Benjie’s “My S4 gearbox is fine,” thread… Spoiler Alert – it’s not.

Ha ha ha, sorry mate shouldn't laugh but attention to detail ***...they probably noticed and thought ah well it still starts, it'll be ok...*****...


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Okay, so some extra info for you guys... certain ECUs and Mechatronics ECUs do not get on very well at all, causing the ignition to by tried twice before the engine will start. There's a technical bulletin out for certain Mech/ECU combos and it just so happens that mine was in that group.

On the plus side, I have my baby back! Sooooooooooo smooth, slightly different shift points (+/- 1 or 2 mph). Fallen in love with the car again, unfortunately it'll be up for sale in the not-too-distant-future (spread the word!)

Too anyone who contributed their knowledge, time, experience, or just said something nice - thanks for the support with this, sending love to you all!

Here it is in all of it's functioning-gearbox glory!

 
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benjie said:
Okay, so some extra info for you guys... certain ECUs and Mechatronics ECUs do not get on very well at all, causing the ignition to by tried twice before the engine will start. There's a technical bulletin out for certain Mech/ECU combos and it just so happens that mine was in that group.

On the plus side, I have my baby back! Sooooooooooo smooth, slightly different shift points (+/- 1 or 2 mph). Fallen in love with the car again, unfortunately it'll be up for sale in the not-too-distant-future (spread the word!)

Too anyone who contributed their knowledge, time, experience, or just said something nice - thanks for the support with this, sending love to you all!

Here it is in all of it's functioning-gearbox glory!

Click to expand...
@benjie - Great news buddy! :thumbs up:
 
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Just to give you all a bit of a chuckle, I had to take the car back today. The gear changes, whilst really smooth, were not right. Whenever it changed up a gear, the revs jumped a tiny bit, like 200rpm. So went back in, the master tech comes out and apologises that I am having to continually return with issues and asked if I wouldn't mind taking him out to show him the problem. He's a really nice guy and very knowledgeable.

We get down the road and within 1/2 mile he says he's very sorry, but that's how the gearbox is meant to act. As I now have the latest version of the gearbox (as opposed to the first one), there have been a few differences. Namely - B8 S4 customer feedback indicated that they didn't like the jerkiness of the gearbox, so that had been rectified for the B8.5 - the box adds a few revs on gear changes when on light throttle to improve the smoothness. Basically, as I was hyper-aware of the gearbox doing its work, I was essentially being paranoid!

I was so embarrassed. I went to complain that the gearbox was working properly. Awkward.

Having done 50+ miles in it now, it's an absolute joy to drive, so perfectly smooth. The only problem I'm having is that I'm accellerating too hard after being used to driving a car with 1/2 the power for a month - embarrassing around town, an old lady shook her fists at me today... I gave her a toot and a wave!
 
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@benjie do you have access to VCDS? It would be interesting to know see the p/n data from your TCU.
 
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benjie said:
Just to give you all a bit of a chuckle, I had to take the car back today. The gear changes, whilst really smooth, were not right. Whenever it changed up a gear, the revs jumped a tiny bit, like 200rpm. So went back in, the master tech comes out and apologises that I am having to continually return with issues and asked if I wouldn't mind taking him out to show him the problem. He's a really nice guy and very knowledgeable.

We get down the road and within 1/2 mile he says he's very sorry, but that's how the gearbox is meant to act. As I now have the latest version of the gearbox (as opposed to the first one), there have been a few differences. Namely - B8 S4 customer feedback indicated that they didn't like the jerkiness of the gearbox, so that had been rectified for the B8.5 - the box adds a few revs on gear changes when on light throttle to improve the smoothness. Basically, as I was hyper-aware of the gearbox doing its work, I was essentially being paranoid!

I was so embarrassed. I went to complain that the gearbox was working properly. Awkward.

Having done 50+ miles in it now, it's an absolute joy to drive, so perfectly smooth. The only problem I'm having is that I'm accellerating too hard after being used to driving a car with 1/2 the power for a month - embarrassing around town, an old lady shook her fists at me today... I gave her a toot and a wave!
Click to expand...

That's funny, my new 'box was exactly the same, and I didn't like it! It was as if the clutch was slipping as the gear was selected. Put your foot down/ or switch to dynamic, and it changed a bit quicker/better though. I had it all checked and re-checked, and they said it is how they are now!
 
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Previous:
Address 02: Auto Trans (J217) Labels: 0B5-927-156.clb
Part No SW: 8K0 927 156 H HW: 0B5 927 156 D
Component: 0B5 30TFSIRdW H02 0013
Revision: --H02--- Serial number: 0000000255
Coding: 000001
Shop #: WSC 06335 000 00000
ASAM Dataset: EV_TCMDL501 A02051
ROD: EV_TCMDL501.rod
VCID: 397EA785B8CA46F676-806C

No fault code found.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------

NEW:

Address 02: Auto Trans (J217) Labels: 0B5-927-156.clb
Part No SW: 8K5 927 156 H HW: 0B5 927 156 K
Component: 0B5 30TFSIRdW H03 0004
Revision: --H03--- Serial number: 0000000674
Coding: 000001
Shop #: WSC 04742 780 00200
ASAM Dataset: EV_TCMDL501021 A03002
ROD: EV_TCMDL501021.rod
VCID: 3E74B499A1E461CE4C-806A

No fault code found.
 
benjie said:
Part number now has a 5, instead of a 0 - I think the 5 means Avant only, whereas the 0 means any type.
Click to expand...
Yes I think that's correct.

