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brembo 18z brake upgrade project.

Just Rob. Feb 18, 2017

  1. Just Rob.

    Just Rob. Moderator Staff Member Moderator Team Brilliant Black Team Daytona TFSI Owners Group Team V8 VCDS Map User Gold Supporter Audi RS4 Audi A4 Audi Avant Owner Group quattro S-line owners group Manual

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    As in the title really chaps, thought i'd share my little project .
    So postman pat delivered the calipers and brake kit yesterday and so i'm ready to rock and roll with things.
    I know from reading a lot of other posts that many guys have encounter problems with doing the upgrade and I did have my reservations also, having already purchased a new kit a while back and the decided to give the mod the miss I was really hoping things were going to be straight forward, any thus far it appears that things are looking good.

    Bought the calipers used but in VGC working order etc for a really good price , just need painting , which is fine for me as I wanted to choose my own colour anyway.
    after help from tony and carl I ordered the fitting kit which I must say came really fast and they are very helpful, just waiting for the HEL lines to arrive otherwise everything was in the kit.

    So then managed to get the caliper organised for painting on Monday (another job less) , in the meantime I decided to do a dry fit now to ensure if there were any issues I could address them.
    best plan was to remove a front wheel, fit the pads in the caliper and fit the caliper on the disk in the correct position, then position the disk and caliper in the wheel upside down , having made sure everything was lined up I took some pics .
    It all appears to fit ok with no contact with the inner wheel spokes or rim , that caliper certainly fill an 18" rim , snug in a word.
    So when the calipers are back in there new rob's special livery and the brake lines are here I will wack it all on.

    pics so far.
    bre1.JPG bre2.JPG bre3.JPG bre4.JPG bre5.JPG bre6.JPG
     
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  3. tony mc

    tony mc Well-Known Member Team Phantom Audi A4 Audi Avant Owner Group

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    wow, tight, nice Rob mate, how did the caliper and disc mount like was it hassle free also
     
  4. Just Rob.

    Just Rob. Moderator Staff Member Moderator Team Brilliant Black Team Daytona TFSI Owners Group Team V8 VCDS Map User Gold Supporter Audi RS4 Audi A4 Audi Avant Owner Group quattro S-line owners group Manual

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    Tony, something has to go right for me at the moment mate, I seem to be struggling with one problem after another , anyway, I was amazed frankly that it all fitted in that well , albeit a dry fit but I was very carefull to make sure everthing was aligned etc and in the right position , and things look to be fine, plenty of space between caliper body and wheel spokes and still a bit of air space between the inner rim surface, and considering I have 18" rims aswell.
    I expect there may be a bit less space between the rim spoke when its all fitted to the car on a final fix but only a mm or so, still plenty of space .
    disks are a right old lump of metal but the calipers a nice and light, so combined with my nice light rims I still think the end result will be a tad lighter than the original oem setup.
     
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  5. tony mc

    tony mc Well-Known Member Team Phantom Audi A4 Audi Avant Owner Group

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    looking good mate
     
  6. Just Rob.

    Just Rob. Moderator Staff Member Moderator Team Brilliant Black Team Daytona TFSI Owners Group Team V8 VCDS Map User Gold Supporter Audi RS4 Audi A4 Audi Avant Owner Group quattro S-line owners group Manual

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    wait till you see my colour chart... , its red hot hot mate..lol
     
  7. tony mc

    tony mc Well-Known Member Team Phantom Audi A4 Audi Avant Owner Group

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    have you gone for a levi roots theme
     
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  8. carlcall

    carlcall Well-Known Member Team Brilliant Black VCDS Map User Audi A4 Audi Avant Owner Group TDi Manual

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    It's about time something went right for you Rob....

    Can't wait to see these on the old girl.....let's see if you nearly go through the windscreen first time you tap the brake pedal.


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  9. Just Rob.

    Just Rob. Moderator Staff Member Moderator Team Brilliant Black Team Daytona TFSI Owners Group Team V8 VCDS Map User Gold Supporter Audi RS4 Audi A4 Audi Avant Owner Group quattro S-line owners group Manual

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    i'm hoping for a nice progressive feel to them chaps , if I don't like them then there history....and the old setup is going straight back on..
     
  10. ajax1976

    ajax1976 Well-Known Member

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    Make sure you remember to flip the bleeders and balance pipe around when rebuilding them.
     
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  11. Just Rob.

    Just Rob. Moderator Staff Member Moderator Team Brilliant Black Team Daytona TFSI Owners Group Team V8 VCDS Map User Gold Supporter Audi RS4 Audi A4 Audi Avant Owner Group quattro S-line owners group Manual

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    yep, will do , thanks for the reminder....I would have overlooked that one knowing me...
     
