eibach arb 's

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20vtdaz

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hi guys, ive been told that i should change my arb's to lose a lot of the cars body roll, but how well do these work, the guy recommended eibach ones for my s3 but ive done a search and someone says the eibachs only do front arb's for the s3, is this true?if not are the eibachs anygood, im hopefully going to order these tomorrow so any light on this would be great guys thanks, daz
 
H&R H&R H&R or get R32 ones from VW dealers just as cheap! and will transform the car they are one of the thing on my long long list of things to do!
 
S3 = H&R
A3 = Eibach
R32 = Waste of time, not correct for the job, get what you pay for..
 
im running r32 ones on mine front and rear and there pretty good, but i am running coilovers as well, i had eibach front and rear on my mk4 and they were very good also..
 
Got Eibachs on my a3. ******* amazing. The difference it makes has to be experiences. It's a whole different car.
 
thanks for the info guys, so wheres the best place to buy h&r arb's then, and by best i mean cheapest, its been an expensive month, the guys quoted me 150 to fit them, is that a good price, thanks again guys daz
 
Again, H&R's transform the S3 into the car it should have been.
 
I don't mean to hijack, but didn't think my question needed its own thread; might be relevant too?!?

Currently I have standard S3 suspension with 18" RSTT reps. My main niggle with the handling is the body roll, so wondered if I could fit up rated ARB's on my car without up rating the rest of the suspension first?

Ultimately I think I would like to up rate all of the suspension should ARBs alone not be an option (or improve it sufficiently for me), but due to funds I cannot jump in with both feet at the moment.

I believe this topic has been covered before but I do not believe there was a definitive answer. Has anyone else taken this route (ARB's then Shocks and Springs)?


Cheers,

ICE
 
I've done my ARBs only, initially the suspension felt a bit springy but without the body roll. Now I'm used to the springiness it feels normal.

It would be better with uprated dampers though.... but I've found the ARBs a great upgrade. They seem to sharpen he steering feel alot as well.
 
audi upgrades
how much for H&R through DPM then? i've seen them for £233 posted thats front and rear.
is it true that i have to drop the subframe to fit the front one??
thanks
 
Blunteh said:
I've done my ARBs only, initially the suspension felt a bit springy but without the body roll. Now I'm used to the springiness it feels normal.

It would be better with uprated dampers though.... but I've found the ARBs a great upgrade. They seem to sharpen he steering feel alot as well.
Click to expand...

I see you went for Neuspeeds over H&R any reason why? Don't worry if it has already been answered else where on here as I have probably already read it!

I believe one of the reason why not to upgrade the ARB's on there own is because the dampers can't handle the extra spring of up rated ARB's. Do you feel you have experienced this? Was it scary? Do you drive your car hard?

Does Lee have anything to add?

Sorry for all the questions.


Cheers,

ICE
 
vanilla_ice said:
I believe one of the reason why not to upgrade the ARB's on there own is because the dampers can't handle the extra spring of up rated ARB's. Do you feel you have experienced this? Was it scary? Do you drive your car hard?
Click to expand...

I'd like to know the same. I drive my car hard and don't really want to mess around with the suspension, just change the ARBs. Maybe thinking R32 Arbs as a middle ground if the shocks can't cope with H&R's, Eibach etc.

All comments appreciated.
 
vanilla_ice said:
I see you went for Neuspeeds over H&R any reason why?
Click to expand...

I did the same...
The reason I went with Neuspeed is that they do a proportionally larger rear bar to front bar - the rear is 1mm larger than the front.
This not only reduces body roll (as do all the kits) but reduces understeer by adding a proportionally larger rear bar.

Some things to consider:
Bigger bars reduce body roll.
Big rear bar reduces understeer - and can add oversteer.
Big front bar adds understeer.

Go too big (as I think H&Rs are I think 25/21) and you reduce body roll but don't significantly reduce understeer compared to other options (Neuspeed)

R32 is the same as the H&Rs...too big, in my view. They don't alter the chassis balance like they could if they were sized differently.
I believe R32 ARBs are not ideal at all.

In my view, too stiff all round...fine for smooth roads and non aggressive driving styles (smooth drivers) but I believe the Neuspeed ARBs are a better overall package if you have badly rutted roads and are fond of throwing the car about.


I believe one of the reason why not to upgrade the ARB's on there own is because the dampers can't handle the extra spring of up rated ARB's. Do you feel you have experienced this? Was it scary? Do you drive your car hard?
Click to expand...



Either set up on standard dampers is in my view, potentially dangerous, depending on how you drive.
I've already written off one car by having big ARBs snap unload when the standard dampers couldn't control them...I'd hate to have another added to the list.

Plenty of people will tell you it's just fine...only you know how hard you push your car....personally, I'd not risk it.
 
ess three have you driven a an S3 with teh H&Rs to compare against yours ?

Road around my way are far from good so less harshness is always a good thing.

also how much harsher is the ride with the ones you are using ?

cheers
James
 
Effect said:
ess three have you driven a an S3 with teh H&Rs to compare against yours ?
Click to expand...

Not an S3 sadly...but a TT.
Hard to judge though...
It didn't seem as keen to turn in as mine did...but that could have been down to any number of things.


Road around my way are far from good so less harshness is always a good thing.
Click to expand...

Don't get me wrong...ARBs don't really up the harshness of the suspension. But my concern was hitting a pothole/rut on full-on cornering and having the rear uprated ARB let go, if the dampers aren't up to it.

Or, having the front struggle to find grip because the ARBs are a shade too large and they are adding to understeer.

In my view, to run a front ARB the size of the H&R, I'd want more aggressive front suspension geometry as the car won't lean as much - it wasn't leaning much on the Neuspeed/Bilstein/H&R combo as it was...but I wouldn't have wanted it to lean aly less on the roads around here - or I think I'd have been breaking traction at the front and understeering.

