RS3 8V PFL Aftermarket Rims and Spacers Squeak

[JayRS3]

Hi All,

New to the forum so please bare with me if I make a conduct mistake.
I have looked around the forum for a problem related to mine but could not find anything.
Here is my issue:
10 days ago I got my new rims fitted, however we had to put in 6mm spacers to make the rim clear the front brakes (also put the same spacers on the rear), as well as hubcentric (spigot) rings to make sure there is no vibration etc.
The rims are 19 inch 5/112 with a 42pcd. I used to my original tyres (Pirelli P-Zero) and did a swap from the OEM to the new rims.
Installation went well and fitted snug. I was ecstatic about the new look, however, a few days in a squeak started from the front left wheel.
The best way to explain the squeak is an oscillating(rotating) sound that is in direct correlation with the speed that the wheel turns (not RPM). Under braking it goes away, but it happens after 5 minutes into driving the car and sounds like a little bird chirping very softly. It is not grinding or doing anything bad (no knocks, clicks etc.).
It doesn't sound like a bad wheel bearing, it is literally a soft 'chirp' that occurs.

On Wednesday I took the car to Audi for new front brake pads to omit the terrible brake squeaking problem (completely different issue to this, i'm sure most owners with RS3 8V PFL have experienced the brake squeak under low speeds). Audi fitted the new pads and brake squeak sorted so far. However, I received the car back and the turning squeak of the wheel is still there.

The problem has escalated to 2 wheels now, one on each side of the car, it is driving me insane. Tomorrow (Monday) I will take the car to the fitment center that did the rims to have a check, but I was wondering if anybody has experienced anything like this and can shed some light?

It would be much appreciated.
I have attached 2 images of the car.
Regards
Jay

 

[Hal Adams]

If it is definitely a high pitched chirp and definitely goes away on braking, then it is more than likely pad related (but coud be other things - piston slightly sticking is one, but would not think so on the age of the car) Suggest the pad is rubbing a bit on the disc and vibrating in its housing.
When you apply the brakes is there feedback through the pedal, even slightly? This will indicate that the pad might be rubbing on a high spot on the disc, maybe built up from your old pads.
You need to have someone look at the car as it is impossible to guarantee an armchair diagnosis.

 

[JayRS3]

Thanks Hal,
No feedback at all through the pedal, but I am heading out in a bit and will revert once I have taken it for a drive again.
Will be taking it tomorrow to get checked!
Thanks for the info, will be looking out for that.

 

[wab172uk]

Love the rims. Great choice.

 

[nervus]

It could be the wheel bolts incorrectly torqued OR, sounds silly, as the wheel supplier would know this, the wrong seat/bolt type on the extended bolts you've used for the spacers!

 

[JayRS3]

@wab172uk Thanks so much!
@nervus Interesting! I am heading to the fitment centre in an hour and will revert to see if it is that.
Thanks guys.

 

[JayRS3]

Hi all,
I went to the local fitment centre and did some tests, the mechanic said that the bolts weren't torqued correctly due to the bolt length. I opted for longer bolts which they fitted all round. (excluding locknuts) Unfortunately it didn't fix the squeak. It is a very unusual problem so I don't expect anybody here to have the same issue, but I will continue posting in case people have the issue in the future. The next step is to get a set of proper spacers that are made for the RS3 (maybe ST wheel Spacer kit like this: https://ecotune-scotland.co.uk/product/st-wheel-spacer-kit-audi-rs3-8v-125mm). Once this is done I will revert.
Jay

 

[nervus]

Hmmm, that's irritating!

I have some Forge hubcentric 10mm spacers in my garage as they caused a very slight vibration! I sent them back to Forge, they checked them out and said they were fine, but they still did it! Removed them and the vibration goes.

I've heard the ST ones work well but its still a risk!

Theyre sitting

 

[teslaboy]

I recently fitted Bimecc hubcentric 12mm spacers specifically for RS3 8V all round they came with associated correct length extended bolts and lock nuts. Cost was 160 (Not fitted).
So far no vibration issues at all.
According to the fitter these are torqued to 110NM.
Audi handbook for standard wheel fitting is 120NM.

Would suggest you get the right kit and either do it yourself or get a decent local tuning shop to source and fit.

