Facelift S3 project.

[ianh]

Thought I would start a thread with a new project in the hope that with all the knowledge and technical know how on here I can gain some help with the repairs.

I am a mechanic up in manchester of 40 years but I am limited on my electrical skills or vcds programming/fault finding.

Anyhow with all this pandemic going on and with business quite a bit quieter than I like I thought I would buy a car that needed some work doing on it to keep me occupied and went to view a 2017 Audi s3 saloon with 625 miles only from new,it is a australian import and unregistered in the uk,it was described as fire damaged. (It would be amazing if someone from oz reads this and recognises it’s there old car and could throw some light on its history as I don’t have any and can only guess at what’s happened and when)

On viewing I was surprised at how little damage there actually is,there was no bumper on it or bumper wiring and at first glance no obvious damage to anywhere else.

Due to the mileage being so low I realise it’s quite a unique vehicle realy and well worth taking a chance on,so I negotiated a reasonable price and had it delivered.

can’t find a build sticker with the options on but it does seem well equipped ,found a date of build sticker that says October 2016 so unsure why the seller had it listed as 10/2017,maybe a misprint!

I will have to register it but think I need to have a Iva test done first and can’t do that till it’s all repaired and running sweet,so anyone knows about Iva test or registering a vehicle shout up please

Here’s some photos from the advert for now.
If this is the wrong section I apologise.

 

[CanadaA3wales]

IVA test is £200.00 for this car, thats all I cant tell you.
Once its done I am unsure if they just give you a V5 or if you mail to the DVLA with the IVA cert and they give you a V5 doc.
You can give Audi the VIN number and they can tell you when it was first registered, regardless of where it was built or sold.
I am sure Aus Audi will give you the details as well if you email them with the vehicle docs and proof of ownership.

 

[ianh]

I have been online to Australia Audi and there’s not actually a email address,there’s only a contact us form and when I inputted all my details it wouldn’t send because my postcode is uk not Australia,I was expecting the Iva to be around the £200 mark.
Not got any documents so haven’t got proof of ownership,the only document I have is the customs clearance nova certificate.
I have emailed Audi uk for coc certificates and have asked if they could provide any info regards the car,but not holding my breath for a reply!
I rang Bolton Audi to enquire about Audi connect not working and when I try to register it it says contact your trading partner (Bolton Audi) to confirm proof of ownership,so rang them and had to explain myself to the receptionist only for her to tell me no ones available and they will call me back..........5 days later still waiting.

 

[ianh]

Once I got the car home I started to order bits I would need,that’s where the problem starts,most used parts available are for hatchbacks and pretty sure they must be different,so start to look at various websites for diagrams and the only exploded parts diagram I can find online is USA or Germany and even then it only goes up to 2016!anyhow I have been going off These first 2 photos.
So I source a wiring loom in Lithuania for 6 sensor bumper as this one has lane assist and side assist etc.sourced a bumper which isn’t pre drilled for sensors so ordered a cutting tool.
Sourced 2 used modules for the side assist,exact same part numbers as the ones taken off.
I did notice that the keyless lock doesnt work and vcds says it’s rear bumper kessy Ariel,I have tried to find info out and can’t find zilch,the only thing I have found reference to it is a eBay advert in America for a pair with brackets,so I have ordered them and whilst I am waiting delivery I will try and find out how they are wired in as there’s no sign of any spare connectors on the new loom I have.
So if anyone has a wiring diagram or can advise where and even if it should have these sensors I would appreciate it.

 

[ianh]

The other thing I noticed is that reverse camera is missing?took the trim of the boot and the wires been cut at the connectors so I think someone has changed the boot lid,that’s the trouble with not knowing history,everything’s guesswork,I have ordered a camera and from what I can gather there’s a fibre optic in the cable which can’t be repaired,so I have ordered a new loom for the camera from kufatec and may have to replace all the wires for that.I am beginning to wonder wether the kessy antennae wires are amongst this lot and the antennae fastens in the boot?anyone know for sure?

 

[ianh]

After having a good luck underneath the car the fire was confined to the bumper area only,it doesn’t seem to have touched the main loom in the car going to the back bumper although the grommet is burned,the exhaust valves show a little bit of heat damage yet things like shockers and diff still has part stickers on and all looks like new........suppose that’s the benefit of a Australian car,our British weather hasn’t started to corrode everything.

