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Power, mods,specs, remapper and graphs!

Cambaines Jun 16, 2016

  1. weemanno1

    weemanno1 Registered User

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    Im in the midst of getting mine booked in for a stage 2 map at r tech been there with all my card but have you guys got any ideas or reading from befor eyou cars were mapped?.. i have an air intake, down pipe and sport cat, cam followers been done and all the prep work ready but i have a standard cat back system as they seem to flow pretty well?. im imagining youll get an extra few ponies and torque before would i be wrong to estimate about 270ish and about the same torque?. seems to come on boost alot lower down the rev range and stronger since the precat was removed and sport cat fitted?... exhaust pressure seems to push harder out the back to?.
     
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  3. Bournee94

    Bournee94 Registered User

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    I have just got the 181bhp a3 (2015). What's peoples opinions on more power? What's the best route to take??
     
  4. leshkin

    leshkin Hold my beer... VCDS Map User

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    Sell and buy a S3 or RS3 would be my advice - I know it's more money, but you can't beat a good base for more power.
     
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  5. e9_mustii

    e9_mustii Registered User

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    Just bought my s3 8p about a month ago just curious to know what the performance mods are in terms of CAI, I,C exhaust setups etc sorry in advance if that been covered abajllion times as i want the best performance gains possible for the price

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  6. paddy

    paddy Registered User

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    Best performance gains for the price are std set up with stg1.
    after that it get pretty expensive, prob +£2.5k minimum for 2+
     
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  7. e9_mustii

    e9_mustii Registered User

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    Im planning to go stg 2+ anyway so im.not to fused about the final cost as ill.do it gradually i just want to know the best Cai known to give the best gains in term of bhp and free flow of air, etc since ive only just started modifiying my s3 and you guys have the years over me, ive got the do it once and do it right kind of attitude

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  8. paddy

    paddy Registered User

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    TBH all the proprietary CAI kits will flow ample for 2+ so its going to be down to noise and fitment. I use a VWR fully enclosed unit that takes cold air from outside the engine bay which is pretty quiet but they are expensive at about £600, its good for 600bhp, others like a lot of induction noise and a cone style filter with a heat shield, they will also flow more than enough.
    I have an APR cast down pipe (£900) and cat, the std exhaust will flow more than enough for stg2+, you will need a HPFP (£600), i have a Loba , a wagner intercooler (£900) and APR 2+ software (£600) which gives me just over 380bhp. There are cheaper and more expensive ways of doing the same thing.
     
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  9. e9_mustii

    e9_mustii Registered User

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    Thanks for the reply bud and yea i do like my induction noises

    Will.oversozed piping like on the ram air cai give me any benefits over the normal heat shield cone setup

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  10. Niffty9

    Niffty9 Guest

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    Welcome to the darker waters. In my opinion it's time and money well spent. You'll struggle to find much under 20k in the classifieds that'll outrun a Stage 2+ S3. It surprises owners of cars with 500hp that are a bit heavier like big Mercs & Jaguars that can't believe how fast the S3 is.

    The most important thing to do first is read the common faults/tips guide here. It is excellent and catches all the big engine killers before you waste money tuning your car only to have it detonate 500miles later through oil starvation or become FWD because no-one has changed the haldex filter!

    Then:

    Stage 1/2 (335hp/350ft/lb on my car):- With only Ram-Air cold air induction kit £190, map & walnut blast ~£500-600.

    It's wise to budget a little more for stage 1 than the map cost as this is when you'll test all the little weaknesses that weren't apparent on the standard car. I had prepared the car with fuel filter change, oil change (5/40 for a little more load/heat) and spark plugs. Mine also needed a PCV valve, DV valve, new coil (so bought a set) during the checks/dyno day to make the power.

    There's no point trying to work a turbo hard on a car with carbon behind the valves or boost leaks, it'll only run badly, make less power and do damage. I'd allow ~£1200 and you'd be unlucky to be disappointed.

