Preventing carbon build up [2.0 TFSI]

[S3Alex]

you best bet is buying a non TFSI TDI engine as the injectors spray directly on the piston make it efficient when new and worse then the 1.8T after 10k miles.. the only way i think to minimize it is buy getting a manifold like alex priming the injector to soak the valves every so often which would keep it clean a catch can will help but not cure it as in Alex's case.. the old 1.8T didn't have this problem as the injectors sprayed directly onto the valves top down approach unlike the TFSI etc..

what also would be interesting is alongside the fuel rail on Alex's manifold if he got port injection; wonder how that would work on the carbon build although methanol is being sprayed in miniscule portions

It won't be meth going through the rail on mine.

We know from some other guys running WMI and my own results,that pre-TB injection doesn't make any difference from WMI.

There's also no evidence that port injection for WMI makes any difference either as the volumes are pretty small overall,and nowhere near the amount of petrol injected in the same time,and it's not running constantly.

Also,to run that sort of system,you need a manifold like the HEP or Boulekos,plus a controller for not only the fuel rail,but also a sequential WMI system.

 

[veeeight]

Few things anyone wanting more power is going to hate....


3mm block thickness

Integrated exhaust manifold,with water cooling.

I can confirm my 2.0 TFSI EA888 has the additional 4 port injectors.

Love the integrated exhaust manifold, makes for a very quick warm up time, and they have replaced the traditional wax thermostat with 2 rotary slide valves to tightly manage all the cooling within the engine - much tighter limits now.

As for power gains, Audi have already produced a 420PS version of this engine

But yes, for the enthusiast, the additional power route will be limited

The carbon build up issue is one of the reasons I jumped from the 8P to the 8V.

 

[Sevv]

I can confirm my 2.0 TFSI EA888 has the additional 4 port injectors.

Love the integrated exhaust manifold, makes for a very quick warm up time, and they have replaced the traditional wax thermostat with 2 rotary slide valves to tightly manage all the cooling within the engine - much tighter limits now.

As for power gains, Audi have already produced a 420PS version of this engine

But yes, for the enthusiast, the additional power route will be limited

The carbon build up issue is one of the reasons I jumped from the 8P to the 8V.

its all the same shi*t really;

@ Alex: i knew that mate; and it isnt cost effective unless you're running big power like yourself as doing a carbon clean yearly will suffice but at a higher cost for the avg. audi owner which really sucks as for the WMI yeah im also aware of it

 

[stetheo]

I am going to have this done to mine at Awesome GTI, they offered a very reasonable price for it and as it hasn't been done before thought may as well give the inlet a clean.

Unfortunately it is pretty much an unavoidable thing on FSI engines and i know the 4.2FSI in the RS4 suffers really badly. I just see it as part of the maintenance of the car as it's relatively inexpensive to get done.

 

[s3_trev]

Have any of you heard of a company called Terraclean?

 

[veeeight]

Only from watching Wheeler Dealers!

AFAIK it still connects to the fuel rail, so it will only clean parts that the normal fuel system reaches.

I reckon Mr.Muscle Oven Cleaner squirted into the inlet ports should do the same job...... who want to try

 

[stetheo]

Have any of you heard of a company called Terraclean?

A lot of people over on rs246 have mentioned this. Seems to get mixed reviews some say there are notable benefits others say it is a waste of money.

That is on the RS4 mind.

 

[davc]

It's a waste of time on DI engines.

 

[s3_trev]

It's a waste of time on DI engines.

Yeah thats what most people seem to be saying on other forums.

 

[S3Alex]

It's a waste of time on DI engines.

Absolutely.

If it goes through the injectors,it's wasted.

 

[Madpete]

Hey Alex, you've had this done a couple of times... Do yo mind if I ask you want it costs? I've been considering having this done, I'm in the North West towards Chester. Cheers, Pete.

 

[S3Alex]

Hey Alex, you've had this done a couple of times... Do yo mind if I ask you want it costs? I've been considering having this done, I'm in the North West towards Chester. Cheers, Pete.

Hi Pete,

I'd have to have a run through the bills,as both times it's been done during a lot of other work.

If I remember,the sort of price you're looking at is a few hundred pounds,but I will have a look later.

 

[Sevv]

I'm Glad people are heading Alex and my selfs' advice finally; its a problem and every owner should have it done.. once its gets really bad the injectors on start up will have to over fuel and you'll also have a hard time starting the car up when cold..

 

[crazylegscrane]

I was amazed when I saw the pictures of Alex's valves and the state they were in. I heard plenty about RS4's suffering but never anything for S3's

Mine has over 70k on the clock now and it's never been cleaned so it will be getting booked in for a clean up soon.

 

[stetheo]

Hey Alex, you've had this done a couple of times... Do yo mind if I ask you want it costs? I've been considering having this done, I'm in the North West towards Chester. Cheers, Pete.

I am also based in the north west and have very recently asked about this at Awesome GTI up near Manchester and they charge £175 for the carbon clean.

 

[S3Alex]

I was amazed when I saw the pictures of Alex's valves and the state they were in. I heard plenty about RS4's suffering but never anything for S3's

Mine has over 70k on the clock now and it's never been cleaned so it will be getting booked in for a clean up soon.

