Tempted to change from PFL to FL

Radman

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Hi all,

I have received an email from my dealer who I will leave anonymous. Basically he knows my car inside and out, knows of the paint protection I have on the car and the condition. Basically it's showroom condition with just a little over 4K miles in 15 months ownership. That was always going to be the case for me, minimal fun miles for me, hence resale would be more benificial. Basically he wants my car, as he has a waiting list for PFL cars wanted, so he can get me in a new SB for £100 more a month that I am paying already with no cash input. That is based on a good spec. I originally put 8k down on mine and the residuals are really good on the PFL. I'm wary, as I love my car and now realise that the PFL has a certain cult following?
What would you do?

Thanks,

Rad
 

D0C

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That is a really tough one! Honestly, I think if I could swap out for £100pm more, I'd do it.

Pros - faster, lighter, virtual cockpit.

Cons - still £100pm more, doesn't sound quite as good, hideous rear bumper deflectors!

I reckon I'd be looking at £200pm to change which is too much and to be honest I love mine. Had it professionally valeted on Thursday and the the Panther black just looks sensational when clean. And the noise!
 

Radman

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That is a really tough one! Honestly, I think if I could swap out for £100pm more, I'd do it.

Pros - faster, lighter, virtual cockpit.

Cons - still £100pm more, doesn't sound quite as good, hideous rear bumper deflectors!

I reckon I'd be looking at £200pm to change which is too much and to be honest I love mine. Had it professionally valeted on Thursday and the the Panther black just looks sensational when clean. And the noise!
That's my dilemma, mine has paint protection film on front of the car and ceramic coating on the rest. Touch wood, the car hasn't got on swirl. Like you said pros and cons, but this car is a true labour of love and I'm not sure if I can justify it. I still think the PFL has a far better looking front end stance and those Ford deflectors in the bumper? Really?
 

D0C

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That's my dilemma, mine has paint protection film on front of the car and ceramic coating on the rest. Touch wood, the car hasn't got on swirl. Like you said pros and cons, but this car is a true labour of love and I'm not sure if I can justify it. I still think the PFL has a far better looking front end stance and those Ford deflectors in the bumper? Really?
Personally, I'm probably going to get mine mapped after it's first service and stick with it until the next RS3 comes out. You never know though, I usually get bored of cars easily. Although the RS3 is without doubt my favourite car of the many that I've owned.
 

Steff s3

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It a tuff one to decide on,me I'd think I'd sit and wait for the next generation A3 to come out in 2019,as much as I like the FL I still think between the two it isn't enough to justify the swop from PFL to FL.
It's interesting to note that there's a a lot of demand still for the PFL.
Mines also has the ceramic coating and front end PPF installed,I'm thinking about getting rid of mines and getting an RS4 that I've found with beautiful spec on it,in fact I've secured the car already with a small deposit while I think it through.
I'd be selling mines privately,I've had an offer already on mines but I just don't think it's enough,but then it never is in the owners eyes is it.
 

terminator x

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Imho FL not different enough if you already own a PFL. If it was a free swop though then yes a proper dilemma ;)

TX.

Sent from my STV100-4 using Tapatalk
 

Snake Pliskin

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That almost sounds too good to be true !

The facelift RRP will equate pretty much to an extra £4,800 (48 months @ £100) so unless he is increasing the balloon at the end to compensate that sounds an incredible offer.

Newer car, newer spec, new tyres etc, FL higher residuals .... well worth considering !

Saying he has a waiting list for PFL does sound like typical 'sales patter' though so I would be dubious till I saw the actual figures in black & white.
 

PanamaS3

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If I was you I would do it....meant to be dynamically better car, newer engine and tech...you can fix the noise with some mods...but thats just me.
If you have driven them back to back and can't tell any difference, and love your car still, then keep it and wait for 2019.
 

AudiNutta

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If I was you I would do it....meant to be dynamically better car, newer engine and tech...you can fix the noise with some mods...but thats just me.
If you have driven them back to back and can't tell any difference, and love your car still, then keep it and wait for 2019.

Agree to the above, try and test it.. if it feels exciting to you, do what feels right. Demo's should be here for the end of the month fingers crossed...
 

Ozmosis

Registered User
Another point to note is that the FL engine has not been "proven" for it's reliabilty just yet. I think you'd be gutted if you decided to make the leap and end up with a car with niggles galore...

Sometimes if it sounds too good to be true, it is ;)
 

AudiNutta

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Another point to note is that the FL engine has not been "proven" for it's reliabilty just yet. I think you'd be gutted if you decided to make the leap and end up with a car with niggles galore...

Sometimes if it sounds too good to be true, it is ;)

I doubt it hasn't been proven, it has been over a year since the Saloon was seen darting around the ring with this engine in.......
 

