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Anyone else with this problem on 2006 2.0 TDi? Injectors...

Discussion in 'Audi S4/A4/A4 Cab (B7 Chassis)' started by jfarhead, Sep 21, 2010.

  1. lespaul
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    lespaul Member

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    [May 24, 2011]
    Cool I spoke to vosa too. Although not had a failure I sent in a report with my worries. Well sent them an email yesterday and was told this will soon be sorted. They were waiting to hear back from VAG
  2. v1raj
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    v1raj Member

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    [May 25, 2011]
    Hey guys,

    Not sure if this thread relates to me, but thought i'd aski anyway. I was on the way to work yesterday morning (7.30), driving on the M1 and my A3 completely cut out on me. Glow plug light started flashing.. Brakes went stiff... Couldn't turn the wheels... I'm surprised i managed to get it to the hard shoulder if im being honest!

    After waiting hours for the AA, finally managed to get it towed home. I mechanic had a look at the car and hooked it up to his computer, it displayed "Power Supply Relay for ECU (J271 or J363) Electrical Malfunction" as en error.

    Does anyone know what this error message means? Or experienced this before? How did you resolve? Is this related to the injector issues discussed here?

    Car spec:
    56reg A3
    2.0TDI 170bhp
    S-Line
    DSG

    Any advice/help is appreciated.
  3. ldavis
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    ldavis New Member

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    [May 25, 2011]
    My A4 was diagnosed with a relay fault which was replaced only for me to be told that an injector fault had appeared so I would advise you get them to check the injector as weel and potentially save you some time.

    Good news that there is a meeting between VOSA and VAG on Thursday. My car is due back from France in 2 weeks so i hope there is some positive news before then.
  4. v1raj
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    v1raj Member

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    [May 25, 2011]
    Thanks for the update.

    How are we to find out about the discusssions/conclusions of the meeting?

    Is there a way for anyone to see VOSA's current case on this situation?

    Thanks.
  5. mm707
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    mm707 Member

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    [May 25, 2011]
    May be worth you sending in a form and they will keep you updated otherwise just keep an eye on what's happening here
  6. jfarhead
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    jfarhead Member

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    [May 25, 2011]
    They will not update you as the case progresses. When chased, the response has been "we are having meetings with VAG" or "we are waiting for a response from VAG". They will update everyone who has sent in a form with the conclusion, whenever that is reached.

    I don't think you'll be able to get any details on the discussions.

    So like mm707 suggested, just fill in a form, they'll send you a confirmation letter etc, and you'll be on their database to be contacted...
  7. ldavis
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    ldavis New Member

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    [May 25, 2011]
    Sent an email to the editor of Diesel Car magazine and he has passed it on to Dr Diesel. Hopefully they can raise the issue with VAG and also make their readers aware. More pressure is a good thing.
  8. mm707
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    mm707 Member

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    [May 25, 2011]
    Maybe if nothing comes from the vosa investigation we should get as many as possible to e-mail watchdog over a day or two. If they get a lot at once they may respond.
  9. pc1975
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    pc1975 New Member

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    [May 25, 2011]
    Talking of Watchdog my wife just told me that Watchdog will tomorrow be reporting on an engine fault that could affect millions of cars, according to the TV listings in our local paper anyway.

    So I guess one of two ways of looking at this, either Watchdog have a bigger issue to look at regarding engine faults, as I can't imagine that there are milllions of 170bhp 06 or 07 VAGs knocking around. Alternatively, if they are looking at engine faults tomorrow, maybe a time to raise the sudden cut out issue that we have experienced.

    Looking at their website I can see no reference to what they will be talking about. Although there is an interesting article for C3 Picasso's which could potentially be stopped by the passenger, because the main breaking lever on the passenger side is covered by felt. The Citreon response I felt was interesting so have attached. There have been no reported incidents, this is only a potential issue, but within a month or two have taken as they decide the "responsible decision" to recall in association with VOSA. This all seems to be driven from the concerns of one company that has 3 Picasso's.

    If anyone can find info on the report tomorrow would be interested to hear.