It's just another aspect of the same engine design to be fair,and also,mine runs a lot more boost etc,so that will no doubt add to blow-by and oil misting I would have thought.

 

[Madpete]

Thanks for the reply mate, I didn't mean for you to dig bills out. A rough ball park figure is all I was after, which is what you've given me. Thanks Alex!

Hi Pete,

I'd have to have a run through the bills,as both times it's been done during a lot of other work.

If I remember,the sort of price you're looking at is a few hundred pounds,but I will have a look later.

 

[Madpete]

I never thought to ask Awesome, that seems a fair price too. I'll give them a ring. Thanks, stetheo.

I am also based in the north west and have very recently asked about this at Awesome GTI up near Manchester and they charge £175 for the carbon clean.

 

[S3Alex]

Thanks for the reply mate, I didn't mean for you to dig bills out. A rough ball park figure is all I was after, which is what you've given me. Thanks Alex!

To be fair it may be less than my ball-park figure based on time.

I think for anyone based in the South East,it's best just to give AMD a call.

 

[stetheo]

I never thought to ask Awesome, that seems a fair price too. I'll give them a ring. Thanks, stetheo.

Yeah I thought as they're a VAG specialist I'd ask. They mentioned they've had more and more people wanting it done. Getting mine done with a service as it seems a reasonable price. Deffo worth giving them a shout.

 

[wongachinga]

Just the dpf to contend with instead then!

 

[luckbox]

Had my intake valves cleaned today. Don't have pics but apparently they were in a filthy condition(cars done 86k miles). Initially starting the car I noticed idle was much smoother and had less of the diesel like sound these engines tend to have. Car has gained some lowend torque, pulling away is much smoother from a stand still. It feels like the engine responds a little better and as the car had warmed up and I took off on to the motorway it really pulled like never before. I would guess somewhere around 20bhp was regained.. Overall I'm very happy with this service and the price wasn't too bad at all

 

[s3_trev]

Thanks for sharing luckbox. I am certain I want this done now. Currently in the process of finding someone local that does it.

 

[S3Alex]

Thanks for sharing luckbox. I am certain I want this done now. Currently in the process of finding someone local that does it.

Where are you roughly?

If anywhere near the southeast,I'd recommend AMDTuning.

 

[s3_trev]

Where are you roughly?

If anywhere near the southeast,I'd recommend AMDTuning.

I live in N.Ireland Alex. County L'Derry. The black sheep of the UK when it comes to things like this unfortunately.

 

[S3Alex]

I live in N.Ireland Alex. County L'Derry. The black sheep of the UK when it comes to things like this unfortunately.

Lovely place to live,but as you say,difficult to find the right tuner.

Wish I could help!

 

[Tom5190]

Hmm, its an annoying thing to have to get done for me, I do everything my self normally but I certainly don't have the gear to clean carbon build ups if the head is still on. Luckily mines only around the 25,000 miles mark atm but I'll look at getting it done when it hits 40,000.

Has anybody used any North East companies for it?

 

[JohnE]

How the hell does an inlet side of a petrol engine coke up?
It must be connected directly to the exhaust plpe!

It is - that's what the EGR valve does.

 

[JohnE]

I live in N.Ireland Alex. County L'Derry. The black sheep of the UK when it comes to things like this unfortunately.

Don't tell anyone about Benone Strand - or the cafe in Austin's. They'll all want one

 

[S3Alex]

It is - that's what the EGR valve does.

There's also the numerous breathers running into the inlet which are mostly responsible for the oil vapour that cokes up the inelt.

 

[s3facelift09]

Yesterday I've cleaned the carbon build up in the intake manifold locally at a garage with a mechanic that works at the Audi Dealership who is a friend of mine. It's been done on MY09 S3 with 59k on the clock. It's been cleaned for the first time ever. I was surprised at how much gunk was out there. I am pleased with the results even do it wasn't wallnut blasted, but was done manually with sprays for cleaning throotle body of carbon build up. I had to buy an inlet manifold gasket and a valve repair set containig some small rubber gaskets that were damaged (they were teared) during dissasembling of the intake manifold.

Part number of the intake manifold gasket is:06F 129 717 D (quantity: x1)
Part number of Valve repair set is: 06D 998 907 A (quantity: x4)

Here are some before and after images:


One odd thing that's happened after assmebly. I took the car for a spin and I heard an amazingly loud whistle sound every once and a while. I returned to my mechanic and he found out that my PCV valve had malfunctioned. This should not be related to the cleaning of the intake manifold, it should be just a coincidence. During assembly we talked about this very same PCV valve and he said to me that there is a newer uprated factory version of this valve, and it looks like I would need to buy it now..

P.S. Today I noticed that the revs in neutral started to raise from 850/900 to 1400 rpms by itself. I called the mechanic and he explained that it's all because of the malfunctioned PCV valve, and that the new one will sort out the problem. I did not notice any other problem, the car runs great, it seems faster, more responsive, I'll know more when we change the annoying PCV valve.

