Badger 5 - results inside

vrbob

Thats no Moon, Thats a space station!
Hi Peeps,

Well my trip to B5 yesterday was a bit deflated as I was hoping I had a good car as I had tried hard to make it as good as possible in prep for this mapping.

Turns out I was driving a bit of a time bomb oops. Got to B5 and the guys got to work first off was a smoke test which went well albeit a slight leak from the TIP adapter.

So once this was done they moved on to strapping the car down on the rollers to get an idea of how it was running. This turned out to be a bit interesting as my car was running ala a diesel (Whoops) so figures were interesting as I was getting 30psi and about 320torque!!!!!

So a bit of fault diagnosis was needed and Paul (Tuffty) Mark and Bill started to try n work out what the hell was going on.

First issue that was found was that when I fitted the new fuel pump the return fuel line had got twisted and was stopping the fuel returning to the tank so instead of 3bar mine was getting 4bar. This was fixed (mmm the smell of v power) and we moved on.

So the mapping process started and things were looking better but another issue cropped up as my smallish FMIC just couldn't cope with the heat the K04 produces when pushed and my Pre cat lambda was giving a few issues too.

Finally managed to get a good compromise on the balance of heat and fuelling and got a figure of 265bhp and the same in torque and its defo quicker than its been before in any of its previous setups on the revo software.

I am happy with the results (even though I was hoping for more) as the car was in a dangerous way before and I was lucky it had held together as well as it had.

So the conclusion is I need a bigger FMIC to cope with the heat and possibly a new pre cat lambda sensor.

Today I have already actioned this a bit as I have re-sealed the TIP adapter to try and eliminate that leak that was found and also removed the pre cat lambda for inspection. It was pretty sooty so have cleaned it up in the hopes it might work better now its clean.

I am gonna search for Intercoolers I think I can use and this will be next job as once I have done this I can do some logging to show Bill to see if the heat issue has been rectified and the car will work any better.

All in all it was a good day and my thanks goto Bill, Paul and Mark for there good banter and lots of great info plus of course all their hard work.

Cheers

Rob
 

Gops

Badger 5 Edition
VCDS Map User
Ahh the woes! Rob it's better that you found out now! Just imagine if you had a stage 2 "flashed" on your car, would of been catastrophic! But I suggest a welly cooler for the fmic, more than capable for the power! Bill would of mapped it to a safe parameter until you get these sorted out, then go back for a map tweek :)
 

vrbob

Thats no Moon, Thats a space station!
Ahh the woes! Rob it's better that you found out now! Just imagine if you had a stage 2 "flashed" on your car, would of been catastrophic! But I suggest a welly cooler for the fmic, more than capable for the power! Bill would of mapped it to a safe parameter until you get these sorted out, then go back for a map tweek :)

****** cars lol!

Its a permanent adventure and things are better as the time bomb was avoided! yeah I am looking for coolers welly cooler sized in dimensions but maybe a little thinner as this way it might be easier to keep the fogs and grills.

Still its not slow lol and I did get the 5 maps and Launch Control so things are good so can only get better with the improvements suggested.
 

Gops

Badger 5 Edition
VCDS Map User
Wellycooler will fit and keep fogs! Get some 63mm ends welded on or if your not too bothered in showing abit of pipe age, I did mine like this..
ImageUploadedByTapatalk1397844607.728178.jpg
ImageUploadedByTapatalk1397844639.906600.jpg
 

vrbob

Thats no Moon, Thats a space station!
Will check out the welly cooler again as cant afford a AH Fabs one.

Also anybody recently purchased a pre cat lambda sensor for a BAM engine? if so where is the best priced one to be found that works?
 

vrbob

Thats no Moon, Thats a space station!
Right......

I am on this as I would like to get the car running as best it can especially on its new software.

So I have done a couple of things to try and rectify the issues highlighted whilst at B5.

First off I have removed the 80mm TIP billet adapter as this seemed to have a small air leak which was discovered during the smoke test. So I have used some instant gasket and made the seal much better so I hope this will of solved the small leak.

I have also removed the pre cat lambda as during the mapping it was not reading right. It was pretty filthy/sooty so I have cleaned it up and re-installed it. If it does not improve I will look at getting a replacement.