    Response from Citroen:
    We would like to thank Town & Country Cleaners for bringing this matter to our attention.
    Citroën has sold a total of 22,000 C3 Picassos in the UK since the model was launched in 2009 and, before this case, there had been no reported incidents of the type detailed in your package.
    However, as there is a remote possibility that the conditions featured in your programme could be replicated, we have taken the responsible decision, in association with the Vehicle & Operator Services Agency (VOSA), to recall all right hand drive UK supplied C3 Picassos. The recall will require the fitment of an additional component to isolate the braking mechanism from the front seat passenger.

    This will be available via all franchised Citroën dealers under the terms of a standard VOSA recall.
    We expect the work to take approximately one hour and it will be completed free of charge. We wish to apologise for any inconvenience this may cause to our customers.

    In the meantime, C3 Picasso owners should continue to use their cars as normal. Customers wanting further advice or information are asked to call the Citroën Contact Centre on 01753 475862, or to email cuk_contactcentre@citroen.com.


    BBC - Watchdog: Some 'brake'ing news!
  10. v1raj
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    v1raj Member

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    [May 26, 2011]
    Any updates from todays meeting?
  11. mm707
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    mm707 Member

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    [May 26, 2011]
    I e-mailed asking them and this was the reply .........

    All I can tell you at the moment is that the case is still under
    investigation. As soon as we have an out come we will be incontact with
    you.
  12. ldavis
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    ldavis New Member

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    [May 27, 2011]
    I spoke with VOSA yesterday when they confirmed receipt of my form. All he said was that the meeting should have happened but had been pushed back and there was no firm date. He also mentioned that some forms are coming in with little or no information. He wasn't sure if people weren't filling them out properly of there was an issue with the automated submission system. I had to send mine by post as the submission function didn't work and the form does not show all fields on Mac browser Safari.

    Spoke to the RAC today and my car is being picked up on Tuesday and will be at the Audi garage by the end of next week so i can hopefully get back on the road soon.

    Despite my eagerness to replace all 4 injectors at this moment it makes no economic sense as there is no guarantee that they won't fail again. If they replace the faulty ones for free one at a time then i would rather they had the expense than me. Hopefully the pressure we are putting on will force them to locate and rectify the fault soon.
    Frustrating that we can't find out what is happening behind the scenes. I am sure VOSA are the same. VAG probably want to do their investigations first before sitting down to the table to discuss the next course of action.
    If anyone reading this is either an Audi mechanic or know one it would be useful to hear what they have to say, unofficially of course!
    Last edited: May 27, 2011
  13. fatbutcher
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    fatbutcher New Member

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    [May 30, 2011]
    I had issue submitting the form to VOSA, took a few attempts, so some of them blanks could be me. Wouldn't work on MAC, or PC with a non adobe PDF reader. i've had my conformation letter though, so think the last one worked ok.

    I've also had my car fixed by Audi now, they agreed to pay for the part if I paid for the labour, I took the offer as I couldn't afford to have the car off the road any longer. Still a little frustrated they said they would replace it for free, and there was other parts involved in causing the issue, but have back tracked on this now. I spoke to a technician, and he said nothing but the injector, a gasket and a few screw where replaced. Wasn't aware of any new parts or other part causing the issue.
  14. mm707
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    mm707 Member

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    [May 30, 2011]
    If anyone is having a problem with the pdf form for vosa let me know - I have a microsoft word version which is a lot friendlier - I will e-mail it to you
  15. jfarhead
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    jfarhead Member

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    [May 30, 2011]
    Fingers crossed it won't come to that... their generic responses don't sound promising though. It's the same wording I get from support staff that have usually done nothing on a task and are just hoping I'd either forget about it or hope I won't chase as it has become irrelevant...
  16. fartingfury
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    fartingfury New Member

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    [May 30, 2011]
    I would be inclined to say that if nothing comes of the VOSA investigation, maybe somebody in the UK could contact a solicitor to whom we could all send a not-huge-ammount-of-money to take a group action under the sale of goods act.
  17. Quantum
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    Quantum New Member

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    [Jun 1, 2011]
    A left-of-field suggestion:
    Maybe a solicitors letter to VOSA to remind them of their responsibilities... and liabilities. This may get their attention.
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2011
  18. Adgard
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    Adgard New Member

