I think I’d have been much more contemplative if it had been a purchase. But for a lease, when the vast majority of my mileage actually quite suits diesel, I find myself not displeased, if that makes sense? Quite happy, in fact: better economy and an even better financial deal. If I was purchasing and made lots of short journeys, I’d probably have a very different view!
Have you heard the S4/S5 rumour...
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Just out of interest what is your deal? As I class mine as a good deal and want to compare
That must have been for a pre-WLTP car though. My S4 order got caught up in a dealer queue and, long story short, I’m going to get a post WLTP car which happens now to be a diesel!
So it might be difficult to compare like for like as I optioned metallic paint, mirrors (now standard) and VCP (likely to be standard on the new S4) - on which note, I’m likely to get some form of rebate for the mirrors and VCP. And it’s for 11000 miles p.a..
But it’s around £374 on a 6+23.
Yeah there isn't muxh much in it, I'm daytona grey, VC And extended interior lighting and I'm 3k deposit 280x23 on 10k
I think we'll have to hear from autocar on any verified reports from journalists to actually confirm this.
Doesn't make sense to drop the petrol but I understand the emissions..
The positive for me is Im upgrading to an a7 soon but not happy with the current engine choices so a sporting diesel will be perfect for me.
Rs7 new shape will obv be way out of my budget..
Doesn't make sense to drop the petrol but I understand the emissions..
The positive for me is Im upgrading to an a7 soon but not happy with the current engine choices so a sporting diesel will be perfect for me.
Rs7 new shape will obv be way out of my budget..
Thundercliffe81
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For a while. But they'll drop. I don't go for new cars anymore. All the cars I'd love will depreciate and fall into my sticky web eventually
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For a while. But they'll drop. I don't go for new cars anymore. All the cars I'd love will depreciate and fall into my sticky web eventually
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I know what you mean about new cars, I specced a 50tdi a7 up to 80k on the vorsprung edition.
Actually has every option ud ever want but can only imagine what the monthlies would be..
Thundercliffe81
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It's a cliche. But autotrader, £80k max and blow your mind...
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Shock, horror, Audi's become expensive the more options you add ;-)
Thundercliffe81
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Oh come on now...you know I know that! Haha. I'm not biting.
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There's no way that RS/S models are going diesel when only a couple of years back the SQ5 went from Diesel to petrol. Given that S cars are pretty much identical to other cars in the range apart from a few visual tweaks, there would be no point marketing these as diesel cars when you can already buy a diesel S-Line/Black Edition with similar styling and a large outputs. Add to this that NO ONE who is in the market for an RS car will buy a diesel AND the recent diesel scandal AND that none of the motoring press has even mentioned what would be a monumental shift in, and not to mention incredibly foolish strategy by Audi.
Short version = other than the possibility of the SUVs it is not going to happen.
Short version = other than the possibility of the SUVs it is not going to happen.
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I shall only believe that the next S4/5 will be a diesel if it turns out that the 3.0TFSI cannot meet the new regulations. Audi have invested a lot in this engine (and I think its also used in some Porsche models?) and so if it can meet the regs then surely they will keep it going for a few more years. Then surely the next model will be electric or hybrid.
Fortunately I don't care anyway. I'm hoping my next car will be electric, maybe a Tesla 3...
Fortunately I don't care anyway. I'm hoping my next car will be electric, maybe a Tesla 3...
Thundercliffe81
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Thundercliffe81
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Yeah it's believable. We're just so close to the mid size segment having a fully fledged EV range, it would make sense to start making the cars in it already...less desirable to its current customer base? In the interim, Diesel fans could get quite a fun car! It would definitely be a temporary, less than ideal solution to the TFSI not meeting standards though.
Hard to see/comprehend them pouring more money into another petrol V6 for the B10 platform. Hence why I just don't see there 'being' a B10.
Is the market ready to welcome the Etron SUV in place of the A4? 4 years probably.
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Thundercliffe81
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If the 3.0 doesn’t meet, they could chuck in a detuned 2.7 from RS
That's cheating! But I wanna see it
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Has your dealer hundred percent confirmed that your s4 is going to be diesel? Or is this a last resort of some kind if it turns out they can't get the current s4 through the emissions testing?
And when does he expect you to receive delivery?