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  13. carlcall

    carlcall Well-Known Member Team Brilliant Black VCDS Map User Audi A4 Audi Avant Owner Group TDi Manual

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    I've heard that Rob has has gotten rid of his new BBK and gone for different set-up.......

    [​IMG]

    :tongueclosed:
     
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  14. Just Rob.

    Just Rob. Moderator Staff Member Moderator Team Brilliant Black Team Daytona TFSI Owners Group Team V8 VCDS Map User Gold Supporter Audi RS4 Audi A4 Audi Avant Owner Group quattro S-line owners group Manual

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    now that is a BBK...lol, not off the shelf pads either......haha
     
  15. Just Rob.

    Just Rob. Moderator Staff Member Moderator Team Brilliant Black Team Daytona TFSI Owners Group Team V8 VCDS Map User Gold Supporter Audi RS4 Audi A4 Audi Avant Owner Group quattro S-line owners group Manual

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    Well on a crappy stormy day it seemed like a good time to semi - finish my caliper refub / paint.

    After taking on board the advice from you guys on wet paint being ok and spending way too long looking at a vast array of colours , I decided to go back to colour option 1a , my fav colour , good old "RED" , I know it's a colour that's done to death these days but I think the brembo's on a black car do look better red than other colours, don't get me wrong all the other colours are great , but I just cant help going with red ....I think it's a old guy thing...lol

    So didn't fancy lashing out anymore £££ on the project as I had set my limit for the final fix at £550 on the road as they say, and thus far I am still within budget, i'll now need a set of dust covers due to 3 being less than ideal but those included I should come in on budget, just.

    So after a fair bit of prep work , some good old painting and use of the my good ladies kitchen oven they are done, albeit fitting the three new dust seals...
    I used a tin of E-tech caliper paint I had left over from the last caliper paint episode , those small tins seem to last for ever, probably enough to do the rear upgrades shortly aswell.
    Applied some new decals, not the original brembo or porsche ones, but decided to get some RS ones , not that I am trying to make it an RS4 far from it, but just a bit of an alternative to the norm, RS on my avant being short for "Rob's Special" .

    Anyways, pretty well all sorted and nearly ready to fit, still waiting on the HEL brake lines that appear to be long winded getting here.
    A few pics , no pro paint jobs here i'm afraid , nor specialist caliper overhauls, just a old guy doing some DIY brake upgrading and enjoying it at the same time.

    They work for me , probably nowwhere near as good a job as many guys on here so don't be to harsh on my work....
    just need to get the rest all fitted asap now.

    cheers
    rob
    rs41.JPG rs46.JPG
     
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  16. ajax1976

    ajax1976 Well-Known Member

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    I had a nightmare with HEL when I was doing the lines on my coupe and will never use them again. They were custom ones and took forever to arrive, when they eventually did arrive they were the 8cm shorter than I'd ordered. Phoned up and complained and they agreed to do them again, arrived quicker and the length was right but wrong colour of hose, ended up keeping the two sets and my money back. For custom hoses they are also very expensive compared to less well known brands.
    I've actually got an unused set of HEL RS4 lines in the garage if anyone else needs some for the 18z conversion.
     
  17. Just Rob.

    Just Rob. Moderator Staff Member Moderator Team Brilliant Black Team Daytona TFSI Owners Group Team V8 VCDS Map User Gold Supporter Audi RS4 Audi A4 Audi Avant Owner Group quattro S-line owners group Manual

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    PM me about the lines chap...as I cant wait for the HEL much longer.
     
  18. Just Rob.

    Just Rob. Moderator Staff Member Moderator Team Brilliant Black Team Daytona TFSI Owners Group Team V8 VCDS Map User Gold Supporter Audi RS4 Audi A4 Audi Avant Owner Group quattro S-line owners group Manual

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    Ajax, have PM'd you aswell re the lines.
     
  19. Just Rob.

    Just Rob. Moderator Staff Member Moderator Team Brilliant Black Team Daytona TFSI Owners Group Team V8 VCDS Map User Gold Supporter Audi RS4 Audi A4 Audi Avant Owner Group quattro S-line owners group Manual

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    OK then, looks like the brake lines may turn up tomorrow but i'm not holding my breath just yet.... anyway if they do what sort of time scale would one expect to allow to do the swap over.
    So change the discs, fit calipers and bleed the system....that's is provided there are no unforeseen problems.
    I'm thinking 1 1/2 per side , so all in 3 hour job , that is off course allowing for tea & biscuits in between...haha , got to have those important bits..lol

    any thoughts chaps.

    rob
     
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  20. Dani_B19

    Dani_B19 Audi-sports own special child.

