still no response from abs module

boost-addict

Registered User
right.... so when i got the car the abs light was on and there was 3 beeps on the clocks (researched that to be a dead abs module)
so its been like that some time, i got a s/h one thats been tested working. ive plugged it in and still no response from the abs controller.

so what now? do i need a registered version of vagcom to work round it and find the fault? or does it need coding? altho as theres no response im not sure. any chance of there being a broken wire anywhere?

with the old abs module when plugged in it locks you out of every thing, but this time it hasnt.

ive got the same part numbers as the old one.

one thing that is becoming apparent is the seller of the car also supplied a set of clocks. and when looking in to it it also showed no response from the instruments,, altho with the dead abs module unplugged, i then could access as much as vagcom lite would let me,

sooo.... what do i do now?
 

aragorn

"Stick a V8 in it!"
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Theres a big fuse for the ABS under the dash behind central electrics, maybe worth checking its not blown?
 

aragorn

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Clocks have nothing to do with the K line to the ABS module.

Both the ABS module and the clocks sit on the same K line, but they're both independent devices.

This is the same for every module in the car, bar the engine ECU.

What sometimes happens though, is when the ABS unit goes faulty, it jams the K-Line, so no other devices can communicate on it.


Do you still have the big red ABS warning on the dashboard? Does the ABS system actually work?

Re-reading your first post you say you plugged it in, but this perhaps implies the pump isnt actually fully fitted, just plugged in loose? Is there perhaps an earth strap from the pump to the car that isnt fitted because its plugged in loose?
 

boost-addict

Registered User
Ive just split the module from the pump it cane on and im sticking it on my car as we speak. Before i had 3 beep, flashing red and yellow symbols, and no abs. I plugged in the pump and module directly to the plug and still no luck. Both mine and pump that came with the module read 1.8ohms

Just to clarify both pump and module part numbers match my existing stuff
 

boost-addict

Registered User
right,

disconnected the battery, installed the abs module..... then went for lunch, and to reset the car fully
turnt the car on and got 2 bleeps then followed by one (low fuel) so over the moon
scanned it... hey presto it worked... right rear sensor fault, which i know as its currently stuck in the hub i removed ages ago.

i pressed the button under stick and the bottom half of the dis went black but the abs light remained and the yellow flashing brake symbol remains
thought great must be down to that rear sensor.

so took it out for a drive locked it up a few times actually got the front inside wheel to lock so thought great, but then the red light is back flashing
so pulled up scanned the abs module and no response from the controller?

so whats gone wrong? should i disconnect the battery and repeat the first few steps?

so i have established at least every thing can and did work briefly.

now im slightly stumped! i read if the abs unit detects a fault itll switch its self off till reset, which i guess means removing the battery terminal.

i can get in instruments 17 , airbags 15 35 but not engine , ctrl locks. havent tried any other modules

so going to disconnect the battery, but what are your thought arragon
 

aragorn

"Stick a V8 in it!"
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yellow flashing brake warning is nothing to do with the ABS, thats a fault with the pad wear sensors.

You might just have a dodgy vagcom lead, my mate had one that would only connect to some modules.

Fix the pad wear sensors and the orange flashing should go away, and fit the right rear sensor (£15 on ebay for a new sensor) and see what happens with the ABS.
 

boost-addict

Registered User
I have one in the hub at my dads. Im going to go try now as battery has been disconnected a while. Well maybe but ita never been a problem before but i guess theres that risk.

It was ok till it locked up. It then threw a hissy fit and made the read light flash on the dash
 

boost-addict

Registered User
well nothing, so my pump has either fried the abs module, which may have done the same to the last module.
or something else is acting strange stopping the abs and engine from communicating,
as its cold and raining i couldnt be **** to carry on, so i disconnected the battery with both terminals touching as i did before.
disconnect the abs module and im off to work soon so ill check it tonight when i get back if i can be fussed, or tomorrow after work and see what happens, so would mean more then 24 hours with battery disconnected


so if the abs module then refuses to work, then what? ideas? least i know the k-line and power is geting to the module and then communicating back. ill also get the hub from my dads tomorrow afternoon and get the sensor out, of course if its broke by me hammering it then ill just order a new one, BUT, i know that the abs module worked with that abs sensor disconnected.

oh im actually more upset then i was before it wasnt working the first time!!!
 

aragorn

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you need to be clearer about the current situation...

If you just turn the car on do you get the three warning beeps and big red warning? or just the yellow abs light?

If not, and they only happen when you connect with VCDS, thats normal. When VCDS connects to the ABS pump you get the three beeps and big red warning. It usually goes off again when VCDS disconnects, but i guess if VCDS isnt communicating properly then it might well leave it in an unknown state.

You'll almost certainly ruin the sensor trying to get it out, but i guess give it a go anyway.
 

boost-addict

Registered User
Right at the begining
As i can br unclear some times!!

Had 3 beeps red flashing symbol and abs light

Fitted abs module. Got one beep followed by two bleeps( low washer fluid and low fuel)
I searched the abs module it went on to the module, checked code and it said right rear abs sensor. Which i know is missing.

