. Their guys work 8 till5 ,9 hour days so thats £1440 a day and at that rate your bill soon racks up.
I was told after my timing chain issues that you should never!! keep a Audi out of warranty unless you have very deep pockets...in which case you shouldn’t need to keep it out of warranty. Buy new, extend the warranty for 2 years and sell at 5 years....and that from the service manager and Audi tech who did the work on my car. You buy at 3-5 years old and you are buying someone else’s problems and over 5 years you are out of the "Audi good will window" and you live in fear of a timing chain or DSG problem that potentially puts your car beyond economical repair overnight.

 

[Ads]

The boxes are sealed and there is no fix for them, instead its just a case of an exchange unit. the cost of exchange and fitting is approx. £5k. I find it staggering the amount of times i have come across 3.2's with problems that in effect write the car off because the cost of repair is prohibitive. To this end Audi have a serious problem that will only get worse as their labour costs and parts increase. I recently had some work done at my local independent BMW garage and they are charging £49/hour. Audi Guildford are now charging £160/hour ! This is fast heading towards Private dentist rates to get your car serviced.....lol. Their guys work 8 till5 ,9 hour days so thats £1440 a day and at that rate your bill soon racks up.
I was told after my timing chain issues that you should never!! keep a Audi out of warranty unless you have very deep pockets...in which case you shouldn’t need to keep it out of warranty. Buy new, extend the warranty for 2 years and sell at 5 years....and that from the service manager and Audi tech who did the work on my car. You buy at 3-5 years old and you are buying someone else’s problems and over 5 years you are out of the "Audi good will window" and you live in fear of a timing chain or DSG problem that potentially puts your car beyond economical repair overnight.

Quite chilling. Makes you think, doesn't it.

 

[-Ju-]

The boxes are sealed and there is no fix for them, instead its just a case of an exchange unit. the cost of exchange and fitting is approx. £5k. I find it staggering the amount of times i have come across 3.2's with problems that in effect write the car off because the cost of repair is prohibitive. To this end Audi have a serious problem that will only get worse as their labour costs and parts increase. I recently had some work done at my local independent BMW garage and they are charging £49/hour. Audi Guildford are now charging £160/hour ! This is fast heading towards Private dentist rates to get your car serviced.....lol. Their guys work 8 till5 ,9 hour days so thats £1440 a day and at that rate your bill soon racks up.
I was told after my timing chain issues that you should never!! keep a Audi out of warranty unless you have very deep pockets...in which case you shouldn’t need to keep it out of warranty. Buy new, extend the warranty for 2 years and sell at 5 years....and that from the service manager and Audi tech who did the work on my car. You buy at 3-5 years old and you are buying someone else’s problems and over 5 years you are out of the "Audi good will window" and you live in fear of a timing chain or DSG problem that potentially puts your car beyond economical repair overnight.

Cheers for that Paddy, really made my Christmas lol!

 

[paddy]

No Probs Ju

Have a good one

 

[paddy]

One of the aspects that i find difficult is Audi pricing. I except that if you want a quality car made of quality materials you will have to pay more. S3 owners can expect to pay £10k more than a Renault Megan 250 Cup and Ford RS. A lot of extra cash but if you want Audi quality then its a conscious choice and you pay the price. That then should be it ! You paid for the product and i don't then see why you should continue to pay for the pleasure of owning it as well.
My Audi dealership is on a huge trading estate, its opposite the VW dealership which is owned by the same parent company. It is a mile from the Skoda dealership, also owned by the same company. Why then does and A3 owner have to pay £399 for a cam belt change when a VW Golf owner pays £299 for the same thing on the exact same engine. ? Why then does it cost £160/hour to change the oil and check the tyres on a A3 and £99/hour to do the exact same thing on a Fabia ?
If you look down the price lists you see this over and over again ! The same brakes on a golf and A3 but a pad change or disc change cost 25% extra on a A3 and so on.
Its dificult to see how ajn Audi owner is ever going to bet value for money all the time we have to pay through the nose but i do wonder why an A3 owner dosnt book his catr into sa VW agaent for a cam belt ? he would still get a VAG stamp on his service book and save 25-30%