Purely selfishly I am glad that yours is 0B5 927 156 K because so is mine, implying that it is the latest version and had not been revised since, further implying that it is now as revised as it needs to be???

My SW is different though - I have 8K0 927 166. I understand that this is because my engine meets EU6 regs whereas yours should be EU4. Does the redline still match what's shown on your dash or does it fall short?
 
@razza1 Thanks, and thanks so much for all your help whilst I was having all my trouble!

@Dippy I'm not sure what you're asking... Do you mean, "Does it change up at red line or before?"


I'm curious as to why a gearbox would be specific to an Avant? Seems weird.

Also, EU4/5/6 emissions... EU rules. Wonder what implications this will have?
 
As I think you know there were two major revisions of the gearbox. One of these coincided with the facelift (B8.5) and the redline was reduced. I believe on the B8 it was around 7000rpm and on the B8.5 is it around 6250rpm. Now the EU emission rules are obviously mainly an engine matter, for example I understand that in order to meet EU6 rules the CREC engine had to be developed with its second set of fuel injectors (I think that has something to do with controlling particle emissions). However the gearbox mapping is also involved because the SW on your new box is clearly the old SW used for EU4 engines. I'd expect that your new box will rev to around 7000rpm as the old one did (and as per the real red line on your rev counter) but was interested hence the question.

As for the Avant coding, again this is the gearbox SW. Maybe there is a difference in mapping between on Saloons and Avants that nobody has noticed? But its also quite possible that the only difference is the '5' in the part number!
 
I can confirm that it does I deed still rev to the red line, 7k. I checked several times, it was great!

As for the 8K5... It's ringing bells that the 5 isn't Avant, but saloon. And 9 is Avant. I suppose it could just be a number, but The Group are very meticulous with thru part numbers, so it could mean something. Who knows!?
 
Yeah, quite. Gearbox number 3 going in on Wednesday! It made a whistling noise at 50mph, so took it back and they took the oils out - one of them had metal shards in it, so it's being replaced!
 
Oh no! 3rd time lucky hopefully ;)

My box can be a bit temperamental (a bit of jerkyness going from 2nd down to 1st when coming to a slow stop on D) just hoping mine doesn't progress down this route. Kinda regret getting the stronic now, it's brilliant when it works but too temperamental for me.
 
@Lavis89 - From what I hear 2-1 in the DL501 box was never perfect. This malarkey hasn't put me off S-Tronic to be honest, it's such a good box.

@AudiLeon - Yeah, I'm quite philosophical about it all. At the end of the day, they paid fore most of my replacement and now it's gone again, it's just bad luck. After all, Audi don't make the gearboxes, so it's technically not them. They've been good to me I think.

@mister.c. - Friday or Saturday apparently. Was all poised to get it properly clean, get dome nice photos take and put it up for sale, but no. Another week lost. I'm emigrating in 8 weeks and would rather not leave it to my parents to sell!
 
@AudiLeon - Yeah, I'm quite philosophical about it all. At the end of the day, they paid fore most of my replacement and now it's gone again, it's just bad luck. After all, Audi don't make the gearboxes, so it's technically not them. They've been good to me I think.


I feel your pain in being let down, and that is what has happened, Audi via its spares supply and dealer network has let you an Audi customer down. Very few product manufacturers manufacture all assembles in house - but it is them and only them that you should point the finger at when things go wrong, there are other gearbox manufacturers out there who might just be able to provide a more reliable box.
 
Nevertheless @benjie I think they owe you an explanation. Did you ask if the 2nd box was brand new or refurbished? Audi HQ ought to strip the box and do a failure analysis.
 
I see where you're coming from rum4mo, but where will it get me? They can't get it delivered/fitted any quicker so I'm not sure what any complaining would achieve. Though I am planning to have a discussion with the service manager when I collect it regarding the time I have lost in terms of selling it.

Is that a thing they do Dippy? I would be interested to know exactly what did go wrong. It drove absolutely lovely, it was just the humming/cooing noise.
 
benjie said:
I see where you're coming from rum4mo, but where will it get me? They can't get it delivered/fitted any quicker so I'm not sure what any complaining would achieve. Though I am planning to have a discussion with the service manager when I collect it regarding the time I have lost in terms of selling it.

Is that a thing they do Dippy? I would be interested to know exactly what did go wrong. It drove absolutely lovely, it was just the humming/cooing noise.
Click to expand...

