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Has anyone added a subwoofer or amplifier to their 8v?

teamspb May 10, 2018

  1. teamspb

    teamspb Member

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    Hey guys,

    Just wondering if anyone here has added a subwoofer to the 8v? Specifically the standard systems and not the B&W or any of the OEM amplified systems?

    Interested to see what methods you generally use to integrate with the OEM kit

    Nice one
     
  2. Schizophonic

    Schizophonic Well-Known Member

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    Its been discussed a number of times but if you search it will cover most of the questions you might have.

    Yes if you got the basic sound system on a PFL, you can you add a ASS sub to the boot, code in your MIB (within limit) to active the MIB's output for sub and center speaker pin and off you go.

    I still have a ASS sub that I need to sell. Interested?
     
  3. Gazwould

    Gazwould Well-Known Member

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  4. teamspb

    teamspb Member

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    No not after a subwoofer, just wondered how people are doing it...I have helped lots of people used simpler and easier methods of OEM integration in the past, so wondered if it was a big thing in the Audi world...

    Me myself, will be using OEM integration with the stock system that doesnt require any cutting into the original loom etc...will be amping a set of 3-way front components, and additional amplifier for the subwoofer or subwoofers, not decided how many yet...

    I know lots of people splice into the looms etc, which is fine, but im one that doesnt like to cut into OEM looms if it can be avoided
     
  5. DJAlix

    DJAlix VAG Car Coding Site Sponsor Team Ibis VAG Can Professional VCDS Map User Gold Supporter quattro ODIS (Offboard Diagnostic System)

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    Retrofitting the Audi Sound System Sub, and centre, is one of my most popular retrofits at a rate of 2 to 3 a week. Totally OEM with no splicing as all factory parts are used.

    The internal amps on the basic MMI units can have their additional outputs activated and an additional tone control added in order to connect 3rd party items also, again no need for splicing.
     
    T-800 likes this.
  6. Dunedin

    Dunedin Member TFSI Owners Group Audi A3 S-line owners group

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    How much would this cost @DJAlix ,
    How far north do you travel?
     
  7. DJAlix

    DJAlix VAG Car Coding Site Sponsor Team Ibis VAG Can Professional VCDS Map User Gold Supporter quattro ODIS (Offboard Diagnostic System)

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    Can you fire me a message via:

    https://www.vagcarcoding.com/contact_us/

    Don’t really travel to be honest, only when attending events or when working on large scale projects.
     
  8. Dunedin

    Dunedin Member TFSI Owners Group Audi A3 S-line owners group

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    I've sent you a message @DJAlix .
     
  9. BillyGiann

    BillyGiann New Member

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    There are a couple of solutions for OEM integration, offering also loom extensions, so no need for cutting.

    I have an Audison AP 4.9 bit amp/dsp for example, to actively drive front mids and tweeters and feed an extra amp for subwoofer.
    Apart from the dsp, a nice feature is the auto turn-on from speaker signal
     
  10. cuke2u

    cuke2u Well-Known Member TFSI Owners Group saloon Audi A4 S-line owners group

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    When you say additional tone control do you mean the subwoofer setting in the MMI can be enabled? Mine is missing this setting as it is a earlier firmware version and later ones had this.
     
  11. Schizophonic

    Schizophonic Well-Known Member

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    You still own a a3?
    On my PFL 8v, my car from factory had the stand sound system, I retrofitted the ASS sub with @DJAlix and he parametrised my MIB with the new subwoofer and centre speak erdial on the sound settings (i never got around to installing the centre speaker)
    We originally tried to just code it in via VCDS but it was a more involved job for Alix and the software side.

    As to your question, later MIBs never would have had it, it would depend how your car came out from the factory and what sound system it had with it.

    Now on my brothers A4 (2017) hes got the ASS and doesn't have the Sub dial in his MIB.
     
  12. cuke2u

    cuke2u Well-Known Member TFSI Owners Group saloon Audi A4 S-line owners group

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    As in my sig, I guess I have hijacked this thread andnow for a fact that Audi put back in the subwoofer settings in later firmware. I was just asking DJAlix about clarifying the additional tone control he mentioned in his post...
     
    DJAlix likes this.
  13. DJAlix

    DJAlix VAG Car Coding Site Sponsor Team Ibis VAG Can Professional VCDS Map User Gold Supporter quattro ODIS (Offboard Diagnostic System)

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    The tone control in question is the Subwoofer volume. Here is an example from a retrofit I completed yesterday:

    Before
    IMG_0381.jpg

    After
    IMG_0385.jpg
     
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  14. cuke2u

    cuke2u Well-Known Member TFSI Owners Group saloon Audi A4 S-line owners group

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    So you update the mmi firmware, can this be done to a A4?
     
