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Discussion in 'A3/S3 Forum (8L Chassis)' started by Essflee, May 13, 2008.

  1. jojo
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    jojo S3 Drift King! Staff Member Moderator

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    [May 15, 2008]
    That would make sense, it's all coming back to me now, I remember seeing a table with requested boost values at different revs through vagcom.
    #41
  2. NHN
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    NHN Retrofitter - Audi - VW - Skoda - Seat Site Sponsor VCDS Map User

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    [May 15, 2008]
    Yeah I would be interested to know what Si says tbh, if he doesnt offer something I would be very surprised.

    But if the car had the sensor fault when it had the map & we all know that vag/5052 dont always get a fault up with the temp sensors & I know this as I had changed mine on my S3 way before he mapped my car, then you could look at it from devils advocate stance of, if they wernt aware your car had a fault, then its not really there fault in the 1st place, hey I'm just being fair to you & them, I'm not biaised to Si but you have to be fair, he has done literally hundreds if not thousands of maps & never had a major issue he couldnt resolve.

    But if you want to leave it there then no worries, I just think its not as clean cut you you have portrayed to the rest of us, there are many factors involved in this that you, amd, jabba could never control so its one of those up in the air issues mate, as far as this issue goes I'm neutral, I dont favour amd or you, just looking at it from my personal experiences from my S3 & many others I know he has worked on mate.

    Let me know please.

    Thanks.

    Nigel.
    #42
  3. S£
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    S£ Member

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    [May 15, 2008]
    Nigel i can understand that your obviously friends with Si and your trying to look out for his company, but as i said above when i got my S3, I booked it in with AMD for a check up and rolling road as i was curious of the power out put, Little did they tell me that the RR is worthless as they pull a fuse to make it run 2WD and there fore not get a accurate read out, 227bhp on a mapped S3 to be precise, but they were more than willing to take my money and when i questioned the salesman behind the counter he said my map was **** in so many words and tip toed around all other questions then suggested one of theres will put i right. It wasn't until Leggy had been back there with his problems and spoke to the mechanic and he explained the whole RR procedure with S3's and the Haldex system which was then passed on to me.

    This in my eyes is not a way to run a business, selling something they can't provide.
    #43
  4. Essflee
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    Essflee Well-Known Member

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    [May 16, 2008]
    Well Nigel....
    I have just got off the phone to Amd, and like i predicted.... a complete waste of time. Your friend Simon is from the Woking branch, i've been talking about Amd at BBT in West Thurrock. I spoke to them and asked about the remaps, he admits there remaps could be 4 years old or even possibly anything up to 9 years old when the S3 first came about. He could see nothing wrong with this and the same went for the Revo maps they do, he said they could be 4 years old too ! I did say, so your telling me Revo wouldn't be up dating their maps ? and he said that is correct !
    The boost peaking at 1.9 he believes is rubbish, it is impossible for that to happen with a K04 and i am being span a yarn, he didn't seem to agree with me that Rempas have been developed further in the last few years !
    To be honest it's a complete waste of time, one company blames another and so on....
    However, i know where i will be going in the future now.....
    that was never a doubt !!!!!!
    #44
  5. Dave_Bayern
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    Dave_Bayern Slipping at 3.5Krpm

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    [May 16, 2008]
    Might be worth spending a few £ with a Custom Code dealer/JBS for a phase two.

    They HAVE been recently updated, and in fact are tailored to a degree for every car.

    I dont know anyone (except prawn who has the same remap) with figures as high or graphs as smooth as CC phase 2......
    #45
  6. Essflee
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    Essflee Well-Known Member

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    [May 16, 2008]
    I've had the car Remapped with Jabba now cheers Dave.....
    Touch wood....everything now seems to be hunky dory !!
    #46
  7. Dave_Bayern
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    Dave_Bayern Slipping at 3.5Krpm

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    [May 16, 2008]
    Yup, and Jabba are great.

