Remap on 170 Diesel - is it worth it?

The Governor

Registered User
I've been thinking of a stage 1 remap for my 170 BE Quattro. but didn't want to do anything drastic like remove the DPF so I dn't get any future MOT problems.

Talking to regal, they're saying that will limit the BHP increase to 190 - 200, so now I'm starting tot hink is it worth it or not for maybe 20 - 30 bhp?

Was interested in experiences on remaps, I'm thinking I probably wouldn't notice that sort of increase in real world driving?
 

millsy4002

Registered User
Big difference mate, got my PD170 done stage 1 to 205 with DPF hollowed out. The real difference in real world driving is the torque like @LEE69 said. For example mine went from 260lb/ft to 320


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aqibi2000

Registered User
Sherv was that dyno'd at 460Nm? I may need to get this done to mine too what's your mpg like with regular city driving
 

millsy4002

Registered User
No way have you made that torque with stage 1. Even the quoted revo figures are max 318


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desertstorm

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
VCDS Map User
Revo must be quoting LB/FT and 318 Lb/ft is 430Nm. 460Nm is possible but not advisable. If you were to look at the dyno plot there would just be a big peak as the turbo spools. This gives you what looks like a good map looking at numbers, but in the real world the sudden increase in torque will just give you wheel spin and it does the clutch / DMF no good at all.
To the OP, what looks like a small increase in power 170 to 200 is just the improvement at a single point. What gives you acceleration is torque and a good improvement in torque throughout the rev range makes you feel like you are driving a car with a larger engine.
If you do a reasonable number of miles a year and longer trips every other week say then you should have no issues with the DPF with a good map.
 

Sherv

Registered User
Sherv was that dyno'd at 460Nm? I may need to get this done to mine too what's your mpg like with regular city driving

Yep that was on the dyno. Regular driving I get about 40mpg about town/city & 55mpg on the motorway.
 

Sherv

Registered User
[QUOTE="460Nm is possible but not advisable. If you were to look at the dyno plot there would just be a big peak as the turbo spools. This gives you what looks like a good map looking at numbers, but in the real world the sudden increase in torque will just give you wheel spin and it does the clutch / DMF no good at all.
[/QUOTE]

Had it mapped for a full year now & done about 20k within that time & I think I've had wheel spin once, at -3 on a corner. The car is a quattro btw. Original clutch & is now sitting at 127k!
 
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Cornish John

Guest
When I had a VW Passsat it had the 130bhp PD engine, it was remapped via Celtic, no problems and went up to 184bhp stage one. But my car as standard on there dyno showed it was at 155bhp, was it reading high? I also found that there remap was "aggressive" But did the job.

Now I bought a 2010 plate A3 2.0tdi 170bhp CR engine about four to five years ago, had been thinking about a remap for a while. So last year, after loads of research, used "Quantum" after I found "Celtic" to be aggressive in the past.

It was terrible, flat spots, dipping performance, poor performance curve and so on. The place I had it done, did try allsorts, ever head office at Quantum sent over a revised map, it was better, but output was down to 110bhp! It was 170bhp at the start! Still not right.

Quantum did try and say it must be my car!
I gave the garage its due, they looked over my car, found zero problems.
Original map installed, my old car was back and good again!

So I waited until last week to try a remap again, it just really worried me about what dealers were selling!

I did some research, decided REVO was the way to go, yes it cost more than most, but proven product with a good track record.
Its been in a week, its great! More power when needed, around 205bhp, smooth power delivery in all gears. Just like my original map, but has the power that it missed, that said it was quick before! Good smooth results with the added power, first class.

On a 200 mile motor way run, doing my normal motor way driving speed I'm getting a 4mpg improvement.

So REVO a big plus from me.

216K miles, same clutch, no DPF or EGR problems.
I look after it, service every 6K, drive loads of motorway miles, always top gear & fast!
 

Gazwould

Registered User
Celtic's dyno is out , easily caught out by almost every car having a very generous before reading .

A Hyundai 134bhp is 151 bhp on THEIR dyno , etc , etc .

So you never really had a 184 bhp 1.9 PD 'ssat.

Also they will BS performance claim differences by quoting the manufacturers stock figure.
 

The Governor

Registered User
Great advice thanks everyone - I'd also be really interested in tried and tested mappers who can also blank EGR and map out the DPF (but leave it in).

I'm down Southampton way, so have thought about Regal Autosport, but would also be interested in any other recommendations...
 
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Cornish John

Guest
Celtic's dyno is out , easily caught out by almost every car having a very generous before reading .

A Hyundai 134bhp is 151 bhp on THEIR dyno , etc , etc .

So you never really had a 184 bhp 1.9 PD 'ssat.

Also they will BS performance claim differences by quoting the manufacturers stock figure.

That was my point in another thread about remapping, Celtic are not realistic.

Back on topic, really happy with my REVO remap, 205bhp (from 170bhp) its nice and smooth and better mpg!
Result.
 

millsy4002

Registered User
I mean they seemed decent enough but to do my injection timings and remap, I was sat in their waiting room for over 6 hours. And then I had to go back twice as the map wasn't right.

