I believed Audi's were made of Galvanised Steel ?

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Demented

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I was under the impression Galvanised steel doesn't corrode ?

Yet, I've encountered a few 04 Audi A4's with small rust/paint blisters.

On the the edge of the boot lid, base of rear wheel arch/sill and on the front wing ?
 
Galvanised steel is not completely rustproof, it will rust eventually if exposed to the elements, but at nowhere near the pace of unprotected steel.
 
I have rust bubbling up at the top of the drivers door just back from the wing mirror, apart from that its perfect even the arches
 
It's rather annoying, mines going into Audi tomorrow to try my luck with the warrenty. It's got a pretty much full service history with Audi.
 
audi upgrades
My old B5 didn't have a spec of rust on it when I sold it and it was 14 years old, my sisters 2000 mini cooper s on the other hand.....
 
Maybe the newest is 7 years old and to some we expect a vehicle of that age to show signs of corrosion ?

However, I'm certain during the early 80's and the mid 90's TV ads stated Audi's are made of galvanised steel.

I'm unaware whether recent Audi ads state this but I believe galvanised steel still used to manufacture Audi's of today.

It is my understanding that the steel used is actually Galvanised prior to the steel being pressed?

Once pressed into shape and body panels assembled the car is dipped in anti corrosion resin and painted.

The process to galvanised steel is to prevent corrosion. I've never heard the process referred to, as to delay corrosion ?

So, whether 7 years old or more, on vehicle claimed to be made of galvanised steel, with a 12 year anti corrosion warranty, should there be signs of corrosion ?
 
I expect most corrosiion is caused by damage, be it from an accident, or a wheel arch liner rubbing on the arch etc. Galvanised steel is only so good, it's not going to stop everything.

I'm not sure on the details of the warranty, is it Anti Corrosion, or Anti Perforation?
 
I thought the chassis and all main bodywork (not trim) had a 10year Audi warranty? I thought it was for rust though?
 
Only if it can be proved that its bubbled from underneath the paint work! I noticed a rust patch under my numberplate took it to audi they looked at it and it turns out the number plate has worn the paint down...how I ask you!!! I did say well the plate has been on the car since new but still cause it wasnt coming from under the paint work they wernt interested.
 
T0m said:
Only if it can be proved that its bubbled from underneath the paint work! I noticed a rust patch under my numberplate took it to audi they looked at it and it turns out the number plate has worn the paint down...how I ask you!!! I did say well the plate has been on the car since new but still cause it wasnt coming from under the paint work they wernt interested.
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hmmm.... annoying, but kinda understandable - I guess they want to eliminate claims for rust where the paintwork is damaged.
 
[FONT=&quot]I'm new to this forum and as of yet I don't even own an Audi, although I hope to do so soon.

So, I'm not disputing Audi owner’s answers or their experiences.

However, when I do acquire my A4, I have no intention of making the galvanised steel rust by rubbing off the zinc, but surely to do so, the paint, under seal and resin coat would require removing first?

My confusion is regarding the Galvanised steel?

Yes, Galvanised steel is electroplated with a zinc coating to prevent corrosion.

The Audi auto body paint process, I believe the Galvanised body, once assembled is dipped in an etch primer, then dipped again in some form of additional anti corrosion resin and painted?

If this is so, how can the zinc coating be rubbed off?

Suppose if the arch liner is rubbing on the inner wing, yes, in time that will eventually rub through, same if the registration plate is rubbing on the paintwork and once the galvanised coating has rubbed off and the steel is exposed to the elements, then rust will appear and spread.

However, I don't think it is so easy to rub the zinc coating off, especially with plastic, with an angle grinder, yes!

Audi do not rust as much as other cars and are fairing well, but should they be rusting at all, no matter how insignificant?

I'm beginning believed that not all body panels are galvanised, possible only significant areas, but maybe W3STY experience with the 8L chassis contradicts my theory.

I believe the warranty is an anti perforation warranty rather than anti corrosion, maybe it is for 10 years?

I also believed it stipulates that perforation if any, must somehow be from inside the paint, with no signs of previous bodywork repair or paint chips.

I have experience of the paint and body shop industry and I can understand how a repair, if corners are cut, rust can break through in a matter months, if not weeks.

Nearly 20yrs ago, a fire escape and balcony made of unpainted Galvanised steel was erected on a trendy flat conversion opposite where I used to live, when fitted were shiny and new.

20yrs later, no longer shiny and new but not covered in rust either?[/FONT]
 
Demented said:
[FONT=&quot]Nearly 20yrs ago, a fire escape and balcony made of unpainted Galvanised steel was erected on a trendy flat conversion opposite where I used to live, when fitted were shiny and new.