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    [Jun 2, 2011]
    Sorry for not updating you all recently but my a4 is still in the dealership. Had quite an annoyed service manager on the phone yesterday telling me how my car sitting in the compound was looking bad on his figures sobwould I either pay for it to be repaired or collect it. So where to go from here I have asked him that if audi do recall these injectors would he give me in writing a garuntee that they would refund the cost of the repairs. He wouldn't suprise suprise. My next question was as to why they inflated the price and could they tell me the part number of the injector they fitted last time supprise supprise it's a re manufacturedone so when questioned about why they didn't fit a brand new one he put the phone down on me and now won't take my calls. So guss what his figures are going to look bad for another month as I still can't afford the repair yet. Landrover going strong though hahaha
  19. benr
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    benr Member

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    [Jun 2, 2011]
    Well if he put the phone down on you and wont take your calls get on to audi uk and tell them that he wont talk to you.

    Also why does it make his "figures" look bad? Dont really get it.
  20. mm707
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    mm707 Member

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    [Jun 2, 2011]
    I know which dealership you mean and know from experience that they have bad attitude in there.
  21. jfarhead
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    jfarhead Member

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    [Jun 2, 2011]
    Why should they care? For every one of us that gets ripped off and ignored, there are 20 other Audi owners with deep pockets that will just pay any price thrown at them, keeping these dealerships in business. Unlike independents, they don't rely on good reputation to keep going, they just need sheep with money and ignorance. Unfortunately I have nothing useful to add, and reading all this just makes me angry... I've had to stop posting for a few days to keep me from going off at one about them...
  22. matthew999
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    matthew999 Member

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    [Jun 3, 2011]
    hello all, i have just registered to post on this forum. this is sad new man, i have just reserved this car

    https://www.tescocars.com/cars/audi/a4/590843/audi-a4-diesel-avant-20-tdi-quattro-170-s-line-5dr/

    and now i really dont know what to do, i have been trawling the net for 6 months to find this and with all these horror stories im tempted to let it go.

    do i get it with the rac 2 year warrenty but i dont even know if they will over it their warrenty document isnt very concise.

    jfarhead would you mind telling me who privides your warrenty

    cheers

    matt
  23. Dens
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    Dens New Member

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    [Jun 5, 2011]
    Hi all
    I have a A4 avant 2.0L T.D.I 170 56 plate and it has let me down no end. 3 injectors have failed on me in the last 3 months and its out of warranty so cost me a small fortune. FSH, cam belt booked in for monday and the 3rd went last wednesday. I am totally lost I have already contacted Audi with a formal complaint and all the costings but to no avail. All my confidence has gone in this car as I have read that changed injectors have failed
    within 11k . Lovely car to drive but I do not trust it. I cannot believe I have just said that about ''Audi'' but its true.
  24. Quantum
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    Quantum New Member

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    [Jun 5, 2011]
    Hi Matt,
    I'd hate to DEVALUE the BRAND but I'd think twice before purchasing one of these time bombs. Come to think of it, who is devaluing the brand, AUDI by not facing up to their responsibilities? I note that due to stalling faults, the lesser(?) brands: Nissan have recalled 2.14 million cars and Honda 700 thousand cars.
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2011
  25. jfarhead
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    jfarhead Member

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    [Jun 5, 2011]
    It's only a breakdown cover + repair warranty from AA, around £145. I just needed it to cover 2 people driving the car, and it will cover up to £400 or £500 per claim (4 claims a year max). All I need it for is the just-in-case, and to make sure most of the cost is covered.
  26. Barker44
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    Barker44 New Member

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    [Jun 6, 2011]
    sent my report off to vosa and recieved a phone call the following day telling me that this is a serious issue that they are trying to get to the bottom of......he said i was added to the pile of over 70 other claims of the same problem....

    the case gets stronger
  27. Dens
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    Dens New Member

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    [Jun 9, 2011]
    Spoke to VOSA today and was told that VAG are covering the cost of injectors but not the cost of labour. Then spoke to VAG and they seconded it.
    that. So cheaper injectors but that does not solve the problem of recon being fitted and still breaking down.
  28. mm707
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    mm707 Member

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    [Jun 9, 2011]
    Do we still have to wait for a breakdown before they will replace an injector or are they replacing them by doing a recall ? If they're only replacing after a breakdown then it is still a safety issue that needs resolving which is why we all contacted vosa.
  29. jfarhead
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    jfarhead Member

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    [Jun 9, 2011]
    Exactly.

