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Corrupt ebay buyers?

Discussion in 'General Chat' started by AlexGSi2000, May 30, 2014.

  1. AlexGSi2000
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    AlexGSi2000 Well-Known Member VCDS Map User

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    [May 30, 2014]
    Another ebay related scenario - we have all seen this before, but this time I think I may be the victim.

    Long story short, I sold my Xbox One the other day to help fund leathers for my new bike (hardly used it anyway).
    It sold for £310 to a user from Ireland with 100% positive feedback - item was paid for within 5 minutes of the auction end via paypal - perfect.

    Organized collection - it was gone the next morning.
    Later on after it was collected, I received a polite email from the buyer stating that he won it for his son - however he wanted a PlayStation4 due to all his friends going onto that platform and asked if he could cancel the purchase.

    I responded politely by stating that it had already been sent and that it would be difficult to retrieve - even if I did then I would need to re-list and potentially have to sell it for less (2nd highest bidder stated they had already purchased on elsewhere).
    I said that if he had sent the email the day before I would have happily canceled and refunded, I also reminded that if you bid on ebay you are agreeing to purchase something.

    The courier has stated the item has been delivered (I have requested proof of delivery - which takes 2 working days) - but the buyer has stated it hasn't turned up.
    I'm guessing the buyer is hoping he can get a refund if he states it hasn't been received.

    Where do I stand with this? I'm hoping that when I receive proof of delivery then the signature makes reference to the guys name, in which case its case closed - however, whats to stop him using a fake signature or name and persist that it hasn't been delivered?

    I insured the item, but only up-to the value of £150 as insuring up-to the full value would cost £75 (combined with the £35 ebay fees almost makes it not worth selling)
    So that means that If I were to make a claim and refund the buyer I would be out of pocket.
    #1
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  3. ruffrida
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    ruffrida Well-Known Member

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    [May 30, 2014]
    been ere bud, if you can prove it has been delivered then all is good.

    I had it when i sold me last Blackberry, but the worst thing was the buyer even removed him self from Ebay, but what they dont realize is, it is all backed up by Paypal & Ebay to make sure it is dealt with correctly.

    The bad bit is you need to ring Ebay, and they are in America, but its the only way bud, i had a 15 min phone call with them, which they were totally on my side.

    Put a case in against him first then go from there!!
    #2
  4. woollyjoe
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    woollyjoe Member

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    [May 30, 2014]
    You will be covered as you have proof of delivery (receipt). In certain cases, eBay refunds the buyer and doesn't charge the seller as you haven't done anything wrong.
    #3
  5. jojo
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    jojo S3 Drift King! Staff Member Moderator

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    [May 30, 2014]
    The whole eBaY thing is a con these days. I mean charging ebay fee's for the frikin postage in itself, and they offer a dropdown menu for Royalmail prices at cost price, then they expect you to absorb the cost of the fees on it afterwards! Absolute joke!!

    What IS good about the bay is selling sh!t you no longer need, but other people have a use for it, so you can actually get something for something that you would otherwise bin.

    Saying that, there's actually not many places I trust selling my stuff now. I've had good success on the forum classifieds, FB can also be a good place to sell, but it's also a mine field aswell. Having had a bad experience off a friend of a friend. I felt bad I had to get my first FB friend involved, but it needed his intervention to get things resolved, but in the end, I'm just treating it as a bad experience
    #4
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  6. Veneeringman
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    Veneeringman Bazinga VCDS Map User

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    [May 30, 2014]
    Everytime I've sold anything on eBay I've always used Royal Mail special delivery 1. Items have £500 insurance 2. You get a tracking number......