  15. DJAlix

    DJAlix VAG Car Coding Site Sponsor Team Ibis VAG Can Professional VCDS Map User Gold Supporter quattro ODIS (Offboard Diagnostic System)

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    I effectively edit the units existing firmware.
     
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  16. cuke2u

    cuke2u Well-Known Member TFSI Owners Group saloon Audi A4 S-line owners group

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    I see...
     
  17. teamspb

    teamspb Member

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    Appears most people like to go OEM coding route...ill be doing things a bit differently with OEM integration and keeping the stock headunit, but upgrading everything else, yet not cutting any cables etc so everything is reversible to put back to stock if ever needsbe
     
  18. DJAlix

    DJAlix VAG Car Coding Site Sponsor Team Ibis VAG Can Professional VCDS Map User Gold Supporter quattro ODIS (Offboard Diagnostic System)

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    You keep mentioning “not cutting cables”. The OEM solution does not invlove this, in fact it’s just about the most non-destructive installation you can get.
     
  19. teamspb

    teamspb Member

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    A stock subwoofer or anything Audi offer as OEM is never enough for an audiophile unfortunately
     
  20. DJAlix

    DJAlix VAG Car Coding Site Sponsor Team Ibis VAG Can Professional VCDS Map User Gold Supporter quattro ODIS (Offboard Diagnostic System)

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    Understood, but I was talking about your not wanting to cut / slice cables.
     
  21. teamspb

    teamspb Member

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    I see, I think we are looking at two different approaches...generally when OEM integrating, lots of people splice into the rear speaker cables, or lose the rear speakers altogether, I'll use looms that take away the need to splice into anything, and also takes away the need to run extra speaker cables into the door etc.

    This was more of a post to see how people are adding aftermarket audio equipment into their Audi's just like we will be doing

    I fully agree...someone who wants OEM and is happy with the Audi sound, then coding and your method is certainly the way forward....but in my line of business...that just doesnt cut it lol
     
  22. BillyGiann

    BillyGiann New Member

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    billp25 likes this.
  23. DJAlix

    DJAlix VAG Car Coding Site Sponsor Team Ibis VAG Can Professional VCDS Map User Gold Supporter quattro ODIS (Offboard Diagnostic System)

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    Agreed on all counts, however what most ICE installers don't understand is that the stock outputs on the back of the internal amp can be activated via coding in order to make for a better installation and retain OEM onscreen controls. Yes other speakers will need to be split out by way of looms or splicing etc etc but instead of tapping a speaker and adding a cross over in order to connect an amp to drive a sub for example is not needed when you can just code the subwoofer channel and connect your amp direct and thus making for a more tidy and cost effective install, while doing away with the need for an external bass controller as the MMI tone control will work.
     
  24. DJAlix

    DJAlix VAG Car Coding Site Sponsor Team Ibis VAG Can Professional VCDS Map User Gold Supporter quattro ODIS (Offboard Diagnostic System)

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  25. teamspb

    teamspb Member

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    Valid point, do you know if this subwoofer out on the headunit will give you a full range signal or a filtered signal?

    In my case, the output needs to be full range as it will be going straight into an amp with DSP on board, then the amp itself will send the relative signals to the relevant speakers etc
     
  26. DJAlix

    DJAlix VAG Car Coding Site Sponsor Team Ibis VAG Can Professional VCDS Map User Gold Supporter quattro ODIS (Offboard Diagnostic System)

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    Well the Subwoofer output is there is output Bass / Low end signals only so not sure why you would be wanting to connect a full range speaker to that particular output. When activating this output the related frequencies are no longer passed to the vehicles "old" bass speakers, the ones in the door cards. The Front centre will be mid and treble frequencies but not exclusively as it will share these duties with the vehicles other mid range and treble speakers.
     
  27. teamspb

    teamspb Member

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    See, this is why this wont work in my particular application...