    And will they be covering costs for every Audi owner with the issue, or the select few that service with Audi, because if that's the case, the response means nothing, they've just rephrased what they already do anyway (with some argument from owners).
  30. Jeeves
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    Jeeves quattronly

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    [Jun 9, 2011]
    Picked up the link to this from Briskoda.net (not that it applies to my Skoda I hope), so thanks.

    My 2007 A4 2.0 TDI S-Line Special Edition turned 4 yrs old in March, and I decided that after a year in the wilderness (where there's a good chance of goodwill) a 3rd party warranty was required. Reading this, I'm so glad I took one out. WarrantyWise seem to cover most things including also (but optional) the DPF whereas Warranty Direct do not.

    Although its some relief that Audi appear to be covering the faulty injector, I'm disappointed that it's a remanufactured unit as that's compounding the variability of the injectors. Furthermore, if the labour is not covered then potentially you are paying for upto 4 times the labour cost (assuming 4 separate failures) rather than 1 slightly larger labour charge for replacing all four injectors simultaneously.

    If you have a warranty with a relatively high excess then you could be paying for 4 excesses when there's an argument to say that in fact you shouldn't pay for any labour!

    Clearly this is for four cylinder units. It looks like the 3.0 seems to also have problems and presumably costing 50% more to rectify.

    Will Audi retrospectively reimburse those affected if they (Audi) ultimately do the honourable thing and announce a recall? I'm on my 6th consecutive new Audi and considering a 7th. Perhaps its time to take the blinkers off and look further afield than VAG.
  31. KMoore
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    KMoore New Member

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    [Jun 9, 2011]
    Hi, I was miserable a few hours ago, now I'm more like suicidal. We bought our 07 A4 Avant 170 Tdi last August. High mileage but very clean with FASH. Cars been going great until this morning when my wife was travelling to work at 70+ on the fast lane of the M6. No steering and no brakes etc. To say I am unhappy about this is an understatement.

    Got the car picked up by a friend who owns a garage. He's got back to me to say its an injector. He's given me a price of £480 + VAT for the injector then fitting on top. After reading the pages on this thread, I really dont see why I should be paying for it at all. Thing is, do I have a leg to stand on as i brought the car from a bloke who i think was a trader (ebay), and he acquired it from a lease company.

    I am going to ring the Audi dealerships in my area (Cumbria) tomorrow, and argue that its a fault with the car and should be replaced by any Audi dealership. I suspect I wont get very far.

    Will def be filling in the VOSA from as well. Anymore suggestions?

    Thanks - and to think I was buying into a well respected brand.
  32. pc1975
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    pc1975 New Member

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    [Jun 9, 2011]
    KMoore, unfortunately welcome to the thread, as you'll see from the comments as you have fash then you'll have more chance of the factory goodwill. Personally, I'd email audi customer services saying exactly what appendedtonight and then ring audi customer services in the morning. Id then ask them who you can get the car transported to. Also from my experience I'd ask how long they will take to diagnose and then fix. I tried to be polite during my conversations, which was difficult at times, tell them how dangerous it is and I guess it cut with no warning etc. Hopefully, you'll be able to get the goodwill, or some. The worst part for me was when asked what could have been better, I said if they'd had a courtesy car for the 5 days I was without to be told is need to give about 2 weeks notice. When I said that would be difficult given the sudden loss of everything, the 2 weeks was re-iterated.