    A3_Turbo has a Jabba map on his K03s and he says its pretty good now that its sorted.
    #47
  8. Ess_Three
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    Ess_Three Active Member

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    [May 16, 2008]
    Whoever told you that is a fool.
    My old S3 was running 1.9 bar (Ok...1.89 bar boost) on and off for years (over 5 years) and it's still on it's original turbo.

    1.9 bar is well over 330 lb-ft by the way...if you haven't got 1.8+ bar of boost...you haven't got 330+ lb-ft..and consecuently, if you only have 280 lb-ft, you aren't making 1.9 bar.

    But it's possible...on the limit for the con rods though, I believe.


    Another thing...if using VAG Com to measure charge pressure, you can't measure 1.9 bar boost as the std VAG MAP sensor saturates at around 2650 mb..so around 1.6 bar of boost!
    You need an accurate logging external pressure transducer to log boost when running daft high boost.
    #48
  9. A3_Turbo
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    A3_Turbo Swaying towards IHI....

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    [May 16, 2008]
    Interesting thread,

    Just my 2p But Jabba are great in terms of after-sales. Had my original Map done and wasnt making any-where near Prawn Or Daves power levels BUT it was really smooth it was only boosting to just under a bar and made 250 ftlb's took it back to Jabba mike had it back and now its hitting 1.5 Bar.

    Most companies wouldnt have cared but i found Jabba really helpful.

    J
    #49
  10. Essflee
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    Essflee Well-Known Member

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    [May 16, 2008]
    Ess Three.....
    I was under the impression that running anything over 1.6 bar was bad for a standard k04, i cant personally measure the charge pressure, but when i put my Sealy vag code reader on the car this is a fault that kept propping up, when i looked up the code one of the reasons for this described was to much boost (excessive)
    I dont know enough about boost pressures = Ibs ft ot torque, i just relay what i'm told. Apparently Mike has now set the car to run at 1.5 bar on Shell V power. I was using Bp ultimate, which is meant to be **** !
    The torque figures i have now are 402nm on Bp, but Mike reckons he has set the car up now to run on Shell, and should raise this figure to about 410ish i believe.
    #50
  11. Essflee
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    Essflee Well-Known Member

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    [May 16, 2008]
    A3 Turbo.....
    I completely agree with you, i know it's only my first visit but i tended to get a good vibe from Mike. Although some times he did tend to lose me when talkiing about what and why he was doing this or that.....if you know what i mean !! I had read about your car and s3Steve's car going in which i think swang me that direction....glad it did !!
    #51
  12. Ess_Three
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    Ess_Three Active Member

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    [May 16, 2008]
    It's not the best place for the turbo to be..but as long as you look after the oil, it's fine.

    Trouble is, at those sort of pressures the K04 is just a heat pump...so you get LOTS more heat for smal increases in pressure...so in order to run 1.8+ bar, you really need very efficient ICs..or you potentially gain torque but loose top end power as the timing is wound back to protect against the extra heat.

    The conroda are the weak point...apparently.
    The limit was regarded as 300 lb-ft...but I remember telling Mike at GTI Int'l one year I was running 330 lb-ft and had been for nearly a year..and his voice went up a couple of octaves and he lookes somewhat shocked.

    In all honestly...315-320 is fine...at 330 its not nice to drive on a K04...too harsh a torque delivery and you end up fighting the car.


    You get that code when you go a certain percentage over the max boost set point I seem to recall...or of you saturate the MAP sensor.
    I tried using an electronic MAP clamp to fool the ECU into not seeing a saturated MAP and prevent limp..but you have to be damn sure your fuelling, EGTs etc are all OK before removing a safety element like that..so I removed it.