 

[teslaboy]

Also note.
The trouble with spacers 8mm and less is a lot (due to their thiness) are not hubcentric i.e they don't have the locating ring hence you can get vibration issues if their not set up perfect.

 

[nervus]

I recently fitted Bimecc hubcentric 12mm spacers specifically for RS3 8V all round they came with associated correct length extended bolts and lock nuts. Cost was 160 (Not fitted).
So far no vibration issues at all.
According to the fitter these are torqued to 110NM.
Audi handbook for standard wheel fitting is 120NM.

Would suggest you get the right kit and either do it yourself or get a decent local tuning shop to source and fit.

Hi, Where did you get this kit from?

Thanks

 

[teslaboy]

Hi, Where did you get this kit from?

Thanks

My local tuner EMP performance.
Bimecc are are an Italian make.
They just happen to be the make used by EMP.
However the likes of H&R and Eibach both sell RS3 / S3 specific spacers of varying thicknesses.

 

[JayRS3]

I recently fitted Bimecc hubcentric 12mm spacers specifically for RS3 8V all round they came with associated correct length extended bolts and lock nuts. Cost was 160 (Not fitted).
So far no vibration issues at all.
According to the fitter these are torqued to 110NM.
Audi handbook for standard wheel fitting is 120NM.

Would suggest you get the right kit and either do it yourself or get a decent local tuning shop to source and fit.

Thanks for this! looking at getting a set of 12mm spacers made, they will have to be adapters as my new rims have a centre bore of 66.45mm and the RS3 is 57.10mm. I have plastic spigot (hubcentric) rings in now, but I just feel like it isn't smart to rely on 4 plastic rings on an RS3. They could also be causing the squeak.

 

[Hal Adams]

With greatest of respect - how can a plastic centre ring cause a squeak?
On the subject of spacers, there is not a ‘special’ spacer made for the RS3 - it will be a 5x112 common to many German hubs.

 

[JayRS3]

Hi Hal, regarding the squeak, I honestly don't know. I'm shooting in the dark to get the squeak away. The best way can do this is to omit all current aftermarket (spigot rings & generic 6mm spacers), as they started the issue.
Relating back to my previous post - I need to close the centre bore gap (66.45 - 57.10) as well as space the wheels out to clear the front brakes,
the best way I have found to solve both these 2 tasks would be to have custom spacers(lets rather call them adapters) made by local automotive engineers.
Here is how it will work:
The adapter (inner, facing brake disc) will fit directly onto the original 57.10mm centre bore - the adapter will serve its purpose of spacing at 12.5mm - the adapter (outer, facing rim) will have a 66.45mm centre bore which the new rim fits on to. I will then use M14 x 1.5 x 50 extended wheel bolts (trimmed to suit fitment) in order to mount the wheels.
By doing this, I can exchange the 2 aftermarket parts that I currently have into one solid aluminium spacer/adapter.
If you think this is a bad plan, please let me know.
Jay

 

[Phil3]

Am I looking in the right direction to think something like this would be good for the FL Saloon...

https://www.awesomegti.com/shop-by-car/audi/rs3-8v/st-wheel-spacer-kit-audi-rs3-8v-12-5mm/

To bring the alloys (staggered ones) out close to level with the arches?

 

[Hal Adams]

Hi Hal, regarding the squeak, I honestly don't know. I'm shooting in the dark to get the squeak away. The best way can do this is to omit all current aftermarket (spigot rings & generic 6mm spacers), as they started the issue.
Relating back to my previous post - I need to close the centre bore gap (66.45 - 57.10) as well as space the wheels out to clear the front brakes,
the best way I have found to solve both these 2 tasks would be to have custom spacers(lets rather call them adapters) made by local automotive engineers.
Here is how it will work:
The adapter (inner, facing brake disc) will fit directly onto the original 57.10mm centre bore - the adapter will serve its purpose of spacing at 12.5mm - the adapter (outer, facing rim) will have a 66.45mm centre bore which the new rim fits on to. I will then use M14 x 1.5 x 50 extended wheel bolts (trimmed to suit fitment) in order to mount the wheels.
By doing this, I can exchange the 2 aftermarket parts that I currently have into one solid aluminium spacer/adapter.
If you think this is a bad plan, please let me know.
Jay

Yes, you will be doing the right thing by going back to the point where the squeak started. Reading your first post quickly, I did not appreciate that the squeak only started once the new rims are fitted. This then is your problem and not loose pads (unless co-incidental) Squeaks are not produced by spacers or spigot rings - these are passive and cannot be a cause. A squeak will only be produced by two solid pieces rubbing together. The squeak is the high frequency vibration during the rub. Try looking at the calipers and inside of the wheel. Look for a very small bright spot on the wheel spokes. Some wheels do not have deep enough dish for big brake kits and, as your supplier noted, need to be spaced. It could be that 6 is not quite enough on yours.

