Audi A3 quattro vs ClioSport 172 vs Pulsar GtiR vs Passat TDI vs Jardo's old cars....

Power is merely a product of torque and revs, hence why our turbo cars make power lower down, and na cars make power higher up with revs.

Still, I see what robin means. Right gear, full pelt, it's power that's important. Torque will help you when you catch people napping midway through the traffic light GP, but in an all out race power is what counts.

I still stand by my original statement though :laugh:
 
Why is everyone so obsessed with pulling a car length ahead at 80+mph, nailing it off the line etc etc? I mean, I enjoy the performance of my S3 and don't drive around like Miss Daisy, but I'm also realistic about its capabilities and don't want to go racing everything with 4 wheels on.

The Clio 172/182 are classic performance cars but with a different design ethos (NA engine, light weight, FWD, no frills) to the S3 (turbo, quality build, 4WD, good spec). I considered a Clio V6 (another classic) and a series 1 Elise (another classic) when I bought my S3 but eventully decided that I wanted better build quality, good equipment spec, practicality and 4WD over the unique attributes of the others.

Just enjoy the car you've got or change it for one you want. Problem is, there are so many on my "want" list that I need to build a large environmentally controlled hangar to put them all in first! Oh, and win the lottery. I'd probably keep the S3 too though.
 
The Doctor said:
Why is everyone so obsessed with pulling a car length ahead at 80+mph, nailing it off the line etc etc? I mean, I enjoy the performance of my S3 and don't drive around like Miss Daisy, but I'm also realistic about its capabilities and don't want to go racing everything with 4 wheels on.
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This, my friend, is you showing your age. I agree with you 100% though :friends:
 
I would actually say that a Ph2 Clio is higher spec than an S3.

Cruise control, audio controls on the steering wheel, auto wipers and auto lights, solar reactive windscreen, 6 disc changer, heated mirrors, half leather and alcantara as standard, isofix rear seats, the spec list on non cup pack Clios is pretty vast.

You certainly get a lot more kit for your money; and if you get a good one which hasn't been taken apart they aren't that badly built. Not up to Audi standards but they don't feel cheap as such.

The reason I say this is because I was so delighted with mine; when I bought it I didn't have a clue about the spec. I saw it at the side of the road, liked it and did a deal. I picked it up at night and it wasn't until the next day driving it to work I realised just quite how highly spec'd they are.

In all honesty; I really miss mine and would certainly swap it back for the Audi.

MPG was excellent too, I used to average 34mpg easily and on a long run back to Basingstoke I saw 48.
 
Yeah I know Westy. And the age counter will click over another digit later this week. At least it means more cake.

Other signs of my age that I've noticed recently:
1. my left knee clicks when I go upstairs
2. I don't understand the obsession with Facebook, Twitter etc (and I can't use them either)
3. most of the celebrities on telly are younger than me
4. I do enjoy a "nice cup of tea" at increasing regularity through the day
5. My youngest son (he's 2) has started bringing me my slippers when I get in from work.

Time for a mid-life crisis I think.
 
The Doctor said:
Why is everyone so obsessed with pulling a car length ahead at 80+mph, nailing it off the line etc etc? I mean, I enjoy the performance of my S3 and don't drive around like Miss Daisy, but I'm also realistic about its capabilities and don't want to go racing everything with 4 wheels on.

The Clio 172/182 are classic performance cars but with a different design ethos (NA engine, light weight, FWD, no frills) to the S3 (turbo, quality build, 4WD, good spec). I considered a Clio V6 (another classic) and a series 1 Elise (another classic) when I bought my S3 but eventully decided that I wanted better build quality, good equipment spec, practicality and 4WD over the unique attributes of the others.

Just enjoy the car you've got or change it for one you want. Problem is, there are so many on my "want" list that I need to build a large environmentally controlled hangar to put them all in first! Oh, and win the lottery. I'd probably keep the S3 too though.
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<puts his baseball cap on>

You don't understand! :laugh:
 
16Klappe said:
I would actually say that a Ph2 Clio is higher spec than an S3.

Cruise control, audio controls on the steering wheel, auto wipers and auto lights, solar reactive windscreen, 6 disc changer, heated mirrors, half leather and alcantara as standard, isofix rear seats, the spec list on non cup pack Clios is pretty vast.

You certainly get a lot more kit for your money; and if you get a good one which hasn't been taken apart they aren't that badly built. Not up to Audi standards but they don't feel cheap as such.

The reason I say this is because I was so delighted with mine; when I bought it I didn't have a clue about the spec. I saw it at the side of the road, liked it and did a deal. I picked it up at night and it wasn't until the next day driving it to work I realised just quite how highly spec'd they are.

In all honesty; I really miss mine and would certainly swap it back for the Audi.

MPG was excellent too, I used to average 34mpg easily and on a long run back to Basingstoke I saw 48.
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aaaaaaarrrrrrggggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

www.clio-sport.net

go!
 
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16Klappe said:
I would actually say that a Ph2 Clio is higher spec than an S3.

Cruise control, audio controls on the steering wheel, auto wipers and auto lights, solar reactive windscreen, 6 disc changer, heated mirrors, half leather and alcantara as standard, isofix rear seats, the spec list on non cup pack Clios is pretty vast.