    However, as jfarhead will no doubt agree this is not about the payment, albeit a significant hit. It's about the safety, I now have a family car that I've had for 10 weeks and for about half of that my family will not get in it........
  33. Adgard
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    Adgard New Member

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    [Jun 9, 2011]
    6 weeks 2days countless phone calls emails leagle letters and me marching in to the dealership managers office and I have had my car back repaired for free and washed but still they don't want to give me any paperwork for the work they have done. After a phone call to audi uk paperwork is in the post. The end of it some may think? No not at all, all this means is I now only have 2 more injectors left to fail in theory I am still going to keep pushing in every way I can to get a recall on theese injectors. If not for me but the safety of every road user out there
  34. ldavis
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    ldavis New Member

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    [Jun 10, 2011]
    Got my car back yesterday and Audi dealership had replaced all 4 injectors + wiring loom for free. Very happy with this outcome however there is still the possibility of future failures however VOSA will update me with the outcome. Having spoken with Audi UK and VOSA they were aware of my situation even before the car was repatriated from France and diagnosed by my local dealership. I spoke with VOSA and they said the VAG had agreed to replace the injectors free of charge and that i should tell this to my Audi dealership and Audi UK. I did this by neither new any thing about it. Contacted VOSA again and they spoke with VAG and within 30 minutes i had a call from Audi UK to say that they were on the case and would deal with my car once the diagnosis was completed.

    On tuesday they identified 1 injector had failed and told me all 4 would be replaced free of charge. Got my car back wednesday evening.

    Although it is a frustrating situation it pays to speak with people at VOSA, Audi UK and I also have this issue being highlighted in the July addition of Diesel Car Magazine. Keep them updated and push politely and keep pushing. I bought my car second hand last year from a dealership and it has FSH.

    I will monitor the situation closely to see what comes back from VAG on the root cause. For now, other than selling the car the I have had the best outcome.
  35. Swainy
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    Swainy New Member

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    [Jun 10, 2011]
    I purchased my 07 Quattro Avant from a dealer May 2010, 11600 miles, full Audi service history. 1st went in Sept 10, replace with 70% good will, 2nd Oct 10, replaced about80% good will, 3rd pick up as fualty by Audi dealer at long life service, 100% good will and last shows signs and was replaced at 100% good will. It cost me about £350 for 1st and 2nd injectors but the rest were free. Make sure you push for 100%. If my dealer can do it they all should! Since found out, by the bubbling, that it has had a rear quater which is going rusty on arch - must get it done! :lmfao:
  36. jfarhead
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    jfarhead Member

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    [Jun 10, 2011]
    VOSA are having yet another meeting with VAG because the free replacement interim solution, does not actually solve the safety issue because it is only after a failure has occured. From what I understand, this measure is done on a vehicle basis, and not whether it has been serviced by Audi or not. I will assume they will charge for diagnosing the problem and then the labour time to fit it, and it probably does not include the loom.

    The next meeting should cover whether you can claim back money lost on replacing the injectors, whether all should be replaced, and whether they should be done before a failure happens (effectively a recall).

    I am still trying to get my money back, but this has given me more ammo as VOSA have told me to go to Audi UK with the receipts and "see what happens" based on the current evidence... which I will... I blew about £1000 in diagnosis, towing, and replacement (twice), I plan to get it back. We plough on... better let the Seat, VW, Skoda people know!
  37. stidge20
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    stidge20 New Member

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    [Jun 10, 2011]
    This serves your right for buying an Audi A4. Troll. Audi A4s are not as cool as BMW 3 series. BMW 3 series 4 EVA!!!!!!!! I am trolling this thread.

    BMW 4 EVA. Audi A4s sux 4 EVA. I AM A TROLL
    siu00adg likes this.
  38. Dens
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    Dens New Member

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    [Jun 10, 2011]
    Don't be a Prick.
  39. siu00adg
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    siu00adg Member

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    [Jun 10, 2011]
    **** YOU! S-LINE BEATS ANY BMW!!!!!!!!! EVEN M5s!!!

  40. lespaul
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    lespaul Member

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    [Jun 12, 2011]
    I had this from VOSA

    Audi have not called a recall at the moment, but as yet don't know what the final outcome will be. We have had notification that Audi will change the injectors when they fail free of charge up to 84 months old. But this does not prevent the problem from happening in the first place so we are still working on it.

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