Correct part number for AFB injectors

adamss24

Registered User
Hi Ben, you're still at it ? How are the new manifolds ? I will make a few sets myself, got most of the bits and flanges ready to weld so i will have to get into it and finish the car...
 

two left feet

Registered User
I will have to work out how to hide the gtb2260 though. I am proud of your boost pipes so will not bother to paint thm. Took off the intake manifold (to help with the injector swap) and was amazed how much oil is caked in all the pipes. Don't suppose it makes any sense to get them cleaned. See you next weekend. Safe travels..
 

ben parris

Registered User
Hi Ben, you're still at it ? How are the new manifolds ? I will make a few sets myself, got most of the bits and flanges ready to weld so i will have to get into it and finish the car...
Yes still at it. New suspension is taking a bit of getting used to, it's better on one hand but not on the other, but that's best kept for a different thread. manifolds are on, it seems a little more smokey, does that make sense to you?

Hey two left feet, I did exactly the same with my intake manifolds a couple of months back, caked is putting it lightly. I burned all the crap out of mine....
 

two left feet

Registered User
Hi Ben, how did you burn the oil out? I am currently soaking the bits in degreaser and will hit them with the high pressure hose in a few days....
 

adamss24

Registered User
Light uP the barbeque Andrew, it's the only way to get rid of the rubbish in the intake... See you this weekend if all is well... Let me know when you get the injectors please, i can stay a bit longer if necessary !
 

two left feet

Registered User
Hi Chris,
BBQ the pipes - got it! I will try and get at the rubbish near the valves with vacuum cleaner and small brush.
Will contact you once I get the injectors from diesel Bob, I expect them Wednesday.
I will remove the old injectors perhaps Friday. Do you have a rough idea when you will pass by?
just kept me know for planning purposes.
Andrew
 

ben parris

Registered User
Hi Chris,
BBQ the pipes - got it! I will try and get at the rubbish near the valves with vacuum cleaner and small brush.
Will contact you once I get the injectors from diesel Bob, I expect them Wednesday.
I will remove the old injectors perhaps Friday. Do you have a rough idea when you will pass by?
just kept me know for planning purposes.
Andrew
HI Andrew, yes I used a flame thrower!!!
 

ben parris

Registered User
Disaster with my allroad yesterday, went up country, had a spat of driving in limp mode and an audible change to a louder drone from the exhaust, eased off and it cleared so carried on for 3 hours. Parked up had a full day shooting, got back in the car at 5, drove off, all good.
Hit the motorway same spat of limp mode and same sound, a louder drone, eased off, it cleared, so I carried on.
5 miles from home BLUE SMOKE, bitch... not bellowing out but noticeable.
Dropped my friend off, still smoking even on idle.
Got home, plugged in, no fault codes.
Left it overnight, started up next day rough idle. I have just changed my exhaust manifolds which lead me to check the turbo. So I took off the exhaust side and stated her up. The wheel is badly coked and the chattering was quite severe.
I have taken the turbo off, there is play in the shaft and there was a clip missing which holds the actuator arm in place, however it was still attached. It is now off to adam at tdi turbos.
When I first put the manifolds on I took it for a spin and forgot to put the vacuum pipe back on from the n75 to the egr, this was quickly rectified as I heard the same audible drone.
I have checked the egr and it's fine.
I have checked the pcv that is fine too.
Oil feed to the turbo is fine and I have just serviced too, oil level was spot on.
So I'm looking for causes, if anyone has any ideas?
also wondering is it ok for me to start the engine without the turbo in place (obviously making sure the oil feed goes into the return) to rule out valves or piston ring wear.
 

two left feet

Registered User
Just took the intake manifolds out of the degreaser tank, worked like a charm. Might do the blow torch thing for the fun of it, but the degreaser stripped 95% of the oil out. I used this stuff diluted 1:5.
 

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two left feet

Registered User
Update. New injectors are in, all road FMIC with aluminum boost pipes are in. New 4bar MAP is in.
Just waiting for Chris to check the install, then I will be able to fire her up.....
 

