Experience of handing a car back at the end of a PCP?

[sunscreemer]

Hi, has anyone much experience of handing a car back at the end of their term? How "picky" are the dealerships? Normal wear and tear and mileage in line with the agreement are assumed, but for example do they look to bill you for every stone chip and minor scratch (which I would see as wear and tear)? I'll likely be closer to 44,000 miles than the contracted 40,000 miles, do they insist on billing you for a few thousand miles over or do they only apply it if it's a far more significant difference?

Part-ex valuations at present are coming in far lower than the outstanding finance and therefore it's looking like the MGFV is very 'optimistic' so unfortunately handing the vehicle back is looking like the best option. Other than that I could buy it out but feel I would be wasting my money if i'm paying about £2k more than the market value.

 

[cuke2u]

Why not hand the car over to a dealership and just get them pay off the finance and they sell the car themselves and you go for a new one? This is what I do then you're not penalised in any way..

 

[sunscreemer]

Why not hand the car over to a dealership and just get them pay off the finance and they sell the car themselves and you go for a new one? This is what I do then you're not penalised in any way..

I've done that in the past, but i've been offered an estimate of £17k part-ex in April and the outstanding finance at that time will be £18.8k.

 

[NevMan]

That is odd that your outstanding can be so much higher than p/x, if you are coming to end of term, or are you looking to hand back halfway through deal? GFV is guaranteed so they will have to give you that for the car (which would settle), unless you are trying to end early.

 

[sunscreemer]

That is odd that your outstanding can be so much higher than p/x, if you are coming to end of term, or are you looking to hand back halfway through deal? GFV is guaranteed so they will have to give you that for the car (which would settle), unless you are trying to end early.

Non-Audi dealers I expected to offer me a lower part-ex but it was the fact that Audi themselves are not keen to offer me a part-ex equal to or higher then the outstanding finance at this stage (i'm less than 12 months away from the end of a 4 year PCP) that surprised me as I thought they'd be keen to get me into a new deal.

This is why i'm wondering if i choose to hand it back at the end of August are Audi going to insist on clawing back more cash from me for minor damage and mileage excess if they believe the value is less than the MGFV (which annoys me as I think the forecourt price is higher than the outstanding balance).

 

[NevMan]

that is surprising, as you would have thought less than 12 months from end of pcp, there would be some equity.
Have to shopped around dealer-wise? And equally, some other marques would possibly be very keen to get you across.

Would imagine if you did hand back at end, you would have to pay the excess mileage, but if car is in general good condition, all should be ok.

 

[sunscreemer]

that is surprising, as you would have thought less than 12 months from end of pcp, there would be some equity.
Have to shopped around dealer-wise? And equally, some other marques would possibly be very keen to get you across.

Would imagine if you did hand back at end, you would have to pay the excess mileage, but if car is in general good condition, all should be ok.

Yes, I was led to believe that when I entered the last 12 months of the deal i'd be in equity. Rough figures:
O/S finance currently ~£22.5k
Parkers p/ex estimate for a base model, no extras roughly £19.5k
Audi p/ex offer ~£18k
Mercedes p/ex offer ~£17k (but estimated for in April when the O/S finance will be just under £19k)

Based on the above i'd thought i'd be roughly at parity (which i did before going to dealers so i wouldn't get my hopes up at not having much equity) - so to find out i'm about £2k in negative equity was a shock!

Excess mileage charge would be less than £300 so i'd be pretty ****** off if Audi charged me that if i handed it back, especially as there isn't the promised "equity towards the deposit on my next Audi"!

 

[AlS3BE]

I looked through this as part of my options when I changed cars a few years ago.
Excess mileage will have to be paid if you are ending the agreement. This is really to stop people buying a car and using it as mini cab then handing it back with 200k and all the took was a 10k per year pcp.
As for the damage there is a guide on the BCA website that shows what is acceptable wear and tear and what isn’t. I.e stone chips can’t be more than 3mm or 5mm in size. No tears in the upholstery or excessive wear through. Alloys can have kerb damage but like stone chips it has size limit. There’s a whole heap of criteria.
At the end of term you don’t hand it back to dealer. It will most likely go to auction with BCA.

