NOW WHATS WRONG

[peakey]

Why has my car started to make this noise

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oTP9bVIT64o

this wouldnt be anything to do with the re map ??

 

[Dani_B19]

On the 1.8t's isnt it the dv thats split!

 

[Broken Byzan]

Get yoursef a new Dv yours isnt working and is causing compressor stall. Not drectly causd by the remap but the extra boost now has seen off the valve

 

[kaizokuninja]

mine be doing that too i do believe. What is the uprated OEM item that i think Tim uses, i cant remember xD

 

[voorhees]

for the sake of the best part of a hundred quid I would stay safe and get the Forge 007p one......but thats me.

 

[kaizokuninja]

i thought the OEM one was about 30 pound or something?

 

[Broken Byzan]

710n from a 225BHP TT/S3 etc. A shade under £25

 

[kaizokuninja]

thats the one!

you know wut the part number is bud?

 

[Broken Byzan]

a quick search revealed this 06A 145 710 N

 

[TurboDave]

The amount of chatter you are getting is unlikely to be causing any harm to your turbo anyway. Idd just block up your DV and vacuum like mine has been since day one of ownership.

 

[ash_pearce]

The amount of chatter you are getting is unlikely to be causing any harm to your turbo anyway. Idd just block up your DV and vacuum like mine has been since day one of ownership.

are you joking?

 

[Broken Byzan]

The amount of chatter you are getting is unlikely to be causing any harm to your turbo anyway. Idd just block up your DV and vacuum like mine has been since day one of ownership.

I hope you are kidding too, the shaft on a k03/4 is o small that any type of chatter can cause it to snap, unlike the shafts on cossies and the like they are massive in comparison

 

[Shy19s]

i love posts like these.. they do make me smile.. Im pretty sure the K series turbo's are too small to block off the pipes.. evo's cossies etc.. they have big compressors and can handle it.. wouldnt be so sure about the little KKK's tho.
i agree with jason, get the 007p, much better quality, the OEMs are prone to going wrong, either this or get a stronger spring.

 

[TurboDave]

I hope you are kidding too, the shaft on a k03/4 is o small that any type of chatter can cause it to snap, unlike the shafts on cossies and the like they are massive in comparison

i love posts like these.. they do make me smile.. Im pretty sure the K series turbo's are too small to block off the pipes.. evo's cossies etc.. they have big compressors and can handle it.. wouldnt be so sure about the little KKK's tho.
i agree with jason, get the 007p, much better quality, the OEMs are prone to going wrong, either this or get a stronger spring.

I also like being told how to run a turbo which I build and supply on a daily basis.

I mean are you being serious when you say snapped shafts as a result of compressor stall? if it was some serious chatter or causing compressor surge (which are different things) it could cause more bearing wear.

The stall is caused when the throttle butterfly closes and forces the compressed air back through the IC piping, some of this air pressure will be discipated by the rubber expandable IC pipework and the rest will pass back into the comp housing of the turbo and push against the comp wheel which can be spinning at 130,000rpm, the result of the air being "chopped" up by the comp wheel will create the flutter hoise which we hear.

If you are running serious boost i.e. 2.0+ bar on a non competition vehicle then running some sort of BOV would take some strain off the turbos bearings but I mean 1-1.4 bar of boost snapping shafts your having a laugh!

I ran a Hybrid CT9 turbo on a heavily modified Starlet Turbo which I had previously running 270bhp/tonne at 1.4 bar without any BOV for over a year with no issues at all and this includes track work and a very heavy right foot.

The long and short of it is the amount of chatter you get by blocking up the pipe on the S3 it isnt going to cause any more wear on the bearings than is caused when the turbo spools from ~10,000rpm to ~120/130,000rpm in seconds.

The reason people run without a BOV is because you always get some boost leak when you are on part throttle and between gear changes the compressed air/boost is not wasted and vented instead if you change gear quick enough you still keep some pressurised air in the IC piping meaning you will come back on boost quicker.

I dont mean to sound ranty, but I dont like being told about a subject in that sort of manner when it is something I do and speak about on a day to day basis.

 

[TurboDave]

i love posts like these.. they do make me smile.. Im pretty sure the K series turbo's are too small to block off the pipes.. evo's cossies etc.. they have big compressors and can handle it.. wouldnt be so sure about the little KKK's tho.
i agree with jason, get the 007p, much better quality, the OEMs are prone to going wrong, either this or get a stronger spring.

The shafts on the Cosworths i.e. T34's etc are indeed larger but when they are also spinning at up to ~120,000rpm they have a greater rotational mass due to their increased weight and therefore can suffer as much as a smaller unit. The TD05's fitted to most of the Evo's (although in different trims and specs) are quite strong in comparison with other units and cope well.

Shaft snapping is mostly caused by foreign objects in the oil damaging the bearings which causes more friction between the shaft and its bearings causing increased heat and when all are found together it can result in the shaft snapping. Foreign objects entering the compressor housing which jam the comp wheel are also common.

 

[S3-Oski]

So your saying i could do this on my S3 with no ill effects?

Im not going to do this though or am saying i dont belief you just curious,

as i had a modifed r5gtt on a t25 that run 18-20 psi all day and i had the dumpvalve blocked off for a year no problems as i did not really like the loud dumpvalve, and it never caused me any problems, but did like the chatter noise i got,but imdo not have a clue in the difference to a ko4 from my r5gtt one,

 

[TurboDave]

So your saying i could do this on my S3 with no ill effects?

