Hill Hold Assist.

sunscreemer

Back with the 4 rings
Daft question, but if you have HA do you have to have it switched on?
 

Andyescos

Registered User
No, there's a switch next to the parking brake.
 

a3_phil

Registered User
It'd be interesting to know the split of lovers/haters on HA based on transmission...

A lot of the criticism seems to be from people with S-Tronic where you lose some of the control you might otherwise have for creeping, nipping out of junctions etc.

As someone with a manual and HA I don't find that it has any drawbacks. If I don't want it to trigger I can also depress the brake very lightly and if I want to prevent S/S kicking in with HA is on I can just keep the clutch depressed.
 

Andyescos

Registered User
It'd be interesting to know the split of lovers/haters on HA based on transmission...

A lot of the criticism seems to be from people with S-Tronic where you lose some of the control you might otherwise have for creeping, nipping out of junctions etc.

As someone with a manual and HA I don't find that it has any drawbacks. If I don't want it to trigger I can also depress the brake very lightly and if I want to prevent S/S kicking in with HA is on I can just keep the clutch depressed.

Mine's s-tronic and it still creeps, if I have come to a stop - once i want to creep again a quick flip of the accelerator starts it creeping again.

It seems to works the same as you say depending on how you depress the brake pedal. I spoke to the sales manager at Northampton, as I had his s-tronic without HA as a courtesy car, he said that it used to be quite "grabby" and would activated at 0.9 mph so you'd feel it stopping the car, so he doesn't normally spec it. But he did say that it has been improved recently.

I don't get the impression mine stops the car, but only comes on when the car is stopped.
 

JonathanY70

Registered User
Have had a Tiguan (manual) for 5 years with electronic handbrake and Hold Assist. I find the electronic handbrake doesn't give you the progressive feel of an mechanical one. The driving experience is so different that Hold Assist is essential (in my view). Of course if you don't habitually use the handbrake anyway then you may have a different view. But it never comes on when the vehicle is moving unless you stall the engine and are nearly stopped. I think it is a great option, and of course you can turn it off. Will be specifying it on my next Audi (TT or S3, not sure yet), coming from a B7 A4.
 

Martinbanshee

Registered User
Mine's s-tronic and it still creeps, if I have come to a stop - once i want to creep again a quick flip of the accelerator starts it creeping again. ..............
I don't get the impression mine stops the car, but only comes on when the car is stopped.

Precisely, it's very easy to make the car creep when needed. My TT was S-Tronic and didn't have HHA, I'd definitely spec HHA on future cars.
Also, on my car anyway, it doesn't activate until it's fully stopped.

Although it's not a critical feature it's a nice bit of automation and you can always switch it off for a while if you want to...just push that button.
 

h5djr

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Why does everyone continue to refer to this option using the wrong name. In the Price and Specification Guide Audi refer to the option UH2 Hold Assist. This is the option you have to pay £90 for. All A3s are fitted with Hill Hold as standard. The is no such thing as 'Hill Hold Assist' and the term can confuse between the two. Lets try and refer to these two system by their correct name or correct initials of HA or HH and not HHA and end the confusion.
 

veeeight

I am a very pretty girl
VCDS Map User
Too many Assists on an Audi.



Hill Assist
Hold Assist
Park Assist
Lame Assist
Hold Assist
Parallel Park Assist
Bay Park Assist
Call Assist
Hearing Assist
Vision Assist
Side Assist
Steer Assist
High Bream Assist
Perch Assist
Light Assist
Seat Assist
RAC Assist
Drive Assist
Stop Assist
Go Assist
Clutch Assist
Breath Assist
..............
 

sunscreemer

Back with the 4 rings
Why does everyone continue to refer to this option using the wrong name. In the Price and Specification Guide Audi refer to the option UH2 Hold Assist. This is the option you have to pay £90 for. All A3s are fitted with Hill Hold as standard. The is no such thing as 'Hill Hold Assist' and the term can confuse between the two. Lets try and refer to these two system by their correct name or correct initials of HA or HH and not HHA and end the confusion.