Also which leasing company did you go for? I did a pcp on my car but I'm seeing much lower monthly payments on lease deals just not that knowledgeable on the main differences benefits of the lease as opposed to the pcp
The current S4 has passed the current wltp tests otherwise you'd not be able to order one. Unless the tests change yet again I cannot see why they'd drop the petrol version..
It's NOT 100 percent but the very strong hint was as described - to the point of me being pretty confident it'll be as described. In other words, I wasn't sensing either a guess or BS but, instead, insider knowledge.
Delivery is simply not known other than it won't be before April. So that'll be at least 12 months between order and delivery!
It's through VWFS direct (via my dealer).
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I ordered back in April when I was expecting to get the current petrol S4 but various delays, including WLTP, mean I missed that boat. But since the finance had been agreed, VWFS committed to honouring the deal for an S4 with price protection.
FYI...
The RS4/5 engine is a 2.9 biturbo. The S4/5 is a 3.0 turbo. Reduction in volume is to do with tolerances Both engines were developed by Porsche and the 2.9 features in the Panamera 4S. Orders for this car and a number of other Porsche models are currently also on hold.
No reports of Porsche sale men telling their customers they need to buy the diesel version so far...
The closure of orderbooks on these cars are because the red tape that is in place for WLTP is taking months rather than weeks. @Zippytoo your dealer may have taken an order from you but Audi has not (or they did and cancelled it). They’re now sowing FUD based on rumours and speculation. Don’t expect a build slot any time soon. It is currently impossible for any dealer to place an order for an S4 with the factory.
The RS4/5 engine is a 2.9 biturbo. The S4/5 is a 3.0 turbo. Reduction in volume is to do with tolerances Both engines were developed by Porsche and the 2.9 features in the Panamera 4S. Orders for this car and a number of other Porsche models are currently also on hold.
No reports of Porsche sale men telling their customers they need to buy the diesel version so far...
The closure of orderbooks on these cars are because the red tape that is in place for WLTP is taking months rather than weeks. @Zippytoo your dealer may have taken an order from you but Audi has not (or they did and cancelled it). They’re now sowing FUD based on rumours and speculation. Don’t expect a build slot any time soon. It is currently impossible for any dealer to place an order for an S4 with the factory.
I'm certainly not expecting a build slot anytime soon - that was quite clear from the dealer and I'd not be surprised if it's not before the summer. I have an Audi order number.
I’d call Audi UK , quote it and ask what the status of your order is.
Pending means your order is in the system but nothing more. Which means yours must have been one if the last in the system before they stopped accepting orders.
Word on the street is that orders won’t reopen till at least the summer. Also there were reports in the last 12 months that Audi were developing new engine management software on the S4/S5 to deal with the new emissions requirements, so it should already be compliant. I know the 2.9 already is. Most likely just the testing itself that’s holding things up.
Rest assured, if you do get one it won’t be a diesel!
Ta! I guess I'm at the point where, since it's a lease car, I'm not really that fussed whether it's a petrol or a diesel so long as I get it (eventually!).
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Any compensation offered or something to sweeten the wait?
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Not yet, without a date. That said, I had to extend my VWFS Golf R (and will probably have to do so again), necessitating an additional service - in lieu of which I've been offered by VWFS a free first service on the S4.
It will be petrol, if Audi had suddenly swopped over the S4 to diesel we'd know about it.
The issue is complicated:
1) Right now Diesel is regarded as the bad boy, with nitrous oxides being to blame - these things go in cycles, some of us older contributors will be able to recall when leaded petrol was really bad news and diesel looked so much better. The manufacturers threw all their efforts into making diesel engines that were fun to drive, comparable with petrol versions. As time would show, catalytic converters, unleaded fuel, direct injection, smaller capacities making the same power outputs using Turbos and Superchargers have become mainstream - lots of the tech being found in diesels too.
2) The manufacturers had got so far down the road with diesel that the petrol engine technology development rate was slower in comparison. The manufacturers then got a multiple hits of bad news in the global markets:
- 'Diesel gate' VW were the first to get caught (so that's Audi/VW/Seat/Skoda/Porsche), followed by other's getting caught - no surprise as there only a handful of fuel injection/ECU OEMs.