    Stage 2+ (368hp/416lb/ft on mine):- My experience is this is quite a big cost jump. You'll need a good clutch, the Spec Performance option clutch is only rated to 400lb/ft. I went for the Helix Organic and it is superb £1250 fitted. Milltek downpipe and 200cell cat (for mot) £600 + fitting, Auto-tech high pressure fuel pump £400+fitting, Rs4 return valve £40 (allows the higher fuel pressure), Map upgrade £360 and I also had my injectors ultra sonically cleaned (mainly for the injector metal filter buckets, because the standard ones can break up with age and cause damage). Allow £3,000 and you will hopefully leave with a smile.

    Stage 3 (not done on mine):- basically the next limitations are turbo, injectors and intercooler. You can see from the high torque stage 2+ cars make that drops right off after 5k rpm. By holding this longer towards the 7k limiter you can pick up to 420hp mark with small gains in torque but similar. Cost is I believe.. £5k ish?

    To drive the Stage 1/2 is a real giggle, it's like the standard car only with a much bigger hit when the turbo comes in and it feels strong to the redline.

    Stage 2+ feels like you get more power low down, the engine generally feels stronger, like you've long stroked the 2.0 rather than added more fuel. Numbers and ferocity start to feel like 3.0 turbo /six and eight cylinder cars I've owned previously. I have no regrets.

    Stage 3 I haven't experienced.

    Reliability, there's strong evidence that if maintained properly the car takes a stage 2+ state of tune quite comfortably. I've noticed no quirks, overheating or bad noises and haven't broken anything in the last 20k miles tuned or 5k miles at Stage 2+. Others here seem to do track work at stage 3 on standard internals and that is always a good acid test for reliability.
     
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  11. paddy

    paddy Registered User

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    The larger piping will not make a difference at 2+ because its not a restriction at 400bhp IMHO
    Probably just go for a revo if you dont mind the noise. Cheap and effective.
     
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  13. e9_mustii

    e9_mustii Registered User

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    I agree with you 100% im.having my car dyno'd this saturday at sa tuning on there new 4wd dyno to see how much my s3 is making currently my plan from then is have it carbon cleaned just as a precaution/preventative maintenance dsg service is also due to be booked in at some.piont next week/month. At the moment i just want to get rid of my evap canister purge flow fault as its driving me nuts ive replaced the valve and going to pick the the charcoal canister tomorrow or on saturday before the dyno, if you could send me a link for the DV and any oher parts to deal.with the cars weaknesses first would greatly appreciate it and then ill.move onto things like cai and haldex controller cause i want a permanent 4wd ( i think that's what it does rather than the 4wd only if tyre slip is detected or pedal.planted )

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  14. Niffty9

    Niffty9 Guest

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    I did this on my old 2000reg 1.8 S3. It didn't make a significant difference to the handling and after that I broke two haldex units due to the oil overheating and the clutch plates cracking. I would avoid this mod like the plague although I have no specific experience of it on the 2.0 cars.

    It is a different generation Haldex unit but the workings are the same principle, it is geared to slip slightly in normal driving (fwd mode) to allow greater than 50% torque to be applied when needed. If you pressurised the pump all the time it would be a bit like welding your traditional differential and driving around a roundabout. The rear wheels are trying to rotate at a different speed to the front.. I can only see it ending badly.

    If you want to adjust the handling then changing the anti roll bars and tyre pressures will have a larger impact for less cost/risk.
     
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  15. e9_mustii

    e9_mustii Registered User

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    Ideal tyre pressures for a 3 dr ? Audi put all fours on 40psi and I'm used to 34s max on my previous cars, and yea I'll do a bit more research on this and avoid until its more clear probably when i go the stage 2+

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  16. e9_mustii

    e9_mustii Registered User

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    Hey, so i took my car to SA tuning for a dyno just for peace of mind, since ive recently bought my s3, with the found if i get anything lower than 250bhp id get it walnut blasted as the car is bone stock apart from the previous owner removing on of the silencers just to make the exhaust louder, managed to get more BHP than i was expecting with the first run on 279bhp with 385nm but as you can see it starts to drop after each run to 256 bhp and 343nm the tuner simon said there is something unhealthy about it as there is a huge spike and then the ecu seeing this and backing off saying this is either mechanical issue or a bad remap, told me to replace my DV with an oem Rev G DV as it the latest aswell as my boost controller with oem spec, got home and took off my DV to see if it had any issues and noticed its a Rev D which is suppose to be the latest revision if im not wrong, couldn't find the boost control solenoid car run fine no idleing issues or whistling to indicated leaks and i dont have any history on a previous tune, not sure how to proceed, has anyone had something like ?
    I wasnt planning on remaping the car so soon since purchase, but if it means paying 400-500 quid for a tuner to diagnose and restore it he may aswell make it faster, or is there any other part or check i should carry out [​IMG]

