VW Emission Scandal - Are we going to get Compensation

The biggest winners here are the 1.6 TDI owners...
New injectors and updated software, maybe a free service etc..
That's some years of free motoring for what is a decreasing VAG diesel market. As for me I will stick with my fixed TFSI atm. Takes the emphasis away from these superb engines once fixed I suppose :yum:
 
  • Like
Reactions: CHEZ and ianv5
Yes, it's the parasitic mindset that's led to higher insurance costs for most of us and patronising warnings and messages on just about anything you buy. As a society we're becoming risk averse to the extent that we are now too afraid to develop new ideas lest some slack jawed daytime tv aficionado get lawyeredup and make a fast buck of the mistakes that inevitably come with bushing the bounds of current knowledge.

I work as an engineer designing products - my clients are so risk averse they spend years and tens of millions more than they need to just to disprove some improbable failure mode that my entire industry is now becoming un competitive. And the cost of the final product is too high.

That's the beef I have with this money for nothing mentality. In relation to Vag - they haven't hurt anyone or even come close. They will be punished first by the regulators whose rules they broke and then by the future customers who don't buy their their products anymore- justice will be served to them but I don't believe for a second anyone bought a diesel powered car because they thought it was good for the environment. They were thinking of their pocket only. If you thought anything else it indicates a certain amount of stupidity.

And this brings me full circle - society used to progress on the back of innovation and creative thinking which implies some risk now we're becoming paralysed by the stupid people and their lawyers in society who only view mistakes as a cash cow rather than a learning opportunity. Rather than society being led by the smart we are being reduced to the lowest common denominator.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Zafi, gary_a4_quattro, DJ_26 and 7 others
The only compensation I think Audi could owe anyone would be if the re-sale value of the car is compromised by the cheating. I know that the emissions/economy/performance are not affected by UK rules and regulations but the Audi/VW image has been tarnished because, lets face it, if they have cheated about this they could cheat about something else. With that in mind I am pretty sure my car has been de-valued as it is now less desirable. Of course all of this is conjecture but, if you are to seek compensation, that is the only legitimate compensation you could claim for IMO.
 
If its brand devaluation, not just diesels but the brand, then every single Audi/VW/Seat owner would be able to seek compensation. It's not going to happen.

Wait until the investigation is done and it turns out other manufacturers have done similar things. Everyone's cars devalues.
 
I think most otherr makers have gone to great lenghts to clear their names. I also see this (as many do) as a massive storm in a tea cup.

Cars with cheat software will be fixed and life will go on. Car values wont be affected. Its just press and internet BS scare mongering as usual, which most people take as gospel.

The only negative effect will be on VAG's reputation. And this wont last for too long.

People whittling about loss of value and compo etc need to get a grip. Ride it out. And get you cars software fixed.
 
ub7rm said:
The money for nothing mentality of some is frankly sickening.
Click to expand...
That's nothing. Some people expect the chicks for free.
 
  • Like
Reactions: gary_a4_quattro, RyanJonS4, xpoweruk and 1 other person
ub7rm said:
Yes, it's the parasitic mindset that's led to higher insurance costs for most of us and patronising warnings and messages on just about anything you buy. As a society we're becoming risk averse to the extent that we are now too afraid to develop new ideas lest some slack jawed daytime tv aficionado get lawyeredup and make a fast buck of the mistakes that inevitably come with bushing the bounds of current knowledge.

I work as an engineer designing products - my clients are so risk averse they spend years and tens of millions more than they need to just to disprove some improbable failure mode that my entire industry is now becoming un competitive. And the cost of the final product is too high.

That's the beef I have with this money for nothing mentality. In relation to Vag - they haven't hurt anyone or even come close. They will be punished first by the regulators whose rules they broke and then by the future customers who don't buy their their products anymore- justice will be served to them but I don't believe for a second anyone bought a diesel powered car because they thought it was good for the environment. They were thinking of their pocket only. If you thought anything else it indicates a certain amount of stupidity.

