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Facelift BIL11 85 Audi RS3 Build

billymc92 Jan 10, 2018

  1. AudiNutta

    AudiNutta Well-Known Member Team Racing Blue Mica Sportback Audi RS3 quattro

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    Great thanks! Will that improve a stock car though? Not going down the remap route...
     
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  3. Leo-RS

    Leo-RS Well-Known Member

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    Doubtful there would be a noticeable driving effect other than placebo, you’re not going to feel a 5-10hp increase in power in the real world. On the dyno there may be a very slight increase, on the stop watch there may be a very slight decrease.

    Stage 1 tuning would only break something if there was already a manufacturing defect present that would cause failure anyway. Stage 1 tuning by a reputable tuner keeps everything safe, it’s a moderate boost in power. Audi component design and specs have high engineering tolerances. You could always purchase a secondary ecu if you really wanted to go down the tuning path and keep your warranty. ECU swaps are plug and play, in and out within a few minutes. Would obviously cost a bit more having to purchase a 2nd ECU (£1k?) but a way around the TD1 issue. Mileage is not stored on the ecu’s so as long as the coding is replicated onto the 2nd ecu, all is good.

    Saying all that and back to the discussion, I have no idea if the eventuri is doing the car any good, it may well do. These are just my opinions on intakes in general. Keep an eye on MRC’s Facebook page for updates as they will likely have more cars in for Stage 2 tuning on the standard boxes.
     
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  4. D0C

    D0C Well-Known Member Team Nardo Team Panther Audi RS3 TTRS

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    Interesting re the extra ECU comment. I would actually be inclined to do that if remapping a brand new car. Are ECUs easy to get hold of, or could someone like MRC get one?
     
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  5. Ed_rx7

    Ed_rx7 Active Member

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    interesting Leo-.... be told by two separate sources that the mileage is recorded on the VC and gearbox ecu as well as the ECU its self..... based on a FL though?
     
  6. Shawn8V

    Shawn8V Active Member

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    New ecu’s have a component protection lock on it, you gotta know someone with the correct tools to get it removed before you can use it.
     
  7. Leo-RS

    Leo-RS Well-Known Member

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    Ed, I am not 100% certain on the facelift RS3, I am going off my RS6 ecu (MY16 car) - This definitely does not record mileage on it as I have used dual ecu’s in my car whilst testing. This was done via postage from MRC to me at home. First thing I said to Doug at MRC is surely that won’t work due to mileage discrepancies and he said It’s a common misconception that it’s stored in the ECU’s, they’re not. Right enough when I fitted the 2nd ecu, there was no difference noted in the mileage nor any error codes come up. When he sent me the 2nd ECU he would not have possibly known what my mileage was to match. I was driving the car between postage date and receive also.

    It’s certainly worth asking MRC about and yes they do have the ability to get 2nd ECU’s. You leave your factory ECU stock and tune the 2nd one. Any issues, connect your standard one back up, Bobs your uncle. It’s a way to beat the TD1.

    For the pre facelift RS3 8v this is also the case as I have a friend out in South Africa that runs dual ECU’s for warranty reasons.

    There’s also Syvecs ECU’s but they are expensive.
     
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2018
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  8. AudiNutta

    AudiNutta Well-Known Member Team Racing Blue Mica Sportback Audi RS3 quattro

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    Why do you think a decrease on a stopwatch?

    Nothing might be broken now, but there is nothing saying that there isn’t a component on the road to failure even if Stage 1 doesn’t affect that. I need Audi to partner up with a tuning company and offer a map, which won’t ever happen. It’s inevitable in my 4-6 year expected ownership, I will have a good few claims on the engine / drivetrain, knowing my luck.

    With the separate ECU, but it wouldn’t be untraceable. Surely the ECU’s record data for a period of time? If my car breaks down at the side of the road, I swap the ECU.. Audi plug the car in, see no engine data for months....??
     
  9. Leo-RS

    Leo-RS Well-Known Member

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    A decrease on the stopwatch? Figure of speech, you increase power by 5-10hp, you won’t feel it but it may reduce your 0-100mph time by 5/100 of a second. Hence the decrease on a stopwatch statement.

    You’re asking about intakes but you don’t want to tune the car? If you did have a failure with an intake fitted, you would lose your warranty as the airflow going into the engine has changed from OEM spec.

    You are over thinking things by about a factor of 10 and just guessing what may happen. If there isn’t a TD1 flag, your ecu would never be sent to Germany for investigation, that costs a lot of money, a lot of time, it’s forensicially broken down. Yours wouldn’t flag TD1 with a secondary ecu so why would you think that they would bother forensically investigating your Ecu? It’s Audi Germany, not the CIA.

