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AVF Engine performance advice?

Tom-Audi May 3, 2015

  1. Tom-Audi

    Tom-Audi Member

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    Currently owning 1.9 - 8V TDI, PD, Sport, AVF engine, and I am thinking what I can improve in terms of performance before it gets way too expensive...
    Anybody had been going same way I am thinking to go for it? And what kind of repairs, or upgrades u can do it, to be on the safe side, and before u blow it up your old PD engine? :)
    I believe 1.9 Tdi Sport model have 130bhp, and 310Nm with a AVF engine, maybe I am wrong? Now that is a lot off Torque at low revs... I been searching info about what difference between normal PD, and PD Sport. I don't know or is it true, but Sport model have got better clutch, much stronger piston rods, and a better ECU MAP from Audi, not sure about bigger injectors, and better turbo...?!?
    I still can see a lot off un burnt diesel smoke by pass my exhaust, if I need a quick overtake or just a faster speed. I believe this is because I need to remove-delete EGR. And improve exhaust, by De-cat, and remove middle silent box, and back end box, and just run a straight thru pipe all the way?
    And when exhaust done go for a Stage 1 remap?
    Now my question will be, is it all that worth a hassle, and money? Anybody who done it am self? What I will get from Stage 1 remap, due to Sport model have better map already from EOM Audi ECU?
    Any info would be a massive Thank you!
    :thumbs up:
     
  2. Gazwould

    Gazwould Well-Known Member

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    Clutch is bigger 240mm from AWX 228 mm so can handle more torque.

    Egr disable or delete all good , Tom what's your plate and year ?

    You need 1 silencer remaining for exhaust sound taste . Loose the cat and heavy middle box , keep the back box .

    Perform surgery to the back box and cat to make straight through or ideally get a 2.5" system made up.

    Don't know about the pistons and rods .

    Maps , 2 to choose from most around 163 bhp / 290 lbft or 175 bhp / 265 lbft the , later preserves the clutch .

    180 bhp max from above mods with a 175 bhp clutch friendly map.
     
  3. Tom-Audi

    Tom-Audi Member

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    Thank you very much for a great advice! Mine is 03 plate, and 126K clocking at the moment...
     
  4. quattrojames

    quattrojames Moderator Staff Member Moderator Audi A6 Audi Avant Owner Group

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    The engine is the same whether the car is a Sport or an SE, the principal differences are trim and suspension etc. An AVF will be the same engine no matter what car it is from.
     
  5. Gazwould

    Gazwould Well-Known Member

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    Build sticker bottom right ,

    OGE or OGZ ?
     
  6. Tom-Audi

    Tom-Audi Member

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    I went to have a look, but I could find one, there is one on the cambelt cover, that's the engine code and number. Another sticker is in the spare wheel base, but there is car colour code. Another code u can see by your windscreen at the bottom. And I found another metal plate, what tells all loading weights, and car weight...
    But don't know where is that code OGE or OGZ? No idea really...
     
  7. Gazwould

    Gazwould Well-Known Member

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    Boot , spare wheel area might be it , also service books .
     
  8. Tom-Audi

    Tom-Audi Member

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    OGZ I found, but its a lot them codes there, this is a second 3 digit code...
    And what that OGZ means?
     
  9. Gazwould

    Gazwould Well-Known Member

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    OGZ-Unfortunately by performing the super simple egr disable will give you an eml, the positive is you intend to remap thus option to remove egr from ecu software .
     
  10. Tom-Audi

    Tom-Audi Member

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    Sorry I didn't get that, what is it "an eml"? I been told by my garage mechanic, there is no difference or u just block it EGR, or u delete from ECU, apparently he told me, that makes no difference...
    But I am strongly thinking to improve exhaust flow by de-cat, and remove middle silent box, still thinking about back box though...
    Posible simple and not massive expensive way is to improve exaust, second remap+egr delete from ECU. Is it worth a cash K&N air performance filter for better breath for engine...? Before I was thinking about performance intercooler, but its daddy wagon :), not formula 1, and I am looking more mpg, not super fast Avant A6. I had before 1.9 Tdi Mitsubishi Sparestar, I believe it was Renault DID engine, common rail, and when I sit down in to this Audi, it feels like from a push bike to the car! This Audi has got a lot Torque, pleasure to drive... But on the idle sound worse than a tracktor, unless that is EGR fault?
     
  11. Gazwould

    Gazwould Well-Known Member

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    Engine Management Light.

    It improves low down turbo spool, less exhaust smoke and engine oil will stay cleaner for longer.

    Fmic not needed at Stage 1 .

    K&N no improvement as stock box and filter are big and pose no restriction .
     
  12. Tom-Audi

    Tom-Audi Member

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    Anything else I could do apart from the exhaust, EGR delete, and remap? Now about remap, I know u can do more torque, more bhp, a bit off bouth, and there is a eco remap. Whitch one would be ideal for a better performance, and maybe even improve mpg? I am not a boy racer, just looking to gain what is possible to be at the safe side, and improve mpg...
     