adamss24

Registered User
Disaster with my allroad yesterday, went up country, had a spat of driving in limp mode and an audible change to a louder drone from the exhaust, eased off and it cleared so carried on for 3 hours. Parked up had a full day shooting, got back in the car at 5, drove off, all good.
Hit the motorway same spat of limp mode and same sound, a louder drone, eased off, it cleared, so I carried on.
5 miles from home BLUE SMOKE, bitch... not bellowing out but noticeable.
Dropped my friend off, still smoking even on idle.
Got home, plugged in, no fault codes.
Left it overnight, started up next day rough idle. I have just changed my exhaust manifolds which lead me to check the turbo. So I took off the exhaust side and stated her up. The wheel is badly coked and the chattering was quite severe.
I have taken the turbo off, there is play in the shaft and there was a clip missing which holds the actuator arm in place, however it was still attached. It is now off to adam at tdi turbos.
When I first put the manifolds on I took it for a spin and forgot to put the vacuum pipe back on from the n75 to the egr, this was quickly rectified as I heard the same audible drone.
I have checked the egr and it's fine.
I have checked the pcv that is fine too.
Oil feed to the turbo is fine and I have just serviced too, oil level was spot on.
So I'm looking for causes, if anyone has any ideas?
also wondering is it ok for me to start the engine without the turbo in place (obviously making sure the oil feed goes into the return) to rule out valves or piston ring wear.
HI Ben, did you check the air filter ? Had a friend on which the turbo sucked the air filter in and got damaged in the process, also were there any debris in the new manifolds ? Had a few cars with bad manifolds that jammed the vnt mechanism and produced the drone as the exhaust gases did not spin the turbine anymore due to damaged vnt ring...

you can get a suitable bolt and nut with 2 copper washers to block the oil feed pipe to check engine's health !
 

ben parris

Registered User
HI chris
thanks for reply
air filter was ok a new one put in, have checked the breather on the top of the engine that is good. Adam said the shaft seems fine but they can see it's been leaking. He is busy moving premises over the weekend so will not be able to strip it down until next week. Not sure about insides of manifolds, that is a possibility.
Should the engine start without the turbo on?
can you tell me if there is anything else I need to check please.
hope you had a good time away...
 

adamss24

Registered User
It's a bit unusual for the turbo to leak, in the end the turbo had a full overhaul with new seals and gaskets... Only place it could leak was at the exhaust side if the downpipe flange warps due to heat...

My hybrids are very reliable with 0 failures to date however i will drop them as manufacturing costs are too high and i make very little on them... On the other hand the gtb2260vk are very robust and can take loads of abuse at the same time...
 
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two left feet

Registered User
the boost pipes are now in matt black "stealth" mode. (just to not be seen - nothing to do with thermodynamics)
 

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two left feet

Registered User
Took a photo of the cams during the injector install, after only 40,000 km they look a little scarred. (not with long life oil) no sign of popped rocker arms this time though.
 

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adamss24

Registered User
Were there any deep ridges when you looked at the cams andrew ? From picture they look rather ok to me... very busy this week but will try to dig them injectors that i have at the garage so we can get your car running as it should...
 

two left feet

Registered User
finishing touch mode now. gtb2260vk installed by Chris with adapter, race 683 nozzles on AFB injectors, and today removed the EGR entirely and replaced with plates. First drive with remap from Chris was a little scary, and blew one of the boost connectors, all tightened now. Boost really kicks in around 2000 rpm, idle is a little rough. Will need another remap to really put all the pieces together. Currently keeping the rpm below 3000 rpm until a new remap is available. Found a few missing bolts with the EGR out.
IMG_0368.JPG
 

adamss24

Registered User
Looks so much cleaner now Andrew and one less issue to worry about ! I will have again a look at your map, need to modify Start of injection maps and End of injection maps to suit the new pop pressures, however i believe they pop a bit too high... still overwhelmed with work at the garage, work was piling up whilst away on holiday... i will get your car to drive as it should, it just needs a little time. It's a pity because you cannot do logs and doing mapping on the fly is not the best way to tune a motor...
 

adamss24

Registered User
I am going back home middle of August, i could stop again on the way there and fix whatever bugs there are... as i said, most ingredients are there, i will get a set of nozzles fitted to a good set of injectors and we'll see how it goes ! Should be a pretty fun car to drive then. You might neex to consider stiffer springs and larger brakes/better pads- whilst the car stopped ok, i found the suspension fighting to grip and a bit soft. You said that the car has H&R sway bars ? Try using the 2nd setting as there was a little too much roll for my liking ! Keep up the good work, i am really waiting for that dino plot...
 

two left feet

Registered User
Hi Chris, good to see you found some quiet time this morning.
August looks OK for me, if its not too much of a bother for you. (BBQ is still waiting)
Will get the sway bars on the harder setting, and get the radiator fan replaced also. Is there anything else i should look at / get done in the meantime (based on what you felt?) e.g pump timing ?
Also, how should i drive the car in the meantime with the map you mailed me ? my intention was to keep the rpms below 3000 and not overly stress the car until it had the right tune.
take care, see you next month.
Andrew
 

adamss24

Registered User
I would check pump timing with vcds, if the car starts ok then it's not too far off. Best to have it adjusted really...
That gtb2260vk is a big turbo, you wont get much boost under 2000rpm's as the fueling is masivelly reduced to minimize smoking off boost. Best to get a EGT gauge and measure EMP vs Boost/IMP...
 