Ozmosis

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I doubt it hasn't been proven, it has been over a year since the Saloon was seen darting around the ring with this engine in.......

Yeah about a year and they decided to delay the introduction...

Most new engines have niggles, and the 'Ring is hardly day to day, stop-start, short trips, idling in traffic etc etc.

Plus as Honda have found out in F1, bench testing doesn't necessarily translate to reality.

I hope you are right and you do not have any issues at all, as I know how long you've been planning to get yours. But I do seem to recall the experiences you've had with your S3 haven't shown 100% reliability?
 

AudiNutta

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Yeah about a year and they decided to delay the introduction...

Most new engines have niggles, and the 'Ring is hardly day to day, stop-start, short trips, idling in traffic etc etc.

Plus as Honda have found out in F1, bench testing doesn't necessarily translate to reality.

I hope you are right and you do not have any issues at all, as I know how long you've been planning to get yours. But I do seem to recall the experiences you've had with your S3 haven't shown 100% reliability?

Well I would like to think that they have done an amount of reliability testing. I'm expecting that they will have niggles, the PFL did.. within a matter of days of its arrival all were taken off the road for an oil pressure sensor.

Providing any niggles are sorted hassle free, it's part of owning a performance car and using warranty isn't any hassle to us.

Yep, I have had a few issues with it. None with the engine, the engine is solid and pulled 336hp on the dyno, rather than the quoted 306. I doubted that figure, but the person who ran it told me don't be disappointed if it didn't pull 300 because the engine only had 2k on the clock. Judging by him guessing it would be really hard on figures, has told me it did do well.. he was amazed with the results it returned and they specialise in mapping the German cars and have done a lot of work with Golf R's and S3'. I did plan on putting it on again, but I don't think I will get around to it now.

I've had a steering rack fail, when I say fail it was clunking and there was a 'sticking' point in the rack. 2000 miles later I had a wheel bearing start clicking the same, upon maneuvering.
 

Ozmosis

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Well I would like to think that they have done an amount of reliability testing. I'm expecting that they will have niggles, the PFL did.. within a matter of days of its arrival all were taken off the road for an oil pressure sensor.

Providing any niggles are sorted hassle free, it's part of owning a performance car and using warranty isn't any hassle to us.

Yep, I have had a few issues with it. None with the engine, the engine is solid and pulled 336hp on the dyno, rather than the quoted 306. I doubted that figure, but the person who ran it told me don't be disappointed if it didn't pull 300 because the engine only had 2k on the clock. Judging by him guessing it would be really hard on figures, has told me it did do well.. he was amazed with the results it returned and they specialise in mapping the German cars and have done a lot of work with Golf R's and S3'. I did plan on putting it on again, but I don't think I will get around to it now.

I've had a steering rack fail, when I say fail it was clunking and there was a 'sticking' point in the rack. 2000 miles later I had a wheel bearing start clicking the same, upon maneuvering.

I understand the point you are making, but would the OP really want to trade in his beloved car for one that may develop some niggles if his is still like new?
 

AudiNutta

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I understand the point you are making, but would the OP really want to trade in his beloved car for one that may develop some niggles if his is still like new?

I would struggle with this too, I've done this deal with little thought of the S3.. until it came to planning how to move it on and I will be gutted to see it go. There isn't a day I get in it and it doesn't make me smile one way or another, I'm definitely not fed up. But I'm bettering the car and achieving the long lasting dream.

For the OP, the best thing has to be to go and drive one back to back and if he is wow'ed by the new car then go for it. But if he comes back out and thinks it's a great car, but isn't a world of difference from his PFL then save the money. What I will say is the FL is a better car in the A3 range overall, much better standard equipment as it always should have been. Mine was much quieter getting in from my PFL as far as noise deadening goes, that was going from 18's to 19's, you'd expect more noise.
 

kayemill

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I went from a 58 plate S3 8p to an 11 plate facelift S3 8p. It was the worst thing I ever did. My original 8p was solid no issues at all. However the facelift was a bag of spanners. From rattles in the interior to steering wheel judder at high speed. For me all they do with a facelift is take the opportunity to seriously cheapen the components in the car to make more money. If I had the offer you have been given I wouldn't even consider it.
 

Radman

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Another point to note is that the FL engine has not been "proven" for it's reliabilty just yet. I think you'd be gutted if you decided to make the leap and end up with a car with niggles galore...

Sometimes if it sounds too good to be true, it is ;)
I kinda agree Oz. The more I think of it the more I'm put off.
 

