Revo stage 3 remap to custom remap

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legal_ice

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Hi,

I bought my car a couple of months ago it was just a spur of the moment thing but to this day i am still happy with my purchase. The thing is i hardly know anything about engines and how to modify or what to modify. I was told the car has a stage 3 revo map on it and i was given a receipt for it aswell along with a rolling road chart. The previous owner advised me to get a custom remap done and it would increase the bhp quite abit. Would you say what he said is right? How much more gains could i expect to see?

The car is a A3 1.8T Quattro W-reg

Currently on the car is a T28 Hybrid turbo, 550cc injectors, bigger intercooler. custom powerflow exhaust, stage 3 remap and a few other bits.

Where would be the best place to take the car for a custom remap?

Cheers

Ibs
 
audi upgrades
The last rolling road chart i've got for it says 237.2HP with 278ft/lb
 
wouldnt just a stage 1 remap reach them figures? whats the idea with the stage 3 then?

am i right in saying itll be the same as a stage 1 until u get the shiny bits to make the most of it?
 
badger5 said:
less power than a K04 makes?
why would someone bother doing this?
Click to expand...

Seems a lot of hassle to go through for not a great deal of gain.

However, I would of thought it had potential.

Wary of standard internals though....
 
See thats what i was thinking. Its got had all those bits done to it plus a k&n typhoon induction kit and S3 BAM throttle bodies and inlet manifold and i'm sure theres more i've missed out aswell. Surely it should be running more than 237HP rite?

So do you think a custom map will sort that out? Also i have been thinking of getting the internals upgraded but don't know where to start or what to go for. Any recomendations?
 
legal_ice said:
k&n typhoon induction kit
Click to expand...

Remove this and install a cone filter. Enclosed induction kits are very restrictive on the 1.8T, especially with a larger turbo. Get a Jetex cone filter from Bill at Badger5.

legal_ice said:
So do you think a custom map will sort that out?
Click to expand...

Depends on what you mean by sort it out. REVO Stage 3 is generic, I think that there would be more to come from the engine with the mods you have listed. Have a chat with Bill at Badger5.

legal_ice said:
Also i have been thinking of getting the internals upgraded but don't know where to start or what to go for. Any recomendations?
Click to expand...

IE Rods are very highly rated on this forum. I use them and have no complaints at all. You can get a set from (wait for it).... Yes! Bill at Badger5. Last known price to me was £320 including VAT. This varies with the exchange rate though, as they come from the states.

Depending what engine you have, the gudgeon/wrist pins may be 19mm or 20mm. If 20mm, then all you need is those rods - everything else will be forged. You will need new big end shells though, which are £50 - £80 depending on where you get them.

Here is an image of the uprated item vs. stock:

21.jpg


Drop Bill an email at sales@badger5.co.uk.
:icon_thumright:
 
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If it's a T28 from a Nissan SR20DET then it should be capable of 300HP. To be fair though a lot of Garrett GT series turbos use a T28/T25 flange so I'd try to identify exactly what turbo you have first.

A Pulsar GTI-R will produce around 300HP at 1 bar of boost on the OEM T28. If it's a hybrid then I'd imagine you'd see some good figures from it with a suitable tune.
 
Cheers Welly i really appreciate your help. Looks like Bill at badger5 is the man to see then.

:icon_thumright:
 
Lee Goodall said:
If it's a T28 from a Nissan SR20DET then it should be capable of 300HP. To be fair though a lot of Garrett GT series turbos use a T28/T25 flange so I'd try to identify exactly what turbo you have first.

A Pulsar GTI-R will produce around 300HP at 1 bar of boost on the OEM T28. If it's a hybrid then I'd imagine you'd see some good figures from it with a suitable tune.
Click to expand...

I'm not exactly sure what model of the T28 i've got on there. I've got the orginal invoice from turbo technics for the turbo but all it says is
1.8T T28 Hybrid turbo then underneath its got
AUDI A3 180BHP T28 conversion.R163

Does the R163 mean anything?
 
Welly said:
Yes, but that dyno states peak BHP was 198.8 which seems a bit strange.

That's not really much help if trying to figure out what the boost is to get you to current BHP...
Click to expand...

IMG_0401.jpg


Ive also got this printout but it does not tell me what boost it was running
 
Bit of a pain that...

That's a big difference in output between the first and second graph, and the reason could be more boost....
 
