Terrible tracking causing ESP warning light?

Squirrelofdoom

Squirrelofdoom

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Hi guys,

So fitted powerflex bushes on the front left of my car tonight (only had time for that), but have horribly messed up my tracking :S it's really quite bad. On the way home the ESP light kept flashing and I could feel it cutting in (only on corners). Then eventually the ESP warning light just stuck on. Can this behaviour happen with just bad tracking? I hope so, cuz I hope I haven't messed anything else up while replacing the bushes :S

The plan is to do the front right bushes tomorrow evening (but there is a horrible belt which is properly seized). If I can do that then can I do a basic tracking myself just to make it "ok" until I can take it to get done properly? Any guides on how to track the front myself? Sorry if it's a stupid question, but i've never tracked a car myself before.

Cheers,
Aran
 
Its seems strange how they could be connected but i could be wrong. Scan it, see what VCDS says..
 
normally happens with faulty ABS sensor and/or wiring to the sensor... had this on Danes S3..

I would scan for faults too... it should tell you a little more rather than guessing...

I assume the steering wheel is on straight?

<tuffty/>
 
^ thought about that but wasnt sure if it was the ABS light which flagged that up but given what you have confirmed, would seem likely that it has something to do with it. I had to replace a faulty one on a 2002 Tdi A3 once to but no dash lights, just abs cutting in at low speed and a simple fault code.
 
After fitting my suspension (I was quite brutal with it and I sort of winged it!) my tracking was miles out. My ESP light came on after about 10 miles then stayed on for a couple of days untill I had four wheel alignment done the following weekend. After FWA everything was spot on, drives perfect and ESP light went straight off. Not saying yours is fine but this is what happened with my car
 
Hi guys,

Hoggy, I reckon i'm like you to be honest, should fix with tracking as i've never had any ABS problems. Will track it and see if it helps. If not then i'll get it scanned. @Tuffty, no the steering wheel is almost 45 degrees off straight!! (told you the tracking was f'ed :p)
 
s3 Hoggy said:
After fitting my suspension (I was quite brutal with it and I sort of winged it!) my tracking was miles out. My ESP light came on after about 10 miles then stayed on for a couple of days untill I had four wheel alignment done the following weekend. After FWA everything was spot on, drives perfect and ESP light went straight off. Not saying yours is fine but this is what happened with my car
Click to expand...

Where you not curious to see the fault code(s) to try and work out what it was exactly ?
 
prob steering angle out

esp is dependent on the steering angle being correct....

happened on my car when bushes and suspension was changed, steering wheel was well out, after a alignment and a 10 miles drive, ignition off and ignition on, it went

normally the abs light comes on though
 
audi upgrades
no ABS light, but seems like it's tracking related due to my steering wheel being way out of position.

Are these cars easy to track at the front? Is this something I could do myself?
 
brasiliangringo said:
Where you not curious to see the fault code(s) to try and work out what it was exactly ?
Click to expand...

I was but my Liquid guage didn't show a fault? I didn't get time to do a proper scan so just waited till the following weekend as it was going to APS for 4WA
 
Squirrelofdoom said:
...@Tuffty, no the steering wheel is almost 45 degrees off straight!! (told you the tracking was f'ed :p)
Click to expand...

Theres yah problem... its the ESP getting confused as the steering angle sensor isn't where it should be for the expected speed differentials from the the ABS esensors... this is why the ESP light is flicking on and why the 'abs' feels like its kicking in... guessing it stops misbehaving when the ESP light stays on? try turning ESP off until you have had the tracking sorted... that should at least prevent the ESP from kicking in when it shouldn't...

Fair play on getting the steering wheel that far off from just changing bushes... I have had the whole subframe off and not done that lol ;P

Fun and games aside... I would be rechecking what you have done as just fitting bushes should have no way knocked the steering out that much unless you done something silly like undo the ball joint via the 3 bolts on the arm rather than undoing the nut and popping it out from the hub carrier...

That can throw the camber and the tracking right out if you didn't mark the original positions and have pulled the ball joint out too far or pushed it right in...

<tuffty/>
 
alright gringo :p i ask mostly because i want to do the front right tomorrow; but I also want to do the rear bushes at some point but that won't be for a while, so I wanted to track it to a decent standard before I do the rears and then get it 4WA properly after all that. Didn't want to pay for alignment twice unecessarily
 
s3 Hoggy said:
I was but my Liquid guage didn't show a fault? I didn't get time to do a proper scan so just waited till the following weekend as it was going to APS for 4WA
Click to expand...