    There’s a hell of a lot of scaremongering on car forum sites, people guessing, making things up in their heads and trying to convince themselves and others that it’s all doom and gloom and Armageddon. If your ECU is standard, there is no further investigation, they sign off on the new engine and it’s replaced. Simple.

    Also you are being overly cautious on the tuning front, Hank Iroz is running close to 800hp on his RS3 so what makes you think that a stage 1 480hp tune is going to break? The failure rate for Stage 1 maps must be in the ratio of high tens of thousands to 1. I’ve been around the forums for about 15yrs now and Stage 1 tunes just do not break cars. Unless there is an inherent fault known, like the Golf R turbo issue (those failed on standard cars too) - On this new engine, there are no such issues known.

    I take it you went for the extended 4/5yr warranty then? A lot of people would probably choose year 2-3 to tune the car based on probability. Standard warranty is up at 36 months, tune at say 30 months and you’re risking 6 months. Tune at 3 months and you’re risking 33 months.

    The engines and transmissions will cope with Stage 1 and 2 no problems. It’s stage 3 and beyond is where you may start to see premature failures. This is just my opinion and based on my experience but of course, you tune the car, there’s always a risk. You have to pay to play at the end of the day.

    For me the risk is worth the rewards. Stage 2 FL RS3 is Audi R8 V10+ quick. At a fraction of the cost.
     
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  10. Boosta

    Boosta Member Team Daytona Sportback Audi RS3

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    I could be wrong
    Is a stage 1 tune just bringing the car back to the state of tune before the detune for emissions ?
    if so the engine is not going to be over stressed.
     
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  11. Leo-RS

    Leo-RS Well-Known Member

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    Not exactly but the RS6 for example went from 560 to 605 under the “performance” tag. All it was was a 0.1bar boost increase from 1.2 bar to 1.3 bar on the turbos.

    TTRS first generation went from 340-360 under the + tag.

    It’s likely the RS3/TTRS will also see a + tag somewhere in their life cycle especially if the A45 comes with the stated 405ps engine. Hazard a guess they will release a 425ps RS3/TTRS as a result.

    And yes, just a boost increase.

    Billy, apologies, just remembered this is your build thread, wrong place to be discussing all this. Thread back to you.
     
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  13. AudiNutta

    AudiNutta Well-Known Member Team Racing Blue Mica Sportback Audi RS3 quattro

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    BUT, an intake is a bolt on bolt off part with absolutely no trace.

    From what I’ve heard, the cars are plugged in and Germany can sit at their desks and read the ECU and it wouldn’t be difficult to check history of boost and mixtures? That’s what I’ve taken away from numerous discussions on the forum.

    Yes I have the 5 year warranty.
     
  14. Leo-RS

    Leo-RS Well-Known Member

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    That doesn’t make any sense especially when we are talking about the standard ECU. You’re making things up in your head now. Too much scaremongering from people they have read stuff on the internet with no real knowledge about what they are talking about.

    With a standard ecu, where do you reckon these engineers in Germany are going to find all these tuned readings from? In addition if you think Audi Germany have a control centre full of engineers just sitting waiting on forensically investigating ECUs every time a warranty claim is made, you are very much mistaken. If there was a TD1 warranty flag generated and the owner did not know anything about it (say bought used car) then the ECU would physically be sent back to Germany for investigation.

    Over and out on this one, you can continue to believe that Audi pay forensic detectives to routinely catch people out for no reason (No TD1 flag on a standard ecu) and I’ll continue to have my cars tuned and ignore internet hearsay and scaremongering. You would think that top tuners like MRC would know what they were talking about eh?
     
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  15. AudiNutta

    AudiNutta Well-Known Member Team Racing Blue Mica Sportback Audi RS3 quattro

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    Alright sorry!!

    Just after a bit of advice from somebody who knows what’s going on, you can’t blame me for believing what has been discussed on the forum in the past.
     
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  16. billymc92

    billymc92 2018 Ara Blue Facelift RS3

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    So shall I go for the milltek exhaust with or without silencers :eyes:
     
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  17. q5man

    q5man Well known member Team Mythos TFSI Owners Group Gold Supporter Audi Q5 quattro

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    I think you need the silencers, as sounds like your beast is loud enough


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  18. Shawn8V

    Shawn8V Active Member

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    Go for whatever your ears will be able to tolerate.
     
    Last edited: Feb 26, 2018
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  19. terminator x

    terminator x Well-Known Member

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    Hey butt out fella ;)

    TX.

