Manual S3 or RS3?

[thecalmdoc]

Hi,

Looking for some advice here, please lads.

I'm after a 'fun' car, not a daily - solely for me to drive when I have a few hours spare.

The car needs to be involving, and fun to drive. I don't care too much for going VERY fast in a straight, I'd rather have a spirited drive down some B roads.

Other nice to haves:

- 5 door - in case I need to carry my son. (rarely)
- prefer a darker colour.
- preferably 2014-2017.
- less than 50k miles.
- < £18k.

I'm leaning towards a manual S3, stage 1-2 mapped, NO pops and bangs. ***.

Will the RS3 be too easy, fast and 'boring' for my needs?

Thanks!

 

[Damo S]

With a manual S3 you need to factor in an uprated clutch to take a remap. That's in the order of 1200, 1300 quid. Unless you find one that has had some of the mods done already. They can be a bit twitchy at speed and have a tendency to understeer a little, but not badly. You can eliminate the understeer with an uprated rear anti roll bar (sway bar). A stage 1 / 2 S3 is a brute of a car, a lot of fun, and very quick acceleration (proven <4 secs to 60). Very different beast to the stock car.

I've never driven an RS3 so cant comment on their ride / handling although I'd happily have one for the exhaust note alone, but not sure how much of a car you'll get for 18k. A stage 1 / 2 S3 will be quicker than a stock older rs3.

 

[pburv]

As posted above by @Damo S other considerations is resale value. Most but not all will want an S tronic S3 and with your budget the most likely RS3 available would be on the older 8P variant which won't attract a decent resale return unless it's in very good unmolested condition.
For driver involvement enthusiasts tend to prefer manuals. The only issue with them is the clutch isn't up to much compared with an S tronic clutch.

 

[K96]

For what you have specified and the budge I personally think you are looking at the wrong cars. I have a S3 8V they are great cars all round so you can't go wrong with them and of course I enjoy driving it been an Audi man at heart (I've had two s3's in a row now). But to give you some advice without been bias I would say you should look at BMW M140is. RWD 3.0 Litres engine so they sound amazing and you'll find them more fun to to drive.

Anyway thats just my 2 pence. Good luck with whatever you choose !

Sent from my SM-G973F using Tapatalk

 

[thecalmdoc]

Thank you so much for your reply,

Do you need to consider an uprated clutch even at stage 1? How long does the standard clutch last?

My ideal would be a manual RS3, I love the 5cyl sound too - but they don't exist.

What do you have @Damo S ?

 

[thecalmdoc]

Thanks!

I'm not too worried about resell, I plan on keeping it for a while - theres plenty of potential with the car.

As you've said, I want the driver involvement not the ease of driving. I've got other boring, easy cars to drive.

As posted above by @Damo S other considerations is resale value. Most but not all will want an S tronic S3 and with your budget the most likely RS3 available would be on the older 8P variant which won't attract a decent resale return unless it's in very good unmolested condition.
For driver involvement enthusiasts tend to prefer manuals. The only issue with them is the clutch isn't up to much compared with an S tronic clutch.

 

[thecalmdoc]

Thanks!

I test drove the M140i with a manual gearbox a few years ago when it came out. I hated it, the engine needed to be wound up past 4-4.5k revs to get anything out of them. I have an E46 M3, perhaps I expected too much from the M140...
AND it sounded shxt.

My actual ideal car is a manual M2 Comp, but I missed the boat on ordering a new one. I will have to wait another 2-3 years or the leases to end, then I'll have a look again.

For what you have specified and the budge I personally think you are looking at the wrong cars. I have a S3 8V they are great cars all round so you can't go wrong with them and of course I enjoy driving it been an Audi man at heart (I've had two s3's in a row now). But to give you some advice without been bias I would say you should look at BMW M140is. RWD 3.0 Litres engine so they sound amazing and you'll find them more fun to to drive.

Anyway thats just my 2 pence. Good luck with whatever you choose !

Sent from my SM-G973F using Tapatalk

 

[pburv]

Thanks!