And this brings me full circle - society used to progress on the back of innovation and creative thinking which implies some risk now we're becoming paralysed by the stupid people and their lawyers in society who only view mistakes as a cash cow rather than a learning opportunity. Rather than society being led by the smart we are being reduced to the lowest common denominator.
Click to expand...

Totally agree and my guess is we work in the same industry. It used to be leading edge but is now 10-20 years behind the curve set my the commercial world, due to Qualification requirements and Safety Acceptance policy.

Have I ever been involved in an engineering discussion where a requirement was bent or a tolerance stretched........I couldn't possibly comment ;)
 
  • Like
Reactions: xpoweruk
Had the letter since end of March to send my Audi off to get the emission fix.

Been holding off to see what the impact is, if any, on performance etc........

Read that some owners have noticed a difference in performance after they had the software emission fix. When Audi(VAG) again state they will be no change to the car.
Also owners having the software fix applied when the car is in just for service, even when given instruction not to do it.

Has anyone else had this done and noticed a difference in performance,torque or noise levels?
 
ub7rm said:
In relation to Vag - they haven't hurt anyone or even come close.
Click to expand...

Far be it for me to question the authority of a engineer on public health issues, but the World Health Organisation has very plainly detailed the effect of increased particulate matter on respiratory disease and increased mortality. The fact that VAG have deliberately cheated the system to circumvent the guidelines and thereby contributed to the decreased air quality is nothing short of despicable...You can debate about the real world impact of increased emissions from VAG group cars in the context of diesel buses, taxis and lorries, but that does nothing to take away from the fact that VAG were knowingly selling cars that were producing harmful emissions above what is legalised in order to increase profits. They couldn't care less about what consequence it had on yours or my health....

I'm sure if a water company was found to be pumping more carcinogenic material in your drinking water to increase profits you would be just as quick to jump to their defence...
 
  • Like
Reactions: audiwaterpump
DrEskimo said:
Far be it for me to question the authority of a engineer on public health issues, but the World Health Organisation has very plainly detailed the effect of increased particulate matter on respiratory disease and increased mortality. The fact that VAG have deliberately cheated the system to circumvent the guidelines and thereby contributed to the decreased air quality is nothing short of despicable...You can debate about the real world impact of increased emissions from VAG group cars in the context of diesel buses, taxis and lorries, but that does nothing to take away from the fact that VAG were knowingly selling cars that were producing harmful emissions above what is legalised in order to increase profits. They couldn't care less about what consequence it had on yours or my health....

I'm sure if a water company was found to be pumping more carcinogenic material in your drinking water to increase profits you would be just as quick to jump to their defence...
Click to expand...

I'm not jumping to their defence, laws have been broken and trust shattered. VW are rightly being punished by governments, customers and shareholders. My objection is to individuals looking to make a fast buck of the nearest bandwagon when they have suffered no loss. By that I mean no individual has suffered loss greater than anyone else.

I agree that statement you've quoted could have been better phrased and you're right. A little more harm has been caused to all of us than might otherwise have occured had they played with a straight bat. I was trying to make the distinction between say Toyota whose failures led to direct loss of life.
 
  • Like
Reactions: DrEskimo
ub7rm said:
I'm not jumping to their defence, laws have been broken and trust shattered. VW are rightly being punished by governments, customers and shareholders. My objection is to individuals looking to make a fast buck of the nearest bandwagon when they have suffered no loss. By that I mean no individual has suffered loss greater than anyone else.

I agree that statement you've quoted could have been better phrased and you're right. A little more harm has been caused to all of us than might otherwise have occured had they played with a straight bat. I was trying to make the distinction between say Toyota whose failures led to direct loss of life.
Click to expand...

This not people trying make a fast buck, think you are getting confused with 'mis-sold PPI claims' Here you would have had to YES! and that's whole different story.

This is about if the software change and is it going to affect a difference in performance, torque or noise levels etc...

One of the 101 reasons I bought my Audi included the performance, torque, mpg, tax, etc.

Okay the Americans have all been compensated for this cheat with gift vouchers and sums up to £7000 for newer models, and not suffered no loss and it was not down to individuals jumping on the bandwagon.