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  17. Daveyonthemove

    Daveyonthemove Well-Known Member VCDS Map User

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    That's quite a large spike and drop off, something must be bad somewhere.
    Getting the DV changed is an easy fix and should restore power. I'd be disappointed if my Peak figure was only 279bhp after a remap. Mine made 274bhp on stock, but I went to R-Tech and they did a health check before it went near the rollers and gave it a custom remap (actually got 5 maps).
    rsz_img_20190401_072226.jpg
    rsz_1img_20190320_023144.jpg
     
    Last edited: Apr 1, 2019
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  18. paddy

    paddy Registered User

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    Its a long shot but a 2011 S3 will have a plastic IC and they are prone to leak. On stg 2+ i gained 30bhp when i changed mine.
    Your chart shows a build in Torque that suddenly pops and goes flat. Its not an easy job but you could at least check the IC hoses and the unions on the IC where they clam because thats the common leak area. might also explain why your figures drop with more runs/heat. That said if you ignore the first and last run the figures are spot on std.
     
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  19. paddy

    paddy Registered User

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    Actually i am not sure about your figures because wheel bhp is within 2 bhp first 2 runs but engine bhp is down 13bhp
    did the tuner disconnect your 4 wheel drive on a 4 wheel roller and i wonder if there was wheel spin ?
    These are all questions that the tuner should have told you because there is no point in him doing dyno runs unless he can interpret the results for you.
     
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  20. e9_mustii

    e9_mustii Registered User

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    Problem is at sa tuning they don't let you see the car when it on the dyno they close the door "due to noise complaints" and that it was ran on a brand new 4wd dyno but ill.give him a call and ask him i doubt I'd use him for tuning though thanks alot ill try and check the IC piping is there a replacement piping kits for the s3 ? Hard pipe kit or something of the likes if i do need to replace them

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  21. e9_mustii

    e9_mustii Registered User

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    Is he suppose to disconnect the 4wd ? If so how and where would he do it if you know

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  22. paddy

    paddy Registered User

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    I might be talking rubbish, maybe they disconnect the 4WD on 2WD rollers, its done electronically via the haldex i think....that makes more sense
    I had a friend with a TT and he pulled the IC pipes off his car and the IC was full of oil which i think is a sign your DV is leaking which might be why yours has been changed.
    We can only guess TBH which isn't very helpful.

    actually looking at Daves chart that torque spike is there on his std so it may be a characteristic of the stock set up
     
  23. e9_mustii

    e9_mustii Registered User

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    Tuner words are "this is not healthy" which is what bugs me even if i make less power as long as its healthy I'm happy ill take it to my mates garage on saturday pull the front bumper my DV looked fine didnt seem.to have any oil on it but there was some on the aluminium body that the Dv bolts on too so ill check the IC and see where to go from there thanks bud

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  24. Daveyonthemove

    Daveyonthemove Well-Known Member VCDS Map User

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    I think the Haldex can be turned off by removing a fuse. I've also heard that keeping the handbrake on will disable it, but I wouldn't be keen to try it.

    When I first had my S3 (1 year ago today!) I thought it felt below the 265bhp stock figure, so I got it remapped by Bluefin.
    When I sent them the file they called me to advise it had already been remapped, so I assumed it was a bad map and asked them to send me a remap file anyway, so they sent me one of their stock maps first and then the remap.
    I didn't really notice much difference, and after speaking to Superchips and asking advice on here we narrowed it down to the DV being split.
    As soon as I replaced it I got a huge power increase and the car came alive.

