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STANDARD Vs BLUEFIN

Discussion in 'A3/S3/Sportback (8P Chassis)' started by EAGLE79, Apr 22, 2008.

  1. EAGLE79
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    EAGLE79 Member

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    [Apr 22, 2008]
    Righto Gents,

    First thing is that i'd like to state that the following was done on a privately hired area, totally free from pedestrians, other vehicles, livestock, wildlife in general, milk floats, Pensioners and women drivers!

    Also people involved wore safety equipment and had the car's mechanically checked before the fun began!

    (Hopefully this should stop the armchair police from cherpping up!) :busted_cop:

    I have been looking at getting my car remapped as most people on here do and was wondering what the difference was between a standard car and a car with a remap.

    So here's the scene, my standard 2008 S3 (apart from panel filter) and my mates Bluefin'd 2007 S3. My car kickin out around 266BHP and his around 309BHP. Car's both running the same fuel type, same tyre pressures, same amount of passengers, well drivers as it was just us (although he is a little heavier than me :eyebrows:)

    Basically we thrased our S3's around to see what the remap does for up to and around the English speed limits.....

    The answer you ask..... :think:

    Absolutley nothing! there was nothing to seperate the 2 motors, 1st & 2nd gear acceleration is virtually identical and at one point as we sprinted from a standing start from which i was directly behind him i started to reel him in in 3rd!

    :wtf:

    My car is still quite tight in the engine department too after only 1400 miles approx, my mates has done around 3k i think??

    So what i'm trying to say is that all the reviews on here where people have said that their S3 now takes off and accelerates like a space rocket must have it all in their head as its the same speed of acceleration as before!

    Would like peoples opinions on this as always but if i'd spent £500 on a remap and the standard S3 next to me stayed with me i'd be gutted!

    Surely 40 odd BHP more makes a difference??

    Let the opinions begin!
    #1
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  3. Staz
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    Staz is a retronaut Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Apr 22, 2008]
    Hmm!

    Who was his remap done with?! Have either of you driven both to see if it feels different?
    #2
  4. RichC
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    RichC RAC 500W

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    [Apr 22, 2008]
    That sounds very worrying. Have both of the cars been on the RR to confirm these figures? Was the map loaded properly?

    Rich
    #3
  5. phantom
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    phantom On Boost

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    [Apr 22, 2008]
    Need to know have you been on a RR as above ^^^^^^^^^^


    When we had the RR day mine and Mitch78's car both made 280bhp/280lbft both STD

    The 2/3 remapped cars ( Mitch78's got remapped as a guide for APR ) roughly made 300bhp/310lbft ( i have no proof of the remapped cars figure's , it's just from memory )

    Not a bigger gain over STD as the tuners would have you believe , BUT you should still see a difference on the road and the way it drives!

    p
    #4
  6. julians
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    julians Member

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    [Apr 22, 2008]
    you say you tested it up to and around english speed limits, I'd not expect them to be much different from standing to 60ish, but I'd expect a large difference from 60 to say 120, or from a rolling 50mph to 100mph.

    Interesting results though nonetheless, I do wonder whether remapping the S3 is worthwhile, and all it does is make it feel faster without being faster.
    #5
  7. S3-N
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    S3-N ?

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    [Apr 22, 2008]
    Even if they are 280bhp/280lbft standard that's a good increase for what it costs
    #6
  8. Kontraband
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    Kontraband Active Member

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    [Apr 22, 2008]
    well the S3 is hardly slow. And even the super mighty are only knocking what is about 1.5 seconds of the 0-62 time. which is like... <------> that much on an English road.

    I kinda like the idea of the traffic light grand prix win in the bag nearly everytime but for what its worth none of us are the super qualified race car drivers we often like to imagine we are. SO how much can you really gain (without blatant disregard for safety)?? The figures are so low already is hard to see a massive difference...

    its only gonna come in the pickup/higher speeds I would have thought??
    #7
  9. Staz
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    Staz is a retronaut Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Apr 22, 2008]
    If the chip on my previous 2.0TFSI is anything to go by the extra torque low down was the most useful thing.

    There's a vid on youtube of a guy who had his S3 chipped by superchips and was driving at 171mph!

    http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=7sQK6rfcfMY

    And yes I know the speedo is incorrect but who has a standard S3 that will show that much on the dash?! lol

    My bluefin is already paid for from my last car so it doesn't really matter to me anyway :rock:
    #8
  10. newbiecrg
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    newbiecrg windsurfer

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    [Apr 22, 2008]
    Mine is standard and has done 164mph on the digital speedo at least twice in different occasions... I think it would reach a bit more like 168mph or something if I hadn't chickened out...