20yrs later, no longer shiny and new but not covered in rust either?[/FONT]
Click to expand...

I have built a building by the sea on Anglesea and we have some fancy bollards that have appeared to rust and the customer is complaining however it is only cosmetic and will not effect the structural inegrity due to the composition of the alloy when they were made. So you get this appearance of them rusting and to the normal person they wouldnt know, of cause there is a remedy of regular maintenance but it costs money and in this day and age everyone is trying to cut costs....

By the way I am no metallurgist!!
 
Demented said:
[FONT=&quot]However, when I do acquire my A4, I have no intention of making the galvanised steel rust by rubbing off the zinc, but surely to do so, the paint, under seal and resin coat would require removing first?
Click to expand...

I don't think anyone rubs the zinc plate off on purpose ...... You can make sure you buy the best car you can at the time, but if things like the wheelarch liner have already rubbed the damage will have been done even if the corrosion hasn't yet started.

I would stick my neck out and say the majority of A4's rust a lot less than most other cars of the era, I've seen plenty of late model rusty Mk4 Golfs - and they're most definitely better built than most for the price. Failing that there's plenty of 3 series about! Seriously, I wouldn't worry too much.....
 
It's a shame the B6's are prone to rust. It is very very common for them to rust firstly on the front arches were the arch liners rub.

Mine is coming out of the bodyshop having this sorted, in preperation for sale :crying:, If a B6 has not rot here yet, it's been done already.

I tried to go to Audi to have this done on warranty, however, with the way of the world at the moment they will find anything to get out of paying out.

At least it's not a merc. Not unusual to have to put new wings on 2 year old Mercs!
 
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I went to audi yesterday, unfortunatly my car has been painted in the past (he showed me the evidence) but he had no idea at all about them rusting, and the arch rubbing. Apparently there is nothing in writing at audi?
 
I'm not worrying regarding Rust and my reference to rubbing the Galvanisation off was only a joke.
I'm not looking to claim on a warranty either.

It is just a query, based on my own beliefs and understanding.

Whether right or wrong, most companies try to wriggle out of the warranty offered and by the looks of it, Audi too?

Yes, A4's probably do rust a lot less than other cars. However, if made of Galvanised Steel, should they be rusting at all ?

The fancy bollards that have appeared to have rusted, they may be made of a different material altogether ?

The integrity of the bollard may remain but would look far more unsightly if had been painted and covered in paint scabs.

With my own experiences and understanding of Galvanised Steel, other than observing the greying over the years, it should not rust, of any kind, not even surface rust.

I have recently retrieved a section of Galvanised Steel plate from the back garden, it was discarded approx five years ago, landing in between the garage and the fence.

One side I had been primed and spray painted (5yrs ago) the other side, other than the galvanisation was untouched, untreated. Yet on retrieval, NO rust at all ?

Audi's have some kind of anti corrosion treatment as well as the Galvanisation and are also painted and undersealed etc. The wings, boot lid, bonnet etc and any other panels with access gained to the rear, are also treated and painted on both sides.

Whenever I have prepared Galvanised Steel for welding, I have been told to grind off the Galvanisation with an angle grinder ?

I can accept that once the paint, anti corrosion resin, underseal and Galvanisation are removed, then yes, the bare steel will corrode.

However, I find it hard to believe that plastic rubbing against the bodywork will ever wear through the Galvanisation.

Yesterday, I came across a 2003 Audi A4 Avant, the wheel arches had so many rust blister/bubbles in the paint, I will go as far to say, Audi's are not made of Galvanised Steel.

If they are, then in my opinion something is not right ?
 
Simple fella go ask Audi direct that way it will put your mind to rest ;-)
 
If so simple, Fella, I wouldn't be asking opinion on this forum would I ?

You do the asking and when Audi reply, post it on this forum for all to see.



In all advertising literature, Audi stress their vehicles are manufactured from pressed Galvanised steel. They also stress they are the only company to Galvanise the steel prior to pressing and assembly.


It is my understanding that Galvanised Steel does not rust; same goes for some compositions of alloys, such as the alloy used to manufacture alloy wheels.

However, although I'm no expert and just a normal person, I would assume Alloy which contains Steel would rust due to the element of steel used when made, unless stated its been galvanised.

As for maintenance of fancy alloy bollards to prevent the rusting, other than galvanise or paint, I can’t image the kind of maintenance required, regardless of cost.

I guess you may feel, no mater how ugly or unsightly the rusted galvanised steel looks, as long as the structural integrity isn't compromised then everyone is happy.