    1.5 bar peak is a nice sensible amount...should be 270ish lb-ft I think at that.
    What's it holding to the limiter?
    You physically can't hold much more than 1.2-1.3 bar by the fuel cut as the K04 is too small to move enough air to fill the cylinders...so the boost always tails off.
    #52
  13. Essflee
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    Essflee Well-Known Member

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    [May 16, 2008]
    I'm not to sure, when i work out how to put my graph up i will......
    #53
  14. S3Steve
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    S3Steve Active Member

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    [May 16, 2008]
    Glad to see another happy Jabba customer, the thread makes for interesting reading its always good to get lots of different peoples perspectives on different companies, i think it helps people make informed decisions on where to take your car.
    #54
  15. Essflee
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    Essflee Well-Known Member

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    [May 16, 2008]
    Oh yes !! and hopefully after reading this....
    you'll know where not to go !!!!
    #55
  16. NHN
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    [May 16, 2008]
    I'll catch up to this thread properly tomorrow as Olly had some cookie issues earlier on server & only just got back on the site, plus finishing my rns-e sds setup, which is cool with the new mfsw fitted.

    But I will say I'm neutral in this, I dont favour amd(Si) over Jabba, just havnt had any issues with Si atall, I dont personally know Jabba so I wouldnt know if they are good or not, if they were closer to me then I might try them, but Si is closer & he's never faulted me so I will continue to use, so please dont tarnish me with the oh you are looking out for your mate & the company cause it simply isnt true, I'm just advising of my experiences of working with Si & you have said you spoke with BBT guy, I did advise better to speak with Si, he is the main man not BBT guy, mate trust me.

    Jabba have a very good rep, alot of very happy people & they obviously know there stuff aswell & I havnt knocked Jabba once from what I can recall, we are all in same boat as we really dont know whose right, Jabba probably has had clients with issues like yours that have also gone somewhere else mate, Si as Jabba have both done a hell of alot of maps without any problems at all, bet they all have had ***** ones & problems, I mean personally I dont rate QST in haywards Heath for work they didnt do to my car but still cost me £400, but I know that they can be arse's anyway from other people & they are very stuck up there own arses tbh very, think they know it all, they overcharge & underwork, but others have been happy with there work, even though there prices are absolutely extrortionate & they always find a problem on your car that needs fixing when it wasnt a problem before you went in, so it swings & roundabouts tbh.

    I will say, you have made your case, you prefer Jabba, others have had amd maps which are maybe same as with previous owners & they have been extremely happy with service & they still are, think its time to stop bashing the drums & move forward to more progressive things as I think we would all agree point has been made.

    I am just also playing devils advocate on this aswell & I will also put hands up if wrong & agree with anyone if they are right, so fair play, you are happy now with your car & I'm happy for yer as I know all to well anxieties on your nice car really piss you of, lol, like me 2 days back when the mfsw new control module broke, thats another story........................

    Anyway I will read all I missed tomorrow, I wont quote anymore on this amd issue, point has been made & its finished I beleive.

    On another note, they are making a sequel to Point Break if Swayze can get over his cancer, hope he does, thats if he can put his damn fags down for the treatment.
    #56
  17. j4jon
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    j4jon Member

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    [May 17, 2008]
    Is it possible to change the MAP sensor to one that can read higher to get around the maximum boost vlue?
    #57
  18. shaun@amdessex.com
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    shaun@amdessex.com Member

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    [Jul 2, 2008]
    Hi

    I have only just had this thread brought to my attention.

    I am only replying because a number of very important FACTS seem to have been left out of the various posts.

    The customer brought a car to us which would not pull beyond 60mph and had a number of stored faults in March. He had previously had other suspension work carried out by us in 2007.

    We changed the MAF sensor and remapped the vehicle which then ran well.

    He returned 2 weeks later with running problems. We kept the car 2 days, fitted a new temp sensor and road tested. Kept the car overnight to ensure no problems.

    He called that day to say it was down on power and we said give the car a few days to adapt. We didn't hear from him again until about a month ago.

    He had taken the car to Jabba who said the map was old technology and was overboosting. I said bring the vehicle to us and we will look at it but he said that he had already got Jabba to remap the vehicle.

