DESPERATE! - Instrument cluster not working - car wont start

[Squidy]

Hi All...

At the end of my tether with this now :/ I've ripped the car apart trying to find a fix, but still cant find a solution. It's Audi A3 BKD 2006 8P with DSG

It started with flickering dash clocks, the radio asking for a code sometimes and then next day the instrument cluster was dead and car wouldnt start. It had been sat for a week or two while I changed the turbo, so it had to be jump started twice, and when the battery was low I used to get ESP Fault on the dash, but after a run that went.

After extensive googling, it appeared all roads led to instrument cluster being dead and I sent them off to be repaired at a cost of £160. They replaced the processor and sent them back. However, when I (all happy smiles) put it back in, the dash clocks were still dead - no lights, clock, etc.. so I sent them back to the repair company under warranty. Speaking to the guy on the phone he said "They're lighting up on my bench" but replaced the processor again to be sure, then sent them back. Yet, on my end still dead.

All other electrics work, both keys lock and unlock, indicators work, headlights etc. Before sending the clocks off I did the usual checks:

Checked dash fuses . Engine fuses . Checked battery . Tried another battery . Had the battery tested by tyre centre and was told it was good, no dead cells.

Swapped some relays on comfort control module (under drivers dash) . Bought a relay tester and cycled through relays - all good (But I couldnt test the larger relays as the pins wouldnt fit in my tester)
Swapped comfort control module with one from a breaker
Swapped CAN gateway module from a breaker
Checked CCM in boot for water/damage
Checked ECU for water damage

I bought a 2nd hand instrument cluster off eBay (same part No.) That didnt light up either. Bought yet another instrument cluster, that is the same. The seller sent me a pic of it off the car and it was shown working at his end.

I've put multimeter on the fuses and getting 12v.

Lastly, the loom to the instrument cluster, I've put the multimeter to what I think is positive pin 1, and I get around 9v? It's the singular 'blue' 32 pin connector.

I can't think what else to do.. ignition switch? or maybe the cluster isnt coming on with only 9v supply? This is the scan with OBDeleven.

Date: 2020-02-13 18:13

VIN: WAUZZZ8P87A050925
Car: Audi A3
Year: 2007
Body type: Sportback
Engine: BKD 103 kW (140 HP) 2.0 l

---------------------------------------------------------------
01 Engine Control Module 1

System description: R4 2,0L EDC 000AG
Software number: 03G906021LG
Software version: 9558
Hardware number: 03G906021AN
Serial number: AUX7Z0F7FN70DV
Coding: 0000078

Trouble codes:
P1650 - Databus drivetrain missing message from instrument cluster
static
Priority: 3
Frequency counter: 2
Driving cycle: 255
U1019 - Instrument cluster control module Missing signal oil level/temperature
static
Priority: 3
Frequency counter: 2
Driving cycle: 255
P161C - Glow plug cylinder 3 Open circuit
static
Priority: 3
Frequency counter: 1
Driving cycle: 255


---------------------------------------------------------------
02 Transmission Control Module

System description: GSG DSG 070
Software number: 02E300042S
Software version: 1102
Hardware number: 02E927770AE
Hardware version: C30
Serial number: 00000606270164
Coding: 0000020

Trouble codes:
P1862 - Databus drivetrain missing message from instrument cluster
static
Priority: 0
Frequency counter: 255
Driving cycle: 40


---------------------------------------------------------------
03 Brakes 1

System description: ESP FRONT MK60
Software number: 1K0907379AC
Software version: 0101
Hardware number: 1K0907379AC
Coding: 0023170

Trouble codes:
01317 - Instrument cluster control module No signal/communication
static
00474 - Anti-theft immobilizer system control module No signal/communication
static



---------------------------------------------------------------
08 Air Conditioning

System description: KlimavollautomatH18
Software number: 8P0820043Q
Software version: 0300
Hardware number: 8P0820043Q
Hardware version: 000
Serial number: 8P0820043Q

Trouble codes:
00483 - Auxiliary air heater control module Please read DTC
static
Priority: 3
Frequency counter: 1
Driving cycle: 243
01317 - Instrument cluster control module No signal/communication
static
Priority: 3
Frequency counter: 4
Driving cycle: 243


---------------------------------------------------------------
09 Central Electrics