 

[sunscreemer]

Yes, I was led to believe that when I entered the last 12 months of the deal i'd be in equity. Rough figures:
O/S finance currently ~£22.5k
Parkers p/ex estimate for a base model, no extras roughly £19.5k
Audi p/ex offer ~£18k
Mercedes p/ex offer ~£17k (but estimated for in April when the O/S finance will be just under £19k)

Based on the above i'd thought i'd be roughly at parity (which i did before going to dealers so i wouldn't get my hopes up at not having much equity) - so to find out i'm about £2k in negative equity was a shock!

Excess mileage charge would be less than £300 so i'd be pretty ****** off if Audi charged me that if i handed it back, especially as there isn't the promised "equity towards the deposit on my next Audi"!

Further to the above, this is my second Audi with a BMW in-between. At the time BMW offered a lower p/x on my first Audi than Audi did but in an attempt to do a deal rang around to pre-sell my part-ex to get a better value. Great service.

 

[Sparks43]

The problem I had with my change to my current car was that the Audi dealer I was using were using British Car Auction prices to value my car which was 2 years old with 15,000 miles on it - Purchased from that dealer with a new one on order - Even using their website valuation showed it as £1000 more than they were offering

I was furious as no way would they put a 2 year old out to auction and I certainly had no intention of selling it through an auction either - They had a new used car sales manager

I did't expect an auction trade in price from a main dealer when the car had a years manufacturers warranty on it

I sold it to a used car trader and got £1500 more than Audi were offering - How can that be even allowing for their overheads

I think I will just lease next time as seem to always have to put money in now to change - Dealers just getting greedy, I don't know but all my other cars I've traded in have soon been sold on - Maybe the market is a awash with used cars

 

[TYb]

Might be worth considering a voluntary termination if paid over half of the loan amount. Might be charged for being over mileage, my rate is 11p inc VAT, so if 4K over you could be charged £440 or similar.

You can’t be charged for reasonable wear and tear but can be expected to correct any damage.

 

[AlS3BE]

Here you go.
This is pretty similar to the Audi financial one I’ve seen. Think they are all written by dvlra.

https://direct.leaseplan.co.uk/Media/Default/PDFs/Leaseplan_Fair_wear_tear_guide_cars.pdf

 

[Ron240]

Car valuations should be more or less the same between dealers because they should all be singing from the same hymn sheet as it were.
However some dealers can be so money orientated that they effectively try to rip off the customer for all they can get.
Example.... Before buying my previous car I visited a local dealer who is part of a large chain and they offered an insultingly low trade in for my car and weren't prepared to budge.
I then visited another franchised dealer who is much smaller and was immediately offered £2200 more for my trade in with the new car being the same price. As a direct result of this I vowed never to return to the first dealer.

 

[NevMan]

So true @Ron240 I have had similiar experiences. Equally, I have in the past sold cars privately for £2k+ more than offered P/X.

 

[AlS3BE]

Thing is, a lot of dealers can give you a good trade in but ultimately sell you an expensive car.
Or you get a rubbish trade in and get a massive discount on new car. Rarely you get both a good trade in and good discount.
Just swings and roundabouts.

 

[Ron240]

Thing is, a lot of dealers can give you a good trade in but ultimately sell you an expensive car.
Or you get a rubbish trade in and get a massive discount on new car. Rarely you get both a good trade in and good discount.
Just swings and roundabouts.

I completely agree....and they frequently use it as a way to fool less clued up buyers.
However in my case the new car being purchased was full retail price no matter where you bought from, so they only thing I had to bother about was the trade in price.

 

[Terminator x]

Car valuations should be more or less the same between dealers because they should all be singing from the same hymn sheet as it were.
However some dealers can be so money orientated that they effectively try to rip off the customer for all they can get.
Example.... Before buying my previous car I visited a local dealer who is part of a large chain and they offered an insultingly low trade in for my car and weren't prepared to budge.
I then visited another franchised dealer who is much smaller and was immediately offered £2200 more for my trade in with the new car being the same price. As a direct result of this I vowed never to return to the first dealer.

