To clean or not to clean that os the question

jassyo06

T-Cut King !

This is their zero bucket carwash process. On a nice clean car. Never the less a really nice expensive car though.
Ok, I'm going to be cynical and say they just happen to sell all this stuff. But they do run what seems to be a successful detailing business.

But I'm intrigued, though too frightened to try this, rubbing a mitt around my paint that is covered in dirt is not something I'm brave enough to try. I suppose I could try it on the wife's car and not tell her.

I'm always looking at improving my wash technique to reduce the damage to my paintwork. So I'm open to suggestions but I'm not ready to forsake my two buckets just yet. Though I will keep an eye on this.
Trying it on the wife's car....like it
Try one of these, after l have used this several times av realised how much easier it is to wash me car it just glides of the paintwork
Screenshot_2016-01-03-12-30-33.png
 
Last edited:

jassyo06

T-Cut King !
.........oh for sure, I always do a full chemical analysis before I undertake any detailing..................doesn't everyone??!! :whistle2:
PMSL.......:box:
 

THQuattro

Site Sponsor
Site Sponsor
VCDS Map User
Gold Supporter
I don't think the car was dirty to start with.
 

DrEskimo

Registered User
To be fair, I think that link has a fair point. I've always been skeptical about whether snow foam was actually getting more dirt off than a high pressure rinse. I've used it just to add more soap over the car while I then do a two bucket wash.

With regard to the two buckets and grit guards, I've always seen the advantages of the two buckets as my rinse bucket is always filthy at the end of the wash, while my shampoo bucket is clean. However, I have thought, why not just rinse the mitt under the hose...surely that would be better?

I've never thought about the physics of the grit guard, but their evidence is pretty convincing that it isn't actually doing anything...

Think I may change up my routine and get rid of the buckets...

I'm still waiting to do a full correction on my car (weather hasn't been kind :( ) and will then probably swap to doing the below:

Clean wheels with bilberry/separate wash mitt/wheel woolies
Pressure wash whole car
cover in snow foam just to add shampoo all over car (and its great fun
smile.gif
)
rinse wash mitt and add shampoo to wash mitt (using left over foam from the lance)
wash top of car
swap to new mitt, rinse and add shampoo
wash bottom of car
rinse whole car
dry with air/MF towel using a QD as a drying aid

I will probably rinse the mitt in between panels using the tap or pressure washer. As above, I'm not confident in washing an entire half of a car without rinsing. My car is likely to get much dirtier than the one in the video!

Will help that my car will be protected with a ceramic coating after the paint correction.
 

Scottyg

Registered User
I've been using waterless wash products for a while now due to my knackered back. It's faster and so far I've not put a mark on the car. I've started using it more confidently when the cars totally minging and still it comes out perfect. This picture below was taken after waterless wash and then topped up with QD wax. The car was pretty minging due to the rubbish weather. Still no swirls or fine scratches.



No actual jet wash water or soap has touched my car since October apart from one local trip to the car wash as I couldn't be bothered doing it myself.
 

SmileyS3

Registered User
You tell me this after I've spent near on £400 on a Karcher and Ultimate Finsh Products and stuff. :(
 

Scottyg

Registered User
Believe it or not, the cost of the two products used to achieve that shine above was £4.50. £2.25 for the waterless wash and £2.25 for the LazyBones Wax. I have plenty more expensive stuff that I use in the summer months but the above stuff is cheap and works great in the winter. The paint does need clayed but that will be done prior to the application of the Cquartz I have in March/April.
 

WarwickL

Registered User
.........oh for sure, I always do a full chemical analysis before I undertake any detailing..................doesn't everyone??!! :whistle2:

There was just a touch of sarcasm in my post but yep, I've had the house water analysed for free. Simple process.

I like to know what is coming out of the tap besides H2O :)
 

Jake 61

Teacher of bad things..!
VCDS Map User
Gold Supporter
Quite interesting. I have never used a bucket to wash a car after I saw the muck sitting in the bottom of one several years ago. For me, the jury is out on snow foam, at best, it's just a pre wash to loosen the crud and I'm not sure that I will continue to use it after I finish the batch I have.
To answer the original question, definitely clean. I have just gone about 4 weeks without giving the car the weekly going over and it hurt immensely to leave it that long. A weekly wash at least, lets you scrutinise the paintwork to see if there are any imperfections that you normally wouldn't notice.
Like the trail of marks across my whole roof, that may, or may not have been caused by some ar$ehole spraying something on it.
Next stop is the paint shop for me.

