PLZ HELP NO REVS WHITE SMOKE

Simon184

Simon184

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(Audi a3 sportback 170 dsg 8pa 2007)

Hi hoping someone could shed a little light on this for me car was working fine turned round a corner as I put my foot back down the revs started bouncing lost power so I pulled over tried restarting engine reved up in neutral and the revs where still very bouncy accompanied by lots of smoke luckily I was round the corner from home and managed to drive the car home giving minimum revs the more revs I gave the less it would do the sound from exhaust is terrible like it's choking car just cuts out now struggling to start when started now I have no revs and getting code p0101 also when I turn ignition on I can hear like a high pitched bleeping noise and for a brief time after I pull the key
 
Take the camcover off (3 clips) and put your phone on camera mode with the flash light running, share a photo of the cambelt tensioner position.

See example
 

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This sounds to me that it may have popped a pipe off.
I’d check all the intake pipes are all connected and that the bottom intercooler pipes haven’t popped off.
That P0101 code is usually to do with air mass reading so intake pipe system.
 
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Marshy said:
This sounds to me that it may have popped a pipe off.
I’d check all the intake pipes are all connected and that the bottom intercooler pipes haven’t popped off.
That P0101 code is usually to do with air mass reading so intake pipe system.
Click to expand...

Good shout!
 
aqibi2000 said:
Good shout!
Click to expand...

The beeping noise you hear when the ignition on is usually the throttle flap / egr assembly is is fairly normal.
Probably just cause your looking for things you’ve noticed it.
The intercooler pipes use a silly
metal clip to secure and are very common to pop off.
 
Marshy said:
The beeping noise you hear when the ignition on is usually the throttle flap / egr assembly is is fairly normal.
Probably just cause your looking for things you’ve noticed it.
The intercooler pipes use a silly
metal clip to secure and are very common to pop off.
Click to expand...

I've had both timing belt jump and intercooled pop off on my 170 TDI, how ironic
 
audi upgrades
Thanks for your prompt replies I will be sure to check tomorrow are the intercooler pipes underneath and will check the position on tensioner but would these cause me to have no revs it's like the engine is being choked I'm hoping it's not the turbo
 
The previous owner changed the cam belt without changing the tensioners and I was fearing that the tensioners can fail too I'm a newb to this so still trying to understand my car with the help of the guys off here
 
The intercooler pipes are underneath although you maybe able to see them from under the bonnet.
A pipe off would cause the engine not to rev and run rough.
The code you have points to the intake system so certainly the first place I’d be looking.
 
Cam belt is this right
 

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I've checked the intercooler pipes and all seem to be in sound condition what would be next to try marshy I've got it been recovered Monday to my mechanic hoping I don't have to go down that route funds arnt great after the festive season and it would have to happen now I'm back at work during daylight hours
 
If your happy that the pipes are all on then there’s not a great deal more you’ll be able to do.
Don’t suppose it’s possible you’ve put petrol in instead of diesel?
Only other thing to try is disconnect the air flow meter and see what the car does with that disconnected.
 
No petrol been running that tank for a week and tried the maf sensor as soon as it happened I got a feeling it's the turbo but wouldn't that throw a code
Thanks for your help I appreciate it
 
If the turbo had failed you’d probably end up with the same intake code which you have.
Looks like you’ve checked and looked at all the simple fixes!
Your probably going to have to wait until it goes to the garage on Monday.
Good luck.
 
Might sound silly but I had the same problem once when I got a CAI fitted found out the MAF was put back in the wrong way round
 
Had my intake pipe off at egr to run it aspirant to find that the intake is blowing exhaust fumes out could only imagine that is the timing on camshaft would it be the hole thing or could it be 1 lobe worn can you just change the worn lobe
 
The egr return is mounted just above the boost pipe to the intake which is what you would be smelling
 
It's definitely blowing smoke out I'm thinking exhaust and intake valve opening at same time sounds logical and car would be fighting itself giving the bounce revs and copious amounts of smoke looks and smells like completely unburnt diesel
 
Simon184 said:
It's definitely blowing smoke out I'm thinking exhaust and intake valve opening at same time sounds logical and car would be fighting itself giving the bounce revs and copious amounts of smoke looks and smells like completely unburnt diesel
Click to expand...

First protocol for issues between intake and exhaust camshaft would be to check the timing, it's a twin over head cam with a pulley for each camshaft. The 13mm bolts could have come lose enough to allow one of the pulleys to adjust the timing.

Unlike the CR engines which have a twin geared cam with only 1 exposed belt driven cam pulley removing the ability to alter timing between intake and exhaust stroke
 
I'm waiting for it to be recovered tomoz or wed this stuffs way out of my league am I right to say you can't tow a dsg for some reason even in neutral? Also you mean I should be checking the two cam gears are in correct position before proceeding with anything else thanks for your help did you check the position on tensioner pic
 
Thought you could if the front wheels were in the air? Don’t take my word I may be wrong!

Owners manual will tell you.
 