    Take a look at the preventative maintenance sticky thread for more info on what to look after and check. These engines aren't expensive or difficult to keep healthy, but if you let things lapse they become a money pit as cheap repair's lead into big failures further down the road.

    If I was in your shoes, I'd order a new DV and Cam Follower if you don't know the history of either, they can both be replaced in an hour if you are handy with a socket set.
     
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  25. paddy

    paddy Registered User

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    I ordered a new cam follow this morning for my HPFP as mines a year old now.... and a "yellow" dipstick :)
     
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  26. e9_mustii

    e9_mustii Registered User

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    Yea im qualified as a mechanic eve thought im an electrician so i know my way around a fair bit about 4 year out of touch thought cam follower is easy just unsure on the DV on with revision is the latest "D or G"and where i should get it from as im not a fan of Euro car parts so i stick with audi or something else. Currently have a Rev D one took it apart looked fine but may just replace it anyway

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  27. e9_mustii

    e9_mustii Registered User

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    Speaking of yellow, do You know where i can find yellow piping going for a black and yellow theme you match my phantom black with yellow big AF calipers

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  28. Daveyonthemove

    Daveyonthemove Well-Known Member VCDS Map User

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    If the Cam follower is easy for you, the DV will be a breeze. Only held in place with 3 torx screws and an electrical connector.
    Rev G is the latest I think and should be bought from a trusted source. I wouldn't get one from ECP, I'd use Awesome or AKS etc.
    https://www.akstuning.co.uk/engine-components/358-genuin-vag-diverter-valve-revision-g.html
     
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  29. paddy

    paddy Registered User

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  30. e9_mustii

    e9_mustii Registered User

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    Yea I've just ordered it from aks aswell as the cam follower

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  31. e9_mustii

    e9_mustii Registered User

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    Misread your post i ended up ordering the revision g as i was told it was the latest which was b.s as i already have a perfectly function rev D which is the latest revision, now what would be the benefit of getting the dv+ over the one i currently have

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  32. paddy

    paddy Registered User

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    Rev G will be fine, a lot of people will say change it every year to be safe where as a DV+ should last for ever.
    The early DV+ suffered from a lot of fakes and poor quality seals but if you buy a new one from a reputable dealer you will be fine, mines done 2 years now with no problem in fact i had a engine management light with the original that no one could diagnose....4-5 trips to the dealers and 20k miles. eventually changed to a DV+ by chance and it put the light out and has been fine ever since
     
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  34. Daveyonthemove

    Daveyonthemove Well-Known Member VCDS Map User

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    You were not fed B.S reference the DV, the revision G is the better one to have to hold boost better.
    if you doubt this, read the page in this link: http://r-techperformance.co.uk/2-0-tfsi-tuning/
    The DV+ may hold more boost than a standard DV, but if Revision G hasn't ironed out your spike in power then it probably isn't the DV causing the problem.
    You could end up chasing your tail and buying a load of new parts trying to get to the bottom of the problem, however there is a chance that the remap has a boost spike and next to no overall gain.
    Who remapped the car?
     
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  35. e9_mustii

    e9_mustii Registered User

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    Hey dave thanks for your message mate yes i just stumbled upon something similar to what you just said on paddys older posts but thanks for the link will definitely take a look and no clue if it has been mapped or who mapped it aa ive only just bought it

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  36. weemanno1

    weemanno1 Registered User

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    Finally Went to get the car remapped Saturday !! after having all the pre work done was sceptical on the improvement from an already healthy 265 bhp but on the day rocked up at R tech as ive been there the last 3 times lol... and after checking the vehicle over niki got it in the rollers to see what the new down pipe made. Ive attached the graphs but made a healthy 282bhp and 282 ft lb standard!.
    obviously the pre cat has quite the hampering on the flow and power output as it was 265 standard!
    After an hour or so of logging and some pops and bangs.. out it came for a road test with a very respectable 340bhp and 350 ftlb which definitely shoves you in the seat , To say i'm happy is an understatement! the horse power doesn't really bother me as I use it every day and tbh very rarely go over 5k unless im in a hurry lol.. but it now produced the same torque as standard at 3k and at 4k you feel the full force of the little 4cylinder torque punch.