System description: Bordnetz-SG H43
Software number: 8P0907279F
Software version: 1201
Hardware number: 8P0907279F
Hardware version: 063
Serial number: 00000006041842
Long coding: F18A5F01B214100000160000160000000008EE175A0500

Subsystems:
System description: Wischer AU350 H01
Software number: 8P2955119E
Software version: 0130
Coding: 0062736

System description: REGENLICHTSENSORH13
Software number: 4E0910557A
Software version: 0090
Coding: 0150573

Trouble codes:
01341 - Control module in instrument cluster at comfort CAN No signal/communication
static
Priority: 2
Frequency counter: 2
Driving cycle: 243


---------------------------------------------------------------
11 Engine Control Module 2


Trouble codes:
No trouble codes found

---------------------------------------------------------------
15 Airbag

System description: Airbag 9.41 H12
Software number: 8P0959655C
Software version: 3760
Hardware number: 8P0959655C
Serial number: 003620G1JHAV
Coding: 0071612

Trouble codes:
01317 - Instrument cluster control module No signal/communication
static
Priority: 2
Frequency counter: 1
Driving cycle: 243


---------------------------------------------------------------
16 Steering Column Electronics

System description: J0527 H34
Software number: 8P0953549F
Software version: 0070
Hardware number: 8P0953549F
Coding: 0014112

Subsystems:
System description: E0221 H07
Software number: XXXXXXXXXXX
Software version: 0090

Trouble codes:
01317 - Instrument cluster control module No signal/communication
static

---------------------------------------------------------------
19 Gateway

System description: J533__Gateway H12
Software number: 1K0907530J
Software version: 0160
Hardware number: 1K0907951
Serial number: 32001067188088
Long coding: 7F3F0BC887003103

Trouble codes:
00381 - Instrument cluster data bus No signal/communication
static
Priority: 1
Frequency counter: 1
Driving cycle: 243
01342 - Engine control module 2 No signal/communication
static
Priority: 2
Frequency counter: 1
Driving cycle: 243
01044 - Control module incorrectly coded
static
Priority: 1
Frequency counter: 1
Driving cycle: 243


---------------------------------------------------------------
25 Immobilizer


Trouble codes:
No trouble codes found

---------------------------------------------------------------
37 Navigation

System description: RNS-E HIGH EU H72
Software number: 8P0035192H
Software version: 0500
Hardware number: 8P0035192H
Hardware version: 014
Serial number: AUZBZ7F0970832
Coding: 0209717

Trouble codes:
16352 - Control module Faulty
Intermittent
Priority: 5
Frequency counter: 1
Driving cycle: 65
Mileage: 1432 km
Date: 2006-09-18 00:22:47
01317 - Instrument cluster control module No signal/communication
static
Priority: 5
Frequency counter: 1
Driving cycle: 243


---------------------------------------------------------------
42 Door Electronics Driver Side

System description: Tuer-SG 020
Software number: 8P0959801G
Software version: 0110
Coding: 0000688

Trouble codes:
No trouble codes found

---------------------------------------------------------------
44 Steering Assistance

System description: EPS_ZFLS Kl.079 H07
Software number: 1K2909144L
Software version: 1806

Trouble codes:
00778 - Steering angle sensor
static


---------------------------------------------------------------
46 Central Module Comfort System

System description: KSG H04
Software number: 8P0959433C
Software version: 0050
Long coding: 198000186D088505489FC63300

Subsystems:
System description: LIN BACKUP HORN H03
Software number: 1K0951605C
Software version: 1301

System description: Neigungssensor 005
Software number: 1K0907719C
Software version: 0003

System description: Innenraumueberw.H04
Software number: 8P0951177
Software version: 0020

Trouble codes:
No trouble codes found

---------------------------------------------------------------
52 Door Electronics Passenger Side

System description: Tuer-SG 020
Software number: 8P0959802G
Software version: 0110
Coding: 0000688

Trouble codes:
No trouble codes found

---------------------------------------------------------------
55 Headlight Regulation

System description: Dynamische LWR H02
Software number: 8P0907357F
Software version: 0010
Coding: 0000012

Trouble codes:
01317 - Instrument cluster control module No signal/communication
static
Priority: 2
Frequency counter: 1
Driving cycle: 243
Mileage: 8 km