All ok in the end but not sure I would recommend them just through personal experience


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kash_v

Registered User
Do it, did my old Mk4 pd130 to 170bhp and shed loads more torque - by Nikki @ Rtech. Transformed a dull power delivery into something that surprised reps in their 320d Bmws lol.
 

Cougar

Registered User
Hi Sorry to hijack your thread, I've got my a3 2ltr cr booked in at Celtic tuning on Monday in Ashford, Kent mate had his done and highly recommended them, they quote 206 from 138 and torque up to 298lb/ft from 236, take it by the comments on here that's not realistic, plus is the egr delete worth it pros and cons not getting it done.....
 
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Cornish John

Guest
I would say you would be looking around 180bhp from 138bhp. (give or take)
If you look at the thread, I had mine done by REVO, took it from 168bhp to 205bhp.

Celtic said they would take mine from 168 to 225 @ stage 1 !!
No way, they will put you car on the dyno, then say as standard, oh look its around 163bhp, then apply the map and say, there you go its now 206bhp!!
Just look at what other firms offer, Celtic always seem about 25bhp more @ stage 1 mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm!
 

Gazwould

Registered User
Hi Sorry to hijack your thread, I've got my a3 2ltr cr booked in at Celtic tuning on Monday in Ashford, Kent mate had his done and highly recommended them, they quote 206 from 138 and torque up to 298lb/ft from 236, take it by the comments on here that's not realistic, plus is the egr delete worth it pros and cons not getting it done.....



No cons to egr delete.

Pros .

Exhaust gasses that should be spooling the turbo are now spooling the turbo which gives good low down torque and driveability .

Few more mpg .

Less soot in engine oil , soot is an abrasive kept in suspension by oil and partly delt with dispersants and detergents in the oil .

Engine oil stays cleaner for longer .

No soot is combining with crankcase oil vapour to clog up the egr valve .

Engine is now breathing just filtered air not the addition of it's own exhaust gasses and soot .

Pure oxygenated full combustion .

If it breathes soot the exhaust gasses are enriched by soot causing a black cloud out the back on or harder work for a dpf .

It's a no brainer .
 

Gazwould

Registered User
By all means get it done as the dyno graph looks good , but take it with a pinch of salt it'll be 206 bhp .

As said 206 bhp is more like a from 170 bhp Stage 1 figure .
 

The Governor

Registered User
I called my insurance (Admiral) yesterday and it only adds a tenner to the premium for up to 200bhp. So all I need now is to find a decent local-ish mapper.
 

Cougar

Registered User
Well EGR delete is software delete and included in the price so might as well get it done then, Thanks
 
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Cornish John

Guest
My A3 2010 plate 170bhp, 205bhp after remap has just hit 217K miles.

Never bothered with a EGR or DPF delete, never had any problems or had to replace them.
Same clutch, same turbo, same everything.

Seems the people who have issues, those who just pop around town or to the shops.
These cars need to be driven.
 

The Governor

Registered User
Sooo, are we saying the EGR delete doesn't need a physical blank just mapped out? I think Regal had said to me that's an extra cost over and above the remap itself.

Should I be looking for a local REVO mapper?
 

buok

Registered User
I have got a B7 2.0 TDI 170hp and I am considering remapping it. Main reason I want to do this is because I don't drive the car enough and do
get limp mode when I do go on motorways. Basically live in South London hence do purely urban driving and I am aware it is causing me issues as I don't warm enough even the gearbox oil so can't get gear 1 and 2 when cold.

Would like to know where about is recommended in and around South London - heard of DNA maps. And is it advisable to get rid of the DPF ?
I love the car otherwise should be driving 1.0 Nissan micra!
 

Cougar

Registered User
I've had mine done this morning, not the greatest of places as it was like a back street garage, but very professional and the difference is night and day, lot more torque low down and nice and smooth through the gears, had the egr done as well, lots of smiles.
 

buok

Registered User
Thanks Cougar for your insight and great to know that you have done the egr as well. Is the place you have done it any where close to South London?
 

Gazwould

Registered User
I have got a B7 2.0 TDI 170hp and I am considering remapping it. Main reason I want to do this is because I don't drive the car enough and do
get limp mode when I do go on motorways. Basically live in South London hence do purely urban driving and I am aware it is causing me issues as I don't warm enough even the gearbox oil so can't get gear 1 and 2 when cold.

Would like to know where about is recommended in and around South London - heard of DNA maps. And is it advisable to get rid of the DPF ?
I love the car otherwise should be driving 1.0 Nissan micra!

1. Oil pump drive .
2. New gearbox oil.

3. Remap .
 

Cougar

Registered User
Nah, celtic tuning I used, doesn't get the best of reviews as there claimed power figures maybe a little over the top, must be a few up that way, there's a few mentioned on here, Revo, Blufin, Shark, just google them, should be able to find one close....
 
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