I was offered £4k less for my RS3 by all the Audi dealers vs what I got for a private sale. I will never bother them again with PX absolute twats imho.

TX.

Sent from my BBB100-2 using Tapatalk

 

[NevMan]

wow, that is a BIG difference! What a joke. I always have a pretty good (realistic) idea of what my car is worth, so aim to get near it, whilst ensuring I get the deal I want/am happy with on new car. When i can't, I go private sale.

Obviously with something like RS, never any shortage of punters

 

[AlS3BE]

I was offered £4k less for my RS3 by all the Audi dealers vs what I got for a private sale. I will never bother them again with PX absolute twats imho.

TX.

Sent from my BBB100-2 using Tapatalk

Problem is these cars even at 5 year old isn’t cheap. It’s difficult to sell a car worth £20k unless it’s to webuyanycr@p.com. If it was a £1-2000 car then you just get the cash and handover v5. With expensive cars there’s hpi checks, making sure money is good and most likely clearing of some form of finance, making sure cheques clear etc. That’s where the dealers have you by the short and curly. Some just can’t be bothered with the hassle or risk. For the buyers, Buying a car of value from a dealer has some come back if it turns out to be a lemon where as personal selling and buying doesn’t have any come back. Sold as seen. I had trouble selling a mini not that long ago. Price was agreed and date was confirmed. Last minute the idiot said I seen a similar one for £1k less and asked me to budge I said no as I get more for trading it in. That was enough for me. Just couldn’t be bothered dealing with tyre kickers and all the idiots. I suppose that’s where we buy any cr@p have made an industry for themselves. Look at glasses guide which all dealers use and offer a little bit more.

 

[Audi Bairn]

My cars are generally in top condition when I trade them in but I’ve never had any issues with normal,wear and tear / chips at all at Audi. My S5 even had a ding in the bonnet from a flying rock.
They’ve also never charged me for excess mileage although that may change if I don’t buy an Audi.

 

[KenL]

I am beginning to think my car (and perhaps all Audis about the age of mine) won't make their GFV come trade in time.

This is because the percentage amount of the cost to by the car outright has dropped significantly if you now look on Audi.co.uk.

I remember being told by sales guy that the car would begin to be in positive equity about 6 months before the end of the deal.

 

[wab172uk]

Maybe the market is a awash with used cars

This ^^^^^^

With Lease / PCP deals. People are getting into cars they traditionally wouldn't be able to afford. Where before Joe Blogs would have bought a Fiesta, as an Audi was out of reach. Or even bought a second hand car as even a new Fiesta was out of reach, PCP deals have made the impossible, possible.

So you now have a situation where lots of people are now buying VW / Audi / BMW / Mercedes etc. The dealers are loving it, as they are selling new metal to a wider audience. So sales are up !!

But, come 3 years later ......... all those new cars they shifted are now coming back to them. Some will swap for another new PCP deal with them, while others will either go try another manufacturer, or just hand the car back. So now, they have a forecourt full of second hand metal, that is hard to shift. Why buy a second hand S3, when you can get a brand new S3 for just a bit extra every month, as Audi have a good PCP rate going.

So now the dealers are stuck. So in order to try and shift all the cars coming in, they'll need to be able to discount. So offering a rubbish P/X deal to anyone needing to terminate early is the only way they can do it.

So to the OP. If you are terminating your contract early, you can only expect the dealer to try and make money from you. Can you not just keep the car till the end of your contract?

 

[NevMan]

well said @wab172uk and pretty much spot on. You often hear people saying, I got a new car for a extra tenner a month over used etc.
Agree in this case, if the P/X / Used value is so out of whack, best to hand back at end of contract, and pay the excess mileage.

Other option is to try a speculative sale privately, to try and cover settlement of finance and move on. Only issues with this:

1. Effort and cost required to post up advert
2. Will need to move into something to replace quite quickly
3. Potential that doesn't sell or get offered derisory offer.

All of the above often mean punters just go with P/X or We buy any car

 

[Nextcar?]

The problem is not the mis selling of pcp as some might say but the buyers mis use.