- slowing of the global economy
- Nitrous oxide output becomes headline news, direct links to death rates
- The cost differential between the production yields of Diesel vs Petrol (roughly speaking for every barrel of oil the refineries get 19-20 gallons of petrol or 12 gallons of diesel). The gap between diesel and petrol prices is increasing not helped by more aggressive taxation.
3) The manufacturers have more diesel engine options than petrol - the rule in sales is to always sell what you have today rather than what you would like to have tomorrow. So the importers and dealers have to spin 'the Diesel has a future' message because that's what they have to sell right now. Petrol alternatives would be good but most manufacturers have fewer options here due to a different R&D spend focus. This overshadowed by the fact that internal combustion engines of either fuel type are environmentally poor - EVs ought to be the right way forward.
4) There is/was a hope that EVs would be more mainstream than they are now - it's simply not happening fast enough.
So there is no 'right' answer - however diesel is dying and petrol engines won't be far behind. Porsche have already announced that there will be no more new diesel models, the new WLTP regulations are laying the brutal truth that we have all known for years bare - none of the modern cars are fuel efficient and that had to mean the environmental impact was in there too.
If you check the Audi web site out carefully some of the higher performance models have just plain disappeared...no RS4 and no SQ5 for example.
1) Right now Diesel is regarded as the bad boy, with nitrous oxides being to blame - these things go in cycles, some of us older contributors will be able to recall when leaded petrol was really bad news and diesel looked so much better. The manufacturers threw all their efforts into making diesel engines that were fun to drive, comparable with petrol versions. As time would show, catalytic converters, unleaded fuel, direct injection, smaller capacities making the same power outputs using Turbos and Superchargers have become mainstream - lots of the tech being found in diesels too.
2) The manufacturers had got so far down the road with diesel that the petrol engine technology development rate was slower in comparison. The manufacturers then got a multiple hits of bad news in the global markets:
- 'Diesel gate' VW were the first to get caught (so that's Audi/VW/Seat/Skoda/Porsche), followed by other's getting caught - no surprise as there only a handful of fuel injection/ECU OEMs.
- slowing of the global economy
- Nitrous oxide output becomes headline news, direct links to death rates
- The cost differential between the production yields of Diesel vs Petrol (roughly speaking for every barrel of oil the refineries get 19-20 gallons of petrol or 12 gallons of diesel). The gap between diesel and petrol prices is increasing not helped by more aggressive taxation.
3) The manufacturers have more diesel engine options than petrol - the rule in sales is to always sell what you have today rather than what you would like to have tomorrow. So the importers and dealers have to spin 'the Diesel has a future' message because that's what they have to sell right now. Petrol alternatives would be good but most manufacturers have fewer options here due to a different R&D spend focus. This overshadowed by the fact that internal combustion engines of either fuel type are environmentally poor - EVs ought to be the right way forward.
4) There is/was a hope that EVs would be more mainstream than they are now - it's simply not happening fast enough.
So there is no 'right' answer - however diesel is dying and petrol engines won't be far behind. Porsche have already announced that there will be no more new diesel models, the new WLTP regulations are laying the brutal truth that we have all known for years bare - none of the modern cars are fuel efficient and that had to mean the environmental impact was in there too.
If you check the Audi web site out carefully some of the higher performance models have just plain disappeared...no RS4 and no SQ5 for example.
Tough balance. But I just can't see Diesel being the answer for the S models. I would imagine that every manufacture is looking at what engine solutions can be used to get them out of the spot they are currently in, but in general Diesel is being vilified and there won't be much space for it bouncing back in the short term.
Personally I came from a 335d and love the S4 engine so much more. Horses for courses, but a big fat lump of torque up to 4k revs is not my idea of fun, or an interactive and exciting drive. We'll just have to wait and see. But with Merc pushing the 35, 43 & 53 engines (let alone the 63!) then I think Audi might get a spanking on new car sales in the segment...
Personally I came from a 335d and love the S4 engine so much more. Horses for courses, but a big fat lump of torque up to 4k revs is not my idea of fun, or an interactive and exciting drive. We'll just have to wait and see. But with Merc pushing the 35, 43 & 53 engines (let alone the 63!) then I think Audi might get a spanking on new car sales in the segment...
Originally found the deal on national vehicle solutions as it was there deal of the day, took the quote into my local audi and they matched the deal, so it also meant I didn't pay the admin fee
Please please Gents., this is ALL absolutely FALSE. Don't give it another thought.
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