  13. Gazwould

    Gazwould Well-Known Member

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    Fmic , but I don't know what it would actually yield .

    I have the clutch saving remap that actually cured the 1st stages of clutch slip .

    Remaps eco or not in reality don't increase mpg but gain much more drivability.

    Do you use 2stroke and what flavour engine oil do you use ?
     
  14. Tom-Audi

    Tom-Audi Member

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    I don't use 2stroke, and at the moment is fully synthetic 5w-40. VW505 01 PD oil, I bought this one from waterloo it was 24.22£ for a 5L. But I am not far away from the next oil service, previously owner was lady, and oil been done every 8-10K, not the best really, but it was proper 5w-40 vw505 01, fully synthetic oil, now I will be changing engine oil in half of this, every 4-5K. To keep it clean, and stay away from the engine **** build up...
    I seen a http://www.tesco.com/groceries/product/details/?id=280042732, and this is tempting me to get for a next service, just is it worth that extra cost, or its just as good like a other one? Just 0w40 I believe would help a lot with a very cold starts, due to not 5w-40, but 0w-40?
     
  15. Gazwould

    Gazwould Well-Known Member

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    5W30 507.00 is the oil for you and will yield better mpg ,bit of power and torque.

    + more .

    5W30 507.00 v 5W40 505.01

    chart (2).jpeg
     
  16. Tom-Audi

    Tom-Audi Member

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    U have surprised me, even at the manual handbook I says only VW505 01. Unless that's the minimum requirements? And for a long service oil it says, 507 00.
     
  17. quattrojames

    quattrojames Moderator Staff Member Moderator Audi A6 Audi Avant Owner Group

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    Put all your codes into this and it will explain all:

    http://igorweb.org/equidec/
     
  18. desertstorm

    desertstorm Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User Audi A4 Audi Avant Owner Group quattro TDi

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    Where abouts are you based ?. Get the car remapped to stage 1, exhausts, cats etc don't make that much difference compared to the difference between a standard car and a mapped car.
    The difference in torque between a standard 130bhp and a sport 130 bhp is small just 25Nm . If you look at the 0-60 times of an SE and a sport they are virtually the same.
    A remapped SE will be around 1.5 seconds faster than a standard sport.
    A map will give you 35-40 bhp extra, an exhaust may give you 5 bhp.If you really want to mod the exhaust gut the cat and replace the back box with a straight through pipe.
    Don't bother with a K and N filter the standard one is fine.
    You can get longlife 3 oil delivered for £26 , I used to use it in my PD Passat and would recommend it to anyone.

    http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Audi-Vw-O...194?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item3f4be694b2

    The OGE , OGZ code is related to the emissions monitoring capability of the ECU. In early 2003 it became mandatory to monitor the emission equipment on the car so if you delete the EGR on a car with OGE as a build option you won't get a check engine light. On a car with OGZ you will as the ECU is monitoring to make sure the EGR is working correctly.
    It's a simple change in the map of the car to disable the EGR which can be done when the car is mapped.

    Karl.
     
  19. Tom-Audi

    Tom-Audi Member

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    Thank you Karl for a very clear explain! I will go for a stage 1, just don't want to mest up the clutch by doing this, that's all. Exhaust and de-cat for sure... About oil, i will be changing every 4-5K miles anyway. I been told proper PD fully synthetic oil 5w-40 gives a best protection, but it needs to be change regulary. I don't believe in long term oil changes... Clean oil, is the best oil, and regulary changes is the way to go... 5w-30 or 5w-40 fully synthetic oil better, i am not to sure on this...?
     
  20. Tom-Audi

    Tom-Audi Member

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    Thank
    Thank you James for this link :thumbs up:
     
  21. Tom-Audi

    Tom-Audi Member

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    I
    l live in the East Yorkshire, Hull. And everybody telling me a Rev0 are very good on remaps, and they are local to me... Anybody used them for anything?
     
  22. Gazwould

    Gazwould Well-Known Member

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    507.00 5W30 outperforms 505.01 5W40 because of its higher quality groups 3, 4 and 5 basestock and higher concentration of additive package.

    [​IMG]


    507.00 beats 505.01 in analysis
    [​IMG]


    Web chart info is further backed up here

    [​IMG]
     
  23. Tom-Audi

    Tom-Audi Member

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  24. Tom-Audi

    Tom-Audi Member

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    This is from vw oil specs:
    VW 507.00
    Low SAPS oils suitable for Euro 4 engines and almost all VAG diesel engines from 2000 onwards with extended service intervals, unitary injector pumps and also Pumpe-Düse ("PD") engines. Excludes V10, R5 engines and VW Commercial vehicles without fitted DPF (diesel particulate filters) – these must use a 506 01 specification oil.
    So if its DPF fitted go for a 507.00. If not it says to go for 506.01.
    My manual tells me same - long life is VW 506.01.
     