Radman

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Love the V8 mate. RS4 is a legend of a car.
It a tuff one to decide on,me I'd think I'd sit and wait for the next generation A3 to come out in 2019,as much as I like the FL I still think between the two it isn't enough to justify the swop from PFL to FL.
It's interesting to note that there's a a lot of demand still for the PFL.
Mines also has the ceramic coating and front end PPF installed,I'm thinking about getting rid of mines and getting an RS4 that I've found with beautiful spec on it,in fact I've secured the car already with a small deposit while I think it through.
I'd be selling mines privately,I've had an offer already on mines but I just don't think it's enough,but then it never is in the owners eyes is it.
 

AudiNutta

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Love the V8 mate. RS4 is a legend of a car.

+1 here, I will forever dream of that car! Used car finance rates aren't on any level reasonable, most are close on 20k mileage and have no warranty.. :( School boys dream, killed off.
 

Steff s3

Registered User
That's the only things that's of concern to me on the RS4 that I've found is the warranty,if it's got the 5year warranty on it when bought new then it's a bonus,if not then as much as I like it I'm going to walk away from it.
I'm looking forward to hopefully getting my own car back from Audi tomorrow.
 

AudiNutta

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That's the only things that's of concern to me on the RS4 that I've found is the warranty,if it's got the 5year warranty on it when bought new then it's a bonus,if not then as much as I like it I'm going to walk away from it.
I'm looking forward to hopefully getting my own car back from Audi tomorrow.

I know Iwould absolutely love one and if I could get one new now, I'd sell a kidney for one ;) Annual warranty with Audi is over £2k, id be happy to pay the running costs for that purr but the warranty... cost mounts.
 

Steff s3

Registered User
It's an astonishing amount to take a risk on a car that's not covered by a warranty,the sound of it when I fired it up is something else though,it's an animal.
It's rare with all the options on it,in fact I've never seen another that colour or with the wing backs an ceramic brakes.
I need to have the sensible head on tomorrow, might have it with me at aitp lol.
 

AudiNutta

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It's an astonishing amount to take a risk on a car that's not covered by a warranty,the sound of it when I fired it up is something else though,it's an animal.
It's rare with all the options on it,in fact I've never seen another that colour or with the wing backs an ceramic brakes.
I need to have the sensible head on tomorrow, might have it with me at aitp lol.

If you do, I need to hear it ;)

I've driven an RS4 and 5, what a noise! Could probably do with an exhaust if you want it to compete with the likes of an RS3, but the tone is insane. The best for me, is the downshifts.. best way I can describe it is, it sounds like it is 'digging deep', cannot get enough of it!!
 

Steff s3

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It's already got the RS sports exhaust on it like my RS3 does, it's just a different sound altogether.
I'll see how I get on tomorrow but if it doesn't happen then I'm not exactly going to be peeved of about it as I've still got my stunning RS3 that I need to start enjoying more,which I intend to do coming down that M6 on Sat morning :yes:
 

AudiNutta

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It's already got the RS sports exhaust on it like my RS3 does, it's just a different sound altogether.
I'll see how I get on tomorrow but if it doesn't happen then I'm not exactly going to be peeved of about it as I've still got my stunning RS3 that I need to start enjoying more,which I intend to do coming down that M6 on Sat morning :yes:

Let us know how you find it, pictures would be great either way too ;)
Yes it's not as if you are hard done by, none of us on here are... :D Looking forward to seeing the car on stand.

What PPF do you have on your car, is it XPEL? My detailer is starting up with PPF but I've personally had bad experience with SunTek so he's gone down the XPEL route and his best rates are still well into a 4 figure sum for front end only. He's ordering the cut-outs in, I am nervous they will be really crap like SunTek were :/ I literally had 5mm uncovered on some panels, as well as it looked like the lines had been drawn by a 2 year old with a crayon.. really poor for templates.
 

msdmjb

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Leaving emotion aside...............an extra £100/month for a very similar car to your current one where the real world performance will be the same when you are only doing approx 250miles/month. For those figures I would be wanting something totally different rather than simply a recent upgrade to the current one.

I only do 7k miles a year and can't justify moving from my S3 to an RS3...........the number of times 300bhp isn't enough isn't frequent enough for me to justify it (whilst having other choices including a 1bhp:1kg machine :))

The irony is that the ££ are irrelevant as I am quite old, simply the justification of spending them.
 
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wab172uk

Now in an X3 M40i And a Yaris GR-Four
I only do 7k miles a year and can't justify moving from my S3 to an RS3...........the number of times 300bhp isn't enough isn't frequent enough for me to justify it (whilst having other choices including a 1bhp:1kg machine :))

This is the very dilemma I currently have. I have a 2015 S3 Saloon, and would love an RS3 Saloon. Thing is, I work from home, and have a little run-a-bout for anything daily, like running to the shops, so the S3 only gets used on a weekend, and not every weekend due to work loads.