    My DSP requires a full range signal, im not simply adding a subwoofer and calling it a day...if this was the case, I would be booked in with you and getting the subwoofer output enabled on the MMI lol

    What DSP's require are a full range signal, they need to see the whole frequency bandwidth...once it sees this, it can split up the frequencies as required - send 4khz upwards to tweeters, send 150hz - 2khz to the midrange, send 50hz - 120hz to the midbass, and 50hz and below to the subwoofer. This signal can also be EQ'd flat, and tailored to meet your musical taste (ie if you like a flat neutral sound, or you like it crystal and sparkinling on the top end, if theres too much mid you can remove it etc), as well as time aligned, phase shifted, and filtered

    What I am interested in trying though, is using the front speaker inputs in to the DSP, for my full range signal for front and rear channels from the DSP, and then use the subwoofer high level outputs from the headunits to feed into my DSP to feed the sub...however this then throws up an issue if the signal is filtered which is usually is below 30hz or so which isnt low enough lol...

    This way, we will be able to use your coding, retain the stock subwoofer control on the headunit, and still add all the external amps in the world and uprate everything...but if the signal is filtered, then it will be a no go. From all of our previous cars and installs, the stock headunit filters the signal on the bottom end

    Worst case we need to add a RCD controller which isnt the end of the world and would look pretty smart too
     
  28. DJAlix

    DJAlix VAG Car Coding Site Sponsor Team Ibis VAG Can Professional VCDS Map User Gold Supporter quattro ODIS (Offboard Diagnostic System)

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    Understand fully. Not many people know this but I am, well was, a professional sound engineer for 20 years of my life :)

    You have a problem then, because none of the standard MMI unit outputs are truly full range. Only way to get where you are wanting to go, and to make the most of your "spend", would be to activate the external fiberoptic output, if you have a unit equipped with one, and bypass the internal amp all together.
     
  29. teamspb

    teamspb Member

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    Thats awesome Alix, good to talk to someone who has good experience too! I myself have been in the audio game for the last 20 or so years and have built some of the most insane audio vehicles in the UK...its my hobby and also my profession luckily

    Thats my fear, from what I can gather, the stock Audi system does filter to some extent...but listening to some of my usual music, it seems to play most if not all the frequencies through the stock speakers...which is making me wonder if the original base spec stereo (which I believe has no external amplification or processing), does give more of a full range signal than any of the higher specc'd units (unless we are talking fibre of course)

    Looking around the boot for external amplification etc, there isnt anything I can find (although I havent looked too deep to be honest), and the headunit doesnt have any output setting for subwoofer etc...hence I have always believed its a basic setup in there at the moment...albeit, it does sound very good for stock! To know whether ours has fiber output, is it a matter of having to remove the brain in the glovebox and looking behind there?

    One BIG annoyance I have with the stock system is the volume limits...which is another reason I want to get cracking with my audio build lol

    Not sure if you have ever looked into it much, but I have heard instances where people have used the MoBridge units to get an optical input, have lost their bluetooth mics?
     
  30. billp25

    billp25 New Member

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    I have a 2017 A3 Sedan/Saloon which came with ASS and no subwoofer control. The sound was very boring and flat. I got tired of waiting for Audi to update the MMI firmware to give me control of the subwoofer so I picked up a Pioneer TS-SW2002D2 subwoofer and an amp with speaker-level (high-level) inputs and a remote bass control. I just used the existing wires from the factory sub.

    Its probably not the most powerful subwoofer in town but WOW what a difference it made. Trunk space is a priority for me so I wanted a shallow-mount sub which would work in a free-air/IB setup (meaning, not in a box). I would probably be happier with the sound if I had a beefier sub in a box but it sounds pretty darn good as is, and it only sticks down about 1 inch below the rear deck so it doesn't eat up my trunk space.

    I'd be very interested in a part number for the Parrot loom mentioned above. I've searched around and haven't been able to find it. I guess the Audison one should work also, so thanks for that link! I've got some quite nice Focal
    speakers along with an amp/DSP combo for the doors that I was planning to put in at the same time as my sub install, but the sub by itself has made such an improvement that upgrading the rest has become less of a priority.

    If anyone is considering going the same route I did, I'd be happy to share more details about my setup, as this was very much a learning experience for me.
     
  31. teamspb

    teamspb Member

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    There are a fair few wiring harnesses - Helix, Gladen Audio, make them too

    Ill be using the Gladen and the Helix options mixed together to give me RCA ends on the amp side, and all the speaker outputs to utilize the OEM speaker cables in the doors for all my aftermarket bits
     
  32. cuke2u

    cuke2u Well-Known Member TFSI Owners Group saloon Audi A4 S-line owners group

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    To be honest those who have the subwoofer control added in the mmi have stated it made little diffference to the overall sound. What you have done is a step further...
     

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