    It was on motorway and with almost 200rpm to reach redline...

    But for me acceleration is everything, not top speed...

    Pedro
    #9
  11. PaulAr
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    PaulAr S3 (8P)

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    [Apr 22, 2008]
    Yep, REVO Stage 1 made a huge HUGE difference on my Golf 20T Gti. Felt flat as a fart when it was flashed to std for warranty work.

    You can never go back to std afer a remap.:eyebrows:
    #10
  12. EAGLE79
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    EAGLE79 Member

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    [Apr 22, 2008]
    Even from rolling speeds of 40 mph there still was no difference in acceleration and we went up to around 110mph (again not on public highways for the record) so unless your going to push on to 130mph odd you ain't gettin away from a std car.

    I do tend to agree that if we were on a motorway doin 80mph and went for it then he might well get away a little but when you can you do that without risking putting your mapped S3 in the garage for a year because the old bill do ya (in an unmarked wagon!).

    As pedro says its more about acceleration and if the car has this extra low down torque i'm told about then why did he not shoot off? Torque is the main ingredient for acceleration.....

    Don't get me wrong i'm gettin my car remap'd but its just not what i expected. Just don't understand the whole its flat before, never go back....

    why? the standard car keeps up! not a rizzla paper between them so its all in your boon boys! Spend 500 squid on something else cosmetic to make it look different.
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  13. phantom
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    phantom On Boost

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    [Apr 22, 2008]
    I don't get the "theres nothing between them , but i'm still getting it mapped " bit? i wouldn't spend the money or take the risk mate if i thought that?

    Will you have yours mapped for the bank holiday meet? if so , and if i don't feel yours is any faster than mine i wont bother untill warrenty runs out!

    Thanks:thumbsup:

    p
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  14. PaulAr
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    PaulAr S3 (8P)

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    [Apr 22, 2008]
    Like I said, I had my Golf 20T mapped and the difference was dramatic, and therefore you could never go back on this basis. The bhp increasd by 50 and torque by around 80lbs/ft which translated to a completely different car out on the road.

    Our experiences with 20T tuning are clearly very different.
    A mapped 20T FSI should feel very different whether its the Golf, S3 or other.
    If it doesnt feel noticably quicker then I would suspect a `problem`which Im sure others here would agree.

    cheers
    Paul
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  15. RichC
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    RichC RAC 500W

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    [Apr 22, 2008]
    As phantom says why would you say its pointless, spend your money elsewhere and then in the same breath say your getting it done anyway. You have just been telling us how you think if anything the standard S3 had the edge in the 3rd. I personally find this hard to believe with the remapped cars ive been in over the years, it just doesnt sound right.

    Does anyone else have Bluefin that agrees with this?

    Rich
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  16. Vtec Abuser
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    Vtec Abuser Member

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    [Apr 23, 2008]
    It's because it's Bluefin, get Revo, it'll be loads faster then... ha
    #15
  17. Staz
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    Staz is a retronaut Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Apr 23, 2008]
    The low down torque doesn't mean it's faster in the same way as you may think. From my experience it meant there was faster acceleration lower in the revs, so you could change gear earlier. I'm talking below 2000rpm. Higher in the revs there wasn't much difference.

    I noticed it the most when I test drove an S3 after being in my old A3 2.0TFSI, I found I had to be in a lower gear than I was used to at junctions etc because, even though the stats say I'm wrong, there was a hell of a lot more torque in the chipped A3.
    #16
  18. simon-s3
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    simon-s3 Member

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    [Apr 23, 2008]
    This assumes you are both at the same level of how you drive your cars and the driver can make all the difference. Did you swap cars and try it to see if driving styles made any difference. I have the Bluefin map and even my Timed sprints are slightly faster. I have got 0-60 in 5.3 secs, without too much clutch abuse and not needing to use 3rd as the rev limiter is raised. I struggled to get 5.7 for 0-60 before the map. The power deliver and responce is so different now. Maybe your mate should speak to Superchips as I don;t think he is getting the gians he should and they may need to review the map they sent him.
    #17
  19. Matt
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    Matt Active Member

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    [Apr 23, 2008]
    Why are you getting it remapped if you didn't notice any difference between the cars....?
    #18
  20. siu00adg
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    siu00adg Member

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    [Apr 23, 2008]
    My car is A LOT fast after the 330 giac map. No question.
    #19
  21. EAGLE79
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    EAGLE79 Member

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    [Apr 23, 2008]
    Because i know someone who's going to do it for next to nothing and not 500 notes but i would be pi55ed if i'd spent the money. Also i want this better driveability everyone talks about. Plus its sounds better telling people ya car kicks out 310BHP :yes:

    It was purely a post for information and peoples views. I was expecting much more thats all, especially after all the threads where people cream themsleves over the performance!