Lastly in regards to my FMIC setup being too small and the uber hot K04 not liking it I have managed to order a Welly Cooler with 63mm outlets from Dan @ BeachBuggyTurbos so hopefully that will arrive soonish and I can get it on the car asap.

Once the new larger FMIC is on I will do some new logs to send to Bill to see if that has resolved the issue I encountered and see if the car has anymore to give.
 

Prawn

My other car is a MINI!!!!
I'd suggest you will most likely need a new lambda sensor sadly Bob.

living in the exhaust, it's not that unsual for it to be covered in exhaust soot :laugh:

Looking forward to hearing how it goes with all the little bits done :)
 

vrbob

Thats no Moon, Thats a space station!
I'd suggest you will most likely need a new lambda sensor sadly Bob.

living in the exhaust, it's not that unsual for it to be covered in exhaust soot :laugh:

Looking forward to hearing how it goes with all the little bits done :)

Cheers Prawny

yeah I am guessing I do too but money being a bit tight at the mo what with paying for the new map and ordering a new FMIC I will see how it goes with the original one with the new cooler fitted. If its still being dodgy I will get a new one as I think I have found a genuine bosch one for about £70 Bosch Lambda Oxygen Sensor, Audi S3, 1.8 Quattro | eBay

So will do some logging first once the cooling is sorted and see how that goes
 

JUS3IN

14.0 @ 98mph 2s 60ft
lol... monster it 523eaf8a2efbe_1.jpg

seriously good luck tho fella
 

Freeman_1986

Registered User
MONSTER IT!!!!!

IMG_2169.jpg
 

vroomtshh

Registered User
[Dave B];2149323 said:
Or, don't 'monster it', fit water meth, then it won't look like an S3 with a brace on.

Or go for the size down from the Welly, with the 63mm outlets, fits perfectly, no trimming, no losing anything, and its coping fine with my k04 hybrid :yes:
 

hoffmanvp3

Registered User
My custom made frame which carries the monster fmic didn't need any bumper trimming other than removing the fogs.
 

superkarl

MAN OF STEEL
Or go for the size down from the Welly, with the 63mm outlets, fits perfectly, no trimming, no losing anything, and its coping fine with my k04 hybrid :yes:
yet the OP its not enough for a stage 2 KO4
 

vrbob

Thats no Moon, Thats a space station!
No cooler yet guess the posty has eaten too many easter eggs!

I am gonna do my best to keep the OEM look as that's what I want for my car so might take a bit of jiggery pokery so only time will tell if its possible or not. Looking at Gops`s install if he managed to keep the fogs and almost keep the grills it must be possible but as yet I am also unsure as to how the 63mm ends are fitted to the BBT/Welly cooler.

Im not keen on the water meth idea as that's a bit OTT for me so biggest FMIC I can fit is my answer lol
 

superkarl

MAN OF STEEL



best i could do with a wellycooler. 63mm piping, which will be painted matte black for extra stealth
 

vroomtshh

Registered User
yet the OP its not enough for a stage 2 KO4

So he has the 550x225x64mm one currently? Odd that its keeping mine perfectly cool. I do have WMI, and a huge pile of other mods to go along with it right enough. But it was coping fine when I was at stage 2 too
 

badger5

www.badger5.co.uk
Site Sponsor
depends on core construction.....
Seems to me some are glued cores and they're shyte for heat dissipation compared to brazed cores..

lucky dip on supply perhaps. from different sources... both "branded" and egay - seen both have different constructions.. Glued dont work well.
 

JimS3

Registered User



best i could do with a wellycooler. 63mm piping, which will be painted matte black for extra stealth

I like! Got any pictures with the bumper off?
 

russwuss

Registered User
Really interested to see the results of the Welly cooler with smaller outlets...

Cooler I have is smaller, 550 x 230 x 65 with 57mm outlets - then piping increases on first bend to 65mm. Hope it's enough for stage 2.
 

vrbob

Thats no Moon, Thats a space station!
Righto,

New cooler is on and have updated my FMIC thread to show the install here http://www.audi-sport.net/vb/a3-s3-forum-8l-chassis/168515-fmic-fitted-3.html (post 84 on page 3)

But for continuity here are a couple of piccies...