  25. Tom-Audi

    Tom-Audi Member

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    I did get it on the end... ;)
     
  26. Gazwould

    Gazwould Well-Known Member

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    Yeah 506.01 is our old LongLife spec back in 2003 , it was superseded in 2004 by 507.00.

    Our 2003 handbooks won't tell us that ;)
     
  27. Tom-Audi

    Tom-Audi Member

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    I will make sure to change to 507.00 very soon. What is the changing intervals in the long life 507.00?
     
  28. Tom-Audi

    Tom-Audi Member

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    A massive thank you to put me the right way for a best engine oil...
    :thumbs up:
     
  29. Gazwould

    Gazwould Well-Known Member

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    Something stupid like 2 years/20k , but just use as a normal fixed interval servicing .

    I change 6 months regardless.
     
  30. Ben jah min

    Ben jah min Member

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    Having been for a ride in a tuned PD130, i can say that its a night and day difference from its standard form.

    The car had a PD130 turbo with a hybrid billet compressor wheel, FMIC with 2.25 boost pipework, de-cat, EGR delete and a map from CC tuning -The car runs 380ft/lbs and 230hp, the delivery is linear and no boost fall of after 3k revs.

    The turbo is the item to be looking at improving if you want to transform an AVF - a garrett gtb2566vk being a proven winner. Darkside do kits for transverse engines but you can gain an idea of the figures you'd be looking at getting near in a C5….

    http://www.darksidedevelopments.co.uk/products/darkside-gtb-turbo-kit-for-1-9-8v-tdi-engines.html

    Ive seen people run setups at half the cost by using parts bin equipment from the VAG range - Q7 3.0 tdi turbo's when they're being broken etc.

    Cheap FMIC kits can be picked up easily off ebay too - http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2-25-UNIV...060?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item19c23dbfa4
     
  31. Tom-Audi

    Tom-Audi Member

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    Ben jah min thank you for a great post :thumbs up:
     
  32. Tom-Audi

    Tom-Audi Member

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    Is it worth doing Fmic, on the stage 1?
     
  33. desertstorm

    desertstorm Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User Audi A4 Audi Avant Owner Group quattro TDi

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    If you want a daily driver thats quick and driveable then the GTB1756VK or GTB2056VK are the way to go.
    As soon as you get towards at GTB2260VK you can start to get surge issues and poor throttle response at low RPM. Certainly something like a GTB2566VK is really only useful at a racetrack or on the quarter mile and requires extensive engine mods to get the most out of one of these.
    As soon as you go over around 330Lb/ft a standard 240mm clutch won't be any good and you will be looking at quite a bit of money for a Sachs SRE organic clutch.
    Standard injectors are good for around 230bhp so any more than that requires an injector upgrade, again not cheap.
    Karl.
     
  34. Gazwould

    Gazwould Well-Known Member

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    Also interested.

    What's the actual figurative gain ?
     
  35. Tom-Audi

    Tom-Audi Member

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    I have found a small intercooler kit and all silicon hoses + delivery for 160£, that is not bad at all... But just thinking will give anything on stage 1, and EOM turbo? Also I been told u have to connect new front intercooler to the old one, that way u need less silicone hoses, and that way better by running 2 intercoolers. Like brand new linked to the EOM at the same time?!?
    That was abit strange to me, coz EOM don't get chance to cool well air when is inside covered in the bumper...
     
  36. Tom-Audi

    Tom-Audi Member

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    I know on the stage 2, bigger turbo, good exhaust, bigger injectors, and intercooler is a must!
    But on the stage 1, front intercooler worth a money, or not really?
     
  37. desertstorm

    desertstorm Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User Audi A4 Audi Avant Owner Group quattro TDi

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    I found that the 550x175x64 intercoolers were a good size on my 211 bhp Passat. There is quite a good rule of thumb for intercooler sizing 3L of core volume per 100bhp.
    These intercoolers have a 6L core so I would say are good for around 200bhp.
    Unfortunately cannot find anybody selling them at the moment, there were 3 sellers but all have bumped the price to £1300 odd pounds which is what they do when they are out of stock. Normally these kits are around £135 .

    http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/UNIVERSAL...804?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item2c5d3e963c

    Personally I wouldn't retain the stock SMIC and connect it in series with the FMIC. You should size the intercooler to do the job you require. I know VAG mount 2 intersoolers in series on some models but they aren't in the best place for airflow and every time you pass air through an intercooler you get a pressure drop. The Turbo will have to make more boost to overcome this extra pressure drop.
    This is one of the reasons why a large free flowing intercooler can help as it not only reduces intake temps but has a lower pressure drop across the intercooler, if it it designed well.

    Karl.
     

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