You certainly get a lot more kit for your money; and if you get a good one which hasn't been taken apart they aren't that badly built. Not up to Audi standards but they don't feel cheap as such.

The reason I say this is because I was so delighted with mine; when I bought it I didn't have a clue about the spec. I saw it at the side of the road, liked it and did a deal. I picked it up at night and it wasn't until the next day driving it to work I realised just quite how highly spec'd they are.

In all honesty; I really miss mine and would certainly swap it back for the Audi.

MPG was excellent too, I used to average 34mpg easily and on a long run back to Basingstoke I saw 48.
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Having been in a couple, they are not a patch on the Audi's when it comes to build quality;

They come with loads of gadgets and electronics because all French sh*t comes with it, and it nearly always goes wrong.

As for the MPG claims, I thought you got 50+ from the 1.8t? :think:

As Paul said, they are different cars and until recently when the S3's got very cheap, they had completely different target audiences.

As a weekend toy / track car they are nice, but you don't get the same comfort and refinement that you do sitting in an Audi...
 
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I don't like the versus threads generally, as they almost always get out of hand, and almost always end up with Jardo going off on one about renaults.

This is how I see it in a few simple points:

He had a clio.

It was nice (Yes, I said it, Jardo's clio was really nice, high spec, and very tidy)

There was nothing wrong with it.

He sold it for no apparent reason

He chose to buy another audi.

Now he comes on here telling us how great clios are.

If it was so great. Sell your audi, buy a clio, and leave us in peace.

I have no quarrels with you liking Clios at all, they're perfectly good little cars, I just really do not care for the constant going on about them on an audi forum. We're not interested.
 
I think they're great, and I've owned one so I can say they are great.

Lots of them are shiiiit, because they have been owned by kids who have abused them. Mine was a one owner car, with full main dealer history which was owned by an enthusiast who was in the RAF, and it only got driven every couple of months at the weekend. I am totally accepting that mine was a very rare good one; but I still loved it and know that they can be a really great car.

Depends what you want really; as a standard car they are quiet, comfortable, quick, well spec'd, good looking and cheap. A far better buy than an 8L as a standard car on the face of it.

Introduce a remap to the 1.8t and they don't seem so great, but standard for standard they trump the A3 and the S3 in every aspect other than build quality, residual values and public image.

That said, in the looks department they were a great design. Very edgy and years ahead of the market. Line the Clio and an S3 up next to each other and I think somebody unbiased and unopinionated would pick the Clio.

The reason I stopped going on the Clio forums is because they were totally unaccepting of any competetor, I always liked ASN because of the mature audience and being able to have a proper debate about other cars :)

What else have we got as a comparison to 8L's that other members have owned? Meganes, CTR's etc?
 
I've had a play with 2 ep3 type r's, they couldn't touch my standard 225 s3
 
s3clarke said:
I've had a play with 2 ep3 type r's, they couldn't touch my standard 225 s3
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About 5bh/ton the Civics way against a 225 S3.

Jason had an EP3 I think, sure he can shed some light. I've driven quite a few, I liked them but they didn't feel as raw as the Clio (but handled better) and did feel a little Japanese inside. Not sure I would buy one myself. :)

Stop being negative Prawn, you always have a go at me for not seeing other peoples opinions and being biased. Just sharing my opinion with some facts and figures :)
 
Same colour, similar angle, S3 does it more for me....

Audi_S3_2002_Absolute_Red_-_Flickr_-_The_Car_Spy_%2811%29.jpg


182Trophy.jpg
 
they must have been sick civics then but 2 of my pals had them and mine used to pull from them both
 
16Klappe said:
I think they're great, and I've owned one so I can say they are great.

Lots of them are shiiiit, because they have been owned by kids who have abused them. Mine was a one owner car, with full main dealer history which was owned by an enthusiast who was in the RAF, and it only got driven every couple of months at the weekend. I am totally accepting that mine was a very rare good one; but I still loved it and know that they can be a really great car.

Depends what you want really; as a standard car they are quiet, comfortable, quick, well spec'd, good looking and cheap. A far better buy than an 8L as a standard car on the face of it.

Introduce a remap to the 1.8t and they don't seem so great, but standard for standard they trump the A3 and the S3 in every aspect other than build quality, residual values and public image.

That said, in the looks department they were a great design. Very edgy and years ahead of the market. Line the Clio and an S3 up next to each other and I think somebody unbiased and unopinionated would pick the Clio.

The reason I stopped going on the Clio forums is because they were totally unaccepting of any competetor, I always liked ASN because of the mature audience and being able to have a proper debate about other cars :)

What else have we got as a comparison to 8L's that other members have owned? Meganes, CTR's etc?
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You had me up until there.....
 
Mk5 r32, kid round mine end with a more door one and i hammer him everytime.
 
16Klappe said:
You don't think the Clio looks a bit more modern than the S3?
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Ok - I'll agree that the Clio does look a bit more modern than an S3....but the original comment was Line the Clio and an S3 up next to each other and I think somebody unbiased and unopinionated would pick the Clio.