New cooler vs old


New cooler on the car


Bumper back on keeping fogs and grills :)


So will do some logging to send to Bill at B5 and then should be able to tell if my EGT`s are now at an acceptable level and also if my pre cat lambda is goosed or not.
 

vrbob

Thats no Moon, Thats a space station!
I am getting some of the brackets like in your setup SK as my spacers I made are a bit bodge tastic lol

And thanks mate I too was impressed I have got it back to an OEM look with a mahoosive cooler fitted!
 

kwistof

South East Events Moderator
Whoop whoop!

Think I need a trip down to Southampton soon bud!

Nice going mate, looks great! All about the OEM look :)
 

vrbob

Thats no Moon, Thats a space station!
Whoop whoop!

Think I need a trip down to Southampton soon bud!

Nice going mate, looks great! All about the OEM look :)

It wasn't easy mate, Took me 2 days to get to this point and that's just replacing the cooler as I already had the pipework in place.

Still am sure its repeatable on another car :)

OEM FTW!
 

vrbob

Thats no Moon, Thats a space station!
Right next step done as managed to do a bit of logging as got some access to a private road.

from what I can see the new FMIC is doing its job as IAT`s were a lot lower than on the old setup

Group A:'112Group B:'118Group C:'031
Exhaust GasEnrichment FactorBin. BitsBin. BitsEngine SpeedIntake AirBoost PressureBoost PressureLambda ControlLambda ControlBin. BitsBin. Bits
TIMETemperature Bank 1Sensor Bank 1TIME(G28)Temperature (G42)Control (N75)(actual)TIMEBank 1 (actual)Bank 1 (specified)
MarkerSTAMP°C %STAMP /min°C % mbarSTAMP
0.034800 0.26160020010000.561.9911.047
0.864700 1.16152021010001.461.9911.047
1.764600 2.07144021010002.371.9910.945
2.684500 2.97144021010003.270.9060.945
3.574500 3.88148020010004.180.9380.945
4.484550 4.78148020010005.090.930.945
5.384650 5.715602095.310005.990.9690.953
6.294700 6.617601895.311406.890.9060.914
7.214950 7.5120801895.313407.80.8830.891
8.115200 8.4124801890.616708.710.860.867
9.015550 9.3230001740.819109.620.8440.836
9.916150 10.2236001639.2198010.520.8440.836
10.836450 11.1341601639.2206011.430.8130.821
11.736950 12.0346801639.2209012.330.8050.821
12.647250 12.9451601639.2211013.240.8130.821
13.547500 13.8457201639.2215014.150.7890.821
14.457950 14.7561601739.2205015.050.8130.821
15.358400 15.6565601839.2203015.950.8130.821
16.278700 16.5669201839.2195016.861.9910.821
17.168900 17.476240150136017.761.0621.047
18.078900 18.374840160107018.661.9911.047
18.978550 19.263640170104019.571.9911.047
19.877850 20.182600180102020.481.9911.047
20.777350 21.081640180102021.381.9910.945
21.687100 21.981040190100022.281.1250.945
22.586800 22.88800200100023.190.8750.945
23.496650 23.79720200100024.090.8360.945
24.396450 24.73720200100025.10.9060.945
134.025000 134.328402495.3990133.730.9450.945
134.925000 135.2312402301040134.620.8360.953
135.835100 136.1315602201050135.530.8830.945
136.745250 137.0413202101020136.440.9690.953
137.645400 137.9414002201020137.340.9690.945
138.545450 138.8513602101030138.240.9610.945
139.455550 139.7512802217.31030139.160.9840.945
140.365550 140.6614402101080140.050.9220.953
141.275600 141.5616402195.31100140.960.9060.961
142.175750 142.4818802195.31240141.860.9610.969
143.075800 143.3822402095.31450142.770.9220.906
143.996050 144.2926802073.71800143.670.8750.883
144.996350 145.2932801839.21900144.620.8830.852
145.96650 146.238001839.22010145.590.8210.836
146.86950 147.144001839.22000146.50.8360.828
147.717250 148.0149201839.22090147.40.8280.821
148.617450 148.9154401839.22100148.310.7890.821
149.527850 149.8258801839.22040149.220.8210.821
150.428250 150.7262801839.22050150.120.8280.821
151.338600 151.6366402039.22070151.020.8130.821
152.248850 152.5468802002360151.940.8130.821
153.149050 153.4453601839.22090152.830.9140.875
154.049100 154.3556002139.22160153.740.8050.828
154.959050 155.2557602139.22100154.650.8210.821
155.859100 156.1659602139.22050155.550.8050.821
156.769151.2 157.0661602239.22120156.460.8130.821
157.679255.5 157.9663202339.22020157.360.7740.782
158.579309.4 158.8753602101210158.280.750.789
159.469100 159.7741202101060159.171.9911.047
160.388600 160.6830402101030160.071.9911.047
161.278150 161.5820802201020160.971.9911.047
162.187500 162.4912402301010161.881.9911.047
 