    First time I sold a brand new iPhone I was scammed, guy paid via PayPal then did a chargeback so I called PayPal they said as long as I had the tracking number I was covered, had to wait a week while they completed their investigations then they reimbursed me, the guy disappeared off the face of the planet, I had the last laugh as I had the IEMI number of the phone, made a phone call and reported it as stolen.
    #5
  7. JG51 AUD
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    JG51 AUD Active Member

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    [May 30, 2014]
    Never had a problem buying or selling stuff on ebay, but gumtree is another story!!!
    #6
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  8. ScottishS3
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    ScottishS3 Well-Known Member

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    [May 31, 2014]
    How bad can gumtree be? People pay cash on collection don't they?
    #7
  9. sliced
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    sliced Drive safe, stay alive.

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    [May 31, 2014]
    Just tell the seller okay you'll accept item back for a refund, don't let him know it's only insured upto £150....
    #8
  10. AlexGSi2000
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    AlexGSi2000 Well-Known Member VCDS Map User

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    [May 31, 2014]
    The saga continues.

    The buyer has received the item and has opened a case on eBay stating the item is significantly not as described and extensively damaged!

    Seems he may be trying everything under the sun to get his money back for a PS4.
    I have responded to the dispute;
    "Hi, I do not wish to issue a refund for this item for the below reasons; The buyer needs to define "extensive damage" - The item was certainly not sent damaged and I maintain the device was pristine as described and pictured in the ebay listing. Please also pay particular attention to the message sent to me on the 27th May - the buyer states he would like a refund due to wanting a Playstation 4 instead - by the time I had read the message the item had already been shipped. I therefore personally deem this request unfair as it seems the buyer may be trying whatever means possible to obtain a refund due to wanting a different console. I have high-resolution pictures of the unit before it was packaged - I also have high-resolution pictures of the parcel before shipping if required."

    For reference - here is a link to the auction, you can clearly see it is as described;
    Microsoft Xbox One - 500 GB Console - With Forza 5 5050013372248 | eBay
    #9
  11. woollyjoe
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    woollyjoe Member

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    [May 31, 2014]
    I've been here before. It will work out in the end but ebay may "hold" the money. Ask for pictures and ask for pictures of packaging. It's what ebay will ask for and you can help speed it up. It will come down to ebay making a decision. Did you use it on Xbox live? In the end ebay sided with me but the buyer can say whatever they want on buyer protection. Which is why I only do collection only and film the packing of the unit. It sounds excessive, but ebay have made it too easy for buyers to take the piss with the 45 day money back garauntee.
    #10
  12. AlexGSi2000
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    AlexGSi2000 Well-Known Member VCDS Map User

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    [May 31, 2014]
    Yep, paypal have placed the money on hold and are requesting I send them the money from my bank account (I withdrew it from paypal once the buyer had paid)

    I will upload a load of pictures I took of the packaging to the dispute.

    Yes - I had used it on xbox live.
    #11
  13. tanjawi
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    tanjawi Member

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    [Jun 1, 2014]
    If the reference number on the receipt proof it been delivered it doesn't matter what name was on the signature
    ( Top rated seller )
    #12
  14. DieselJake
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    DieselJake God Mode

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    [Jun 1, 2014]
    eBay is great... for buyers, always sell elseware.
    #13
  15. woollyjoe
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    woollyjoe Member

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    [Jun 1, 2014]
    Get a screen grab from your computer when you last signed in. It will show when it was last working. The more evidence and supportive of the process you are the better. If you don't pay the paypal money, they just take it anyway so you should do this. Complain to ebay and be offended, just be calm and polite. You should be fine.