 

[Jassyo06]

Judging by them photos the optional extras on the car are SS seats,extended leather....ie in the arm rests/side of centre consul,pan roof,Tech pack including the VC,upgraded alloys,Matrix headlights....S3's in Oz are specified differently from the UK in that they add larger option packs and virtually no individual options,the extended leather was not available with Black SS seats in the UK,only available in the UK with the Red design pack at £895 the stitching was in red

 

[ianh]

That’s interesting as I just noticed that the floor mats have red stitching?

 

[Jassyo06]

That’s interesting as I just noticed that the floor mats have red stitching?

Floor mats with red stitching were standard on all S3 's mate....you've got a very well optioned car the saloon comes standard with 19s the alloys fitted to your car where a £300 optional extra in the UK
Rear camera £395
Super sport seats £795
Pano roof £1095
Technology package ie Virtual Cockpit £995
Matrix headlights £895
Extended leather £295*
It should have the Bang&Olufsen surround sound system £695
Power folding doir mirrors £295

 

[ianh]

Yes,it has the b&o speakers with lighting bars,also a nice little Quattro puddle lamp projection feature,maybe UK standard that though.thanks for the info.

 

[Jassyo06]

Your welcome says me the Audi 8v S3 anorak lol

 

[ianh]

Haha,you are bang on with the extras though,managed to take snaps of a parts vin search and got these.

 

[ianh]

Well I managed to get the car together and looking respectable,I also applied for it’s Iva test and received a call from the DVSA advising me it had already got a certificate from may 2019 and it was unused,so all I had to pay out for was a duplicate certificate.......nice bonus realy.
So put it through it’s mot today and as expected with it only covered 625 miles it passed fine.
So all the paperwork’s now sent off to dvla to register it,so hopefully may get it on the road soon.heres some updated photos anyhow.
It realy is like a new car underneath,nuts/bolts/screws/clips no rust and just as they came from the factory,fantastic for a 4 year old car.

 

[craigpanthercrystal]

Looking great, it does look brand new.

 

[ianh]

Thanks,it’s even better now it knows where it is thanks to Alex for working his magic on the mmi.

 

[ianh]

Well,a bit of a update and not good news realy.royal mail lost my original application to dvla so spent a month getting duplicates together and re applying,sent it all off just before Xmas,then 3 days later I received a thick envelope from dvla! My application hadn’t been lost,it had been processed but returned to me as the dvla had been informed by the Australian authorities that the car was a statutory write off and I will need to change the vin number which they have supplied and then when I reapply it will be given a Q registration,absolutely gutted now.
The car is mint and like new,the damage I have repaired is all cosmetic,zero structural repair as none is needed.
Now I don’t know how to procceed,obviously I was aware it was a salvage vehicl and I thought I knew what a Q plate denoted,indeed I even checked dvla/gov website before purchase and the only info I could find was similar to my understandings.
A q plate is assigned to vehicles whose age or identity is unknown,I didn’t even consider the possibility that this vehicle would be a Q,I expected a dated reg number with a v5 showing that it’s been subject to a insurance claim overseas,that may bother some people but as the car was for myself it wasn’t a issue as I knew what damage it had and also know the repairs are all correct.
Now I have the hassle of cancelling my insurance policy,it’s insured under the vin number by a sponsor on here to enable me to tax the car,but if I change the vin now the car won’t be insured so won’t get registered without tax.
So I will have to get a new policy relating to the new vin and with it going to be registered on a Q plate I would hazard a guess that most insurance companies will run a mile and those that don’t will no doubt be unaffordable to insure.
What a Xmas so far.corona virus and beaurocracy,anyone know if there’s any form of vaccine against beaurocracy

 

[Chris.D]

Sorry to hear about your troubles, going from the pictures, it looks like it’s rolled right off the production line.

Out of interest, why would a vehicle that’s been written off in Australia then be imported to the U.K, is it still cost effective to import and break?

 

[ianh]

Probably healthy profit if they can sell it off as repairable to gullible people,never thought I was one but you live and learn,the trouble is there’s no clear guidance pre purchase for someone in this same predicament.
The guidelines for a Q plate are somewhat lacking.

 

[s3mad_dude]

The DVLA site states the following, so I assume they think your car must be a “rebuild” or something like that, if it was an insurance loss??


When you may need a new VIN or registration
If you have a kit car, rebuild, or radically altered vehicle, DVLA will usually have to assess it.

You may be able to keep its original registration number if you can prove the vehicle’s original VIN. If you cannot, you’ll have to apply for a replacement identity number.