    I personally feel that Jabba found another fault with the car and sorted it but we'll never know.

    He wanted us to refund his money which was not possible because he had not returned to us for diagnosis.

    We offer a 30 day money back guarantee on any remap that we sell if a customer is not 100% happy. As this was after 3 months and also the code had been wiped from the car I do not think it unreasonable.

    We are a company which has a great many satisfied customers who return to us time after time with various cars.

    All our mechanics are VW/Audi trained and all are involved in the running of our VAG vehicle racing team so we guarantee that your car is in good hands.

    On this thread I think one other person was not happy with the rolling road that they received and the result. I will PM them so that we can ascertain exactly what happened on the day they were here.

    Regards
    Shaun Hollamby
    AmD Technik (Essex) Ltd.
    #58
  19. Essflee
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    Essflee Well-Known Member

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    [Jul 2, 2008]
    I'm sorry but i have to disagree that my car wouldn't pull over 60mph, I'll agree that when i brought the car i wasn't overly impressed with the performance, being the MAF did majke sense...but it is over an hours drive to your workshop and i know for a fact that the car wasn't limited to 60mph....that is a crock !! I did suggest to you that the bad running of my car could be down to the map, and you squashed that idea to my face straight away !! i never knew of a 30 day refund as i would of taken this route for sure ! but then.....apparently, their was nothing wrong with the map ??:o.k:

    As you know a friend came to see you too a little while later for a RR test, forget the results because their here nor their....the fact he found a big hook as big as your fist hanging below his car a couple of weeks later that had obviously been used during his RR is a cause for concern on its own....the damage that could of bin caused to another vehicle on the road really isn't worth thinking about !!

    I'm sure you do have plenty of happy customers and yes i was happy when you did the suspension on my previous car, but you know how things work....the bad experiences get remembered....and between me and my mate in the space of 4-5 weeks both having bad experiences for very different reasons isn't very reasurring....and this is the reason for this thread....
    #59
  20. shaun@amdessex.com
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    shaun@amdessex.com Member

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    [Jul 2, 2008]
    Hi

    Surely you remember me, personally, dropping you and your girlfriend off at Lakeside Shopping Centre in your car after which I took your car for a normal pre-map road test.

    When the car was extremely slow I contacted you immediately on my return (5 minutes later tops) and informed you we need to look into that problem before we map the car.

    Now if you don't remember that we may as well end the conversation there to be honest.

    I have PM'd your friend and I will look into that.

    Regards
    Shaun Hollamby
    AmD Technik (Essex) Ltd
    #60
  21. NHN
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    [Jul 2, 2008]
    Oh so Shaun, are you saying the car had the slow fault before you mapped the car?

    Thats thrown a whole new light on this matter.
    #61
  22. Essflee
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    Essflee Well-Known Member

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    [Jul 2, 2008]
    shaun...of course i remember you dropping me and my girlfriend off in my car, i also remember calling you when my car was finished and you said you were on your way to pick us up....half hour later i rang you back to findout where you were to be told you hadn't even left the shop, one of your collegues had to come and get us in the end !!

    I never disputed the car wasn't running right and obviously a new MAF was needed, i have just stated that i was no where near limited to 60mph on my journey down to your workshop !!

    If had the choice, i'd of rather had an up to date remap on my car and walked to the shop with the missus....than to get a lift and an old remap.... that was an expensive Taxi ride !!
    #62
  23. shaun@amdessex.com
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    shaun@amdessex.com Member

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    [Jul 2, 2008]
    Hi

    To be completely fair to Leggy we thought we had got to the bottom of the problem and if we hadn't then we would have wanted to try and resolve the problem.

    If we couldn't have, for whatever reason, then we would have offered him a refund although I can't remember a car that we haven't been able to fault find. We weren't given a chance to do that before he went elsewhere.

    I understand that it is frustrating for a customer to think that he is not getting anywhere but it would have been better to vent their frustration on me rather than on a forum?