    I'm not stupid and wouldn't write this sayin it doesn't make much difference and then spend 500 squid on it! but hopefully people thinking about parting with this sum of money might think twice, trial it first.

    Not quite myself at the mo so the post might not have made sense the way i wrote it so apologises.

    Paul
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  22. simon-s3
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    simon-s3 Member

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    [Apr 23, 2008]
    The exhaust sounds better and the turbo is louder after the remap, thats a bonus too. I think it is £450 well spent on my car.

    Did you do the same test between the cars before the re map ? His car may have been slower to start with due to engineering tolerances etc. You may be lucky and have a good example with over Std performance (if so, you lucky chap).

    Why don't you get your mate to swap back to Std and re-test and then try driving each others cars against each other too. Change back to mapped and do the same again and sway cars too.
    #21
  23. jamiekip
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    jamiekip Guest

    [Apr 23, 2008]
    Interesting post!
    Question - as your mate has the bluefin - has he actually loaded the right map on his car ;) or is it running standard. Don't mean to sound like i'm tkaing the pee, but by 3rd gear you shoudl certainly see a difference between the two cars.
    My last S3 was chipped and it made a big difference in performance - no doubt about it!

    Regarding posts about the speedo - in my expereince, it's pretty accurate!
    I was pulled in France recently, I was on cruise control at 150 km/h on the digi speedo and got caught on the laser - they got me at exactly 150 km/h... no either there kit was out of calibration to the exact same level as my car...... who knows!!! I agree, the faster you go, the bigger the tolerance shifts!

    JK
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  24. PaulAr
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    PaulAr S3 (8P)

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    [Apr 23, 2008]
    REVO:arco: savage maps, very very good.
    #23
  25. L60N
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    L60N Guest

    [Apr 23, 2008]
    Whats the craic with speeding in France??
    #24
  26. jamiekip
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    jamiekip Guest

    [Apr 23, 2008]
    To be fair they were OK. The problem is, it's easy to speed - far less traffic than on our clogged up motorway network.
    Most of the motorways there have a limit of 130km/h (110km'h when raining), about 80 mph, as mentioned I was doing 150km/h on cruise control which is about 93mph.
    Pulled over, given a bit of a lecture "lots of accidents by british drivers recently, yadda, yadda" and fined 22 euro's to be paid on the spot (should be 45 or 50 euros, but as i wasn't stupidly over the limit and the fact I was quite matey with them they reduced it).
    They were OK to be honest!
    As the penalty wasn't much I ended up getting caught again further down the road ;)

    I do know that if you are caught doing silly speeds they can ban you on the spot and take your car.

    Also, I had a Tom Tom with euro maps and speed camera locations (still got flashed - it doesn't tell you about the one's in the tunnels!!!) and the police never said anything about it (I know some have said remove camera warnings!). Toms Toms are sold in France too you know, so I think camera warning on sat nav must be fine, it's if you have a laser detector or such like that they will read you the riot act!

    Hope that helps...
    #25
  27. newbiecrg
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    newbiecrg windsurfer

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    [Apr 23, 2008]
    Last year when I drove my S3 to Portugal I must had to be really lucky then... I speeded from Calais to north Spain always aroun 180km/h-200km/h it was around 4am though...

    I just wanted to get to Portugal.... Did the same in Spain and it was fine... but one must be carefull I know... bringing the car back to London in a month... will drive sensibly.

    In that trip average speed was 124km/h... this includes Inverness-Dover doing the running in.... I am really crazy!!

    Pedro
    #26
  28. EAGLE79
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    EAGLE79 Member

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    [Apr 23, 2008]
    True what you guys have been saying and my mate and i have been rubbing our heads in confusion, asking all the same questions, in fact my first one was

    'is your bluefin map on the car!'