---------------------------------------------------------------
56 Radio

System description: RNS-E HIGH EU H72
Software number: 8P0035192H
Software version: 0500
Hardware number: 8P0035192H
Hardware version: 014
Serial number: AUZBZ7F0970832
Coding: 0209717

Trouble codes:
16352 - Control module Faulty
Intermittent
Priority: 5
Frequency counter: 1
Driving cycle: 65
Mileage: 1432 km
Date: 2006-09-18 00:22:47
01317 - Instrument cluster control module No signal/communication
static
Priority: 5
Frequency counter: 1
Driving cycle: 243


---------------------------------------------------------------
62 Door Electronics Rear Left

System description: Tuer-SG 020
Software number: 8P4959801D
Software version: 0070
Coding: 0000144

Trouble codes:
No trouble codes found

---------------------------------------------------------------
72 Door Electronics Rear Right

System description: Tuer-SG 020
Software number: 8P4959802D
Software version: 0070
Coding: 0000144

Trouble codes:
No trouble codes found

---------------------------------------------------------------
76 Parking Assistance

System description: Parkhilfe 4-Kan H09
Software number: 8P0919283D
Software version: 0060
Hardware number: 8P0919283D
Serial number: 00067824820621
Coding: 0001113

Trouble codes:
No trouble codes found

---------------------------------------------------------------
77 Telephone

System description: FSE_255x BT H21
Software number: 8P0862335H
Software version: 0290
Hardware number: 8P0862335H
Serial number: 00000000513248
Coding: 0011422

Trouble codes:
01317 - Instrument cluster control module No signal/communication
static
Priority: 5
Frequency counter: 2
Driving cycle: 243


---------------------------------------------------------------
7D Auxiliary Heater

System description: PTC-Element
Software number: 1K0963235E
Software version: 0404
Hardware number: 1K0963235E

Trouble codes:
00361 - Heater element for aux. heater Faulty
static

 

[NHN]

Change ignition switch, it's £30 or so, given age of car, I'd try this 1st tbh as they do go faulty & intermittently too.

 

[Squidy]

Ok.. well, I bought a replacement Igntion switch. Annnd... didn't make a difference

I checked the voltage to the Instrument Cluster again (the pins on the blue connector loom) and today I'm getting as low as 5v (4.83v infact) so, that's not enough to power on the Instrument cluster. Fault 01317 appears, which says:


Possible Solutions

• Check CAN-Databus Wiring/Connectors from/to Instrument Cluster (J285)

Which makes me think it might be J519 Comfort Control Module and again a bad relay. I will try some new relays... unless anyone has any other ideas they can shed light on the problem..

 

[nluk100]

Something is dragging your voltage down. Check the Voltage at the ignition switch, if it's less than 12V, disconnect the output from the switch (going to the rest of the car) and check again. If it's back to 12V then the problem is after the ignition (damaged harness/connector causing an earthing effect?), if it's still below 12V then it's an issue with your battery or associated wiring.

 

[aqibi2000]

For the sake of testing your car bypass the existing 12v line and using a piggy back use take 12V from one of the fuses which has ignition feed.

make sure your battery is charged since you’ve been playing with your car for some time the battery will have depleted especially under load when turning ignition on let alone cranking unless you’ve been using a trickle charger

 

[Squidy]

Thanks for the replies! Ok, I've had a little look again today at this and this is where I've got so far. I've attached 3 images to show, hopefully I'm at the right place. The first image here is of the J500 steering control module that the igntion wires pass through, I probed two wires shown in red arrow and they're 12v.


I connected it back up and probed the 4 pins on the yellow block, they're only giving out 0.02v with igntion on and nothing with it off (is this relevant??)

Secondly I probed the cluster loom, And theres 3 red wires that give a voltage, but this voltage is around 4.5-5v. (last week I was getting maybe 9v? dont know whats changed)



And lastly, I probed the fuses on the dash and I'm getting 12v from every one.

This is as far as I've got. Not sure what else to check? If it's of any relevance, when the problem first started the radio was asking for a code, but when I disconnected the J500 and plugged that back in, the radio is no longer asked for a code and is working fine. I dont get any errors/faults coming up with OBDeleven scan for the module.

So my problem is not the battery end?

 

[aqibi2000]

So if every fuse is getting 12v like you’ve stated above:


So if Fuse 6 = Instrument cluster module 5A has 12v and then when you measure this at the connector for the cluster and it is either changing or low = then you have an issue with the wiring going high resistance.