If you get a car on a 3 year pcp. The actual point is you keep it for 3 years and so on. Most people (myself included) just use pcp to get a better car and keep the monthlies down.

 

[AlS3BE]

Cars used to be expensive cherished goods. As a nation we were car lovers. Well at least I am.
Like said before. Cars have just become another utility like gas and are treated like a disposable product. PCP,cheap leases and cheap loans have done this and it also means a car is accessible to most. Cash is not king anymore as dealers make more money on finance deals and other crap they sell you.
Even premium brands are cheap. My neighbour got an A class for £120 a month on a lease. I spend that in a couple of weeks in the train.

 

[Sparks43]

Cars used to be expensive cherished goods. As a nation we were car lovers. Well at least I am.
Like said before. Cars have just become another utility like gas and are treated like a disposable product. PCP,cheap leases and cheap loans have done this and it also means a car is accessible to most. Cash is not king anymore as dealers make more money on finance deals and other **** they sell you.
Even premium brands are cheap. My neighbour got an A class for £120 a month on a lease. I spend that in a couple of weeks in the train.

I like you are a car lover and always look after my cars

It's good in some ways that newer cars are available to more people in that it keeps the older vehicles off the road (I'm talking about the ones that people don't look after here) but it does make trade ins a lot less desirable unfortunately

 

[TYb]

Cars used to be expensive cherished goods. As a nation we were car lovers. Well at least I am.
Like said before. Cars have just become another utility like gas and are treated like a disposable product. PCP,cheap leases and cheap loans have done this and it also means a car is accessible to most. Cash is not king anymore as dealers make more money on finance deals and other **** they sell you.
Even premium brands are cheap. My neighbour got an A class for £120 a month on a lease. I spend that in a couple of weeks in the train.

I think this Is a good thing providing people understand their financial responsibilities when taking these deals. I dread to think how many cars are repocessed these days.

I have been a pcp user for 5 or so years now due to the high miles i used to cover and wanted the security of a warranty etc. Now that miles are reducing the S3 is going to be my last PCP and going to buy a smart 2nd hand car instead.

 

[mcwharam]

End of July I traded my 25 month old A6 in with 11 months of the PCP left. I was 5000 miles under the mileage allowance, car loaded with options and in immaculate condition. I tried the sell privately route to see if there was any interest - and despite the price being 2K under any price of similar cars out there - private or dealership - I got now interest at all (not even from traders). I had planned on settling the outstanding PCP finance if I got any interest but didn't. The trade in was shocking - still paid off the finance and a bit spare for the new car. The A6 is still sat on their forecourt present price £1700 lower than when it was first priced up. Change in health and other personal circumstances was the reason this car had to go and purchasing the smaller A3 as the wife wouldn't drive the A6 due to its size.

I really got the impression that they didn't want the trade in despite the car being immaculate and obvious retail value. Other factors such as diesel and new A6 model released may have also effected the above.

This time round have bought the car outright- PCP deals on new and used were far too expensive even with all the various discounts - especially with all the options this car has on it. This car will be with us for a long time all being well.

Martin

 

[KenL]

@wab172uk . This Joe Bloggs may well get a Fiesta next time.

I just roll up and down the road to work so don't really need a fancy car.

Also considering an Up GTI, basic A1 or back to a MINI.

 

[4K]

This ^^^^^^

With Lease / PCP deals. People are getting into cars they traditionally wouldn't be able to afford. Where before Joe Blogs would have bought a Fiesta, as an Audi was out of reach. Or even bought a second hand car as even a new Fiesta was out of reach, PCP deals have made the impossible, possible.

So you now have a situation where lots of people are now buying VW / Audi / BMW / Mercedes etc. The dealers are loving it, as they are selling new metal to a wider audience. So sales are up !!

But, come 3 years later ......... all those new cars they shifted are now coming back to them. Some will swap for another new PCP deal with them, while others will either go try another manufacturer, or just hand the car back. So now, they have a forecourt full of second hand metal, that is hard to shift. Why buy a second hand S3, when you can get a brand new S3 for just a bit extra every month, as Audi have a good PCP rate going.