    I can understand his frustration and why he wouldn't think that he wanted to discuss it with us before taking your custom elsewhere and as a goodwill gesture I will offer you (Leggy) a credit note for the AmD remap.

    Call me and we can arrange that.

    I would also love to put your car on our rolling road to see the difference between ours and those very fast rollers up at Jabba!

    Regards
    Shaun Hollamby
    AmD Technik (Essex) Ltd
    #63
  24. shaun@amdessex.com
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    shaun@amdessex.com Member

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    [Jul 2, 2008]
    Hi

    You've just replied whilst I was writing.

    Sorry we didn't pick you up promptly.

    The "old map" story doesn't really hold water to be honest.

    If no hardware has been changed and the remap was correctly written why would you alter the information?

    We would alter the timing settings if a customer specifically need this for a specific fuel but in 99% of cases a mixture of fuel qualities is used which the standard ecu can deal with in the adaptation values.

    There is no reason why a map written yesterday will be any better than one written 5 years ago. If anything there is a good chance it would be worse depending on who writes the code and the testing procedures used.

    Regards
    Shaun Hollamby
    AmD Technik (Essex) Ltd
    #64
  25. Essflee
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    Essflee Well-Known Member

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    [Jul 2, 2008]
    A remap that is written yesterday for instance is going to be better than one written a few years ago...technology has improved and the clever people out their have learnt new thing's about the engine and how to extract the best from it... it's the same as anything...

    For instance.... if a new game's console is released, the games only get better, because the people writing the games are learning to use the full power and potential of the games console....it takes time to perfect !!

    I appreciate the suggestion of a credit note, but i would prefer a straight refund.... Thanks !!
    #65
  26. shaun@amdessex.com
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    shaun@amdessex.com Member

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    [Jul 2, 2008]
    Hi

    We'll have to agree to disagree on that.

    The offer was for a credit note not a refund.

    Regards
    Shaun Hollamby
    AmD Technik (Essex) Ltd.
    #66
  27. abdus
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    abdus Top Gear VCDS Map User

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    [Jul 2, 2008]
    lol, a credit note to make a purchase at AmD Technik again (for Leggy obviously)? (from above) I don't think he will like to deal with AmD again
    #67
  28. Olly_K
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    [Jul 2, 2008]
    Speaking from personal experience, from working at a VAG tuning company, other tuning companies always....ALWAYS looks at a car tuned at another tuner and slag off whats been done....it gives the customer confidence in the new tuner.

    And, a generic map is exactly that, its not set up for your car is it ? Its not going to be up to date ? it probably hasn't been touched for years !

    Maybe you should of saved your pennies and bought a custom remap, tailor made for your car ? You get what you pay for at the end of the day I guess.

    And by making the car produce more power is bound to pull up new problems.

    From a customer's perspective, I think shaun has done everything he can to try and make you happy. Whinging about being picked up late ? get in a taxi my friend.
    #68
  29. NHN
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    [Jul 2, 2008]
    Considering AMD's version of events/input today if believed to be honest which I would think it is, so you can see both sides of the story not just Leggy's, then he's lucky to be offered that no???

    He didnt have problem before when he used there services, anyway I'm sure Shaun would honour the credit note whoever used it, hint hint.

    There are 2 sides to this story as we have found out today, I dont favour AMD I read both sides & base on experience you can see how it got to this point if you read from the beginning.

    Take the credit note, make a deal with someone who would use AMD & maybe you get your money back, then this chapter is resolved, just a suggestion of course.
    #69
  30. abdus
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    abdus Top Gear VCDS Map User

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    [Jul 2, 2008]
    well said :iagree:
    #70
  31. NHN
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    [Jul 2, 2008]

    :applaus:
    I have to say Olly, I couldnt have said it better, well put & fair, Shaun has done everything any tuner would do & more & as Olly states whingeing about small things like picking you up is kinda silly TBH & irrelevant to your complaint, if it bothered you so much then why did it take 3 months to get to this position??