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    Sounds about right chap.
     
  21. S3DUST

    S3DUST Just add boost :D

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    These will be awesome! My Q7 runs them and they stop 2.5 ton very well ! So on a lighter car they will be EPIC

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  22. Just Rob.

    Just Rob. Moderator Staff Member Moderator Team Brilliant Black Team Daytona TFSI Owners Group Team V8 VCDS Map User Gold Supporter Audi RS4 Audi A4 Audi Avant Owner Group quattro S-line owners group Manual

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    project aborted now due to a large cockup with a supposed " fitting kit" that wont fit......why the sellers don'tcheck what they sell is beyond me , it really is.
    wasted my whole afternoon and evening , I am so angry I could just ...well you get me drift..
     
  23. carlcall

    carlcall Well-Known Member Team Brilliant Black VCDS Map User Audi A4 Audi Avant Owner Group TDi Manual

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    Why what's up Rob?


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  24. S3DUST

    S3DUST Just add boost :D

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    What's the issue ?

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  25. Just Rob.

    Just Rob. Moderator Staff Member Moderator Team Brilliant Black Team Daytona TFSI Owners Group Team V8 VCDS Map User Gold Supporter Audi RS4 Audi A4 Audi Avant Owner Group quattro S-line owners group Manual

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    I'm a man on the edge carl......that so called fitting kit from ebay is a non starter chap, eithr discs are wrong or bolts are wrong or its all wrong......it has really issed me off after the guy assured me this was a total solution for the 18z fiting...., I don't think so..
    sorry to rant carl...i'll calm down in a minutes...and after a couple of stiff drinks...
     
  26. S3DUST

    S3DUST Just add boost :D

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    Oh no its really frustrating when you are told something will work and it doesn't.... along with all the prep work you must be screwing ! Is it the offset the disk that causes an issue ?

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  27. carlcall

    carlcall Well-Known Member Team Brilliant Black VCDS Map User Audi A4 Audi Avant Owner Group TDi Manual

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    Everyone is entitled to a rant Rob.
    How do you mean they are wrong?

    I'm sure someone else on here used them for the 18z conversion but can't remember for the life of me who it was.



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  28. Just Rob.

    Just Rob. Moderator Staff Member Moderator Team Brilliant Black Team Daytona TFSI Owners Group Team V8 VCDS Map User Gold Supporter Audi RS4 Audi A4 Audi Avant Owner Group quattro S-line owners group Manual

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    the problem is with the caliper mounting, as we know the orinal caliper is threaded so the bolts screw into it , no securing nuts required, with these 18z's they are pass through so a nut must be used on the inside of the mouting.
    the bolts and nylock nuts supplied are supposed to be fine , but the nut with a washer is too large and wont sit in the disc recess , it overhangs the edge so hitting the disc. Even if I used a thinner nut it would happen as ther'e is not a massive amount of clearance.
    Part of me says it's the discs that are wrong as the nuts do need washers and I cant see using silly thin nuts as being ideal...
    just don't know frankly, part of me says to just write the project off and sell the dam stuff and just forget about it all.
     
  29. S3DUST

    S3DUST Just add boost :D

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    Obviously I haven't seen them but could you use the bolt the other way round ? So that the bolt head is where you are struggling for space and the nut the other side?

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  30. Just Rob.

    Just Rob. Moderator Staff Member Moderator Team Brilliant Black Team Daytona TFSI Owners Group Team V8 VCDS Map User Gold Supporter Audi RS4 Audi A4 Audi Avant Owner Group quattro S-line owners group Manual

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    they supplies allen bolts with sleeves and nylock nuts, its a work of art just getting the nut on chap , you could use a bolt what ever head type from the other way due to the disc being in the way, the mounting bolts have to fit from outside the caliper.

    dd5.JPG

    you can see a clearance gap in the pic above, on mine the nut is jammed right into the disk and the disk wont mount flush or move....
     
  31. carlcall

    carlcall Well-Known Member Team Brilliant Black VCDS Map User Audi A4 Audi Avant Owner Group TDi Manual

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    So if the calliper is pushed up to the hub, does the disc sit centrally in the calliper or not as this would show the disc as being wrong.


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  32. S3DUST

    S3DUST Just add boost :D

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    Wow yes see what you mean... really the only way to do that is have the carrier tapped so that you can use a shorter bolt that screws straight into the carrier. What a pita !

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  34. Just Rob.