So now the dealers are stuck. So in order to try and shift all the cars coming in, they'll need to be able to discount. So offering a rubbish P/X deal to anyone needing to terminate early is the only way they can do it.

So to the OP. If you are terminating your contract early, you can only expect the dealer to try and make money from you. Can you not just keep the car till the end of your contract?

Solid advice, and quite true. Exactly what I'll be doing with the S3 until next year unless BMW pull a new M240i xDrive out of the bag and I like it.

 

[S32B]

Hi, has anyone much experience of handing a car back at the end of their term? How "picky" are the dealerships? Normal wear and tear and mileage in line with the agreement are assumed, but for example do they look to bill you for every stone chip and minor scratch (which I would see as wear and tear)? I'll likely be closer to 44,000 miles than the contracted 40,000 miles, do they insist on billing you for a few thousand miles over or do they only apply it if it's a far more significant difference?

Part-ex valuations at present are coming in far lower than the outstanding finance and therefore it's looking like the MGFV is very 'optimistic' so unfortunately handing the vehicle back is looking like the best option. Other than that I could buy it out but feel I would be wasting my money if i'm paying about £2k more than the market value.

Also another question to ask (which I only found out myself recently) has it got a full Audi service history?

I sold it to a used car trader and got £1500 more than Audi were offering - How can that be even allowing for their overheads

My S3 was just over 2 years old and in mint condition, no chips/dents/scratches and very low miles on the clock, Audi were coming in at the lowest price, when I asked why their reply was it will cost us £2,000 to prepare your car for sale, then we have to put some proffit on top of that!!! I sold it to a sports car specialist for about £1,500 more!

 

[Sparks43]

Also another question to ask (which I only found out myself recently) has it got a full Audi service history?

My S3 was just over 2 years old and in mint condition, no chips/dents/scratches and very low miles on the clock, Audi were coming in at the lowest price, when I asked why their reply was it will cost us £2,000 to prepare your car for sale, then we have to put some proffit on top of that!!! I sold it to a sports car specialist for about £1,500 more!

£2,000 to prepare it is such crap - Yours sounds like mine and that would have gone straight onto the forecourt with a quick wash and then serviced when sold

 

[S32B]

£2,000 to prepare it is such **** - Yours sounds like mine and that would have gone straight onto the forecourt with a quick wash and then serviced when sold

Exactly mate, they must think we were born yesterday. Mine looked better than some they already had on the forecourt for sale!

I loved their faces though when I went in to sign the paperwork for the new one! They said "Right we just need to check over your S3", I said "What for?", "To give you your final valuation as it may have gone down", I said "Oh you're not having the S3, I've sold it to someone else" To say that they looked shocked was an understatement...I then said "I did tell you from day one both in person and by email to keep the deals separate, as that may be what I do with the S3"

The £2,000 must have been to get mine looking clean!!! ...these were taken when I first looked at selling it:

 

[Sparks43]

Exactly mate, they must think we were born yesterday. Mine looked better than some they already had on the forecourt for sale!

I loved their faces though when I went in to sign the paperwork for the new one! They said "Right we just need to check over your S3", I said "What for?", "To give you your final valuation as it may have gone down", I said "Oh you're not having the S3, I've sold it to someone else" To say that they looked shocked was an understatement...I then said "I did tell you from day one both in person and by email to keep the deals separate, as that may be what I do with the S3"

The £2,000 must have been to get mine looking clean!!! ...these were taken when I first looked at selling it:

View attachment 167044 View attachment 167045 View attachment 167046

I mean look at it - Excellent and clearly well looked after

My dealer rang me to say what time is your train getting in (we got ours from another dealer to our local one) and I said we're in town and he said I'll pick you and I said no I've got a taxi booked see you in an hour.

When we got there like you he said have you got the V5 and where did you park the S3 I just need to look over your car - I'd previously told him by email and had the new invoice without the PX on it and we'd spoken just an hour ago when he was going to pick me up - If I had the car I'd have driven there!!!

 

[S32B]

My dealer rang me to say what time is your train getting in (we got ours from another dealer to our local one) and I said we're in town and he said I'll pick you and I said no I've got a taxi booked see you in an hour.