    If was me I would be back there like a rat up a drainpipe until resolved & if they didnt resolve I would have asked for a refund & they as stated would have refunded, so I cant really see how they did you wrong.
    #71
  32. jojo
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    jojo S3 Drift King! Staff Member Moderator

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    [Jul 2, 2008]
    Not trying to defend AmD in any way, but I have had no problems whatsoever with my prehistoric mapped AmD Stage1 S3, but it was mapped by AmD when they we're based in Bicester, so it's fair to say it's not the work of the guys based in Essex, but I would have belived it's essentially the same generic map after all these years.
    #72
  33. NHN
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    [Jul 2, 2008]
    Same maps I believe, Shaun can you confirm???

    Generic map like Leggy's & most others doubt would be changed even from 4 years ago as they were good then & still good now, the old saying why fix something that isnt broken, it would have been something else on his car not the map itself & it does seem the case.

    Maf is so common fault its always best to have a spare in your glovebox, lol, lol, lol.
    #73
  34. Essflee
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    Essflee Well-Known Member

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    [Jul 3, 2008]
    Right to start with i int your friend.... second, it's not a case of whinging, i was simply a the beginning of this thread pointing out that i wasn't happy with the service i was getting and wasn't happy with the remap...end of ! When i booked my car in for the remap i assumed my car would have been custom remapped like my previous car in Bicester, not a generic remap several years old....i didn't to be fair know about generic maps !!
    But there are certain people on here that didn't want to let this matter sit.... this is purely my experiences, and nothing else !! I pay credit where credits due !! and the credit note to be honest is a joke........:end_of_discction:
    #74
  35. Olly_K
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    [Jul 3, 2008]
    to start with, if you don't know the difference between generic maps and custom maps then I think you should sell your car and buy a push bike.

    Stop whinging trying to get something for nothing on a public forum thinking if you make enough noise they'll do something about it.

    I don't think there is sufficient grounds to keep this thread, it will be deleted in due course as it serves no purpose to other members about the company, it only highlights your own lack of knowledge
    #75
  36. shaun@amdessex.com
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    shaun@amdessex.com Member

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    [Jul 3, 2008]
    Hi

    Thats fine. The credit note offer is rescinded.

    Cheers Shaun.
    #76
  37. Essflee
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    Essflee Well-Known Member

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    [Jul 3, 2008]
    Trying to get something for nothing.....what you on about ???
    I reckon there's quite a few people about new to the game that don't know the difference between a generic and custom map.....
    Bit of an ignorant comment really, because you know, everyone does yeah !!
    #77
  38. Olly_K
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    Olly_K Administrator

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    [Jul 3, 2008]
    true people might not know the difference.

    But if I didn't know, i'd do some research on the net, or SPEAK to some tuners to find out more.

    dont just pay for something you don't know much about and then whine because it wasn't what you thought it would be.

    thats all im saying.
    #78
  39. DNA Tuning
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    DNA Tuning New Member

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    [Jul 3, 2008]

    There's also a huge difference between a well developed stage one 'generic' map that's had potentially hundreds of hours development and a poorly developed custom map on a system that lets you edit a few areas rather than the entire file done in an hour or so..... Yes all cars are different but they all leave the factory on a generic map and are handily fitted with many sensors and an adaptive system.

    Also just to add there is only one file on a car, I think someone is confusing files with map areas.
    #79
  40. Essflee
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    Essflee Well-Known Member

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    [Jul 3, 2008]
    It was probably not confused, it was just the simplfied way the gentlemen used to explained it to me... I'm not personally a mechanic so i don't know, just say what i'm told..... and speak as i find, that was all this thread was about, to many people want to split hairs a blow it out of context !! The point was that i wasn't happy with AmD, it wasn't whinging, just stating my views, and that Jabba Sport i personally thought were brilliant, from start to finish....
    #80

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