DVLA will give you an authorisation letter to get the vehicle stamped with the new VIN if your vehicle passes its assessment.

You then need to register the vehicle - you can only do this when DVLA receives confirmation it’s been stamped with the correct VIN.

So, if the above is true, surely if DVLA inspect your car and you show them exactly what work you did, provided evidence and receipts for parts, they’ll see the car clearly does not need to be treated as an actual write off. Right?

Surely common sense can prevail here if you argue your case strongly enough? Can Audi help you with supplying additional build documents? Do you have photos of the damage in Australia? I guess the more info you can supply to the DVLA, the greater your chances.

Good luck with it all. Don’t give up.

 

[ianh]

None of the above applies apparently.
It doesn’t have a original reg number as it has never been registered in UK.
The vin and all other numbers are all original and match Audi’s records.
ITs gone through a Iva test and a mot so has been quite thoroughly checked over and tested.
Common sense isn’t possible when it comes to the dvla,shame no one can invent a vaccine against Beaurocracy
Maybe the Australian insurance industry had so many claims from the recent firestorms that they was under pressure to just clear all the claims,I realy don’t know,but it’s A genuinely perfectly good car that I have good reason to doubt the validity of a statutory write off but not in a position to take on the Australian or UK authorities realy.
I accept it’s a total loss and can’t be put back on the road in Australia,and I can accept regulations are put in place here in the uk to protect consumers,just finding it hard to accept there doesn’t seem any appeal in specific cases as I certainly feel strongly this car shouldn’t have been a statutory total loss.

 

[AlS3BE]

Is there any indication why the car was written off in Australia?
In uk there are different levels of insurance write off.

• A: Scrap
  
  
• B: Break
  
  
• S: Structurally damaged repairable
  
  
• N: Non-structurally damaged repairable
  
  judging by the pics that should be a cat N.
  I would expect a q car to have mismatch parts/chassis/subframe etc. If it was light damage the engine and chassis should be matched as per factory and Audi should be able to confirm that.
  Might still be with appealing with DVLa.

 

[ianh]

In Australia they only have 2 categories,statutory write off and repairable write off,in the New South Wales area they only have 1 category which is statutory write off if a vehicle falls within certain criteria,signs of paint blistering on 3 areas of the car being one and I guess this car fell within there guidelines in there opinion so should be scrap.

From what I have been told here in the uk should a car suffer fire damage it’s also categorised a or b and scrapped,but I have been unable to find out if this is true as yet.

All the regs I have read regarding Q plates also lead me to the same conclusion as you state above.

The dvla have suggested that should I be able to get written authority from the Australian authorities that the vehicle can be repaired and put back on the road under its current vin number then dvla would consider an appeal against its Q plate on condition that it’s the original registered keeper within the first 12 months of registration that applies.

I realy can’t see how getting this form of letter would be possible,it’s the other side of the world and emails aren’t acceptable to dvla,it would mean the insurance assessors saying they was wrong so doubt that is going to happen.

I am looking at getting a independent assessment done over here and submitting it to the dvla,but unsure if that route is possible.

The car is original apart from the rear bumper so all numbers match up.

I am sure there are those that would argue that the cars been condemned in Australia to be scrapped so the dvla are right to be cautious and fair in allowing a change of identity to its vin.

Of course I 100% agree that any future purchaser of this vehicle needs to be aware of its previous history and there needs to be a way of making sure they have all the information easily available,but a Q plate and new vin would hide it’s history surely so that isn’t making any sense at the moment.

Coronavirus isn’t helping matters as it’s not possible to speak to people at dvla for guidance of possible options

 

[AlS3BE]

I would expect any fire damage would be a cat a or b. Even a small fire could cause issues in wiring and other stuff compromising safety systems. Wouldn’t want an airbag going off while driving.
It’s gonna be a big battle unfortunately.
Other options are break the car and sell the bits. Should get a chunk of money back for this. not sure what you paid but there’s possibly £5-10k in parts, possibly more.
another option will be turn it into a track day slag, tuned to an inch of its life.