When we got there like you he said have you got the V5 and where did you park the S3 I just need to look over your car - I'd previously told him by email and had the new invoice without the PX on it and we'd spoken just an hour ago when he was going to pick me up - If I had the car I'd have driven there!!!

lol they just don't listen mate!

Warrington Audi is my next dealership to buy from, bloke I know works there and is spot on

 

[Sparks43]

lol they just don't listen mate!

Warrington Audi is my next dealership to buy from, bloke I know works there and is spot on

I know

I dealt with Chelmsford for years - The salesman was excellent (more of a friend than a salesman) and my mate is a mastertech there and was so well looked after - When he went to BMW the person I dealt with and the dealership were just awful and didn't seem to care that we'd had 5 cars off them.

Didn't fancy a BMW but as it was Inchcape I asked if he could recommend an Audi dealer in the group and he set us up with Tunbridge Wells Audi who were excellent first time but last time people had changed again and just wasn't the same experience.

Really am thinking about leasing next time and just have the vehicle delivered as the whole showroom experience was such a let down along with ridiculous part exchange prices - Just pay the 3 months up front which is effectively the same as a deposit and carry on with all the Road Tax, Maintenance and tyres included

Cars only 6 months old at the moment so that's in the future - never know might win the lottery lol

 

[S32B]

I know

I dealt with Chelmsford for years - The salesman was excellent (more of a friend than a salesman) and my mate is a mastertech there and was so well looked after - When he went to BMW the person I dealt with and the dealership were just awful and didn't seem to care that we'd had 5 cars off them.

Didn't fancy a BMW but as it was Inchcape I asked if he could recommend an Audi dealer in the group and he set us up with Tunbridge Wells Audi who were excellent first time but last time people had changed again and just wasn't the same experience.

Really am thinking about leasing next time and just have the vehicle delivered as the whole showroom experience was such a let down along with ridiculous part exchange prices - Just pay the 3 months up front which is effectively the same as a deposit and carry on with all the Road Tax, Maintenance and tyres included

Cars only 6 months old at the moment so that's in the future - never know might win the lottery lol

Been thinking the same, at least you know what it will cost (total) and no hassle at the end, these guys get good reviews: https://www.selectcarleasing.co.uk/

 

[Sparks43]

Been thinking the same, at least you know what it will cost (total) and no hassle at the end, these guys get good reviews: https://www.selectcarleasing.co.uk/

Exactly - Thanks for that

We use Leaseplan at work for our Pool Car and they are very good as well so might give them a try

 

[NevMan]

Exactly mate, they must think we were born yesterday. Mine looked better than some they already had on the forecourt for sale!

I loved their faces though when I went in to sign the paperwork for the new one! They said "Right we just need to check over your S3", I said "What for?", "To give you your final valuation as it may have gone down", I said "Oh you're not having the S3, I've sold it to someone else" To say that they looked shocked was an understatement...I then said "I did tell you from day one both in person and by email to keep the deals separate, as that may be what I do with the S3"

The £2,000 must have been to get mine looking clean!!! ...these were taken when I first looked at selling it:

View attachment 167044 View attachment 167045 View attachment 167046

Haha, their faces must have been a picture.
I see what you mean, car looks filthy

 

[NevMan]

I know

I dealt with Chelmsford for years - The salesman was excellent (more of a friend than a salesman) and my mate is a mastertech there and was so well looked after - When he went to BMW the person I dealt with and the dealership were just awful and didn't seem to care that we'd had 5 cars off them.

Didn't fancy a BMW but as it was Inchcape I asked if he could recommend an Audi dealer in the group and he set us up with Tunbridge Wells Audi who were excellent first time but last time people had changed again and just wasn't the same experience.

Really am thinking about leasing next time and just have the vehicle delivered as the whole showroom experience was such a let down along with ridiculous part exchange prices - Just pay the 3 months up front which is effectively the same as a deposit and carry on with all the Road Tax, Maintenance and tyres included

Cars only 6 months old at the moment so that's in the future - never know might win the lottery lol

I too will potentially go down the lease route next time