Liquid only scans the ECU for codes not the entire car... you need VCDS for that... ;P

<tuffty/>
 
s3 Hoggy said:
I was but my Liquid guage didn't show a fault? I didn't get time to do a proper scan so just waited till the following weekend as it was going to APS for 4WA
Click to expand...

Interesting, so that would suggest its just physical ie car may think its going around a sharp corner at 40mph on hard lock as steering out so wheel is hard over = angel sensors tell ESP ''this is defing the laws of physics etc'' and kicks the ESP / brakes in :)
 
@Tuffty

Thanks for the detailed description, that's exactly what's happening - stopped playing up after the light stuck on! Will try to get it fixed tomorrow. As far as removing the three nuts underneath the ball joint rather than popping the ball joint itself of. I did indeed undo just those three nuts, but I did know beforehand that this wasn't the correct way to do it and will throw tracking/camber off - I guess I just didn't realize it would do it to this extent!! The tracking was slightly iffy before doing this work, hence why I didn't mind doing it via the three nuts because I knew I was going to re-track it afterwards anyway.

Thanks for the help and putting my mind at relative ease guys! Fingers crossed the seized bolt plays nice tomorrow evening!!!
 
@gringo

LOL!! I would love the car to say "this defies the laws of physics" and then throw a paddy!!!
 
<tuffty/> said:
Theres yah problem... its the ESP getting confused as the steering angle sensor isn't where it should be for the expected speed differentials from the the ABS esensors... this is why the ESP light is flicking on and why the 'abs' feels like its kicking in... guessing it stops misbehaving when the ESP light stays on? try turning ESP off until you have had the tracking sorted... that should at least prevent the ESP from kicking in when it shouldn't...

Fair play on getting the steering wheel that far off from just changing bushes... I have had the whole subframe off and not done that lol ;P

Fun and games aside... I would be rechecking what you have done as just fitting bushes should have no way knocked the steering out that much unless you done something silly like undo the ball joint via the 3 bolts on the arm rather than undoing the nut and popping it out from the hub carrier...

That can throw the camber and the tracking right out if you didn't mark the original positions and have pulled the ball joint out too far or pushed it right in...

<tuffty/>
Click to expand...

Thats a more technical description of what i was getting at - well done :)
 
Squirrelofdoom said:
no ABS light, but seems like it's tracking related due to my steering wheel being way out of position.

Are these cars easy to track at the front? Is this something I could do myself?
Click to expand...

As I mentioned in a previous post... S3's have adjustable camber via the ball joints... assuming you removed the arm to get the bushes in I am also assuming you removed the ball joint by undoing the 3 bolts on the arm rather than the single nut securing it to the carrier then chances are you have put this back in the wrong position as they are slotted...

Now if the steering wheel is off straight to the left then this would suggest you have created loads of toe in (the steering will feel a bit dead too) which means you have pushed the ball joint in too far and pulling it out a bit should bring alignment back somewhere sensible... if the steering wheel is over to the right then you have toe out and have pulled the ball joint too far out on the slots so pushing it in a bit should help bring it back in to alignment..

But whatever you do... get it aligned properly once done else it will kill the tyres very quickly...

<tuffty/>
 
Squirrelofdoom said:
@gringo

LOL!! I would love the car to say "this defies the laws of physics" and then throw a paddy!!!
Click to expand...

I tried that once and ended up in a tree, in an A3 - the airbags popped late just to take the **** :) I blame the P6000s.. ****e ;)
 
Thanks Tuffty, I shall do what I can but I will get the fronts tracked properly over the weekend.
 
Take it to a proper alignment place, and ask them just to align the front!

Then once the rears are done, get them to just align the rear :p
 
When are you doing the rears? i would line it up with a straight edge the best you can, get the rears sorted then get a full 4WA, it does not work getting the fronts done first then asking for the rears only, as the thrust angle will probably knock the fronts out anyway..
 
no idea on the rears timing :S I'll try lining then up as best as I can myself and see where to go from there
 
Right. Got the front rights done tonight and made the tracking slightly better. Will get the fronts tracked properly tomorrow.

However, I still get a sort of squeeking, squelching movement/noise under braking from the front left. So I think I will add ball joints to the list of things I need to do to the car.

So next plan is I will probably end up sending the car away to get the following done (cuz I don't have the time/space to do it myself unfortunately).

Front ball joints
Front ARB bushes (should I replace the ARB at the same time?)
Rear ARB bushes (should I replace the ARB at the same time?)
Rear suspension bushes
4WA
 
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