As a car owner, although the structural integrity may be retained, which is highly unlikely due to thickness of the steel used, I don’t want any vehicle of mine to look ugly and unsightly due to paint blisters or scabs.

Other than wash and polish and address paint chips, what more is a car owner expected do to maintain the bodywork of their car.

 
Demented -> I dont want to ask Audi as I dont really care to be fair!

When you type into google 'will galvanised steel rust' like I just did all the answers say yes it will just takes longer than normal steel.

Thats why they continually paint stuctures like the golden gate bridge ok this is what is known as cold zinc galvanising but its still the same principal if your with me fella!

So in answer to your orginal question 'I was under the impression Galvanised steel doesn't corrode ?' the answer is yes it can but it will take a while unless you either scratch off the Zinc coating or the galvanisation process was not up to scratch in the first instance!

Case closed ha ha
 
T0m ,
Case closed in your opinion. As you have no idea what you are talking about.
No wonder your fancy bollards are rusting?

If you don’t really care why bother posting a reply, why contradict and attempt to denigrate my question, opinions or believes?

There is a huge difference between Galvanised Steel and painting with a zinc primer. Surprised you did not Google it before you made such a silly statement?

All this talk of scratching the Zinc coating off, what the hell do you believed Galvanisation is, just a layer of paint?

When I’ve removed the Galvanisation from steel in preparation for welding, it can only be removed inside an extraction tunnel or booth, wearing an air fed mask and using an angle grinder.

The Galvanisation of steel, is to immerse the steel in a bath of zinc, an electric current it passed through it and the zinc bonds and partially penetrates the steel.
Its a process called Electro-Galvanisation, thus of Electro-plating.

Some Auto manufactures are now using a Hot Dip Galvanisation process, where the assembled body is dipped into a bath of molten Zinc prior to painting.


The Golden Gate Bridge is NOT made from Galvanised Steel.

It was originally painted in a Red lead primer and a lead base top coat.
During 1965 the original lead base paint was removed and repainted with a Zinc Primer and vinyl top coats. I googled it


With my own experience, In the UK and in a City renown for rain, I have witness a discarded section of galvanised steel plate showing no signs of corrosion after laying in the Garden for 5 years, same too for a Galvanised balcony and fire escape installed 20 years ago, still no corrosion, yet not painted

Audi are claimed to be made of Electro-Galvanised Steel and are painted too, yet I’ve come across Audi’s of 7/8 years old that are showing signs of rust, yet other vehicles of similar age that are not made of galvanised steel, no rust?

So, what’s the difference between the Galvanised steel Audi are using and that of the discarded galvanised steel plate from my back garden?

 So rather than denigrate my post, if you don’t really care and you cant answer, don’t waste your time answering questions you don’t actually know the answer to, Fella, ok!
 
Jesus this is turning into a slanging match, I am no metallurgist as I said in one of my previous posts but doing a quick search on google and it opens a whole world of info and usually I am good at getting the picture early on however you have someone gone off the point and mis read my last post.

I understand the galvisation process however it is possible for galvanised steel to rust but it may either take longer or it will be the zinc that may rust before the actual steel read this article I pulled off the net...

Galvanized steel has gone through a chemical process to keep it from corroding. The steel gets coated in layers of zinc because rust won't attack this protective metal. For countless outdoor, marine, or industrial applications, galvanized steel is an essential fabrication component.
The principal method of making steel resist corrosion is by alloying it with another metal, zinc. When steel is submerged in melted zinc, the chemical reaction permanently bonds the zinc to the steel through galvanizing. Therefore, the zinc isn't exactly a sealer, like paint, because it doesn't just coat the steel; it actually permanently becomes a part of it.
The zinc goes through a reaction with the iron molecules within the steel to form galvanized steel. The most external layer is all zinc, but successive layers are a mixture of zinc and iron, with an interior of pure steel. These multiple layers are responsible for the amazing property of the metal to withstand corrosion-inducing circumstances, such as saltwater or moisture.
Zinc also protects the steel by acting as a "sacrificial layer." If, for some reason, rust does take hold on the surface of galvanized steel, the zinc will get corroded first. This allows the zinc that is spread over the breach or scratch to prevent rust from reaching the steel.