    I also agree. Rubbish for selling. I sold a designer sofa and buyer who collected herself then asked to return it because it was too big. I offered to contact the other bidders and she ended up saying it was fake and it took over 3 months for ebay to decide. It wasn't fake and there were messages where buyer said they were taking advantage of the buyer protection policy. Issue is with ebay. So now I always sell these items as cash only as buyer protection only applies on PayPal.
    #14
  16. bez101
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    bez101 Yorkshire & Humber Rep. Regional Rep VCDS Map User

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    [Jun 1, 2014]
    as above ebay will ask for pictures of the damage

    or make him return it to you before the refund is placed

    iv got something going with them at the min.
    #15
  17. AlexGSi2000
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    AlexGSi2000 Well-Known Member VCDS Map User

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    [Jun 2, 2014]
    Latest correspondence;

    Me;
    "Your message to the buyer:
    "Hi, I do not wish to issue a refund for this item for the below reasons; The buyer needs to define "extensive damage" - The item was certainly not sent damaged and I maintain the device was pristine as described and pictured in the ebay listing. Please also pay particular attention to the message sent to me on the 27th May - the buyer states he would like a refund due to wanting a Playstation 4 instead - by the time I had read the message the item had already been shipped. I therefore personally deem this request unfair as it seems the buyer may be trying whatever means possible to obtain a refund due to wanting a different console. I have high-resolution pictures of the unit before it was packaged - I also have high-resolution pictures of the parcel before shipping if required."

    Buyer;
    "Hi, #1 The issue about a PS4 is irrelevant with no bearing on this case. I purchased the xbox one and had decided to stand by my decision however The issue lies with the damage to the device (photos included). The outer casing is extensively scored and damaged to such an extent that it is extremely detrimental to the cost of the device. #2 The device was listed "As new with all protective covers and box." and "pristine condition." Both outright lies. #3 The controller back plate appears to be damaged. #4 The security seal showing the integrity of the xbox console itself has been compromised and the case does not appear to have been rebuilt correctly and as such creates the risk of electrical fault and fire hazard. Given this I am not prepared to even switch the device on for the fear of risk caused to my family and children. This has also voided the manufacturers warranty and again creates disparity with the original listing. Again I request a full refund. "

    Me;
    "In reference to the photos - I cannot see them attached to the case, please ensure they are uploaded. From your latest message I can see that you are using a lot of key-words to try and sway the case in your favor. Stating that I have lied is very strong, and I am indeed offended as I have been since this case was raised. Again - the unit was sent in as-new in pristine condition as-well as being listed as used. As I cannot see any photos I cannot make judgement on what you have stated. It sounds like the unit has been tampered with after it was shipped. If the unit has been tampered with after delivery then I am fairly sure it can be classed as fraud - obtaining a refund by deception. I am not accusing you of tampering or opening casing - but a forensic examination would certainly show fingerprints. If the unit had become faulty under my ownership, why would I tamper with it if it was under warranty?"

    I think I will try and call ebay tomorrow and try and escalate the case - if it goes in the buyers favor then I will get good and properly shafted as it sounds like he may have damaged the unit himself to aid his side of the story.
    I removed it from my xbox live account before it was shipped - so I have no way of checking to see if it has been used or not.
    #16
  18. bez101
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    bez101 Yorkshire & Humber Rep. Regional Rep VCDS Map User

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    [Jun 2, 2014]
    it could be a different unit ?
    iv had that a few times and I always water mark any thing I sell now
    iv even water marked tags on clothes
    #17
  19. AlexGSi2000
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    AlexGSi2000 Well-Known Member VCDS Map User

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    [Jun 2, 2014]
    Could be anything - its my word against his - whats to stop him uploading a picture of a damaged unit taken from the net?
    Trying everything I can at the moment - even searching through facebook with the name.
    #18
  20. AlexGSi2000
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    AlexGSi2000 Well-Known Member VCDS Map User

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    [Jun 3, 2014]
    This guy is trying every trick in the book.

    He has uploaded photos to the case, first one is of one of the plastic panels that he has stated has been removed - im guessing thats standard panel-gap that's been exaggerated due to the close-up picture, second one is the COA sticker - this looks fine and un-tampered with to me.
    Third one is of the controller - looks like he may have opened the battery flap so it sticks out a-bit.