    Gonna get my car rolling roaded so all will become apparent!
    #27
  29. phantom
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    phantom On Boost

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    [Apr 23, 2008]
    Tell your mate to tag along at the same time , coz if he's map is not doing anything like it says on the tin he needs it looked at!

    Try Awesome's rollers!

    p
    #28
  30. Spin140
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    Spin140 Active Member

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    [Apr 23, 2008]
    There should be a distinct difference between the 2 especially in gears 2/3 onwards.

    A guy on here had a bluefin map and claimed little difference so moved to a GIAc which he is now very happy with, I've had excellent experiences with both companies so first port of call would be Superchips HQ in bucks and get the car on the rollers with before and after prints, Jamie Turvey at SC would arrange this for you and I'd be surprised if there was any cost once you mention the forum.

    I had my TT mapped by them last friday but i always make the journey to actuate gains, the TT gained a healthy 39bhp and on the road this equates to a much better & faster driving experience, the car did make 221bhp as standard on the day which seems a tad optimistic but essentially the dyno showed an extra 39bhp at the end of the session. Superchips do use generic maps but they have several variations so give them a call because something is not right, of course you might have one of those super powered S3's that come out of the factory occasionally ?!? ---- Yeah right :)
    #29
  31. phantom
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    phantom On Boost

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    [Apr 23, 2008]
    :ninja:

    p
    #30
  32. Spin140
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    Spin140 Active Member

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    [Apr 23, 2008]
    Sorry mate couldn't resist, LOL :)
    #31
  33. phantom
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    phantom On Boost

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    [Apr 23, 2008]
    No probs mate:thumbsup:

    At the end of the day a remapped car is still gonna be 300-310bhp it is what the tuners say they give!

    But your not getting 40-50bhp your getting 20-30bhp off your remap!

    p
    #32
  34. Spin140
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    Spin140 Active Member

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    [Apr 23, 2008]
    I got 39bhp off mine for the TT but perhaps the gains are not so big on the S3 as it's already tuned, either way I'd still remap the S3 - Be rude not to !!!
    #33
  35. phantom
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    [Apr 23, 2008]
    True , it'll be the same with the TT-S mate , they won't even touch it over a STD S3 engaine and there claiming 275bhp on that, which ties in nicely with what we saw at the RR day!

    Just like the S3's of old 210bhp coz the TT was 225bhp , but when you RR'd a S3 it was 225bhp, they then brought out a 225bhp S3 emm!

    Marketing!

    p
    #34
  36. QuickNick
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    QuickNick Member

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    [Apr 23, 2008]
    Hey Spin - Is that where you were Friday am? Why'd you not use Statller?
    #35
  37. EAGLE79
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    EAGLE79 Member

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    [Apr 23, 2008]
    Well if the car is normally 262BHP roughly standard and Bluefin/ GIAC Revo etc say around 310BHP then that is a 40 BHP gain in my book. If you get the hammer then its even more!

    Gents we are both going to get our cars looked over and hopefully mine just popped out the factory at 280BHP or something! :eyebrows:

    it was just one of those things where we both scratched ours heads! did mention a blast on the motorway to see the 50 - 70mph pulling difference..... and report back after that...

    Like guys have said, my first reaction was 'is your remap on' and 'is it working right'??
    #36
  38. phantom
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    phantom On Boost

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    [Apr 23, 2008]
    It's been proved mate time and again that these cars are putting out 275+bhp on RR's all over europe and VAG_COM

    The same can be said about the Leon Cupra and Ed 30! i'm not making it up!:detective2:

    p
    #37
  39. EAGLE79
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    EAGLE79 Member

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    [Apr 23, 2008]
    Cool, well i'm not complaining! Lovin the S3 power and if it does improve with remapping then i'm all for it!

    There's an RR Day at awesome GTi soon isn't there? Anyone aware of this?
    #38
  40. lil_coz
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    lil_coz Active Member

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    [Apr 23, 2008]
    I remember reading some time ago that Audi take their HP readings at the wheels. So if on an RR day readings are taken at the flywheel, then wont the HP be more? I figured that would explain why everyone's figures were more than stated. I could be wrong and I'm sure I'll be corrected if the opposite is ture but thats how I thought it went...

    Coss
    #39
  41. phantom
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    phantom On Boost

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    [Apr 23, 2008]
    I don't know about that my mate , but the Cupra and ed 30 are fwd and there putting out upto 20bhp over book figures!

    We did our RR day in 4wd mode and corrected it down!

    p
    #40

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