 

[s3_trev]

Thanks for posting that. I am interested in this new uprated PCV valve you speak of, do you know anything more about it?

 

[s3facelift09]

He didn't have a lot of time, it was 5pm saturday afternoon, and he was on it from 10am. But generally from what I know, I guess that they had a lot of warranty claims or reports of malfunctioned PCV valves during years. So they've made some improvment to it. And every part that has been improved has an additional letter at the end of the part number, that the first original part number didn't have. But the numbers before the letter are the same. For etc. 06D 998 907, new part: 06D 998 907 A. I will post something new when we install the new valve on. I'll ask if he knows what did they do to it, and what is the difference? Why is it better..

 

[pluves1]

Hmm, its an annoying thing to have to get done for me, I do everything my self normally but I certainly don't have the gear to clean carbon build ups if the head is still on. Luckily mines only around the 25,000 miles mark atm but I'll look at getting it done when it hits 40,000.

Has anybody used any North East companies for it?

Low mileage isn't really going to help I don't think. I would bet money that yours has already had carbon build up. Ours was first done at 20,000 miles and it took our local dealer 6 weeks to get to the root of the problem. The technician couldn't quite believe the carbon build up when he took the head off!

http://www.audi-sport.net/vb/a3-s3-...-issue-when-accelerating-hard-high-speed.html

I'm going to pay a visit to my local BMW dealer to see if they have the decoke facilities.

 

[S3Alex]

Yesterday I've cleaned the carbon build up in the intake manifold locally at a garage with a mechanic that works at the Audi Dealership who is a friend of mine. It's been done on MY09 S3 with 59k on the clock. It's been cleaned for the first time ever. I was surprised at how much gunk was out there. I am pleased with the results even do it wasn't wallnut blasted, but was done manually with sprays for cleaning throotle body of carbon build up. I had to buy an inlet manifold gasket and a valve repair set containig some small rubber gaskets that were damaged (they were teared) during dissasembling of the intake manifold.

Part number of the intake manifold gasket is:06F 129 717 D (quantity: x1)
Part number of Valve repair set is: 06D 998 907 A (quantity: x4)

Here are some before and after images:
View attachment 35400View attachment 35401View attachment 35402View attachment 35403View attachment 35404View attachment 35405View attachment 35406View attachment 35407View attachment 35408

One odd thing that's happened after assmebly. I took the car for a spin and I heard an amazingly loud whistle sound every once and a while. I returned to my mechanic and he found out that my PCV valve had malfunctioned. This should not be related to the cleaning of the intake manifold, it should be just a coincidence. During assembly we talked about this very same PCV valve and he said to me that there is a newer uprated factory version of this valve, and it looks like I would need to buy it now..

P.S. Today I noticed that the revs in neutral started to raise from 850/900 to 1400 rpms by itself. I called the mechanic and he explained that it's all because of the malfunctioned PCV valve, and that the new one will sort out the problem. I did not notice any other problem, the car runs great, it seems faster, more responsive, I'll know more when we change the annoying PCV valve.

Thats a seriously good result from doing the job manually.


For me,the interesting part will come in a few weeks,when it's taken to bits again to fit a new valvetrain and we'll see how much crap has accumulated in a couple of months.

This was mine,done the other way......




And if anything,the before pic looks even worse that yours,and mine already has a Forge catch can etc.

 

[Tom5190]

Low mileage isn't really going to help I don't think. I would bet money that yours has already had carbon build up. Ours was first done at 20,000 miles and it took our local dealer 6 weeks to get to the root of the problem. The technician couldn't quite believe the carbon build up when he took the head off!

http://www.audi-sport.net/vb/a3-s3-...-issue-when-accelerating-hard-high-speed.html

I'm going to pay a visit to my local BMW dealer to see if they have the decoke facilities.

Yea I'm expecting it to have a fair bit of build up now but I guess its just something we have to live with. Short of having it de-coked every 10K (which is at least twice a year for me) I'm not sure there's anything you can do. I'm going to blank the PCV & fit a catch tank but I've seen some posts from S3Alex above that even with this his still had a fair amount of build up.

 

[S3Alex]

Yea I'm expecting it to have a fair bit of build up now but I guess its just something we have to live with. Short of having it de-coked every 10K (which is at least twice a year for me) I'm not sure there's anything you can do. I'm going to blank the PCV & fit a catch tank but I've seen some posts from S3Alex above that even with this his still had a fair amount of build up.

Don't forge that there are breathers that exit into the turbo inlet,from the cam cover,so no system that doesn't remove all of the breathers from recirculating,is going to solve this.

 

[cnahamilton]

Right well im hazzarding a guess that mine will defo need doing as mine just just clocked 120k. S3Alex - this walnut blasting is it something i could do or will it cost more in gear than get a garage to do it?? i am very competent with engines/cars as i build classic fast road and race engines for minis and midgets

 

[Granta]

i think the kit costs near enough £800! will be worth it if you buy the kit and offer a service, something im thinking of doing...

 

[cnahamilton]

Yeah wouldnt be a bad idea. Not sure if i would get enough in my area of the country. middle of the suffolk farmlands lol. Does amd offer the service??