It does appear very confusing though. I'm not sure some features are too well explained in the brochures. And then you get on to the "only in conjunction with x, unless you have y"...!
 

Pulp84

Registered User
I find HA a bit of a nightmare reversing on to my drive.

I have to do a few turns to line up the car to get around some parked cars on the other side of my street before I can reverse - HA has on occasion put the handbrake on for me and then I need to release the hand brake manually to get moving again. Annoying....

Because the nose of my S3 is very close to the car parked over the road, I do not want to dab the throttle which I find can make the car lurch ever so slightly forward. Again, not sure if me putting the car in reverse activates the handbrake.

Never investigated why it does this but now just leave it off. Quite impressed with it initially but I never do any commuting / start/stop journeys so it hasn't been switched on since.
 
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sunscreemer

Back with the 4 rings
Like many features I think this is one to try out and learn to use or not use!
 

veeeight

I am a very pretty girl
VCDS Map User
I find HA a bit of a nightmare reversing on to my drive.

I have to do a few turns to line up the car to get around some parked cars on the other side of my street before I can reverse - HA has on occasion put the handbrake on for me and then I need to release the hand brake manually to get moving again. Annoying....

Because the nose of my S3 is very close to the car parked over the road, I do not want to dab the throttle which I find can make the car lurch ever so slightly forward. Again, not sure if me putting the car in reverse activates the handbrake.

Never investigated why it does this but now just leave it off. Quite impressed with it initially but I never do any commuting / start/stop journeys so it hasn't been switched on since.


^ This.

Hold Assist - coupled with the S-tonic delay in going between D and R and D and R -

When you have to do a 85 point turn

On an incline

Is an utter nightmare.
 

h5djr

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Gold Supporter
I have a similar thing happening. I turn on to my drive and stop. If I have HA engaged it holds the car. I open the garage door, remotely from the drivers seat. I then have to put my foot on the throttle to disengage the HA to move in to the garage. The A3 only just fits width wise so I have to be careful. With HA switched off I can stop, open the garage door, release the foot brake and the s-tronic creeps the car forward and I can control it just using the brake pedal. When I first had the car I tried stopping, switching off the HA but it still needs a press on the throttle to disengage it and move forward. Moving around in confined spaces is much better without HA than with HA, certainly with an s-tronic.

There is also the question I have mentioned before about HA keeping the brake lights on. I know a lot of drivers don't care about their brake lights shining in the face of other drivers, but personally I do and I don't want to be the car in front of anybody with my brake lights on when I'm stopped for more than a very short time. I used to dislike it when drivers of automatics in particular were too lazy to put the car in to neutral when stopped at lights etc and I said that if ever I was to drive an auto it is something I would never do. This is another reason why I personally prefer to the the EPB rather than HA. Even at my age I can still manage to click the EPB switch without any problem.
 

h5djr

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Gold Supporter
Too many Assists on an Audi.



Hill Assist
Hold Assist
Park Assist
Lame Assist
Hold Assist
Parallel Park Assist
Bay Park Assist
Call Assist
Hearing Assist
Vision Assist
Side Assist
Steer Assist
High Bream Assist
Perch Assist
Light Assist
Seat Assist
RAC Assist
Drive Assist
Stop Assist
Go Assist
Clutch Assist
Breath Assist
..............

You forgot the most important one which I think Audi may still be working on - Brain Assist.
 