Oh, and I used to work for a company that was sub-contracted to Scottish Water, I saw what went into the water to bring it "up" to EU standards. I don't need an analysis done to never drink tap water again.

:sob:
 

moorzy

Registered User
I've been using waterless wash products for a while now due to my knackered back. It's faster and so far I've not put a mark on the car. I've started using it more confidently when the cars totally minging and still it comes out perfect. This picture below was taken after waterless wash and then topped up with QD wax. The car was pretty minging due to the rubbish weather. Still no swirls or fine scratches.



No actual jet wash water or soap has touched my car since October apart from one local trip to the car wash as I couldn't be bothered doing it myself.
Looks like great results, went and bought some turtle wax waterless wash today, was £8 and thought I'd have a dabble but snowed so not had a crack yet. Out of interest do you give motor a pound wash to shift stubborn ***** day before or owt? Car is pretty grubby with salt and muck and I'm not comfortable just spraying and rubbing this on paintwork?
 

Scottyg

Registered User
Where'd you buy it? I can get it for £4.25. No, I don't do anything to the car before hand. Just spray and wipe. Always turn MF over after each wipe.
 

RichardT

Registered User
Where'd you buy it? I can get it for £4.25. No, I don't do anything to the car before hand. Just spray and wipe. Always turn MF over after each wipe.

Where does the grit go then? And how do you get rid of it from the towel after you've turned it over a few times?
It sounds great, but I just can't imagine doing it on a mucky car.
 

Schuey

Registered User
So if all this don't use two buckets, don't use shampoo and you won't see any swirl marks is that accurate, then please ask these 'science based' salesman why my local dealer trashed my carbon grey MK6 on a complimentary valet??

If it was that true & that simple we'd all be using just water, whether tap water or filtered rain water, little difference once its on the paint & dried out.

As for the Mercedes video, well whoever detailed that did a fab job, the level of protection that already exists on that car is doing all of the work, evident by the beading & sheeting when pressure washing. Made the sales guys job even easier for all his sprays & mitts he was selling.

I do agree that sometimes snowfoam is not needed and I will admit to a single bucket wash during the summer months. Rinsing the mitt with a hose I thought was obvious?
 

Schuey

Registered User
Where does the grit go then? And how do you get rid of it from the towel after you've turned it over a few times?
It sounds great, but I just can't imagine doing it on a mucky car.

I believe the dirt gets encapsulated in a polymer, there will then be a built in lubricant. The problem that could occur is that the polymer gets overwhelmed by the solids or particles. If that happens regularly then you may start to see swirls & scratches.
 

Scottyg

Registered User
I've been using them regularly since the summer. Did my car yesterday and it was caked in grit, mud and the usual. Only used the waterless stuff and this is the result.


Yet to put a mark on the car.
 

moorzy

Registered User
Where'd you buy it? I can get it for £4.25. No, I don't do anything to the car before hand. Just spray and wipe. Always turn MF over after each wipe.
Was in asda with shmbo and saw it so picked it up, litre I think it is, big bottle anyhow.
 

DrEskimo

Registered User
I've been using them regularly since the summer. Did my car yesterday and it was caked in grit, mud and the usual. Only used the waterless stuff and this is the result.


Yet to put a mark on the car.

By no means suggesting you car doesn't look great (I've actually tried the waterless wash on my GFs car and was quite surprised), but just wanted to say that even a car that had gone through a machine car wash would look great in that light. Not to mention that a lot of those waterless washes contain waxes which would 'fill in' most swirls, if there were any....

Would be interested to see if the paint is flawless if you wiped down a panel with IPA and had a look in direct sunlight.

By no means think yours will be bad, was merely suggesting that 'perfection' is a relative term, and I imagine most would be over the moon to have paint work that only looks slightly bad in the sun if you happen to know what you're looking for!!
 

WarwickL

Registered User
I will never use waterless wash. Did it once. Car looked good but on inspection under good lights, swirls.

I see no value in the two bucket method. I replaced that with the process I mentioned before.
 