 

[ianh]

Well there was Signs of slight damage to the main loom,not bad enough to burn through insulation but had certainly distorted the insulation of numerous wires,easily repaired without signs of further issues.on one of my photos it does actually show the extent of this,the loom ran downside the sound deadening felt pads which wasn’t burned?
It would break my heart to break it not to mention my bank balance,so maybe I had best get ready for a long drawn out battle with the dvla.
Not into track days so not realy a option for me personally.
Crazy thing is that should I decide to put it on a Q plate it can be tuned to within a inch of its life and still pass a mot as Q plates as far as I can make out are treated as far as emissions are concerned just the same as a pre 1995 vehicle and is a visual smoke test only.so I suppose there are some benefits.
Think I would rather procceed with Q plates than break the car for spares but do need to look further into things before deciding what to do.

 

[Chris.D]

Probably healthy profit if they can sell it off as repairable to gullible people,never thought I was one but you live and learn,the trouble is there’s no clear guidance pre purchase for someone in this same predicament.
The guidelines for a Q plate are somewhat lacking.

I certainly wouldn’t call you gullible, but it does sound like you’ve got a battle.

Please keep us posted!

 

[AlS3BE]

Who was the importer? Surely they must have known that this car in the uk would have only been good for breaking or Q plate. If they sold it on as a repairable write off then it’s missold so you might have a bit of recourse there.

 

[AlS3BE]

Who was the importer? Surely they must have known that this car in the uk would have only been good for breaking or Q plate. If they sold it on as a repairable write off then it’s missold so you might have a bit of recourse there.

 

[ianh]

i purchased it from a local car trader,i don't know who imported it though and its not easy finding out.someone in the past had got a iva certificate then didn't use it though and no mention of it when i bought it, which does seem odd, at the end of the day though there's only myself to blame so not really looking for recourse, just attempting to understand how best to proceed.
a big contributing factor in the purchase was my failure to understand the rules regarding Q plates and damaged imports , i read up on what is available pre purchase but all it did was confirm in my mind what i already knew. so i do have questions for the dvla and have asked my mp to get involved.
according to a dvla email i have received
"whilst you have correspondence from the audi customer service team in australia stating the vehicles build date, the fact the vehicle has been declared a statutory write off in australia means we have to allocate a dvla vin and Q series plate, whilst we acknowledge that the vehicle is in roadworthy condition following an iva and mot test, vehicles deemed asa statutory writeoffin australia are unable return to the road in that country.
if the original vehicle cannot be returned to the road in a foreign country, we are unable to register the vehicle under its original identity(vin)in the uk with an age related plate based on its build date.this vehicle will therefore not be deemed the original and the only option to register the vehicle in the uk is to stamp the supplied dvla vin and a Q series registration number allocated."

quite a bit of additional information compared to official guidelines on official websites that describe when a vehicle is likely to be issued a Q plate which had it been available when i checked would likely have given the purchase considerable more thought.

 

[Potterswheel]

Hi sorry to hear your long and painful story, What's wrong with a Q plate other than perhaps value if you want to sell for a profit? I am putting together the parts to fit parking sensors and rear camera to my car, I would be very interested to hear about your experiences with cutting the holes in the bumper and fitting the housings for the sensors (what housings did you use? I have been unable to get them in the UK and have ordered them from Amazon DE) I have ordered a QMax 18.6 mm cutter and am planning to attack my painted bumper in the next couple of days.

 

[ianh]

nothing is wrong with the q plate in itself, its what problems will be made once its on a q such as inflated insurance costs.
the cutting of thebholesbis no problem, the bumper will have the crosses where the sensors fit so getting them in the right position is easy enough.
i actually bought the tool that punches the hole rather than drill and it works a treat for the park sensors, however its too small for the side assist radar ones as they are quite a bit bigger but its simple enough to enlarge the hole with a cone drill bit.
the park sensor holders i purchased used from ebay but the side radar holders i had to order a set from china,ali express as no one in uk or eu even had a listing as there's no part numbers for these, strange thing is when they came they have audi numbers on them!

 

[ianh]

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/202987285323

that's the cutter i purchased, looks exactly the same as the one you ordered apart from the size, mine turned out to be quite a tight fit though.
i glued the holders on using tiger seal acrylic bonding glue but superglued them in position first.

 

[eribaMotters]

Can you put a personal plate on a Q plate vehicle and avoid the higher insurance premiums?

Colin

 

[ianh]

no, once a q always a q hence why i need to consider all options i can find.i will get a price for insurance out of curiosity.....never know i maybe pleasantly surprised.

 

[ianh]

We’ll aib insurance pleasantly surprised me after all,so sent off my v5 application to register it on a Q series registration number,hopefully in a few weeks time I will be able to have a drive in it !