Im not going to do this though or am saying i dont belief you just curious,

as i had a modifed r5gtt on a t25 that run 18-20 psi all day and i had the dumpvalve blocked off for a year no problems as i did not really like the loud dumpvalve, and it never caused me any problems, but did like the chatter noise i got,but imdo not have a clue in the difference to a ko4 from my r5gtt one,

I like the chatter noise aswell even though it isnt very loud at all on my S3 at the moment however some noise will be muffled by the airbox etc the amount of boost its running is nowhere near enough to damage the journal bearings inside the core.

I have mine blocked up now and I certinally wouldnt have it done if I believed it would cause any damage, I am fitting my new custom K04 Hybrid later next week and that will also have a blocked IC pipe even when its remapped.

Hope this helps.

 

[S3-Oski]

I like the chatter noise aswell even though it isnt very loud at all on my S3 at the moment however some noise will be muffled by the airbox etc the amount of boost its running is nowhere near enough to damage the journal bearings inside the core.

I have mine blocked up now and I certinally wouldnt have it done if I believed it would cause any damage, I am fitting my new custom K04 Hybrid later next week and that will also have a blocked IC pipe even when its remapped.

Hope this helps.

Hi mate thanks for the reply yeah its interesting,does it bring up faults though like when my dv failed i had a n249 fault come up, when i had mycar checked?

 

[Broken Byzan]

I like the chatter noise aswell even though it isnt very loud at all on my S3 at the moment however some noise will be muffled by the airbox etc the amount of boost its running is nowhere near enough to damage the journal bearings inside the core.

I have mine blocked up now and I certinally wouldnt have it done if I believed it would cause any damage, I am fitting my new custom K04 Hybrid later next week and that will also have a blocked IC pipe even when its remapped.

Hope this helps.

I will be interseted to see how long this hybrid lasts. So the compressor stall does no harm at all?? So if a customer of yours bought a turbo and ran it without a DV/BOV and it the turbo broke you would replace/repair without question? I don't think so.

It's nice of you to bring your knowledge on here to help us all to learn, i am just going on personal experience and information i have found on the internet etc as to the causes of failiures to the k03/k04 series KKK units

 

[Shy19s]

Always fun talking about this sort of thing, and i never mentioned anything about shafts snapping, i was just under the impression that the KKK series was not as strong as the turbo's on the said cars and from what i have seen from my friends TTS, he ran his BFV engine without any dvalves etc.. turbo went bang after a few months.. dont get me wrong i love that noise, much over the 'open can' tss sound..

i did enquire a few months back whether i could do this without any risk but people who tend to know alot about these engines on the forum did tell me my turbo wouldnt last long.. and it wasnt long after that a m8 of mine told me he blew his Ko4 doing this same thing.

Also interested to see if your hybrid can stand it, as i said would love this noise on my car.

 

[TurboDave]

Hi mate thanks for the reply yeah its interesting,does it bring up faults though like when my dv failed i had a n249 fault come up, when i had mycar checked?

The reason the fault would have come up in all probability is because the diaphram inside the DV could have split and the fault code would represent the loss in vacuum as detected by the ECU.

.

I will be interseted to see how long this hybrid lasts. So the compressor stall does no harm at all?? So if a customer of yours bought a turbo and ran it without a DV/BOV and it the turbo broke you would replace/repair without question? I don't think so.

It's nice of you to bring your knowledge on here to help us all to learn, i am just going on personal experience and information i have found on the internet etc as to the causes of failiures to the k03/k04 series KKK units

Always fun talking about this sort of thing, and i never mentioned anything about shafts snapping, i was just under the impression that the KKK series was not as strong as the turbo's on the said cars and from what i have seen from my friends TTS, he ran his BFV engine without any dvalves etc.. turbo went bang after a few months.. dont get me wrong i love that noise, much over the 'open can' tss sound..

i did enquire a few months back whether i could do this without any risk but people who tend to know alot about these engines on the forum did tell me my turbo wouldnt last long.. and it wasnt long after that a m8 of mine told me he blew his Ko4 doing this same thing.

Also interested to see if your hybrid can stand it, as i said would love this noise on my car.

I am new to the Audi scene only having the S3 for 4 months although it will end up forged and pushing some power .

From my own personal experice I dont believe that compressor wheel stall at low to medium levels and I'm not talking 1.8-2bar would cause any more stress on the turbos internals purely because the comp wheel and shaft are built to be durable and a small amount of air being pushed back against the comp wheel isnt going to cause enough stress to do any harm.

A standard build turbo running standard boost would not fail due to low levels of compressor surge imho. A standard turbo running non-standard boost would void the warranty anyway because you will find most turbo companies will have disclaimers which cover their backs if the turbo has been overspooled or put under lots of stress, which they will know from examining the bearings and they cannot be held responsible for people pushing standard parts past their operating peramiters (as the blurb would be).

Hybrids on the other hand will normally stil have the standard exhaust wheel and shaft (the exhaust wheel and shaft are joined perminantly in most cases and the uprated comp wheel is just fitted to the end of the shaft after the housing has been machined to fit it). They can contain uprated bearings 360degree bearings etc which can provide better lubrication around the shaft keeping it better lubricated and allowing for more stress on it. The oil also is the main coolant for the turbo incase you didnt know . The hybrid supplier would then advise on a safe boost level.

I by no means meant to sound pedantic in my previous posts, as a new member I realise that I am not known at all and I hope I have helped somewhat with regards to the effect of comp stall on a turbo!

 

[MintyS3]

My car has just developed the fluttering when coming off the throttle today. Im going to have a look at the DV which is a forge item and about a year old now.