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I havnt recovered my car yet as without looking at it my mechanic has said that the timing belt has slipped and that it will have mangled rocker arms and it is a big job like 1200 rough or he said I could get a second hand head which I know is good and that would be cheaper as it's less labour hours or I could get a second hand bkd pd140 engine and convert it and that would be about 800 all in he says the bkd engine seems to be a stronger build but second hand items I would have to source myself as he can't guarantee them does this sound about right and what do you think would be the best option thanks for your support guys
 
Like I originally posted, a tooth jumped on the timing belt does not always end up with damaged valves.

My PD170 slipped to point where it would not even start, yours runs.

Just get get the left engine mount off and retime the engine using all the original parts and see if runs... 2 hour job

Engine swap to BKD needs the engine but also since they use Bosch Injectors, you'll need the needing the cluster, engine ecu, intercooler pipes etc and keys
 
Is the timing something I could do myself I don't wanna have it recovered somewhere and that don't work then it's stuck there it runs sounds very rough can't hear the turbo out the exhaust it used to sound nice for a deisel
Its just my luck that the worse possible thing would happen to it lol
The mechanic said he would use my injectors
 
Tensioner is slightly on the loose side but not alarming. Mine was about 5mm beyond that.

You just need to a little mechanically minded and maybe watch some YouTube videos how to do a timing belt with the £15 locking kit.

Remove the driver side wheel
Remove the mud guard thing
Rotate engine via crankshaft, 19mm 12 point socket clockwise to be a tdc to insert the lower locking tool.
Then look with a mirror if the pin holes for where the locking pins for the upper cams is inserted (this will tell you if it has slipped or not) they are allowed to me 2-3mm away from centre

If it is away then simply loosen all 6 13mm bolts and very carefully rotate the cams slowly to the point where you can insert the pins into the locking position. Tighten them. Up. To 25nm. Remove all locking pins and rotate engine over twice to ensure you have nothing wrong/cdashing
Then start it. I finer tweaking is done by looking at the torsion value in vcds however the state your engine is in this will make a drastic difference if this is your root cause.

Or just ask the mechanic to do it. Should not. Charge much he is not changing the belt or even touching the tensioner (no need to remove engine mount) , only retiming with repsxt to the 2 overhead cams.

If the above works, then fit a full new timing belt and tensioner considering it is loose.
 
I have a friend who will be capable of that although I think I would like to have a go myself I like to see how things work so I can have a better understanding and am quite handy when putting my hands to something so with the right guidance I think I will be fine can't thank you enough for your in depth help I'm hoping that if the car starts that it wasn't damaged internally fingers crossed the belt was changed prior to me buying it but belt only and not full kit but looking at the belt it looks to me that the grooves do not marry the cogs well but don't look worn maybe just a cheap alternative belt instead of vag genuine I assume those grooves should fit the apperature of the cogs very snug
 
Have fun, you can watch videos of people doing bmn or bkd engines on. YouTube, Audi A4, Seat Leon FR etc tutorials may be of use to you on YouTube since many have the same engine.

Make sure the gaps on the cams is at the top, else you will be 180 degrees out of time, continue turning the engine over...

There are 2 types of locking pin, make sure you use the correct one in the kit - both fit but for different engine.

And yes the belt sits well inside the groves comfortably.
 

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Thanks for your help I've ordered a timing tool and gonna have a go on Sunday so I can have the daylight would the car still start if the rockers was damaged or would running the car with damaged rockers hurt it further

If the timing has slipped and I put it back right will there be tell tail signs if it is damaged internally

And if all goes well fingers crossed just fit a new timing kit and water pump
 
If its slipped you will be able to tell by the locking tools. Then after rectifying if it still has zero power a compression test would be needed
 
Just finished checking timing and all seems well barring couldn't get one pin in but looking at it looked like the pin should go in couldn't see why the pin wouldn't go in unless it was that fractionally out if it was could that cause this kind of problem if it's not the timing could it be an injector issue just the smoke out of intake making me think timing or valves could exhaust valves not be closing properly
 
Also dpf light came on once on dash while I was trying to start it but was low bat from all the cranking and no driving also I'm sure the dpf has been deleted
 
If the DPF has been removed then you can expect an MOT fail unless you know a dodgy MOT station that will turn a blind eye.
You may also find that the excess smoke could be due to the DPF missing as it is supposed to collect emissions and burn them off at predetermined intervals.
 
I'm sure it's been knocked through so not visible for mot was done by previous owner this smoke is thick creamy grey and black like pure unburnt fuel car has no power sounds terrible like it's chuffing although earlier it sounded quite normal and could hear the turbo but still crazy amounts of smoke sometimes revs are completely unresponsive if they are there hunting up and down also hunting on idle up and down did show maf error code once engine very shaky too
 
So from your inspection the timing is fine, perfectly normal to be a whistler out on locking the cam with the pin. Now you can rule out this basic problem of timing and cams IMHO.

Using VCDS scan looking at the injector stabilisation values in the measuring blocks will help you understand what the injectors are actually doing. If the value is 2.99 or more it means injector is fully saturated.

Common thing in PD is the injectors not being seated properly during the recall - there is an amazing thread of someone fixing their octavia with similar symptoms to you. I will try find it
 
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