I think that Audi in general are behaving like clowns in a part time circus, what can be done by owners is to raise some of these issues up a lot more on other public platforms! Currently I have not had any issues to date with my 2011 S4, but I get very angry when I hear about:- cars are easy to steal with Audi not contacting reg'd owners with a FOC fix, cars with 2.0TFSI engines maybe not getting the correct redress for design issues without being lucky or reading on line forums, auto boxes that still don't seem to be fit for purpose, it might only be a small percentage of boxes that fail - but overall just how many have failed and been quietly replaced at great expense. I'm an Audi car owner, that does not mean that I need to be an Audi product lover blinded to any issues - I can't see me continuing to be an Audi car owner for too long as it looks like Audi don't really bother too much about problems unless they get backed up against the wall. I've not bothered to mention the issues that some people, and one is a friend of mine, had with the 2.0TDI CR oil pump issues with main dealer just saying "these things happen a lot - pay up".

Spreading the discussion outwards to the top level company, I'm just waiting for the AC compressor on my wife's 2015 Polo to do same as that gear box did, chew up its internals, but maybe in that case, the swarf started being generated while these compressor were still in the Sanden factory, with this failure in mind, what is VAG doing, well it seems fobbing people off until the warranty has ended, then making a good living on repairing at customer's cost. Though it will replace the ones that fail completely - with another from the pile?

Edit:- maybe working these assemblies with known problems through the system is VAG's way of being green?
 
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benjie said:
Yeah, quite. Gearbox number 3 going in on Wednesday! It made a whistling noise at 50mph, so took it back and they took the oils out - one of them had metal shards in it, so it's being replaced!
Click to expand...
@benjie - ****** hell mate
Thats absolutely appalling! I just hope that Audi come back to with some sort of explanation

Good luck with no.3 gearbox & keep us all updated
 
@benjie obviously I can only go on what you write here, but Audi is supposed to be a premier car manufacturer who prides itself of achieving progress through technology. If they have fitted a brand new, highly expensive and complex piece of engineering to your car and it soon failed, I do think that they owe you an explanation, at least for assurance that the 3rd box will be good! Audi will be capable of doing FA. I cannot believe that they won't want to do so here. They may not normally let you see the FA report but I'd say you deserve to.

The company which I work for does FA on all returns. The value of the products is a lot less than an s-tronic gearbox, however the company knows that failures cost, so the analysis pays back in terms of improving the reliability of current and future products. I have colleagues who work on different product lines and Audi is a customer. I know from them that Audi is highly demanding of their suppliers on matters of reliability.

In your place I would be very demanding that I be given a detailed explanation as to why a new replacement gearbox failed so soon.
 
Thanks for your thoughts guys. New gearbox is in and is running fine. I asked what the process was for the faulty box and was told that it was a manufacturing fault and they don't open the box and investigate on site. I asked to be told what the problem was when they find out. To be honest though, I'm not that interested. I'm more interested in this one working (and I've don't more miles in it than the other one and it's fine, so touch wood!) and getting the car sold as I am leaving soon.
 
Firstly, thank you, this is great info.
Secondly, I'm terrified...

.... you see I just bought a b8 s4 which was reg'd in late December 2009 - which seems the bad years for gearbox trouble

Now showing 55k. Full Audi service history (s-trontic oil ticked) apart from the last service which is Autobarn (bucks) The inherited invoice details S-Tronic gear box oil £106 but doesn't mention filters.

I can't afford a new box, please explain

1. All preventive action (I'll get straight on it), filters etc ?
2. Symptoms and checks ?
3. Anyway I can check what filters I have and how to change them & when to?
4. Any driving tips to avoid straining what must be a deliaciate piece of kit ?

Please help - worried as hell.
 
Hi Joe. There's bad news stories out there unfortunately and we've probably seen more than most on this forum now.
First point is you have the right service history, and thus at your mileage there's no preventative action needed.
Symptom wise it's big clunks into 1st from 2nd or slow engagement/biting in reverse. If it goes wrong you'll know as your dash will think it's Xmas...
The early ones generally have issues from the mech unit due to poor heat protection. Problem is that's a £3k+ fix.
If I were you, get a good warranty and check it will cover the gearbox, and ensure the limit is >£10k.
Now you've read this thread you'll have concerns, get the right cover and you can relax knowing of t does go wrong you're covered, and can thus drive like you stole it and be happy :)



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Razza - thanks.

That is a good point, get cover and it doesn't matter if it happens.

But you don't think I should check if the previous services did the filters?

Also are there any really top independents who are good at keeping an eye on these things?

Best

Joe
 
Where are you based?

If it's audi that ticked the oil change and receipt that confirms it (you can always phone them up and check) than that's fine as they'll have done the necessary to conform to any claim.

Get yourself carista app and the obd reader in case of faults. Gearbox specialists have much better ideas on fault finding. Audi follow tick box diagnostics...software update, oil change, mech unit, gearbox replacement.
If you get a problem go to a specialist and save yourself money and pain


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