I was thinking it could be absolute pressure but that makes it only about 8.5PSI/0.6bar boost!?

It does seem like a massive amount of boost if it is a decent sized turbo.. doesn't add up somehow.
 
Lee Goodall said:
I was thinking it could be absolute pressure but that makes it only about 8.5PSI/0.6bar boost!?

It does seem like a massive amount of boost if it is a decent sized turbo.. doesn't add up somehow.
Click to expand...

Na, that would take atmospheric pressure into account.

I agree, it is quite a sizeable spike.
 
I'm getting confused now. So what are we trying to say from these printouts?
 
I've just got off the phone to the previous owner of the car and what he said was that the stage 3 map is limited to a certain bhp. Is this true?

Also if i were to get a custom map put on would i 100% have to upgrade the engine internals? Or what bhp are standard internals good til?
 
legal_ice said:
I've just got off the phone to the previous owner of the car and what he said was that the stage 3 map is limited to a certain bhp. Is this true?

Also if i were to get a custom map put on would i 100% have to upgrade the engine internals? Or what bhp are standard internals good til?
Click to expand...

Limited? Hmmmmmm. Not sure about that pal - I wouldn't totally discard it but I've not heard of that before. A stage 2 map on an S3 (And you've got a bigger turbo than an S3) will see you to around the 270 BHP mark.

Internals. Well there a can of worms to open. Some good experiences, some bad. I personally think Audi were an utter bunch of c**ts for taking a forged crank, and forged pistons, and then joining them using sh*te rods.

Some people run quite big power on standard internals and have no worries. Some people run stage 1 power on standard rods and bend them. Me being one of them.

This is what you are trying avoid:

10.jpg


This is what came out of my S3. That was BIG bucks to fix the damage that it did. Much cheaper to pre-empt the issue by fitting forged rods BEFORE you get to the point that you may bend them. Bits snapped off the block inside, and snapped rods sticking out of block isn't a pretty sight.

Have a peruse through this: http://www.audi-sport.net/vb/showthread.php?88861-More-S3-Drama and see if it something you would rather avoid.
 
Ok on second thoughts maybe i should get them changed. So your saying the crank and pistons will be fine and just to change the rods? Is there anything else i should change just to be on the safe side?
 
legal_ice said:
Ok on second thoughts maybe i should get them changed. So your saying the crank and pistons will be fine and just to change the rods? Is there anything else i should change just to be on the safe side?
Click to expand...

Everything else should be top banana pal.

It's just those rods that are a bit sketchy...
 
as spotted by tuffty, the DD plot is @ wheels on boost plot and calc flywheel on the other

no where near the 300 thought possible, despite the reasonable boost running
 
Am I right in saying this is Dyno Dynamics who showed max around 230bhp for most the S3 stage 1&2, as you some of you guys had group gathering & print of your RR at some point with them, and the T28 managed 237, so that makes it around 270bhp on other optimistic RR. i.e. AMD as it is doubted by most on here.
 
as i said, you have no more than a remapped std S3 would have from this hybrid..

you sure its a hybrid?
stock manifold?

whats the install look like, got any pictures?
 
If you have VAGCOM handy maybe do some logging and post up the results... be interesting to see whats happening relative to airflow/fuelling/boost.... if the fuelling is out then that would affect the final power...

<tuffty/>
 
Lee Goodall said:
I can't see how at that much boost it wouldn't be producing 300+ HP??
Click to expand...

on his dyno plot boost its between 25-30lb of compressor flow

Garrett say: "As a very general rule, turbocharged gasoline engines will generate 9.5-10.5 horsepower (as measured at the flywheel) for each lb/min of airflow"

237bhp - 315bhp range using the above extremes of airflow and calculation

online comparison calculation:

to get lb/min to g/s which is what you can log with the vag-com from your mass air flow meter
25lb/min = 189g/s
30lb/min = 226g/s

log yours with vag-com and report back

host of compressor maps here>> http://s4wiki.com/wiki/Garrett_compressor_maps

292g/s - 367bhp for tuffty by the rule of thumb from garrett
 
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tufftybloke said:
I am compiling a list mate.... want it all done and dusted, 60mm pipe work, head and the other bits :icon_thumright:

<tuffty/>
Click to expand...

Naaaaaa..... Stuff the OE look and get some bit, fat, shiny 76 mm pipes sticking out the front..... :icon_thumright:
 
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