    Sent from my BBB100-2 using Tapatalk
     
  20. billymc92

    billymc92 2018 Ara Blue Facelift RS3

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    :tearsofjoy::tearsofjoy::tearsofjoy::tearsofjoy: Sorry I’ll see myself out
     
  21. billymc92

    billymc92 2018 Ara Blue Facelift RS3

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    I’ve just done another 4 launches tonight :kissingclosed:

     
    Last edited: Feb 26, 2018
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  22. q5man

    q5man Well known member Team Mythos TFSI Owners Group Gold Supporter Audi Q5 quattro

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    #WakingupTheNeighbourhood
    Sounds like F1 cars used to!


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
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  23. Kristijan Sabljar

    Kristijan Sabljar Well-Known Member

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    Non resonated , bang it :D

    U can easily buy middle box after if is loud
     
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  24. billymc92

    billymc92 2018 Ara Blue Facelift RS3

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    I think you’ve just won me over, now that wasn’t so hard :smilingimp::tearsofjoy:
     
  25. Dodgygtr

    Dodgygtr Active Member

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    Depending how loud yours is I’ll know what to buy lol
     
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  26. Behind The Bins

    Behind The Bins Well-Known Member

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    Hmmm is this on a housing estate?
     
  27. billymc92

    billymc92 2018 Ara Blue Facelift RS3

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    No mate. I’m on a friends private runway
     
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  28. Shawn8V

    Shawn8V Active Member

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    Your friends got a private runaway but records using a potato ? :blink:
     
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  29. billymc92

    billymc92 2018 Ara Blue Facelift RS3

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  30. Behind The Bins

    Behind The Bins Well-Known Member

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    Is that a HD potatoe?
     
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  31. billymc92

    billymc92 2018 Ara Blue Facelift RS3

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  32. Leo-RS

    Leo-RS Well-Known Member

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    Wonder why they run it in fwd mode? All my cars previously have been run in 4wd on their rollers?

    Any explanation Billy?
     
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  34. Ed_rx7

    Ed_rx7 Active Member

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    I thought that too......maybe it gives higher number.....lol only joking
     
  35. Shawn8V

    Shawn8V Active Member

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    Less drivetrain loss. Higher numbers. :yes:
     
  36. billymc92

    billymc92 2018 Ara Blue Facelift RS3

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    I did wonder it myself. It’s the first time I’ve had a dyno and just thought that’s what they always done?
     
  37. AudiNutta

    AudiNutta Well-Known Member Team Racing Blue Mica Sportback Audi RS3 quattro

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    Get more power in FWD only :/ Cut out the Quattro losses? That’s very strange when they have the option to run it out of 4.
     
  38. Leo-RS

    Leo-RS Well-Known Member

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    I know some rolling road operators pull the haldex fuse to cut power to the rear for 2wd single axle dynos. There seems no reason on MRC’s 4wd dyno though unless they have encountered problems running 4wd mode on these cars.

    Interesting reading in this link here and then the technical discussion with Haldex on why you shouldn’t do it at speed with a stationary axle

    http://www.ttforum.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=300967

    Regardless, MRC know what they are doing. I’m sure there’s a very sound reason for it. MRC’s numbers to me read low, lower than every other dyno plot I’ve seen on RS3’s from other tuners ( but larger gains). Some facelift cars are only tuning to 470ps on their dyno (from 390-395) Bare in mind that ps is a lower reading to traditional bhp. Even Billy’s 512ps is only 505bhp. Other stage 2 cars are managing 520-530bhp in other countries around the world. So I wouldn’t say MRC dyno is reading high, the opposite infact as the cars aren’t even reading standard power on their dyno. Cars should read 400ps minimum, look at MRC’s Facebook page and you’ll see some TTRS /RS3’s only recording 390-395ps standard.
     
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  39. 3SR

    3SR Member

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    i read somewhere recently that a 4wd dyno needs to be of a specific kind where the front and back rollers are linked, otherwise you could potentially damage the haldex diff by running 4wd... hence the 2wd-haldex-fuse-pull i would guess
     
  40. Ed_rx7

    Ed_rx7 Active Member

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    Interesting stuff!!!!!!.... I suppose that’s why you can’t get a definitive % for transmission losses
     
  41. Ed_rx7

    Ed_rx7 Active Member

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    Ask them billy and let us know please
     
  42. q5man

    q5man Well known member Team Mythos TFSI Owners Group Gold Supporter Audi Q5 quattro

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  43. Beebee-one

    Beebee-one Well-Known Member Team Glacier Audi RS3

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    Actually it's a simple explanation.......... I was at MRC the week before and they were having maintenance done on the rear set of rollers (Engineer was there with it in pieces). I guess they were waiting for some spare parts when Billy's car was being run.
    My car has been dynoed at MRC in both 4wd and 2wd drive mode with no issues. It made no real definitive difference to the results of the power runs.
     
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