Desperation time.

g60leigh

g60leigh

Registered User
Joined
Jun 16, 2007
Messages
1,667
Reaction score
207
Points
63
Location
Stockton on Tees
I've had a major engine rebuild and a few hurdles along the way. But hitting these problems at end of the journey and not able to get past them.

Continuously getting the following fault codes.

17748
Fault Description-
Camshaft position (CMP) sensor 1, bank 1/crankshaft position (CKP) sensor - out of sequence
Possible Cause-
Valve timing, CKP/CMP sensor installation, CKP sensor rotor

16705
Fault Description-
Crankshaft position (CKP) sensor/engine speed (RPM) sensor - range/performance problem
Possible Causes-
Air gap, metal particles, insecure sensor/rotor, wiring, CKP/RPM sensor

16711
Fault Description-
Knock sensor (KS) 1, bank 1 - low input
Possible Causes-
Insecure KS, poor connection, wiring short to earth, incorrectly tightened, KS

16396
Fault Description-
Camshaft position (CMP), intake/left/front, bank 1 - timing over-retarded
Possible Causes-
Valve timing, camshaft position (CMP) actuator

Symptoms wise, the car is running well right up until under high boost full load and get a strong pull back.

I have done everything I can think of to rectify this:
Timing belt timing checked
Timing chain timing checked
New sensors (both knock, cam position, engine coolant)
New coils, plugs and also coil wiring loom
Seems to have loads of fuel pressure although I'm going to change in tank and inline pump just to be sure.

Is there one thing that could be causing all of these errors or do I need to revisit something? Seems strange to be getting these errors together and repeating even with new sensors.
All started after had engine rebuild with forged internals and 83mm bore.

Also had an issue with it smoking but seem to be on top of that now. (Burning oil)

Getting so close to giving in and stripping it for parts now.

Helpppppp


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
I'm in no means an expert with these engines but I think tuffty had a problem like this when he missed shifted and overreved. I'm pretty sure his timing looked ok but he had actually damaged the crank sprocket (I think) As I said I've only just got into the Vag scene but just something to check I suppose.

Sent from my E6653 using Tapatalk
 
  • Like
Reactions: g60leigh
audi upgrades
g60leigh said:
17748
Fault Description-
Camshaft position (CMP) sensor 1, bank 1/crankshaft position (CKP) sensor - out of sequence
Possible Cause-
Valve timing, CKP/CMP sensor installation, CKP sensor rotor
Click to expand...
http://wiki.ross-tech.com/wiki/index.php/17748/P1340/004928

Cam belt a tooth out typically throws this... double check by physically setting TDC by sticking something down cyl 1 plug hole and double check the timing marks on the flywheel, cam pulley and the crank damper pulley. Also worth taking the cam cover off to validate cam to cam timing is correct.

Another member on here was having similar issues and was diagnosed by Bill at the workshop in the end to be a loose crank bolt

g60leigh said:
16705
Fault Description-
Crankshaft position (CKP) sensor/engine speed (RPM) sensor - range/performance problem
Possible Causes-
Air gap, metal particles, insecure sensor/rotor, wiring, CKP/RPM sensor
Click to expand...

http://wiki.ross-tech.com/wiki/index.php/16705/P0321/000801

Faulty crank sensor or wiring

g60leigh said:
16711
Fault Description-
Knock sensor (KS) 1, bank 1 - low input
Possible Causes-
Insecure KS, poor connection, wiring short to earth, incorrectly tightened, KS
Click to expand...

http://wiki.ross-tech.com/wiki/index.php/16711/P0327

Sounds like faulty wiring... could be related to the crank sensor fault above... (and maybe the cam position one too if the timing checks out)

g60leigh said:
16396
Fault Description-
Camshaft position (CMP), intake/left/front, bank 1 - timing over-retarded
Possible Causes-
Valve timing, camshaft position (CMP) actuator
Click to expand...
http://wiki.ross-tech.com/wiki/index.php/16396/P0012/000018

Typically a sign the VVT is failing and requires replacement...

I'd double check the timing again... getting to physical TDC is key... its what the rest of the engine will be timed off...

Then check the wiring... earths are a common point of failure under the battery tray... might also be worth checking the following wiring diagram
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B_V9-6xfgGlIVW5wWkd0VE5FcnM/view

Its for an AMK ECU...

<tuffty/>
 
  • Like
Reactions: g60leigh
That's absolutely brilliant Paul. Really appreciate it as gives me something more concrete to go at.
I'm going to find a time served vag tech to check this timing for me as don't trust myself anymore.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Is there any reference to show resistance engine sensors should be? Just thinking of testing them all too.