A rough trade-in value of my car is about £22-23k, or £25k'ish with a private sale. My ideal RS3 spec is coming out at £52k. So if I go for it, I'm effectively buying the exact same car (albeit some differences) as the one I've got, and getting an extra 100bhp, and it's costing me (if no discount) another £25-£30k. I'm struggling to justify that at the minute.

There's not many times that the S3 isn't quick enough to get past most things when I need it to. The GF doesn't like me driving quickly on any back roads. I never get chance these days to take a car out for a blast over some great roads either.

But then, the car nut in me soo badly wants a new RS3. Think if it was a brand new A3 model car, the decision would be easier, but it's basically the same car.

If the new A3 is out in 2019, the new S3 will be another 12-18 months after that, with the all new RS3 maybe another 12-18 months after the S3. It's a long time to wait for the next S/RS3. So maybe the RS3 saloon will be the perfect bridge from current to all new?

I'm going wait it out. I got a very good discount on my S3 by ordering in the week before the end of December 2014, so I guess they were more open to discounts to get their figure's up. I have said to dealer I don't want any new car till April next year, and he has advised to order in November for that. Around that time I may see what discounts I can get through Carwow and alike.
 

dunes7

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@msdmjb & @wab172uk - Whilst not wishing to upset anybody, the 5-pot engine is sooooooo much better to drive with than a 4-pot, its incredible!! Not just for when you want the performance, even for driving around town, the low down torque available makes it such an effortless machine. I've experienced this 5-pot for over a year now in an RS Q3 and loved every minute of driving it.
 

msdmjb

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No argument from me, you are totally right the engine is ace but functionally it won't make any difference on the majority of my S3 journeys (high speed cross country and motorway). Your argument is flawed though e.g. I have found the new AMG bi-turbo motor to be even better than the RS motor but my own 'justificationometer' won't allow it even if funds would.

Back to the question, assuming the OP had no intentions to change prior to talking to a salesman then I reckon he should leave well alone.
 

dno_uk

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£100 extra per month to drive practically the same car? Save you hard earned cash
 

dbm

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What PPF do you have on your car, is it XPEL? My detailer is starting up with PPF but I've personally had bad experience with SunTek so he's gone down the XPEL route and his best rates are still well into a 4 figure sum for front end only. He's ordering the cut-outs in, I am nervous they will be really **** like SunTek were :/ I literally had 5mm uncovered on some panels, as well as it looked like the lines had been drawn by a 2 year old with a crayon.. really poor for templates.
I used these guys for my 8V: http://signature-group.co.uk/ and these guys twice before that for TTS and 8P: http://www.paintshield.co.uk/. I would recommend either happily. The new stuff fitted by Signature was so good I actually asked them if they'd applied it...
 

Evotion

The Greed For Speed
£100 per month extra - I am on the side of definitely do it!
It's a new car, better in most areas and faster, whole new warranty and any niggles will be sorted out.
I would have said yes before the phone had been put down (and asked for the 5 year warranty as a bonus..)
 

AudiNutta

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AudiNutta

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@Radman you've gone quiet, what's your thoughts now everyone has given theirs?

Or, what is your Audi code of your order? ;)
 

Radman

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@Radman you've gone quiet, what's your thoughts now everyone has given theirs?

Or, what is your Audi code of your order? ;)
To be fair
@Radman you've gone quiet, what's your thoughts now everyone has given theirs?

Or, what is your Audi code of your order? ;)
I adore my current car, especially in the Sepang, BUT, I am tempted, but just unsure if I can jusstify it. My config is as attached. I have spoken to the dealer and I will be test driving the new one in a couple of weeks. That will ultimately make my mind up. I'll know pretty much straight away. If not, so be it. My current car still takes some beating
IMG_4402.PNG
IMG_4403.PNG
in my eyes.
 

Steff s3

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I'd take my time on this one and give it a good think over if I was you mate.
You've got your car to the way you've wanted it,cherished it, loved it and looked after it.and I bet you've never used it or opened it up to its full potential,and I'm the same.
All for someone else to snap it up and get the benefits from your labourers.
Oh test drove that RS4 today I was on about,amazing machine.BUT..........
 

AudiNutta

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To be fair

I adore my current car, especially in the Sepang, BUT, I am tempted, but just unsure if I can jusstify it. My config is as attached. I have spoken to the dealer and I will be test driving the new one in a couple of weeks. That will ultimately make my mind up. I'll know pretty much straight away. If not, so be it. My current car still takes some beating View attachment 133363 View attachment 133364 in my eyes.

That's fair enough, totally appreciate what you are saying. Let us know how you get on with the test drive, I'm hoping I am impressed.

Don't blame you for going Nardo, Ara isn't all that... totally gone off of it.
 
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