So cleared that. Disconnected the lead
Got 2 bleeps pressed the buttin under the wiper stick and the bottom half of the screen went black. For the first time in 18 months lol
But abs light remained

So over the moon

Went for a drive. Locked up the wheels a few times to see if it worked as you asked and then the red brake light was flashing again

Pulled over, tried to scan the abs module and getting no response again

So disconnected battery for an hour. Still the same issue

So something. Say the pump has done something to upset or fry the module or stop it working. So im back to square one
Well i say square one. At least i know theres communication and power

And at least i actually have a module i could at least get refurbed?

But just strange to stop working after just locking the wheels
 

boost-addict

Registered User
ok so just been out side, connected the battery,
ran the abs module, no response,
ran the engine module, no response,

disconnected the abs module, ran the engine module, works
connect the abs module while in the engine module, vcds freezes then says no response from controller.

so how could i have a working abs module, then now back to were i started?

what causes the abs module to stop working, besides the little wires that snap. which would have broken in transit if they were going to break!

lost for how and why?
 

Rallyman

LPG Abuser & have VAGCOM
I know what pain you're feeling with this module!

Ok, had similar issues over the last 2 or so years with my ABS module - TQS. ABS module nos' 0265 220 408 - 8E0 614 111 A

Working fine no problems - worked hard over a few snowy months. 3 beeps & RED ABS light came on. Traced to ABS module on the side of the ABS block - sent to BBA reman- repaired all ok.

2 months later, unit fails. Sent back to BBA warranty repaired - Advised that possibly the car had caused the fault like a short. Tried unit again ABS all good. But for some strange reason - no comms with others modules via VAG check.
Rang BBA - they said that this is possibly due to a faulty system. Seems strange that when the ABS was disconnected the system would communicate all OK. ABS working all OK.

Car used normally over 1 - 2 years - If I needed to connect, I would disconnect the battery followed by the ABS - then reconnect after doing the work.

Audi kept wanting to investigate during the service resets as they couldn't connect, though the Service indicator/mileage would always reset within a day!

AMBER light came on, checked without disconnecting the module - code read as rear abs speed sensor - cleared then it wouldn't connect again!

Replaced speed sensor AND module (AFTER a Lucky lucky lucky scrappy find) - I now can connect to OBD and I have no orange light
Happy days!! ABS working ALL OK :)

So some pointers - Always disconnect the battery before you unplug the module don't do this "live" - after reading many USA pages on these modules - Some mention this A version was superseded by another version - ("E" I think?)

There are many threads on this Bosch module / pump from here and the USA, and after reading many of them, you have to replace like for like! Disconnecting the battery wont make a difference - you'll need either a VAGCOM or VAGcheck tool to reset. The ABS light would appear to be on its own system that monitors itself and performs a system check every time you start the car.

Some links useful reads......
Bentley Publishers - Technical Discussions : abs module ...
ModuleMaster rebuilds ABS modules for as low as $100, 2 day average turn-around, 5 Year Guarantee

Perhaps your second module was about to die anyway? Did you reconnect live?
There are a couple of repair companies that service these modules on eBay,

Like Aragorn says get a new speed sensor in!
 

boost-addict

Registered User
no, i connected with the battery disconnected as said in previous posts. it stopped working the moment i locked the brakes,
i find it hard to believe the module was about to die and did so in these circumstances,i don't get any pull under hard braking as far as i know.


maybe the pump is shot then! but don't want to put a different pump in and then find i cant communicate and cant bleed the system!


can the pump short the abs module out? if i lock the brakes the motor surely would have tried to activate


looking back i did remember one wheel locking up like there was more force on that wheel. although


some thing else is going on but where do i start and who do i take it too?


i also don't believe the rear sensor missing would stop the abs module working. as it connected fine,


but anything is possible and even if i have to lay the hub in the rear of the car and hook the sensor up so be it.


maybe i should buy the E version.
 

Rallyman

LPG Abuser & have VAGCOM
What car do you have?

errr ok, though you said in an earlier post:

"connect the abs module while in the engine module, vcds freezes then says no response from controller"

So you disconnected the battery while the diagnostics were still connected ?

Sounds like mine, I had no comms with anything when my first one was working - but not working?!

What diagnostics tool are you running? What ABS module are you running? The Stealers will want about £700 for a complete ABS set up, rebuilds are about £100, though it might be a good idea to get one to diagnose / quote.

I would get a new abs sensor for the car, then you know that you can discount this problem. The AMBER ABS light will come on if there is a faulty sensor, The RED warning light with 3 bleeps will come on with the ABS module fault.

It is possible that the pump motor could place a larger load on the module if it was faulty, though this "should" be covered by the fuse Aragorn talked about. By getting the module checked they will be able to advise what wrong - ie broken gold wire or burnt track for the pump motor!
 

boost-addict

Registered User
sorry yes i did say i removed the plug live, but this is later on once it had stopped working,,

running vcds, i dont see the need to pay audi any money, s/h parts are more then good enough, but i belive the pump is to fault, as it stopped working the minute i locked the brakes,

i have checked that sensor and i know it works, so no point wasting money at this point.

i still dont believe the module was faulty but i guess its possible. but its too much coincidence that it worked, i drive it less then 0.5 miles locked the brakes and it stopped working. just to far fetched for it to break down at the point

can a faulty pump kill a module?

if i remove the my pump and put the pump i got in its place, do i need to run the bleed sequence or can i just bleed the system normally?
 