Martinbanshee

Registered User
What's the problem here? Turn it off if the manoeuvre requires it, leave it on the rest of the time, it's so easy to do. It's weird though, Aberdeen has got plenty of hills and HA has never, ever got in the way of me turning, reversing, pulling away, you name it. What are you doing?
HA releases when reversing as well as going forward, how can it get in the way?
If you don't try and drive an S-Tronic/Hold Assist car like a fully manual car you might get on a bit better ;)
Seems to me the car is just too complicated for some people
 

veeeight

I am a very pretty girl
VCDS Map User
Too much delay with Hold Assist ;)

Too much lurch with Hold Assist ;)

Too much Jerk with Hold Assist ;)

Plus it burns out the retinas of the driver behind :)


Klunk Klick every trip.
Wait, that's something else ;)
 

h5djr

Registered User
VCDS Map User
Gold Supporter
Personally I've managed perfectly well getting my s-tronic car to do exactly what I want it to do for the past 11 years and most of the time without the need for 'assistance' packages. Apart from the usual steering assistance, servo braking, ABS, ASR, ESP, EDL together with light and rain sensors which have been on the A3 for many years. I do also quite like the EPB and being able to drive away without having to release it. ACC is quite useful in traffic queues and through 'average speed camera' zones but I never use on normal roads. All the other options I have with my own car are more related to comfort like heated and electric seats and climate control, although I do have a rear-view camera which can make parking in confined spaces easier. But to me Hold Assist is a step too far. I much prefer to drive without it and not have my brake lights on when I'm stopped and it's not necessary. If others like using it that's up to them, although I will still flash my headlights if I'm stopped behind them at night and their brake lights are shining in my face!!

I also much prefer to drive my s-tronic in manual rather than auto mode because I like to make the decisions about which gear to be in and the s-tronic allows me to do this without having to play with a clutch pedal. Clicking the paddle to change up when accelerating still bring a smile to my face. But to me Hold Assist is a step too far. I much prefer to drive without it and not have my brake lights on when I'm stopped and it's not necessary.
 

a3_phil

Registered User
If others like using it that's up to them, although I will still flash my headlights if I'm stopped behind them at night and their brake lights are shining in my face!!

What outcome are you expecting from this behaviour?
 

veeeight

I am a very pretty girl
VCDS Map User

h5djr

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What outcome are you expecting from this behaviour?
Quite often they realise their brake lights are on and take their foot off the brake and put their hand-brake on. Works most times.
 

Martinbanshee

Registered User
Until you do it to the wrong person
 

Blackwhite

Registered User
Too many Assists on an Audi.



Hill Assist
Hold Assist
Park Assist
Lame Assist
Hold Assist
Parallel Park Assist
Bay Park Assist
Call Assist
Hearing Assist
Vision Assist
Side Assist
Steer Assist
High Bream Assist
Perch Assist
Light Assist
Seat Assist
RAC Assist
Drive Assist
Stop Assist
Go Assist
Clutch Assist
Breath Assist
..............

I agree there are too many assists. :confused:

Pretty soon they will have a Drive-Thru Assist ( McDonald's )
and a Bathroom Assist! :flush:
 

Martinbanshee

Registered User
Every day I drive my work van without ACC, S-Tronic, EPB, HA, etc I wish I was in my car, it's like 1979 all over again
 

h5djr

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VCDS Map User
Gold Supporter
Until you do it to the wrong person

Just a quick flash of the headlights, nothing more. No one has ever taken offence in 50 years of driving. Much the same as a quick flash of the lights if someone comes in the opposite direction with their headlights on main beam, or if it's dark and someone has forgotten to switch their light on or a quick flash as a request for someone to change lanes and let me past. All of these are normally taken in the way they are meant. Anyone offended by them should NOT be driving!
 

h5djr

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Every day I drive my work van without ACC, S-Tronic, EPB, HA, etc I wish I was in my car, it's like 1979 all over again

What colour is your works van?
 

a3_phil

Registered User
Quite often they realise their brake lights are on and take their foot off the brake and put their hand-brake on. Works most times.

Fair enough, but I've never once been flashed for that before and if someone did it to me I probably wouldn't have a clue why they were flashing me.

Unless I spotted they were in a silver 8V A3 sportback of course...
 

h5djr

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Fair enough, but I've never once been flashed for that before and if someone did it to me I probably wouldn't have a clue why they were flashing me.

Unless I spotted they were in a silver 8V A3 sportback of course...