The degree of galvanizing is usually represented as the zinc's weight per surface area rather than the thickness of the zinc, because this gives a better representation of how much metal has been applied. Steel often gets galvanized after individual parts have been formed, such as braces, nails, screws, beams, or studs. However, raw galvanized steel in sheets will withstand some bending and forming without flaking.
Galvanized steel can be found almost everywhere. You might be living in a steel frame house. You are no doubt surrounded by steel parts in your car that allow it to emerge from rainstorms unscathed. Many people work in an office with metal roofing made of galvanized steel. Besides being inexpensive and effective, this metal is popular because it can be recycled and reused multiple times.""]
Click to expand...

With regards to my comments ont the bridge yes I know its not made out of galvanised steel I mearly menitoned another process using another zinc based process to keep rusting at bay and happened to reference the golden gate bridge as an example of a stucture that need s painting I didnt google it specifically!!

So with regards to Audi and your piece of metal in the garden I suggest you ask a metallurgist as to me a brief look at this subject it looks like it depends on a mixture of the process, who carried it out, thinkenss and composition of the steel being galvanised and so forth.

Tell you what as I am a Project Manager and I am paying for someone to look into my rust issue (I have it on other things not just the bollards) when these people report back to me I will share there answers with you.

In the mean time please take my previous post in a jovial way the way it was intended.
 
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It seems as though the only people who can truly answer your question are the technicians/engineers in charge of the process at Audi. Please contact them and I am sure the majority of people on the forum would be very interested to see the reply you receive from them.

It would appear from your post that you have either expertise in this field, or have at the very least researched the subject thoroughly.
Most folks on the forum could only answer your question in relation to possible attempts at claims with their own vehicles and the responses given by Audi main dealers. It is quite clear there is a problem with the process that Audi use, most B6 A4's suffer from blistering on rear quarter panels, front wings and insides of doors and bootlids, maybe if you felt you could use your knowledge to challenge Audi on this, it would benefit some of the owners on here.
 
My own experience, the same as others, is that Audi's of the B6 vintage are no more or less prone to rust than other similar age vehicles from other manufacturers.

In ideal conditions, a galvanised piece of steel will not rust.

Back in the real world though, why do wheel arches etc rust? Well, the plastic liner rubbing on the paint/zinc layer will after many thousands of vibrations wear through it. Sounds unlikely that plastic could do that until you factor in that the plastic and inner arch will be covered in tiny bits of grit and other road debris effectively becoming a very good sanding block! Throw in the fact that the area will then be covered in salt water from the road for a few months each year, and it's very easy to see how the galvanised steel will rust. It's had its protection removed....

As for other Audi's that are showing signs of rust, that could be down to accident repairs. Unless they were repaired at an Audi approved body shop using galvanised parts etc, how do we know if that replacement wing was not a cheap untreated pattern part? I'd imagine a lot of insurance approved body shops use the cheapest possible parts.

In some cases of course, the galvanic treatment may have been poorly applied, or failed. In those instances, I would expect that Audi would fix it.

My old A3 (and my current A4 actually) had what looked like a few little bubbles under the paint on the nearside lower quarter panel. I got Audi to look at these, and they said they were caused by stone chips and the bubbles were what was meant to happen. They showed me the bubble under a high powered loupe, and you could see a tiny little hole, like a pinprick, on top of it. The original stone chip had pierced the paint and zinc layer a tiny amount, and the zinc layer had corroded quickly and swelled to protect the steel underneath. This is what is meant to happen.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that build an Audi, stick it on the driveway and don't move it, and it will not rust for decades. Start to use it and drive it in all weathers and subject it to flexing, vibration, accident damage, and scrapes, scuffs and stone chips, then it will start to show signs of use including rusting.

The problem is when you look at a 7 to 10 year old car is that you just don't know what has happened to it. You don't know if it has been badly repaired or just mistreated all it's life, any of which could cause it to show signs of rust. Trying to establish the effectiveness of Audi's rust proofing circa 1998-2005 by looking at cars from that era today isn't the most effective way in my view, for all the variables stated above.

What was the question again?! :)
 
Hey took, thanks for a detailed explanation of your opinion.

I do live in the real world and I don't expect a vehicle sit on the drive or in a garage without use.

I don't wish my post to turn into a slanging match with anyone but I'm not going to sit by while someone attempts to ridicule my theory or knowledge.

I'm not convinced that plastic wheel liners with girt and salt water is capable of scratching off the galvanisation, if such a process is doing so, then I'm questioning Audi's claims, not the owners experiences.

Yes, some Audi may have had bodywork repairs carried in the past with inferior parts used.

The rear wheel arches may have been repaired using body filler, with repairers keying the surface to take the filler using an abrasive disc or angle grinder, thus grinding away at the galvanisation.