I'm not too worried about resell, I plan on keeping it for a while - theres plenty of potential with the car.

As you've said, I want the driver involvement not the ease of driving. I've got other boring, easy cars to drive.

Ok not exactly a dark colour but this ain't too shabby?
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-de...g-location=at_cars&quantity-of-doors=5&page=1

 

[pburv]

Ok not exactly a dark colour but this ain't too shabby?
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/201811102316007?sort=price-desc&onesearchad=New&onesearchad=Nearly New&onesearchad=Used&transmission=Manual&price-to=18000&maximum-mileage=50000&minimum-badge-engine-size=2.0&model=S3&include-delivery-option=on&radius=1500&make=AUDI&postcode=ll572dl&advertising-location=at_cars&quantity-of-doors=5&page=1

Can't get darker than this lol
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-de...sed&price-to=18000&transmission=Manual&page=1

 

[JohnM100]

Have you thought about an S1?

 

[Leevr]

In all honesty I'd steer clear of the manual S3. I've got the manual and I'm on my third clutch all be it at stage 2. The standard clutch is the same as a golf gti. Same part number. Will not last in most cases. Will start to slip in higher gear then over time lower gears. Its well documented on here. As I eluded to im stage 2, but in reality I'm probably on a par with a stage 1 DSG car. If you get a magride car you have the option to change the ride. Although it is not the greatest system. Subtle changes from comfort to dynamic. There not worlds apart like a focus RS. And not cheap to replace. Factor £1500 from an indy for front strut replacement. Price for the clutches has already been discussed. Seats are not the greatest, not very supportive. The 8p RS i had previously, with a map was an absolute beast and did everything great. Sounded amazing. Aftermarket exhaust and it'll be great. Still command a high premium with low mileage. Good luck with whatever you go for.

 

[Damo S]

Do you need to consider an uprated clutch even at stage 1? How long does the standard clutch last?
What do you have @Damo S ?

yes. as mentioned above the clutch isnt up to the job at all. mine started failing at 22k on a stock car. early demise happened to many others too. well documented on here but in a nutshell not all of them fail so soon, but none of them will cope with a good stage 1 tune. You have to consider that most good stage 1 remaps push the torque beyond 350 odd lbs foot in some cases, which is a big hike over stock and that's the problem.

I've got a manual S3 8v with sachs organic uprated clutch and kind of stage 1.5 (no exhaust mods but everything else required for a full stage 2). I too have always preferred manuals. I test drove both the 6 speed dsg and the manual but decided I didnt like the dsg it felt clunky and annoying. That said, with a sachs uprated clutch its heavy and hard work in traffic, and they dont necessarily come without their problems either. Some on here have had trouble with uprated clutches. In some ways now I wish I had gone of the DSG and just learnt to live with its quirks because the manual and clutch is a limiting factor for tuning. If I want to go stage 3 at any point then i will have to change the clutch again

Have you considered a golf R? same engine but different handling and a bit more of a drivers cars than the S3 (which is a good refined car in stock form, safe, but perhaps not particularly brilliant at anything). If I'm honest I much preferred how my old 3.2 quattro felt on the road. Although it was more understeery because of that big old lump under the bonnet it felt more solid and planted than my current S3.

 

[thecalmdoc]

Have you thought about an S1?

Thanks for the suggestion, not yet.

What should I be looking for? Anything to stay clear of?

 

[thecalmdoc]

In all honesty I'd steer clear of the manual S3. I've got the manual and I'm on my third clutch all be it at stage 2. The standard clutch is the same as a golf gti. Same part number. Will not last in most cases. Will start to slip in higher gear then over time lower gears. Its well documented on here. As I eluded to im stage 2, but in reality I'm probably on a par with a stage 1 DSG car. If you get a magride car you have the option to change the ride. Although it is not the greatest system. Subtle changes from comfort to dynamic. There not worlds apart like a focus RS. And not cheap to replace. Factor £1500 from an indy for front strut replacement. Price for the clutches has already been discussed. Seats are not the greatest, not very supportive. The 8p RS i had previously, with a map was an absolute beast and did everything great. Sounded amazing. Aftermarket exhaust and it'll be great. Still command a high premium with low mileage. Good luck with whatever you go for.