Obviously some drivers are more aware of the recommendations in the Highway Code (Section 114) than others and perhaps were taught to drive when consideration towards other drivers was mentioned by the instructors..;)

If I come up behind an A3 SB 184 TDI in Daytona Grey I'll flash my lights four or five times just in case it's you so that you will know it's just me behind you!!
 
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Symon

Registered User
I'm the same- I would just think "what are they flashing me for!?" Also- if my brake lights are dazzling somebody then they shouldn't be on the road. If somebody finds my persistent brake light irritating then they need to take life less seriously. I can't think of a time I've ever thought "gosh I wish that guy would just use his handbrake".
 

Pulp84

Registered User
As expected - another HA thread that probably should have stopped 10 posts a go o_O

Deja vu my friends..........Deja vu.
 

Martinbanshee

Registered User
If somebody finds my persistent brake light irritating then they need to take life less seriously. I can't think of a time I've ever thought "gosh I wish that guy would just use his handbrake".

Or more importantly, they should have an eye test if it causes that much discomfort.
 

h5djr

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Gold Supporter
Or more importantly, they should have an eye test if it causes that much discomfort.

Not so much discomfort as irritated by the complete laziness of the drive in front. The Highway Code recognises the problem and says that applying the handbrake "will minimise the glare to road users behind". Not so much of a problem during that day but more so at night. I was taught to do this in consideration for the driver behind. Old fashion courtesy.
 

Martinbanshee

Registered User
Can't argue with that
 

veeeight

I am a very pretty girl
VCDS Map User
Deja Vu :)
 

Symon

Registered User
Not so much discomfort as irritated by the complete laziness of the drive in front. The Highway Code recognises the problem and says that applying the handbrake "will minimise the glare to road users behind". Not so much of a problem during that day but more so at night. I was taught to do this in consideration for the driver behind. Old fashion courtesy.

Don't drive so close- less likely to have an accident. That's probably in the Highway Code somewhere. You take six, I'll take half a dozen and we'll call it square.
 

veeeight

I am a very pretty girl
VCDS Map User
Deja Vu from a previous thread:


Not dazzling the driver behind with bright brake lights, falls under 2 categories:

1. Consideration
2. Good Practice/Advisory

Agreed that if you are the last in the long line of traffic, its sensible to keep your brake lights on until someone else draws up behind.

The wording in the Highway Code is "should" (as opposed to "must") - which is where the good practice/advisory comes in. It is good practice, but because its mentioned as a "should" in the highway code, means, that if it were to be shown as a contributory factor in an incident, you could be prosecuted for it (under a relevant Act),

eg: You "should" not cross/enter hatched area bordered by a broken white line - it's legal to do so, but, if it can be shown that it is a contributory factor in an incident, you can be prosecuted. On the other hand, you "must" not cross/enter a hatched area bordered by a solid white line.

But just because you personally aren't affected by dazzling bright brake lights - it doesn't mean that everyone else isn't ;)

As you get older, macular degeneration sets in, and cataracts, and these conditions make you much more susceptible to starbursts, halos and glare in your eyesight, particularly in night vision. :)



We've had 3 pages of this already, in this thread ;)
http://www.audi-sport.net/xf/threads/hold-assist-and-brake-lights.209289/
 

veeeight

I am a very pretty girl
VCDS Map User
Highway Code

114
You MUST NOT


use any lights in a way which would dazzle or cause discomfort to other road users, including pedestrians, cyclists and horse riders
use front or rear fog lights unless visibility is seriously reduced. You MUST switch them off when visibility improves to avoid dazzling other road users (see Rule 226).

In stationary queues of traffic, drivers should apply the parking brake and, once the following traffic has stopped, take their foot off the footbrake to deactivate the vehicle brake lights. This will minimise glare to road users behind until the traffic moves again.
Law RVLR reg 27

https://www.gov.uk/general-rules-all-drivers-riders-103-to-158/lighting-requirements-113-to-116
 
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