_Zerocool_

Registered User
I clean mine even if it is pee'ing it down with rain, neighbours think I am a nutcase....

Ha ha, Me too! Washed mine in the rain last week. The neighbours were in their windows like 'aint nobody got time for that'!
 

Jake 61

Teacher of bad things..!
VCDS Map User
Gold Supporter
Ha ha, Me too! Washed mine in the rain last week. The neighbours were in their windows like 'aint nobody got time for that'!

Same. I don't start it when it's raining, (unless it's a very quick muck sluice), but I don't mind finishing it off in a downpour.
If it's kept clean, it's easier to maintain.
 

Supa Koopa

Registered User
Yup, I'm probably known as the neighbourhood loony when it comes to washing cars. I spent 2 hours cleaning it on Saturday for the snow to fall and cover it an hour later. I then spent a bit of time on Sunday with the citrus pre wash and a hose pipe getting the snow off. :)

There's also a long standing agreement with the Audi garage that no one cleans my car on pain of death.....! lol
 

moorzy

Registered User
I've been using them regularly since the summer. Did my car yesterday and it was caked in grit, mud and the usual. Only used the waterless stuff and this is the result.


Yet to put a mark on the car.
You mentioned earlier up the Fred that helps spare your gammy back, how so, still Gotta get down and clear off then buff sills ain'tcha?
 

daryloffset

Registered User
Some good methods in here chaps, can't beat a 2 bucket method - Ray actually had your dealership call the other day requesting a quote for a nightmare customer haha!
 

moorzy

Registered User
Some good methods in here chaps, can't beat a 2 bucket method - Ray actually had your dealership call the other day requesting a quote for a nightmare customer haha!
The Internet has washed my brain regarding 2buckets1car. Only started using two after forums and reviews with everyone getting hardon about them.

I'm with the method linked to by Warwick earlier in the thread. Must surely make more sense to rinse the sponge/cloth with fresh water rather than a 2nd bucket. I'm going back to monogamous methods, one bucket man from now on.
 

WarwickL

Registered User
It's not just 'rinse' the mitt but using high pressure or at the least a good pressure from house supply. Much more effective at removing grit and foreign matter from the wash mitt than rinsing in a bucket.

I even use multiple mitts, about 5. Dedicated for areas of the car. Swapping sides of the mitt as well. I prefer non foaming car shampoos to increase the ability of the product to encapsulate grit etc and protect the surface.

Everyone has their own method.
 

moorzy

Registered User
It's not just 'rinse' the mitt but using high pressure or at the least a good pressure from house supply. Much more effective at removing grit and foreign matter from the wash mitt than rinsing in a bucket.

I even use multiple mitts, about 5. Dedicated for areas of the car. Swapping sides of the mitt as well. I prefer non foaming car shampoos to increase the ability of the product to encapsulate grit etc and protect the surface.

Everyone has their own method.
Makes perfect sense.
 

S3JOJ

Registered User
It's not just 'rinse' the mitt but using high pressure or at the least a good pressure from house supply. Much more effective at removing grit and foreign matter from the wash mitt than rinsing in a bucket.

I even use multiple mitts, about 5. Dedicated for areas of the car. Swapping sides of the mitt as well. I prefer non foaming car shampoos to increase the ability of the product to encapsulate grit etc and protect the surface.

Everyone has their own method.

Liking the look of this method. New to the detailing game and found the two bucket + snow foam etc rather daunting.

What products / cloths etc do you use?
 

Scottyg

Registered User
Used the waterless wash this morning alongside another 2 products.

Here's some pictures I took before I started





During- front door done back quarter panel not.


No water, pressure washer or rinse agents used before I used the waterless wash. Results below after product used and a QD wipe down and tyre gel applied.







Including a quick Hoover inside all that took was 25 mins.
Pretty pleased with results. It definitely needs a good clay in the spring. I'll do that before applying the CQUARTZ I have waiting.
 

moorzy

Registered User
Used the waterless wash this morning alongside another 2 products.

Here's some pictures I took before I started





During- front door done back quarter panel not.


No water, pressure washer or rinse agents used before I used the waterless wash. Results below after product used and a QD wipe down and tyre gel applied.