    Its unbelievable - the thing is absolutely perfect - he is making things up to try and sound like I'm a dodgy seller.
    If he was any closer then I would be going round for a word, but unfortunately - despite being 100 miles away, it includes a ferry crossing!
    I have tried calling the guy three times, each time it goes through to voice mail - im awaiting a harassment charge now!

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
    #19
  21. woollyjoe
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    woollyjoe Member

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    [Jun 3, 2014]
    Respond and say this. eBay aren't stupid. eBay will ask him to have the item verified by an independent expert and a report created - it's up to him to prove its not as described.

    When my buyer tried similar, this is what killed their case, because no one would verify the sofa I sold was fake (because it wasn't). Only problem was eBay giving the buyer 3 months to do this. When that's a £2k sofa, thats very annoying.

    I know it's frustrating - but put out of your mind and just respond once.

    On the other side - its hilarious the buyer said that about not switching it on - he has no shame!
    #20
  22. Cruiser89
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    Cruiser89 Advanced In Car Tech Site Sponsor

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    [Jun 6, 2014]
    I've got an Xbox One and part of it's design is to have those gaps.

    That picture of the controller just looks like he has taken the battery cover off and then lightly put it back without placing it back with a click.

    Idiot.

    Not switching it on because of fear. lol. How does he get out of bed every morning?
    #21
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  23. DieselJake
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    DieselJake God Mode

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    [Jun 6, 2014]
    Chances are he'll end up sending recorded delivery for an empty box next, will have to state the weight though so possibly one filled with something you'd rather not open.
    #22
  24. moisty
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    moisty Member

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    [Jun 7, 2014]
    Sorry to tell you but ebay will side with the buyer 99% of the time. I sold a faulty Ps3 and described all the faults and guy still got a refund from me a month later .

    Also sold phones and 2 months later people have got in touch saying they are faulty again ebay sided with them even though when i got phone back there was nothing wrong with it.

    Only thing that might make a difference is that he said he didn't want it.
    #23
  25. brasiliangringo
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    brasiliangringo Member

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    [Jun 7, 2014]
    Have you actually called someone at Ebay and asked them to look into it / had a chat with them - ie initial claims it didnt turn up when it did and he put that in writing, then he is saying not as described. Ie the guy has lied once so is loosing credibility and syaing its not as described because he wants to return it. Personally i know a business seller who lets people return everything no problem less postage costs if it was ordered in error and they sell significant volume and dont have any issues. I would speak to ebay.
    #24
  26. Cruiser89
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    Cruiser89 Advanced In Car Tech Site Sponsor

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    [Jun 9, 2014]
    Yeah call eBay or live chat, give it that personal touch, then you're not just a number!! :)
    #25
  27. 45bvtc
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    45bvtc Well-Known Member

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    [Jun 9, 2014]
    I've NEVER had a problem on eBay, and I've some 23-items listed now including ex-RS3 tyres (235/35s) and ex-S3/TT engine oil (Mobil 1 and Castrol Edge Professional), and an audi-sport gilet, to name but three.

    I ALWAYS photograph everything including the internal wrapping (where necessary) and ALWAYS the external wrapped ship/post package making sure to SHOW the address label.

    Invariably I will send all photos to the recipient following ship

    And ALWAYS make sure you send it "signed for", like ALWAYS: PROTECT yourself and your FEEDBACK/reputation.
    #26
  28. AlexGSi2000
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    AlexGSi2000 Well-Known Member VCDS Map User

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    [Jun 9, 2014]
    After escalating the case on Friday I had a few emails in my inbox Saturday morning.

    In a nutshell - ebay concluded that I was not at fault.
    They also refunded the buyer themselves for the full amount - bizarre.
    So basically the guy has bagged himself an Xbox One for nothing.

    I was a little angry when I read the email - I guess its sometimes easier for ebay to just pay the buyer and end the dispute.