A pity you did not ask before you got the wheels. I would have suggested that rather than spacers, which are a nuisance, you get a road wheel with an increased ET. In my case, I have an ET33 which is pretty well what you are trying to achieve. One to remember next time maybe!

As for your plan, I think I follow but dunno how much it will cost you! Why not buy a basic 5x112/57.1 spacer suitable for Audis and MBs along with suitable spigot rings (I suggest you look again at the wheel specs - you say they are 5x112 with a pcd of 42. The pcd is the 112 and I suspect your 42 is the ET... Also look closely at the centre bore dimension. I have never seen a 66.45. Bores are usually denoted by one decimal place and wonder if you might have a 66.6 or a 67.1?

Here is a spacer that will suit - and guess what they even have a RS3 picture with it!:
https://spurverbreiterung.de/produc...ml&cat=c1055_Audi.html&bezeichnung=RS3&typ=8V

Same people do spigot rings, typically:
https://spurverbreiterung.de/produc...t=c470_Zentriersysteme.html&bezeichnung=&typ=

You say you have lugs - I worry though that your supplier has not tightened them up though and maybe worth checking the bolts suit the wheels - ie they have not given you ball seats on a taper hole. Again, this should be on the spec of the wheel but guide of thumb is ball seats on more expensive wheels and taper on the cheaper ones.

 

[Hal Adams]

Am I looking in the right direction to think something like this would be good for the FL Saloon...

https://www.awesomegti.com/shop-by-car/audi/rs3-8v/st-wheel-spacer-kit-audi-rs3-8v-12-5mm/

To bring the alloys (staggered ones) out close to level with the arches?

Spot on! Yes!
Note their proviso that the lugs are used on the Rotor wheels and not a cheaper aftermarket wheel.
(I am only assuming the staggered wheels set-up will allow a 12.5 increase without rubbing. Maybe ask this if you buy them to give you a way back for refund if the wheels do rub)

 

[Phil3]

Spot on! Yes!
Note their proviso that the lugs are used on the Rotor wheels and not a cheaper aftermarket wheel.
(I am only assuming the staggered wheels set-up will allow a 12.5 increase without rubbing. Maybe ask this if you buy them to give you a way back for refund if the wheels do rub)

Excellent... I had these on my Focus RS but a different thickness and they were a quality item

I’ll await my car coming (fingers crossed March 1st) and order after that, I’ll do some extra digging first as you say

 

[JayRS3]

Yes, you will be doing the right thing by going back to the point where the squeak started. Reading your first post quickly, I did not appreciate that the squeak only started once the new rims are fitted. This then is your problem and not loose pads (unless co-incidental) Squeaks are not produced by spacers or spigot rings - these are passive and cannot be a cause. A squeak will only be produced by two solid pieces rubbing together. The squeak is the high frequency vibration during the rub. Try looking at the calipers and inside of the wheel. Look for a very small bright spot on the wheel spokes. Some wheels do not have deep enough dish for big brake kits and, as your supplier noted, need to be spaced. It could be that 6 is not quite enough on yours.

A pity you did not ask before you got the wheels. I would have suggested that rather than spacers, which are a nuisance, you get a road wheel with an increased ET. In my case, I have an ET33 which is pretty well what you are trying to achieve. One to remember next time maybe!

As for your plan, I think I follow but dunno how much it will cost you! Why not buy a basic 5x112/57.1 spacer suitable for Audis and MBs along with suitable spigot rings (I suggest you look again at the wheel specs - you say they are 5x112 with a pcd of 42. The pcd is the 112 and I suspect your 42 is the ET... Also look closely at the centre bore dimension. I have never seen a 66.45. Bores are usually denoted by one decimal place and wonder if you might have a 66.6 or a 67.1?