Thanks for this, I really appreciate it.

You've made it clear that the manual S3 route isn't as robust as I'd assumed. I have a manual MK5 GTi, and love it to pieces, I really want something fun and chuckable like the MK5, but more modern.

From your post, it looks like theres a fair bit of work (and cost) involved to get what I want. Clutch(es), suspension, intake, exhaust. map etc.

Definitely reconsidering now, maybe a manual M2 is a better option?

 

[thecalmdoc]

yes. as mentioned above the clutch isnt up to the job at all. mine started failing at 22k on a stock car. early demise happened to many others too. well documented on here but in a nutshell not all of them fail so soon, but none of them will cope with a good stage 1 tune. You have to consider that most good stage 1 remaps push the torque beyond 350 odd lbs foot in some cases, which is a big hike over stock and that's the problem.

I've got a manual S3 8v with sachs organic uprated clutch and kind of stage 1.5 (no exhaust mods but everything else required for a full stage 2). I too have always preferred manuals. I test drove both the 6 speed dsg and the manual but decided I didnt like the dsg it felt clunky and annoying. That said, with a sachs uprated clutch its heavy and hard work in traffic, and they dont necessarily come without their problems either. Some on here have had trouble with uprated clutches. In some ways now I wish I had gone of the DSG and just learnt to live with its quirks because the manual and clutch is a limiting factor for tuning. If I want to go stage 3 at any point then i will have to change the clutch again

Have you considered a golf R? same engine but different handling and a bit more of a drivers cars than the S3 (which is a good refined car in stock form, safe, but perhaps not particularly brilliant at anything). If I'm honest I much preferred how my old 3.2 quattro felt on the road. Although it was more understeery because of that big old lump under the bonnet it felt more solid and planted than my current S3.

Thank you!

I too test drive the DSG, albeit Golf R - it was a fast car, very capable BUT too easy. There was no driver involvement, literally point and shoot. I think the RS3 will be the same, but with the gorgeous 5 cyl soundtrack.

Hmmm. I need to rethink this.

 

[Damo S]

With a good remap its a different beast. far more brutal torque / power delivery and a lot quicker / more exciting. Perhaps a manual is the way to go, but as said above factor in the cost of an uprated clutch and you're good to go.

 

[wab172uk]

Hi,

Looking for some advice here, please lads.

I'm after a 'fun' car, not a daily - solely for me to drive when I have a few hours spare.

The car needs to be involving, and fun to drive. I don't care too much for going VERY fast in a straight, I'd rather have a spirited drive down some B roads.

Other nice to haves:

- 5 door - in case I need to carry my son. (rarely)
- prefer a darker colour.
- preferably 2014-2017.
- less than 50k miles.
- < £18k.

I'm leaning towards a manual S3, stage 1-2 mapped, NO pops and bangs. ***.

Will the RS3 be too easy, fast and 'boring' for my needs?

Thanks!

If you want a fun car, and not a daily, don't bother with an Audi S3 or RS3. Fast, secure yes. Fun? No.

I had a S3 saloon manual. The only positive for the manual, is it bring some interaction with the car. I enjoy changing gear, so I'll always pick a manual over n Auto. And fun doesn't mean it has to be the fastest. If you prefer to change gear, a manual S3 will be more fun that a DSG S3 or RS3.

If you want a fun car, go get a FWD Hot Hatch, or RWD Coupe / saloon.

 

[msdmjb]

^^ what he said.
Neither are fun, both are effective.
In that price bracket I would be looking at a lightly used 140i or Fiesta ST as a fun car.

 

[Harvey]

My fun to drive car, track focused but road legal

 

[Chris4410]

Neither an S3 or an RS3 is what I would call a fun car, and certainly not what I would consider as a weekend car.

Both are capable daily cars, fast in a straight line and they do everything well. But neither are in the least engaging to drive.