Also the VVT is all new.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Double check the 16 link cam chain timing. Inlet link on the mark and exhaust link just past the mark.
Then crank to cam timing.
Measure TDC through spark plug whole on first cylinder and then line up the cam timing mark on the valve cover.
You need to keep tension on the cam sprocket while installing the belt as the cam will slowly move one tooth out if no tension is on the gear. Once installed, turn engine over by hand for 4 revolutions.
Measure TDC again and double check cam cover timing mark. Physical put something thin like a Stanley blade on the cam pulley mark and across the belt to ensure it lines up with the valve cover mark. Don't put the sharp edge of the blade on the belt :wink new:
 
Was this resolved?.

Sent from my E6653 using Tapatalk
 
Not yet. I've now got a blow at turbo / downpipe so that's getting done now and then taking it over to local VAG specialist to time and check


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Cars goin in on 9th so hopefully will get all set up and be done with these gremlins


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Seems to be the cam chain tensioner at fault as timing is spot on until you reach 3750 rpm then all goes to pot.

Annoying as this was replaced 2 years ago and done less than 1200 miles


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
VVT Cam chain tensioner operates on oil pressure. Worth checking the oil pickup pipe is clear, too...
 
Bit further checking and it's not the cam chain tensioner at fault. Still no further forward.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Whats block 093 timing correction value?

Myself and a few others, who all know a 1.8T pretty damn well, all had issues with the engine saying the timing was out, despite being timed up 110% correct. People were seeing around -8 to -12 KW on the camshaft timing correction maps, meaning a lack of performance and the ECU popping a fault code for the cams being out. Solution was to fit a vernier and tweak until the value reads 0KW correction.
 
Chris90 said:
Whats block 093 timing correction value?

Myself and a few others, who all know a 1.8T pretty damn well, all had issues with the engine saying the timing was out, despite being timed up 110% correct. People were seeing around -8 to -12 KW on the camshaft timing correction maps, meaning a lack of performance and the ECU popping a fault code for the cams being out. Solution was to fit a vernier and tweak until the value reads 0KW correction.
Click to expand...

I can have a look at that over the weekend mate. Do I need to check that at static load or across a rev range?

Thanks


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Mine is showing -17kw at both idle. Engine off and at load.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
g60leigh said:
Is it possible to install them wrong? Just had the timing checked again and it's spot on. Also a new cam chain tensioner


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

I mean the gear on the cam itself. If that's wrong, you could have it appear to be installed correctly but actually the cam itself would be out.
I'm just elaborating on what he said above having to fit a vernier
Have you changed the cams at all or are they all original?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Cams and gears are all original. Have you fitted a vernier? Where is best to get one from.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Have you check the timing by physically measuring TDC of no.1 piston, then checking the cam gear markings?

Just thinking you might have a crank gear that's stripped.
 
Scullies said:
Have you check the timing by physically measuring TDC of no.1 piston, then checking the cam gear markings?

Just thinking you might have a crank gear that's stripped.
Click to expand...

Yes I think so bud. I'm gonna double check they did that now tho.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
  • Like
Reactions: Scullies
-17kw is well out. TBH, the car must feel pretty flat with timing corrections that much.

I went from -8KW on mine to setting it to 0KW and the difference was night and day, Engine could be felt and seen flowing much more freely due to the bit boost it dropped. It felt like vtec kicking in when it was set up properly, it was that noticable.



To check you need to clear codes and then open block 093 and let engine see what it comes up with in the block.
 
Chris90 said:
-17kw is well out. TBH, the car must feel pretty flat with timing corrections that much.

I went from -8KW on mine to setting it to 0KW and the difference was night and day, Engine could be felt and seen flowing much more freely due to the bit boost it dropped. It felt like vtec kicking in when it was set up properly, it was that noticable.



To check you need to clear codes and then open block 093 and let engine see what it comes up with in the block.
Click to expand...

I can do that today.

For it to be going so far out tho. What could be causing that?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

J
Decision time!!
Replies
1
Views
698
RichA3Turbo
RichA3Turbo
peakey
First time detail
Replies
12
Views
1K
peakey
peakey
D
Tyre Time
Replies
11
Views
2K
acf8181
A
Dani_B19
Cambelt time...
Replies
12
Views
912
Kevin@bndynamix
K
heathy
show time
Replies
4
Views
702
<tuffty/>
<tuffty/>
Top
Back