Also where are you putting the black price when measuring fuses vs when measuring the harness?

 

[Squidy]

Thanks for keeping up with me on this everyone appreciated

OK.. had another stab at this and got somewhere...!... but far from a fix.

I put battery on charge overnight and it was fully juiced up. I connected it and tested Fuse 6 in engine bay again, and that was a solid 12v. I'm measuring from the tiny exposed point on top of the fuse and the COM to the thick wire from battery to chasis.

I tested the instrument cluster loom again and with the battery being fully charged I was getting 7v on the two red/white wires. I'm putting the COM of the multimeter to the brown wires on the loom next to the red/white and also (to be sure) the chassis, both times getting 7v.. however, the voltage seems to be dropping, like its counting down? 7v to 6.89 to 6.87-86-85 etc

Where I found the result was by piggy-backing 12v feed off the igntion (the same 12v in the first picture on J500 above) and YES! the instrument cluster lit up, needles twitched, milage and time lit.

So there's something affecting the voltage bringing it down! I tried to follow the red/white wires but they dissapear behind the bulkhead of the dash and I dont know where they go? ... I think I'm getting somewhere? could the wires be shorting to ground? does anyone know where the red/white wires go to?

 

[henkkeumus]

Thanks for keeping up with me on this everyone appreciated

OK.. had another stab at this and got somewhere...!... but far from a fix.

I put battery on charge overnight and it was fully juiced up. I connected it and tested Fuse 6 in engine bay again, and that was a solid 12v. I'm measuring from the tiny exposed point on top of the fuse and the COM to the thick wire from battery to chasis.

I tested the instrument cluster loom again and with the battery being fully charged I was getting 7v on the two red/white wires. I'm putting the COM of the multimeter to the brown wires on the loom next to the red/white and also (to be sure) the chassis, both times getting 7v.. however, the voltage seems to be dropping, like its counting down? 7v to 6.89 to 6.87-86-85 etc

Where I found the result was by piggy-backing 12v feed off the igntion (the same 12v in the first picture on J500 above) and YES! the instrument cluster lit up, needles twitched, milage and time lit.

So there's something affecting the voltage bringing it down! I tried to follow the red/white wires but they dissapear behind the bulkhead of the dash and I dont know where they go? ... I think I'm getting somewhere? could the wires be shorting to ground? does anyone know where the red/white wires go to?

I've got a wiring diagram at home. Can send you that if you fancy. Also got ElsaWin, so if you PM me your VIN number I can check it in Elsa.

 

[henkkeumus]

You can download wiring diagrams from here;

8P from MJ2004: https://drive.google.com/open?id=1inSMENfVA_jZ6KE3Ub8-rMb31l87EfSM
8P from MJ2006:https://drive.google.com/open?id=1PqakjH5W_SqoN-4DOVJkpUOdb_oaMjV-

Download the files, open them, hit CTRL + F and search for some terms like "Cluster" "Tacometer" etc.

Good luck mate!

 

[aqibi2000]

Simplest fix if it is ONLY the cluster power feed that is affected is to cut the wires at the harness behind the cluster and also at the point it merges into the fuse box and run new wires.

Although most likely you have a corroded wire or corrosion on the cluster side of the fuse holder, yes **** like this happens.

I have had the headlight fuse terminal have corrosion affecting one side of the rear tail light indicator only on the left side not even the right side ....wtf so troll though all fuse holders - pull them out as physically inspect

(Personally would go through every fuse holder and inspect by removal)

 

[Simply D]

You can download wiring diagrams from here;

8P from MJ2004: https://drive.google.com/open?id=1inSMENfVA_jZ6KE3Ub8-rMb31l87EfSM
8P from MJ2006:https://drive.google.com/open?id=1PqakjH5W_SqoN-4DOVJkpUOdb_oaMjV-

Download the files, open them, hit CTRL + F and search for some terms like "Cluster" "Tacometer" etc.

Good luck mate!

Are these the full wiring diagrams for the 8P or just the section to help the OP?

If yes, thaaaaaaank you, I am trying to trace a few niggles.

Is the MJ2004/2006 different chassis types?

 

[henkkeumus]

Are these the full wiring diagrams for the 8P or just the section to help the OP?

If yes, thaaaaaaank you, I am trying to trace a few niggles.