However, I find this theory highly unlikely due to the number of Audi's I've seen on sales forecourts, in car parks and parked next to at traffic lights, with rust appearing in similar location around the body work, namely, at least 3cm's above the lip/edge of the wheel arches, specifically on A4's, as that's all I've been looking at.

Yet, vehicle of similar ages, such as Ford’s, which are prone to rusting don't seem to show the rusting as what I'm encountering on the Audi's.

Ford’s have many issues regards rust, lets not go there, I'm just comparing my finding with the area on the wheel arches.

My question, as I have stated earlier is not ridicule or pour scorn on Audi owners experience or their theories but to question this issues and the use of Galvanised Steel?

Other have mention protective coating and maintenance etc, well once an Audi has been assembled using the so called Galvanised Steel, the body is dipped in a bath of epoxy resin, so the paint will adhere to the Galvanisation, then it is either dipped or painted in another anti corrosion substance, once dry, it undersealed and then painted with at least 3 coats of primer, 3 base coats and then at least 3 coats of lacquer.

As you see, with such a process and claimed to Galvanised Steel too, something is not quite right.

I’ve worked on goods vehicles with Galvanised chequer plate floors, steps and goods area, such areas are open to the elements, none are protected nor are they painted, experiencing harsh environments daily, yet no rust ?

I can see this post never ending; my question was based on the use of Audi’s claim of using Galvanised Steel to make their vehicle, I’m convinced Galvanised steel will not rust, that’s based on my own experience, it may well eventually rust but I don’t believe it will do so in my life time.

You may wish to continue this post amongst yourself; however, I will refrain from reading replies from now on.
 
The only thing I will say is I have a 54 plate and apart from the rust on the rear boot lid I have non anywhere else and I am only speaking for myself but these cars you were looking at must not of been looked after or had previous repairs done how many did you look at?

With ref to galvanised steel rusting it is possible in a life time and if audi's are not galvanised then my boot isnt as its started to rust so hey I will get it repaired.

But doing a bit of digging most car companies seem to use a electro plating process which only adds a very small layer (several microns) to adhere to the body and most companies only galvanise the areas/panels they know suffer the most from rust so maybe all these cars you have seen have been repaired at somepoint?!

There are just so many possibilities and reasons but like I said Im no metallurgist so my advice is buy an audi that has no rust on it and that should keep your mind at bay ;-)

Happy hunting fella!!
 
Demented, I wasn't having a go at your view vs mine at all, your opinion is just as valid as mine! :)

I was just sharing my view on it, that's all.

I've never seen the rust on the wheel arches away from the lip like you describe, but clearly that doesn't mean it doesn't happen.

Admittedly, I didn't look at many A4's before buying mine.

The problem is with all manufacturers claims re rust proofing, is that by the time any rust manifests itself, it could be too late and the car will have had several owners and be past its warranty anyway.

It could all be baloney for all I know! :)

Good luck in your search.
 
Im sure most of the lads here can afford to have bit of rust delt with at a good body shop, i cant be ***** to take my 10 year old car to Audi with the 200k miles worth of road wear on the paint to get them to argue the toss over it, rust will come to all cars, i don't care what advertising BS was used, over 10 years ago, if i was that up-tight about it id be buying a new car every 2 years,
 
I've just noticed that the front edge of the driver's side wheel arch on mine is bubbly.

I think I will try Audi - although the car is now 9 years old, to find small areas of rust on a car of that vintage is expected (there's a little bit at the bottom of the doors) but the amount bubbling inder the wheel arec is wrong, moreso if it's a common,, widespread problem.

I'll try Audi, as in theory it's covered by a 12 year anti-corrosion warranty, but as it's been out of the main dealerships for so long for servicing, I'm wondering if I'd have any luck.
 
If it hasn't been back for it's annual perforation warranty inspections, then I think you'll be out of luck sadly...

Always worth asking though!
 
Went to Audi, Hutingdon, last Friday to see what could be done under warranty about the bubbling on the wheel arch.Audi's warranty guy was very helpful but bottom line was Audi wouldn't agree to the work - seems the rust was caused by stone chips on the inner lip of the wheel arch and propagating out so the rust was from outside in, not inside out.I did suggest that it was a defect given that the other wheel arch hadn't gone the same way (I can't believe that over a 9 year period, stone chipping had only occurred on one side) and I was *very* disappoint that a manufacturer such as Audi would suffer rust in such a short timescale, esp as I have had other cars of similar age and hadn't encountered the problem. However, the answer was still "no".Plan B - I'm getting a local resprayer to do the work next w/end for £150 to rub down, etch, prime, put some sort of protective resin on the inner lip and paint and lacquer the whole panel.
 
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