vrbob

Thats no Moon, Thats a space station!
Log 2

Group A:'002Group B:'118Group C:'031
Engine SpeedEngine LoadInjection TimingMass Air FlowEngine SpeedIntake AirBoost PressureBoost PressureLambda ControlLambda ControlBin. BitsBin. Bits
TIME(G28)Sensor (G70)TIME(G28)Temperature (G42)Control (N75)(actual)TIMEBank 1 (actual)Bank 1 (specified)
MarkerSTAMP /min % ms g/sSTAMP /min°C % mbarSTAMP
0.0272027.12.383.830.372033010000.611.0080.992
0.972027.12.383.861.3184033010001.620.930.992
1.9180032.32.383.672.2176033010002.511.0310.992
64.3776031.62.384.1464.67720360100064.971.0310.992
65.27124058.64.428.3365.581560340102065.870.9690.992
66.18128063.95.7816.5666.481280330104066.780.9690.992
67.08152026.32.384.3967.381480310104067.680.9920.992
67.99124063.95.7816.0368.291400320104068.590.9840.992
68.9128020.32.043.7869.191200310102069.51.0390.992
69.81120054.95.113.4470.11240330102070.40.9690.992
70.71136061.75.4417.3171.0114003295.3104071.3210.992
71.61148085.77.8226.1171.9216002995.3111072.220.9380.93
72.51176094.79.1833.1772.8218802695.3123073.130.9140.899
73.422080107.510.5445.1173.7221602495.3139074.020.8910.883
74.332440127.112.9262.7574.6326002482.4166074.930.8670.86
75.242920145.915.6482.6975.5430802245.1185075.840.8360.836
76.143440159.417.34105.9476.4536002145.1194076.750.8440.836
77.054000167.718.02126.7877.3541602145.1201077.650.8210.821
77.954520164.718.02142.8178.2646802145.1206078.560.7970.821
78.86504018219.04176.9479.1652002145.1206079.460.8130.821
79.765520188.719.38201.3680.0656802145.1209080.370.8050.821
80.72596018518.7209.3981.0761202145.1205081.370.8210.821
81.686360175.217.68212.1181.9864802145.1203082.280.8210.821
82.596680167.71721482.8868002245.1200083.180.8050.844
83.48672066.28.5100.8983.7952002245.1195084.090.8210.852
84.395360189.519.72194.3184.6954402345.1208084.990.8280.821
85.3560019119.38202.6985.656402345.1211085.90.8210.821
86.25800188.719.38205.6786.558402345.1206086.80.8210.821
87.11596018819.04211.7887.4160002445.1205087.710.750.891
88.01560011.31.362.4788.315120230120088.611.9911.047
88.9143201208.5889.223960240106089.511.9911.047
89.81328012.808.0390.122920270103090.411.9911.047
90.73232013.505.9291.022000280102091.321.9911.047
91.62140013.51.363.5391.921200300101092.221.9910.945
163.1372020.32.042.97162.54760330990162.830.9530.945
164.03120074.47.1418163.43800330990163.740.930.945
164.95140082.77.8223.5164.3312403295.31010164.640.8910.945
165.852720108.310.5461.53165.2418003095.31090165.550.9140.906
166.76420054.13.40166.1632802645.11520166.460.8750.906
167.673320143.614.62108.36167.0639602401390167.360.8670.922
168.574280168.417.68139.03167.9736002345.11910168.270.860.852
169.48496018.82.380168.8746402145.12000169.170.8360.844
170.384040167.718.02132.56169.7837202045.11730170.080.8830.86
171.294560169.218.36147.08170.6842002145.12030170.980.8280.828
172.195040184.219.04175.94171.5947202145.12020171.890.7970.821
173.15480190.219.38198.42172.4952002145.12060172.790.8130.821
1745960183.518.7209.75173.456402145.12080173.70.8130.821
174.926400173.717.68216.61174.361202145.12050174.60.8050.821
175.81660046.63.40175.2165202345.12030175.510.8210.821
176.725120175.217.34194.25176.1158002245.11490176.410.8440.883
177.6144001204.83177.0250402301690177.320.8280.906
178.52332012.807.92177.9240402201100178.221.9911.047
179.42236013.506.06178.8330002401040179.131.9911.047
180.33148014.304179.7320802601020180.031.9911.047
181.23100015.81.73.19180.6312402701010180.931.9910.945
182.1480020.32.043.33181.549202901000181.830.9770.945
183.0472021.82.043.25182.447603001000182.740.8750.945
183.9572021.82.043.19183.347203001000183.640.8910.945
184.8672021.82.043.14184.257203001000184.550.9380.945
185.7672021.12.043.19185.167603101000185.460.9690.945
186.6672021.82.043.22186.067603101000186.360.9690.945
187.5776021.12.042.92186.977603101000187.270.9610.945
188.4776020.31.72.92187.877603201000188.170.9530.945
189.3976020.32.043188.777603201000189.080.9610.945
190.2976019.52.043.06189.68760320990189.980.9610.945
191.1972019.52.042.92190.587203201000190.890.9530.945
192.0976019.51.72.97191.497203201000191.790.9530.945
19376019.51.72.92192.47203201000192.710.9610.945
193.972019.51.72.83193.3720320990193.60.9690.945
194.8176018.82.042.86194.21760320990194.510.9770.945
195.7276019.52.042.86195.117603201000195.410.9690.945
196.6276018.82.042.81196.027603201000196.320.9610.945
197.5272018.81.72.72196.927603201000197.220.9530.945
198.4372018.82.042.83197.847203301000198.130.9610.945
199.3572018.82.042.72198.737203301000199.040.9450.945
200.2472018.82.042.81199.66760330990199.940.9530.945
201.1572018.82.042.81200.547203301000200.860.9380.945
202.0572018.82.042.83201.457203301000201.750.9380.945
202.9672018.82.042.75202.357603301000202.650.9530.945
203.8776018.82.042.75203.267603301000203.560.9610.945
 