Including a quick Hoover inside all that took was 25 mins.
Pretty pleased with results. It definitely needs a good clay in the spring. I'll do that before applying the CQUARTZ I have waiting.
Fair play, results look very smart, i know this is your usual routine so good on yer but i'd still be bricking rubbing on a layer of shiite on top of the paintwork but yep.... Looks very impressive fella.
 

WarwickL

Registered User
Liking the look of this method. New to the detailing game and found the two bucket + snow foam etc rather daunting.

What products / cloths etc do you use?

All my products and 'cloths' come from the pro detailer I linked to earlier.

That company develops and manufactures all their own stuff.

I've known the owner for 10 years.
 

Pook

Registered User
The thing that confuses me about the 2-bucket: after a few rinses, the rinse bucket obviously starts to build up with grit/dirt floating about. Now when you keep plunging your mitt into this, surely it picks up some of this does it not, and then the mitt goes into your wash bucket straight after. Its kinda like you are just moving the muck around. I use the two bucket, but in my head I'm not sure it fully makes sense....
 

Bristle Hound

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
The thing that confuses me about the 2-bucket: after a few rinses, the rinse bucket obviously starts to build up with grit/dirt floating about. Now when you keep plunging your mitt into this, surely it picks up some of this does it not, and then the mitt goes into your wash bucket straight after. Its kinda like you are just moving the muck around. I use the two bucket, but in my head I'm not sure it fully makes sense....
@Pook - 2BM explained a little better here -
http://www.detailingworld.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=4637

Interesting read here too (7.63mb download) -
http://www.pdf-archive.com/2016/04/24/detailing-hand-book/
 

DrEskimo

Registered User
The thing that confuses me about the 2-bucket: after a few rinses, the rinse bucket obviously starts to build up with grit/dirt floating about. Now when you keep plunging your mitt into this, surely it picks up some of this does it not, and then the mitt goes into your wash bucket straight after. Its kinda like you are just moving the muck around. I use the two bucket, but in my head I'm not sure it fully makes sense....

Well theoretically, thats where grit guards come in, but I've seen enough evidence to suggest they don't actually do a whole lot. If anything, it encourages you to go to the bottom of the bucket and disturb all the dirt to rise up and into the mitt...I still have two guards in my buckets, but now use deep 25l buckets and only wash the mitt in the bucket at the top, being careful not to swirl the water round to disturb the muck at the bottom, which naturally falls there due to gravity.

Of course there are lots of people who think 2, even 1 bucket is unnecessary. I have in the past tried to just wash the mitt off using the tap of the hose, but its such a faff that I just stuck to 2 deep buckets.

I guess thats why a pre wash, and more importantly a power wash rinse, is vital. Makes sure you get most of it off before even going near buckets...
 

Pook

Registered User
Well theoretically, thats where grit guards come in, but I've seen enough evidence to suggest they don't actually do a whole lot. If anything, it encourages you to go to the bottom of the bucket and disturb all the dirt to rise up and into the mitt...I still have two guards in my buckets, but now use deep 25l buckets and only wash the mitt in the bucket at the top, being careful not to swirl the water round to disturb the muck at the bottom, which naturally falls there due to gravity.

Of course there are lots of people who think 2, even 1 bucket is unnecessary. I have in the past tried to just wash the mitt off using the tap of the hose, but its such a faff that I just stuck to 2 deep buckets.

I guess thats why a pre wash, and more importantly a power wash rinse, is vital. Makes sure you get most of it off before even going near buckets...
Thanks Dr Eskimo. I have just bought a Karcher today actually and tried that with my Citrus Pre-Wash, excellent results (on my golf that is, I'm practicing before the arrival of my audi in about a week!).
 

Pook

Registered User

RichardT

Registered User
Thanks Dr Eskimo. I have just bought a Karcher today actually and tried that with my Citrus Pre-Wash, excellent results (on my golf that is, I'm practicing before the arrival of my audi in about a week!).
That'swhat I do - Citrus pre-wash and jet wash rinse. Someone on here suggested using hot water with the pre-wash and I do that, but no idea really if it's better that using cold. The spray must cool instantly when it e its the sprayer/hits the body.
Actually, I tried 2 buckets, but am unconvinced. There's so little muck left after the pre-wash that it seems a bit of a pain. So I only use one bucket now. Oh dear - is that blasphemy :whistle2:
 
Top