Here is a spacer that will suit - and guess what they even have a RS3 picture with it!:
https://spurverbreiterung.de/product_info.php?k=Sp&info=p1064_Distanzscheibe ALU 12mm.html&cat=c1055_Audi.html&bezeichnung=RS3&typ=8V

Same people do spigot rings, typically:
https://spurverbreiterung.de/product_info.php?k=Lk&info=p397034_Center Sleeve Alu.html&cat=c470_Zentriersysteme.html&bezeichnung=&typ=

You say you have lugs - I worry though that your supplier has not tightened them up though and maybe worth checking the bolts suit the wheels - ie they have not given you ball seats on a taper hole. Again, this should be on the spec of the wheel but guide of thumb is ball seats on more expensive wheels and taper on the cheaper ones.

Thanks for such a great reply!
This has really helped me a ton!
Thanks for correcting me there, you are spot on with the ET and pcd error.
I just confirmed with a the supplier that 66.6 is correct, and will fit perfectly, so thanks for pointing me in the right direction.
I have got a quote to get the custom set up done and it will cost $150 for all 4 Aluminium 12mm ‘adapters’ including correct bolts.
This is without installation which fitment Centre said they will do for free as I paid for installation already.
Think I’m going to give it a go!

 

[KKOG]

Have you checked if the brake dust shield is rubbing against the rotors and causing noise?
A weak and careless mechanic might have dropped the wheel on the shield and bent it.

 

[JayRS3]

Hi Guys! An update on this: I received the spacers/adapters and they were exactly what I was looking for. Went to my fitment Centre and removed the old spacers and spigot rings, replaced them with new aluminum adapters, and squeak is completely gone!

Something makes me thing that it was the plastic spigot ring, but that isn’t a fact, just an assumption. Very happy to be sorted now. Thank you for all the comments and help I really do appreciate all the posts here! Managed to mitigate a lot of the problems.

Please see image of spacers. 12.5mm all round, 57.10 inner Centre bore, 66.6 outer Centre Bore and fits snug.

 

[Hal Adams]

To be clear, again, spigot centres do not squeak. The squeak going will be down to the physics of moving your wheel/s out another 6mm from the caliper. Glad it has all worked out.
I never did have a good feeling about your 'fitment centre', so I just hope they installed the correct type wheel bolts or else you will have more problems down the line.

 

[JayRS3]

Thanks Hal, whatever the squeak was, it is gone and that makes me one happy person. Cheers for the help.

 

[MartayMcFly]

Hi Hal, regarding the squeak, I honestly don't know. I'm shooting in the dark to get the squeak away. The best way can do this is to omit all current aftermarket (spigot rings & generic 6mm spacers), as they started the issue.
Relating back to my previous post - I need to close the centre bore gap (66.45 - 57.10) as well as space the wheels out to clear the front brakes,
the best way I have found to solve both these 2 tasks would be to have custom spacers(lets rather call them adapters) made by local automotive engineers.
Here is how it will work:
The adapter (inner, facing brake disc) will fit directly onto the original 57.10mm centre bore - the adapter will serve its purpose of spacing at 12.5mm - the adapter (outer, facing rim) will have a 66.45mm centre bore which the new rim fits on to. I will then use M14 x 1.5 x 50 extended wheel bolts (trimmed to suit fitment) in order to mount the wheels.
By doing this, I can exchange the 2 aftermarket parts that I currently have into one solid aluminium spacer/adapter.
If you think this is a bad plan, please let me know.
Jay

Let’s not call them adapters, that term is already is use for when the hub and wheel have different bolt patterns, or for fitting pegged hubs for wheel nuts rather than bolts. What you’re getting made are just spacers, but with an integrated spigot.

As other have said, non-hubcentric spacers are usually not worth the few mm they provide and almost always lead to noise, vibration and wobble. Luckily since you’re upping the bore at the same time, there should be enough material there to machine in a lip, making them hubcentric.

Fitting aftermarket wheels is just a minefield of conflicting measurements, but best bet would be to find wheels that are either the same ET as you’re after so don’t require spacers, or ones with high enough ET they can spaced properly. Spigots for changing the centre bore shouldn’t cause any issues, and are usually plastic not metal so they don’t squeak or rub.