Personally, I prefer my 4wd cars to have some compliance, in order to make the 4wd advantage work...and to get that on an S3, I found you need some lean in order to make the front suspension geometry work for you - adding negative camber as the car leans over slightly, adding to the grip.

The problem with the standard set up is that it rolls too much...hits the bumpstop on the loaded wheel and then the 'effective spring rate' goes through the roof (like having really stiff springs/dampers fitted) and you start to understeer if you hit a small bumop etc...
Too big a front ARB has a similar effect., in my experience.

ARBs are a very emotive subject though...
And driving style can play a huge part in their selection.


also how much harsher is the ride with the ones you are using ?
Click to expand...

My S3 was on Bilstein dampers, H&R springs, Neuspeed ARBs, Forge rear tie bars, 18" wheels and aggressive geometry...and it was not harsh at all.
Stiffer, yes. But never harsh or uncomfortable.

It's hard to say the ARBs added anything at all to the harshness...as I don't believe they did.
 
vanilla_ice said:
I see you went for Neuspeeds over H&R any reason why? Don't worry if it has already been answered else where on here as I have probably already read it!

I believe one of the reason why not to upgrade the ARB's on there own is because the dampers can't handle the extra spring of up rated ARB's. Do you feel you have experienced this? Was it scary? Do you drive your car hard?

Does Lee have anything to add?

Sorry for all the questions.


Cheers,

ICE
Click to expand...

Hiya mate, i'll give a full review of H&R with std suspension this evening when i have more time.
 
From my pespective it the H&R's seemed too thick but their adjustible connection means you can change their compliance (as far as I understand). I wasn't interested in changing settings until I found what I wanted though, I'd read Ess_Threes and other's comments and the logic seemed to make sense to me.

On the dampers side I figured that I don't drive my car *that* hard so it shouldn't be a problem (I spend alot of time driving in heavy traffic so you can only have fun from tim eto time ). I really don't find it any springier than the stock Honda Civic Type-R (2003) I'd had in the past (which is often critisised for overly stiff suspension for the supplied dampers). You could really feel that car skipping around on bends etc. It hated rough B roads.....

I've not had any scary moments at all....

You can tell though that it would be nicer with some decent aftermarket dampers though... But I would recommend uprated ARBs with standard springs/dampers over the standard setup. *disclaimer* I'm no expert though.. :)
 
Sorry for the belated reply.

I ran with just H&R ARB's for about 3months as i felt the body roll was completely unacceptable and spoilt the whole car. The S3 is a daily driver and i'd hoped to leave it completely std, spending the pocket money my Corrado VR6. So looked at the ARB options a i didn't really want to go mad with springs and damper etc. The H&R kit is very reasonably priced and is a quality german brand with full TUV approval for fitment with standard suspension. Any who's got engineering experience and worked with test houses such as TUV or LPCB in the UK know,s how exhaustive and expensive, (£30,000 for a spring connector for example) so no need to worry about non complience with factory parts. So the kit was ordered and the kit fitted by myself and a friend. Only real issues were bolting up the OSF retaining bracket with the thick 25mm bar (nothing bigger will physically fit) which required a bit of head scratch before figuring out that it need to be left unfixed until the subframe and rack were re-assembled. The bolt was than accessed from the wheel arch. Dead easy after a think and a cuppa. The bars are adjustable front and rear, i set mine on the stiffest setting as i practically live on the track and road cars feel incredible floppy after 60mins in a Swiss Hutless.

Driving (based on stiffest setting), amazing transformation. Virtually zero body roll. If i was to put a percentage to it, i'd say 2-3%. The most rewarding aspect though is the steering. Its was full of feel, something the standard car lacks and was somewhat unexpected. Handling wise is about at neutral as you can in normal driving. Understeer can be provoked with excessive entry speed on a trailing throttle but is not the natural characteristic. If you do make it understeer it will under acceleration or even a constant input pull itself back inline. Very forgiving. There are negetives.

As with any modification it will highlight other areas of weakness, in the same way a power conversion leads to bigger brakes. With the ARB's you'll find that you start to corner faster with more confidence than you would in a standard car...and start pushing the springs and damper near to their physical limits where before the body roll would have been off putting. Thats the only downside to these ARBs and ultimately down to your driving style and needs.

Believe me you'll be delighted if you fit them as a one off mod (there the only mod on my car i'd never give up). Every S3 should have them. If your a bit more aggressive behind the wheel in time you'll definately end up continuing down the spring and damper path to eliminate the for and aft pitch under acceleration and braking. HTH
 
Hi,

Thanks for all of the responses.

At this stage I am prepared to upgrade the ARB's with the standard suspension as I don't feel I drive "that" hard. However, I do plan to remap the car in time so would probably change the suspension at that point in time.

I will take on board Ess Three's comments regarding the ARB's unloading.

I think it is now a case of choosing Neuspeeds or H&R's. Does anyone know off-hand what ChriS3 uses?


Thanks all,

ICE
 
vanilla_ice said:
I think it is now a case of choosing Neuspeeds or H&R's. Does anyone know off-hand what ChriS3 uses?
Click to expand...

Chris was using the front Eibach ARB only - after buying based on really bad advice!
He saw the error of his ways, and did add a rear ARB...but I can't recall which one....and he's now down at GTI International, so he'll not be on for a few days.
 
From a cosmetic point of view, will uprated ARB's and standard suspension cause the car to sit any higher/lower than it currently does?

ICE
 
Replace my worn out ARB with a H&R set up supplied by DPM. Thanks for the quick delivery and telephone support.
 
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