    Just Rob. Moderator Staff Member Moderator Team Brilliant Black Team Daytona TFSI Owners Group Team V8 VCDS Map User Gold Supporter Audi RS4 Audi A4 Audi Avant Owner Group quattro S-line owners group Manual

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    before I fitted the nut on carl the disk was central in the caliper body which kinda discounted the disc being at fault but as the nut fouls the disc quite a bit it also pointed towards the disk. with the disc mounted securely it is impossible to get the nut on full stop carl , just cant be done, only if you loosen the disc right of and pull it away from the moutning face can you then just about get the nut on but then the disc wont go back on flush, it just fouls the disc....I just don't know..
     
  35. Just Rob.

    Just Rob. Moderator Staff Member Moderator Team Brilliant Black Team Daytona TFSI Owners Group Team V8 VCDS Map User Gold Supporter Audi RS4 Audi A4 Audi Avant Owner Group quattro S-line owners group Manual

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    seriously considering sending it all back on Monday , selling calipers and forgetting it ...
     
  36. carlcall

    carlcall Well-Known Member Team Brilliant Black VCDS Map User Audi A4 Audi Avant Owner Group TDi Manual

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    So if I get this right.....it's basically the bolt that's too long


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  37. carlcall

    carlcall Well-Known Member Team Brilliant Black VCDS Map User Audi A4 Audi Avant Owner Group TDi Manual

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    You'll only regret it pal.....need to find out who else has done the same upgrade and what their bolts were like.


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  38. Just Rob.

    Just Rob. Moderator Staff Member Moderator Team Brilliant Black Team Daytona TFSI Owners Group Team V8 VCDS Map User Gold Supporter Audi RS4 Audi A4 Audi Avant Owner Group quattro S-line owners group Manual

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    nope , the bolt is spot on length wise , and the supplied nut is what you'd expect to use with it, just not enough room between the disc face/ recess edge and the nut, which does suggest the disc is the problem.
     
  39. carlcall

    carlcall Well-Known Member Team Brilliant Black VCDS Map User Audi A4 Audi Avant Owner Group TDi Manual

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    Have you got a steel ruler so you can see how high the disc is in total including the hat.


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  40. Just Rob.

    Just Rob. Moderator Staff Member Moderator Team Brilliant Black Team Daytona TFSI Owners Group Team V8 VCDS Map User Gold Supporter Audi RS4 Audi A4 Audi Avant Owner Group quattro S-line owners group Manual

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    I've had a thought now I have calmed down a few clicks..... I will assemble the caliper with bolts using a spacer the same thickness as the mounting bracket on the upright, that way I can take a better picture of the problem and how much space there is, or lack of it .
     
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  41. ajax1976

    ajax1976 Well-Known Member

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    Do you know what disc the kit uses?

    I've never had any clearance issues with the various discs I've used once bolted up. I used to hold the disc on the hub loosely with the wheel studs. It is fiddly to get the nuts started, easiest way is to pop the nut in an open ended spanner and slip it in through where the inboard pad would sit then thread the bolt into the nut from the rear. I've never used the sleeved bolts although can't see that being the issue, I use m16 bolts with the threaded section turned down to M14, a stepped bolt with ******* threaded nut(not nyloc).

    [​IMG]

    It's still a fair size of nut though and cleared the disc fine. The recommended ML disc has to have the centre machined out to fit over the Audi hub, most discs I've used have a chamfered edge so it's easy to see if it has been machined as there won't be a lot of the chamfer left, do yours look like they've been done? What are the dimensions of the disc hat?
     
  42. Just Rob.

    Just Rob. Moderator Staff Member Moderator Team Brilliant Black Team Daytona TFSI Owners Group Team V8 VCDS Map User Gold Supporter Audi RS4 Audi A4 Audi Avant Owner Group quattro S-line owners group Manual

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    Its bonkers really as the when the disc is securely fixed and the caliper in place securely but no nuts on the caliper is spot on central with the disk.
    I did also use the open ended spanner method but with the disk nipped up you cannot get the nut on , its a non starter from any angle, if the disc is loosen off a fair bit the top edge can be moved out and the nut fitted but then the disc wont go back on flush as the nut is pushing the disc outwrds to much.
    had a look at the disc and they are M-tech 345mm drilled discs, not sure until the morning the other dimensions , just really anyoning as the seller states this kit will fit, and it wont.
     
  43. Just Rob.

    Just Rob. Moderator Staff Member Moderator Team Brilliant Black Team Daytona TFSI Owners Group Team V8 VCDS Map User Gold Supporter Audi RS4 Audi A4 Audi Avant Owner Group quattro S-line owners group Manual

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