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Rallyman

LPG Abuser & have VAGCOM
It is possible that removing the plug live could have damaged other parts of the module.

I suppose anything is possible with regards to the pump vs. module. Fortunately I did not get that far with mine so I don't know if you can swap pump motors without disassembling the ABS block.

I'd think that running the bleed sequence would be the best thing to do - I don't know if anyone else has tried this as a non abs system!

Being an Electro-mechanical engineer, looking at the system I would say that the module is more likely to be the cause of the problem than a Bosch sourced motor!

I'd look at having the module checked first, send off your module to one of the below companies - they'd probably quote you before they repair and you could discuss your module and find out what has killed it! It will be easier than messing with the ABS block and lots of brake fluid!

Have a read of the posts on the bentley publishers site - Im pretty sure I didn't see a mention of pumps failing!

BBA reman. ABS, ecu's, throttle bodies, air mass meters, MFD and catalytic converters

Audi A4 / A6 ABS Pump/Module ECU for years 2000 to 2006 | eBay
 

boost-addict

Registered User
Youve missed what ive said

I connected the abs module up with the battery disconnected.

It then worked and then Stopped working in a space of 5 minutes right after i locked the wheels up
In that 5 minutes, i didn't disconnect or reconnect the module with the battery connected!. I was on the side of the road with vcdc telling me it couldn't connect with the abs or the engine!!

Yes going to send it off and get a verdict

Correct me if im wrong but the module you linked wont work with my car

And i cant run the bleed sequence if i cant communicate with the module!!

As per the pump as any motor can short out or spike under load theres a chance its that. But will have to see what the repair service says

Any good places in uk that can do this??
 

aragorn

"Stick a V8 in it!"
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There is no bleed sequence on these pumps.

If you do get the module repaired, i'd swap the whole ABS pump out and use the new one, just to rule out the pump itself somehow killing the module.
 

aragorn

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yep.

The bleed thing only exists on A3/Golf platform cars, and newer A4's with ESP.
 

boost-addict

Registered User
Ok thanks well looks like ill be swapping pumps and sending the module to bba man. I thought it had to be dine that way thus why i just swapped modules. Good job it only cost £27 for pump and module
 

Rallyman

LPG Abuser & have VAGCOM
Bba reman do a before and after test when they do the repair (OR they should do) so they should be able totell you what part is wrong with it. Ie which circuit is faulty input or output
 

Iceash

Registered User
Me either, so had to borrow. Worth it though. Just fired right up. Repaired one failed after a week!
 

aragorn

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Perhaps, but then every B5 driving around essentially has a used one fitted to it, and they all (mostly) work fine dont they!

Its just a shame that these pumps are a bit rare. And i expect they arent even that rare, its just that folk breaking the cars wont even think twice about the ABS pump and so it'll go to the crusher!
 

boost-addict

Registered User
Well i have a pump that came with the module
Is there any thing i can check?
And think its worth getting the module checked and repaired or what?

Makes the car pretty worthless with the abs light on?
 

Rallyman

LPG Abuser & have VAGCOM
@ Iceash - How much £ was it from the stealers ? Also this complete assembly - was it the "repair" kit that Audi mention ? Do you have any part numbers etc... Also what is the number on the top of the abs module? - thanks!
 

aragorn

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and it hasnt worked since?

I'd try fitting the new pump and module together and see if it works.
 

Iceash

Registered User
@ Iceash - How much £ was it from the stealers ? Also this complete assembly - was it the "repair" kit that Audi mention ? Do you have any part numbers etc... Also what is the number on the top of the abs module? - thanks!
625 smackers from memory, was pump and module, code was the same as what's on the old one. It was a complete new unit, a friend fitted it for me.
 

boost-addict

Registered User
and it hasnt worked since?

I'd try fitting the new pump and module together and see if it works.

yep, fitted it, scanned it, worked, flashing red symbol went away
locked the wheels, red symbol came back, cant connect to abs module

im going to be removing it to sent to a company called autotek electronics, will inspect for free and then contact before fixing

website says £54.99 and covers fixing it.


so ill connect it up to the pump it came on and see what happens
 

boost-addict

Registered User
ok something strange happened tonight, still sending module off but
started car and dont remember the 3 bleeps, but then ive switched off to that sound its been a fault way too long,

any way, as i pulled away with a empty car park and a damp surface i gave it some welly and flicked the rear end out, as i pulled straight i got 3 bleeps? just to note, ive never had bleeping while driving, only when turning the ignition

exactly what happened when i locked the brakes.....

the plot thickens????
 

Rallyman

LPG Abuser & have VAGCOM
ABS system works independently from any all other systems, runs a system test from IGN on, and monitors the wheel sensors during driving as it checks the number of pulses all the time,as it is looking for a mis-match of pulses under breaking.
 
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