    As most cdl engines it hits the fuel pump wall and without an uprated pump and possibly a clutch your not going to get any better flow. but its more than enough to upset 90% of the people on the road.. As im a lazy driver the driving transformation is immense. you can curl your toes up at 2k rpm in 5th and it just pull with so little effort its unreal. ive had quite a few cars mapped from R tech a mk4 1.8t that was 150bhp aum engine and came out at 250bhp and 280ft lb. (pocket rocket).. and a mk4 r32 which was 237bhp and came out at 260bhp and 260 ft lb not a lot but the drivability and linier power was like driving a different car. and finally this one which bang for buck is the best and least cost!!.. like most turbos you find the engine note changes, its smoother in and out of gears. a smoother drive, better fuel economy (only 5-mpg ) not as it matters but after driving it for a week its just effortless to drive normally!..
    Safe to say anyone that's thinking of giving there car some much needed "gower power" and doesn't need quite the immense power of the stage 2+ guys really needs to go and see niki!. :)
    The pre work and upgrade list includes the following.

    • Trp Performance downpipe and 200 cell sport cat, with pre cat delete
    • creation motorsport intake
    • new coilpacks
    • pick up pipe and sump clean
    • oil and filter change using decent 5/40 oil
    • ##(majorly important)## cam follower replaced
    • injector clean and decoke
    • a few tanks of 99ron > fuel either v power or Tesco 99

    advised items of replacement from r tech,
    • latest revision g diverter valve
    • fuel pump and rs3 fpr (if gong to stage 2 plus after)

    Only thing I can stress which I saw when you go is make sure you check your tyres and general condition of the car as you would the to travel all that way and be turned away as your car isn't fit for the rollers!.. Seems stupid but sadly that's what I saw when I was there. Luckily the guys at r tech bent over backwards to help him out and even found him some tyres and a guy to fit them so he could still have his car set up in the day!.

    (sorry for rambling) lol
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Apr 4, 2019
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  37. Daveyonthemove

    Daveyonthemove Well-Known Member VCDS Map User

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    My mistake, I may have crossed my wires with all the posts on here reference remaps and figures.
    I'd still say that spikes quite high for standard figures but if the engine is healthy and the weak spots are sorted in advance, a good remap will flatten out that spike and give a much better power delivery.
     
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  38. markbrown87

    markbrown87 Guest

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    Recent rtech figures
     

    Attached Files:

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  39. e9_mustii

    e9_mustii Registered User

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    Nice what are your current mods?

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  40. markbrown87

    markbrown87 Guest

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    Pretty much all stock, just a ramair panel filter and res delete but I don’t think they make much difference tbf
     
  41. weemanno1

    weemanno1 Registered User

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    ###QUICK ADDITION IF ANY ONE HAS A STAGE 2 MAP OR ABOVE YOU WILL MOST DEFINATELY ENCOUNTER TURBO COMPRESSOR SURGE NOISES LOL AND YES ITS NORMAL!. HOEP IT WAS OF SOME HELP TO NEW MAP CAR OWNERS ### :)
     
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  42. paddy

    paddy Registered User

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    I think it was your down pipe restricting things not your pre cat.
     
  43. Leon540

    Leon540 Registered User

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    Thought I'd introduce myself. I have a SEAT Leon MK2 with the following modifications.

    Audi S3 BHZ engine
    Borgwarner EFR 6758 GBR/Turbodynamics Turbocharger
    Revo Stage 4 software
    Devils Own water meth injection kit (Not currently used)
    Miltek turbo back exhaust with sports cat
    Loba high pressure fuel pump
    THS engine mount kit
    Revo Intake
    Audi R8 injectors
    Greddy Profec b spec 2 boost controller
    Forge motorsport intercooler
    Forge motorsport Polished coolant tank
    Forge motorsport PCV delete with catch tank
    Loba Single mass flywheel with organic uprated sachs clutch
    Forge hoses coolant and boost hoses
    Forge external DV high flow
    Forge adjustable Turbo Actuator

    Remaps from GotBoost

    Power 407BHP

    No Graph yet.
     

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