vrbob

Thats no Moon, Thats a space station!
about 18-19 degrees according to the DIS so looks like max is about 10-15 degrees above ambient

Any chance you can tell if my pre cat lambda is goosed or not from those logs?

Oh and Log 1 was Map 3 and log 2 was Map 5
 

vrbob

Thats no Moon, Thats a space station!
Cheers Prawn,

265bhp and 265ftlb was the figures I left with from B5 on map 5 so that's quite accurate then.

Happy Days indeed.

So does that mean my lambda is ok now?
 

gingerben

Registered User
IMG_8728.jpg IMG_8714.jpg IMG_8725.jpg IMG_8698.jpg

This with standard twin decat and a v3 tip on standard airbox made 280 with bills stage 2.. Awesome car
 

vrbob

Thats no Moon, Thats a space station!
Right a little update :

I have sourced a new Pre Cat lambda sensor as I was unsure if mine was faulty or not as during the mapping it was giving a few weird readings but it did not show up as a fault in VCDS.

So that is now fitted and I have had a quick run and it seems nice and smooth. Will run it for a couple of days and then do some logs to see if it reads any different to the old one as I did measure it on the new FMIC on my first run.

Also received a couple of new custom FMIC brackets courtesy of S3Dave on here so if I get time I will also whip off the bumper and swap them about over the weekend.

Also it was noted that my fuel hoses that run in and out of the fuel rail are a little perished so I have bought some new hose so I can swap it out.

Rob
 
Last edited:

vrbob

Thats no Moon, Thats a space station!
So managed to pull my finger out and do some work on the car over the last couple of days :)

So have re-fitted the large FMIC so that the bumper sits better.

Replaced both of the rubber hoses from the fuel rail as they had perished.

Serviced the car with new BKR7E`s gapped to 0.7mm and New quantum 5w40 fully synth with bosch oil filter.

With this done I think I have covered all the issues highlighted on my trip to B5 so will run the car for a bit and then see if I can arrnge to head back to B5 for a quick update and possibly up the power now its running a lot better.
 
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