IMO I would say the general public would pick an S3 over a Clio any day of the week in terms of looks only.
 
kwistof said:
Ok - I'll agree that the Clio does look a bit more modern than an S3....but the original comment was Line the Clio and an S3 up next to each other and I think somebody unbiased and unopinionated would pick the Clio.

IMO I would say the general public would pick an S3 over a Clio any day of the week in terms of looks only.
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I don't know, I'm a car salesman and have been all my life so I view things from quite a distance. I look at things in ways others don't, and to be fair I make mistakes on car prices and what will work and what won't.

You might be right; I think the sort of buyer who wants a performance hatchback for what these cars are designed for might not be so clear cut. It's hard to speak for a majority as a minority. Just thoughts :)

No two ways about it though, they are two cracking cars in their own right.
 
I'd have the clio over an A3, not over the S3.
 
The one thing I will say is a huge advantage to an S3 over some of the competition is the market place being flooded with £1500 172's where as to get the right S3 you need to search for a good one. Exclusivity plays a large factor in perceived value.
 
16Klappe said:
About 5bh/ton the Civics way against a 225 S3.

Jason had an EP3 I think, sure he can shed some light.
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Chris who owned the S3 before me came across a few EPs on the road and other than wet grip he was beat..

My facelift EP felt so much quicker than my S3. Even gave more of a punch in the back with 50ft-lbs less. Even with leather and aircon it still weighed like 1270 something like that? With an even lighter flywheel than the facelifts have and a diff it was a much more rewarding driving experience. I do love the 4wd from the S3 and when it's mapped it'll be better than the EP but currently I do still miss tec and the way the EP drove and laps up insane amounts of abuse. Still a bit wary about giving the S3 death..
 
16Klappe said:
Depends what you want really; as a standard car they are quiet, comfortable, quick, well spec'd, good looking and cheap. A far better buy than an 8L as a standard car on the face of it.QUOTE]

I agree with most of what you've said bar the quiet part, the road noise from the clio is a lot louder than an S3, this is from experience as I would borrow my sisters 182 from time to time when I had my S3. I can also understand why prawn says they dont feel quick, you have to rev them hard to get the full potential out of them.

Side by side too completely different cars as well.
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Jason.s said:
Chris who owned the S3 before me came across a few EPs on the road and other than wet grip he was beat..

My facelift EP felt so much quicker than my S3. Even gave more of a punch in the back with 50ft-lbs less. Even with leather and aircon it still weighed like 1270 something like that? With an even lighter flywheel than the facelifts have and a diff it was a much more rewarding driving experience. I do love the 4wd from the S3 and when it's mapped it'll be better than the EP but currently I do still miss tec and the way the EP drove and laps up insane amounts of abuse. Still a bit wary about giving the S3 death..
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I was shocked by the performance of the EP, although I could get around and off the rounabout quicker than them. Driver skill is also another factor. Id be intersted to know the before BHP when you get your remap too, as for giving it death go for it you've replaced the cambelt, oil pickup pipe and it now sits on a fresh and better suspension the only thing your going to suffer from is heat soak lol
 
haha, I also thought the EP3 I drove was rubbish too :laugh:

It had a full fijitsubu exhaust, manifold and decat, quaife LSD, and a hondata K-pro jobby mapped to 229bhp.

Sounded wicked, but didn't feel fast enough, despite clearly being pretty rapid. handled well too, just didn't 'feel' fast enough.

It must just be me :racer:
 
mk1chopper said:
I was shocked by the performance of the EP, although I could get around and off the rounabout quicker than them. Driver skill is also another factor. Id be intersted to know the before BHP when you get your remap too, as for giving it death go for it you've replaced the cambelt, oil pickup pipe and it now sits on a fresh and better suspension the only thing your going to suffer from is heat soak lol
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Last time I logged the S3 using the usual rule I saw 225bhp up from 210bhp just from the B5 TIP/Jetex. Now on new fuel pump too.
 
Prawn said:
haha, I also thought the EP3 I drove was rubbish too :laugh:

It had a full fijitsubu exhaust, manifold and decat, quaife LSD, and a hondata K-pro jobby mapped to 229bhp.

Sounded wicked, but didn't feel fast enough, despite clearly being pretty rapid. handled well too, just didn't 'feel' fast enough.

It must just be me :racer:
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Thats probably cos it wasn't that fast.........compared to your race car lol
 
This is true. When I had a st1 A3 with 190bhp, anything with more power felt epic. My mates volvo with ~270 ish felt absolutely out of this world.

Then when you grow up with it, and all your mates around you are doing the same thing, 300bhp is really quite 'normal', it makes everything else seem really slow, when in reality, it's not the case.

it just skews your perception a bit I think.
 
Yeah i know what you mean prawn, back in the day i thought my supposedly 240bhp dc2 type r was quick but now i'm used to BT power it would feel damn slow. In reality it would still beat vxr astras in a straight line and leave them for dead in the corners but lets not start talking about vauxhalls too lol.
 
One advantage the original Clio always had over the S3 was "Nicole". She was nice. Just a shame she was French. And imaginary.
 
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