And Yes! I wouldn’t say no if Audi UK offered compensation here. Especially if it affected the performance.

This I know is very unlikely - But if the boot was on the over foot. I sure they would claim what they could if it was a UK company.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Sematic and feva
audi upgrades
I agree with this 100%. (A4A4)

If it affects my performance, torque, mpg, tax or resale value then i want an option for audi to buy back the car and i want to be compensated for the inconvenience as well. Just like the Americans got.
 
  • Like
Reactions: audiwaterpump, A4A4 and feva
A4A4 said:
Had the letter since end of March to send my Audi off to get the emission fix.

Been holding off to see what the impact is, if any, on performance etc........

Read that some owners have noticed a difference in performance after they had the software emission fix. When Audi(VAG) again state they will be no change to the car.
Also owners having the software fix applied when the car is in just for service, even when given instruction not to do it.

Has anyone else had this done and noticed a difference in performance,torque or noise levels?
Click to expand...

My friend has a MK7 Golf 1.6 TDI and when that went in for a service, they also applied the software fix automatically. He said the performance had dropped slightly and the car just wasn't as good. When he asked the service receptionist about the Dieselgate software update (prior to the software fix), they refused to comment.
 
There was an article from Italy about a Q5 that had higher emissions after the 'fix'....perhaps there is a reason why that particular car did not see improvements, but it doesn't bode well...!

There's a reason VAG used the cheat, and why the other manufacturers couldn't achieve low figures without more restrictive 'down-stream' options in the exhaust, etc.....

I really don't see how a quick remap and new air intake will help it substantially without having a rather detrimental impact on performance....so yes, as above, I would be mightily pee'd as well if I owned one..!!!
 
Whilst I understand VAG won't want to give money away unless they're forced to, I am surprised they don't offer an incentive on new cars such as increased deposit contributions - they make money on the car and they're already raking in pretty high APRs on their HP/PCP agreements in comparison to bank loans.

I'm not in for the whole American compensation culture as I think that's OTT but if Audi were willing to chuck some more money at a new A6 to replace our affected 2.0 TDI then I'd be up for that as we're debating it anyway and might just act as an encouragement.
 
Slackworth said:
Whilst I understand VAG won't want to give money away unless they're forced to, I am surprised they don't offer an incentive on new cars such as increased deposit contributions - they make money on the car and they're already raking in pretty high APRs on their HP/PCP agreements in comparison to bank loans.

I'm not in for the whole American compensation culture as I think that's OTT but if Audi were willing to chuck some more money at a new A6 to replace our affected 2.0 TDI then I'd be up for that as we're debating it anyway and might just act as an encouragement.
Click to expand...

Has it not questioned your loyalty to the brand...? I don't even have a car affected by it, but I am seriously considering looking elsewhere based on this (if only there were other companies that built cars I liked that were less corrupt as well...!). Unfortunately fines will only do so much. People voting with their wallet about what they think is acceptable from a manufacturer is the only thing that will get them to listen.

I mean other news coming out about the company doesn't make for great reading either...
https://next.ft.com/content/609c13b0-42ba-11e6-9b66-0712b3873ae1
 
Damn the FT needing a subscription to read their news :(

Personally I am happy to stay with the AudI brand mainly because they do the product I want. While I agree it's best to walk with your feet and stop putting money in their bank, it's hard to find another brand that offers equal quality build. Arguably there's BMW, Mercedes and Jaguar on a similar level but for a choice of 4WD Saloon/Estates with performance diesel engines you're left with Audi and the BMW 330d XDrive which I find very small interior ans boot space wise. When BMW finally get themselves in gear and do a 530D/535D in XDrive then I can see me jumping ship as my previous BMW 330d was bombproof and a hell of a lot cheaper to service. RWD was too much hassle in the snow and rain especially given the distance of my daily commute.
 
Ive got a letter to book my 170 tdi in for update. Any news on performance before I do?
 
I've commented on the other thread, but a member on A5OC had his A5 2.0TDI on the dyno before and after the update and has found performance to be increased, and fuel economy has increased too.

Seems that they have restricted the engine to reduce the emissions, but then effectively applied a remap to make sure performance hasn't been affected.