    I contacted ebay via chat to confirm what had gone on and to verify that ebay had indeed refunded the buyer themselves as opposed to refunding them from my pocket - they stated it was correct.
    I replied back stating "so basically the buyer has obtained an xbox for free?" - the chat session was promptly ended!
    #27
  29. Jameze
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    Jameze James

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    [Jun 9, 2014]
    That's appalling! Seems to me like eBay couldn't be bothered with this one and took the easy option.

    It's no wonder people try it on.
    #28
  30. Viking
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    [Jun 9, 2014]
    Ebay look after the buyers, as that's who make Ebay work. More happy buyers means more money going into the business.

    In this particular case they've looked after the buyer, and as the seller had done nothing wrong they looked after him as well.
    #29
  31. Cruiser89
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    Cruiser89 Advanced In Car Tech Site Sponsor

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    [Jun 9, 2014]
    That's horrific.
    Bet he's laughing all the way to the bank now. I know you now haven't lost out but that system means it's easy to play eBay. Maybe they have sent him an email saying they have to send it back to them?
    #30
  32. Jonathaan
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    Jonathaan Diesel Power!

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    [Jun 9, 2014]
    :idea: How about listing another and we split 50/50 :ninja:
    #31
  33. AlexGSi2000
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    AlexGSi2000 Well-Known Member VCDS Map User

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    [Jun 13, 2014]
    Final twist to this story - the Xbox returned out of the blue yesterday.
    Buyer obviously didn't realize the case was settled so that he could keep it.

    Now I feel like the bloody crook.
    #32
  34. woollyjoe
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    woollyjoe Member

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    [Jun 13, 2014]
    As mentioned at beginning - eBay buyer protection means they sometimes need to do this, and eBay foot the bill.

    I wouldn't worry, eBay make a LOT of money (well Paypal even more).

    How is the Xbox?
    #33
  35. jojo
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    jojo S3 Drift King! Staff Member Moderator

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    [Jun 13, 2014]
    Lol, you did nothing wrong mate, if the Xbox is in good nick, then sell it again! They got their money back and they DON'T have your XBox, which was your aim!

    Incidentally, I was listening to the radio the other day, and eBay was offering a money back guarantee on eBay purchases, so this could be part of it?
    #34
  36. AlexGSi2000
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    AlexGSi2000 Well-Known Member VCDS Map User

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    [Jun 13, 2014]
    Its as it was the day it was sent - perfect.

    Nice start to the weekend!
    #35
  37. jojo
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    jojo S3 Drift King! Staff Member Moderator

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    [Jun 13, 2014]
    So you fired it up, despite the fear of it might catch fire and blowing up? :laugh:
    #36
  38. Viking
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    Viking Member

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    [Jun 13, 2014]
    Something of a result there. Is it still for sale? As it's likely to blow up and take out the house next door when plugged in, I guess you'll want rid of it fairly quickly?

    Edit: Slightly on topic, I bought a DAB rns510 a few weeks ago, for a bargain price (less than a standard one), and when it turned up it was faulty. Wouldn't locate or lock onto any satellites. Tried getting quotes to get it fixed, all obscenely expensive, so ultimately decided a return to the seller for refund was the only viable option. That's when he started getting silly and saying it was fine when removed from the car so I must be a liar. I'd taken vids of it installed and booting up n the car, and showing the fault etc. and also vids of my existing non DABunit working correctly, and had posted all these to him. He wouldn't have it so I opened a case against him. Ebay ultimately decided in my favour and sent me a return postage label to send it back to him at their expense and when I'd returned it I got a full refund. In effect it cost me nothing to try it out, find out it was faulty, and return it. Your buyer probably had the same conditions placed on him, return it at their expense for his refund.

    Have you got a pic of the postage label to compare to the one I had to use?
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2014
    #37
  39. AlexGSi2000
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    AlexGSi2000 Well-Known Member VCDS Map User

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    [Jun 18, 2014]
    Ah, may have been the same then - I think it was a Parcelforce 48-hour sticker. Box has long gone now.
    #38

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