adamss24

Registered User
I would look at a dual boost/egt gauge, there are a few companies that do them. I only have experience with VEI Systems, they do some neat gauges fully customisable. I would pay a bit extra and get a quality EGT probe, cheap ones don't last and i have seen a few which broke and ended up damaging tbe vnt mechanism and turbine blades !
 

two left feet

Registered User
Looking at McNally combo EGT/Boost, no one imports them to EU so will have to arrange a pickup in the US. Took the car out to 4000 rpm today on autobahn, very impressive, though i start to get flywheel rumbling with too much right foot. No smoke though. Will take the car to the local garage and get the Pump timing looked at and also change the viscous fan. Had a small problem also the last days, the bonnet cable came away from the latch mechanism. I couldn't move the latch manually for love or money from under the car. So I have to will let the garage take care of this too. I did however manage to change the mirror in the passengers side mirror. Cheers
 

adamss24

Registered User
I have a feq more maps with different SOI and slightly tweaked boost maps but they will have to wait a bit 'till back to uk...
You will have to learn how to drive it, tweaked diesels need driving with a touch more revs as they will produce too much torque low down...enough to upset the clutch and flywheel combo.
The way car drove on first drive was reslly fast, not far off from 300 Bhp and 600Nm...
 

two left feet

Registered User
Thanks again for the advise Chris, i will be mindful of the revs.
Today i had the car at the local independent garage. I asked them to sort s few little items (viscous fan and opening the bonnet), and they ran the diagnostics over the diesel pump and came up with some errors. They suggested that the pump needed refurbishing....we discussed this the other week as a possible cause for our issue getting the tuning right...
 

two left feet

Registered User
Just completed the first autobahn 400 km road trip. 1) made it without any problems. 2) torque starts really early 3) keep the revs over 3000 rpm to avoid drive train rumble 4) moderate black cloud when flooring it over 3000 rpm 5) lots of smiles 6) wait till the tuning is sorted....7) hit 240 kph and there was plenty left...
Can't wait to drive home on Friday :) :) :)
 

adamss24

Registered User
So it looks like the old girl has a new lease of life !?! I told you that the old girl will impress you when fully done ! I drove many, many cars and to this date i love the v6 for simplicity and reasonable reliability !
 

dwass

Registered User
chris are you still around ?? was wondering if you could help me with 402 mod on my AR ( C6 chassis) could pop in tomorrow afternoon thanks buddy
 

adamss24

Registered User
Yes mate, i will be at the garage all day ! I have not done it on a c6 yet though, is there a procedure for that as with the c5 ? Cheers !
 

two left feet

Registered User
now after 500 kms, the idle is settling down !
btw, Diesel Bob in the meantime confirmed they set the pop pressure to 228 bar across the 6 injectors.
 

adamss24

Registered User
I do hope for you they will work fine, i had a few sets set by dieselbob with raised pop pressures and they did not deliver as they should, had to keep pressures close to standard. Both sets that i had shimmed by Bob did the same noise like on your car and i had a fresh refurbished injector pump.
 

adamss24

Registered User
In the meantime i would keep top speeds reasonable as the stop screw and actuator may still need fine tuning- easy to set with a EMP/EGT gauge...
 

two left feet

Registered User
Again good advise Chris, and i do still have the injector noise.....anyway let me know when you are next travelling through Germany.
Just for my understanding, the opening pressure spec should be 221 bar for the AFB injectors.
PS. also noted that the oil temp increased to 120°C at higher speeds
 
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adamss24

Registered User
I don't have a solution to the oil temperature issue so far so i would not keep the car at high sustained speeds for too long for fear of cooking the oil ! Stick to a good quality 5w40 fully synthetic oil and drop it a bit more often than usual ! I will try to see if i can get a smaller oil cooler core and sandwich plate to work with the v6 tdi however space is limited there as the AC compressor is in the way...
 

two left feet

Registered User
I will keep an eye on the temp and also keep the speed down. EGT will arrive soon hopefully and I will book the car in for pump rebuild next week. Tomorrow another 400 km home trip...
 

adamss24

Registered User
Good luck making the trip back ! I don't really trust analog gauges as they are not too acurate but i will tread with caution in mind just in case... i remember on my old cae the gauge climbing pretty sharp once i've booted the car but i never kept the car sustained high speed- it's easy to loose licence in uk for speeding
 

two left feet

Registered User
Trip back was a doddle, too many road works to open her up. I did have about 30 mins with open roads though, and as long as you keep with the boost (over 3000rpm) it's just delightful to drive. Still lots of injector clatter between 2-3000 though. diesel Bob confirmed 228 bar on all injectors, but this is about 8 bar too high for AFB spec, would this cause the clatter?
I noticed the fuel economy improved also, now getting about 1200 km per tank.
 
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