Is the MJ2004/2006 different chassis types?

The full deal .

 

[Simply D]

Muchas gracias!!

 

[Squidy]

Just an update... it's FIXED! (hoped to edit original post to reflect this?)

After tearing the dash apart, it turned out to be a wire from the instrument cluster loom to the fuse box. There's a red/white wire that provides power to the cluster and it should be 12v, anything less than 11ish volts and it wont come on. I removed the battery tray and exposed more of the wiring loom, pair of scissors and cut the tape back and spread the wires. I noticed two wires caked in a greeny-blue powder coating, so pulled them appart and saw they had rubbed together that much that the insulation wore away and the wires were touching. I cut the wires, resoldered them together, heatshrink and wow, car starts on the button, lights on dash all good.

So relieved! now I have to put it all back together, but I think I might have lost the ABS coding with the swapping of clusters as theres a light on the dash. Once everything is back together I'm going to do another scan, see where we're at.

BIG thanks to all that commented and helped, especially to henkkeumus for supplying the wiring diagrams allowing me to trace the wires.

 

[aqibi2000]

AWESOME!. ESP light normally goes off after driving for about 30 seconds in a straight line if the coding is correct.

 

[ch1z64]

Just an update... it's FIXED! (hoped to edit original post to reflect this?)

After tearing the dash apart, it turned out to be a wire from the instrument cluster loom to the fuse box. There's a red/white wire that provides power to the cluster and it should be 12v, anything less than 11ish volts and it wont come on. I removed the battery tray and exposed more of the wiring loom, pair of scissors and cut the tape back and spread the wires. I noticed two wires caked in a greeny-blue powder coating, so pulled them appart and saw they had rubbed together that much that the insulation wore away and the wires were touching. I cut the wires, resoldered them together, heatshrink and wow, car starts on the button, lights on dash all good.

So relieved! now I have to put it all back together, but I think I might have lost the ABS coding with the swapping of clusters as theres a light on the dash. Once everything is back together I'm going to do another scan, see where we're at.

BIG thanks to all that commented and helped, especially to henkkeumus for supplying the wiring diagrams allowing me to trace the wires.

Glad to hear you finally got to the bottom off your problem great work

 

[henkkeumus]

Glad you got it figured out. Good work mate. And no problemo, glad I cpuld help you.

Verstuurd vanaf mijn ONEPLUS A5010 met Tapatalk

 

[jam1980uk]

I have just come across this very issue hopefully the same thing to sort can someone please post the wiring diagram as I can't access the ones already posted thanks for your time

 

[paul_bfree]

Just for info, I had a similar issue I was chasing two months ago. Same thing, car wouldn't start, no lights at Instrument Cluster. Turned out to be corroded pins at the blue 32-pin loom connector to the Instrument Cluster. Who in Audi thought that putting three +12VDC lines right next to three GND wires was a good design??? Well, mine developed a short between two pins due to corrosion and then overheating. Would randomly blow Fuse 6. Finally gave up the ghost. Rewired loom to 32-pin connector and all good....

 

[NHN]

Just for info, I had a similar issue I was chasing two months ago. Same thing, car wouldn't start, no lights at Instrument Cluster. Turned out to be corroded pins at the blue 32-pin loom connector to the Instrument Cluster. Who in Audi thought that putting three +12VDC lines right next to three GND wires was a good design??? Well, mine developed a short between two pins due to corrosion and then overheating. Would randomly blow Fuse 6. Finally gave up the ghost. Rewired loom to 32-pin connector and all good....

This is an anomaly tbh, I've never found this on any car that wasn't affected by damp or a water leak, allot of modules have +/- next to eachother tbh, I think you were just unlucky, tbh wouldn't matter which pins as it would still cause a fault on in some level.

Question I'd ask is why did it corrode, that's the more important as it could happen again.

 

[paul_bfree]

This is an anomaly tbh, I've never found this on any car that wasn't affected by damp or a water leak, allot of modules have +/- next to eachother tbh, I think you were just unlucky, tbh wouldn't matter which pins as it would still cause a fault on in some level.

Question I'd ask is why did it corrode, that's the more important as it could happen again.

NHN - thanks for reply. Yes, I agree, what caused the corrosion? Hard to tell. Chasing another fault right now, seems to be unrelated - no power to Fuel Pump Relay. Oh, cars....