Whether it has actually reduced the emissions is yet to be proven...! At least your car will feel better to drive though :)

Edit: http://www.a5oc.com/forums/a5-general-q/130961-anybody-had-nox-emmissions.html
 
personally, i think you will feel the car feels a touch more laggier/slower lower down, but will probably come in a bit harder.
 
Chris90 said:
personally, i think you will feel the car feels a touch more laggier/slower lower down, but will probably come in a bit harder.
Click to expand...

The chap in that thread reports better response at the low end. He had the dyno plots which showed improvement across the whole curve, but cant find them on it anymore.
 
Look at the plot of the data. The power and torque is clearly later in the RPMs.
 

Attachments

  • BEFORE.jpg
    BEFORE.jpg
    304.9 KB · Views: 375
  • AFTER.jpg
    AFTER.jpg
    299.4 KB · Views: 362
  • Like
Reactions: DrEskimo
Chris90 said:
Look at the plot of the data. The power and torque is clearly later in the RPMs.
Click to expand...

Ah yes you're quite right! Must of been thinking of a different plot...

Strange that he reports better low end power. Placebo effect?
 
If we get the update done, and the car isn't as good what then?
 
  • Like
Reactions: feva
Probably feels different due to how the power comes in. Comparing the graphs side by side, the AFTER map comes in more aggressive than beforehand.

Could be many things they changed to alter how the car feels. Could have even tweaked the pedal map to make it request more from the engine at lower pedal position. Could be greater boost, etc.

Be interesting to pull 2 maps off before and after and note the changes.
 
Do we have anymore members on here who had the 'emission software fix' done or know somebody who has?.
Be great to read your experiences.
Still reading confusing views on for and against.
 
If a car has already had a performance map applied, how would this software update effect it, if at all?
 
If theres a map on it already...then you will loose it.,...since the software update will reflash the ECU.
 
has anyones tax gone up since the scandal? if not i dont see any reason for compensation
 
youngy93 said:
has anyones tax gone up since the scandal? if not i dont see any reason for compensation
Click to expand...
Tax is calculated on co2 not Nox. So at present can't see how your tax can rise. But never say never but they would have to completely redo the car tax system.

Sent from my Note 4 using tapatalk
 
My wife has an A1 1.6TDi that is affected by this, we've agreed that unless we see reliable evidence that the car's performance won't be affected we won't have the fix applied. It's really as simple as that, currently our local Audi dealer is unable to confirm how the car will be affected as the fix is not ready yet.
 
lfcrule1972 said:
My wife has an A1 1.6TDi that is affected by this, we've agreed that unless we see reliable evidence that the car's performance won't be affected we won't have the fix applied. It's really as simple as that, currently our local Audi dealer is unable to confirm how the car will be affected as the fix is not ready yet.
Click to expand...
Mines available for update. Audi have said it won't effect car at all.
Others have had it done and said cars seem fine. Read others not impressed.

Sent from my Note 4 using tapatalk
 
Do those dyno plots not provide fairly conclusive evidence? As long as you don't mind a slight decline at the low end (which that user didn't report), it actually seems to improve the performance somewhat, and improve fuel economy.
 
  • Like
Reactions: feva
The VW fix for the 1.6 TDi involves adding mesh to the airflow sensor and a software update and VW say that it won't impact the performance or economy on European cars.
Presumably Audi will use the same fix.
 
Mine has a Dtuk box on. I'll remove it but might need to get back to Dtuk to tweak the box up.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

Liquidfusion-S3
We are safe! :)
Replies
11
Views
1K
Crazyfool
Crazyfool
Chop.
The 20" wheels are going !
Replies
54
Views
4K
RS5 JON
RS5 JON
Zobware
Which car to get???
Replies
1
Views
674
dpaz
dpaz
G
Cheapest place to get genuine vag.com ?
Replies
10
Views
1K
Sandra
Sandra
nas1638
VAG scandal and remap?
Replies
5
Views
887
Paul @ Unit 9 Remaps
Paul @ Unit 9 Remaps
Top
Back