A new thread about the cambelt service question

[6EGA3]

A while back I (and others) have asked the eternal question about why the PFL has such a discrepancy between what the manual says and what Audi UK say is the required time between cambelt changes.

As a reminder, the manual gives no time limit and a maximum mileage of 133,000 miles. Audi UK have revised that themselves and suggest 5 years or 75,000 miles.

I messaged Audi in Germany last week and asked them what the reason was, given that the cars are all made on the same production line, etc. Here is their response:

"The information in the manual is only recommendations, which may vary from country to country for different reasons, such as weather conditions, road conditions, geographical location, warranty conditions and other factors. These factors affect the service life of timing belts, so there is no general and fixed replacement interval for all countries. In principle, it is the responsibility of the Audi partner to check the timing belts and replace them if necessary. For further questions or information, please contact your local Audi partner of your choice. Your Audi Germany team."

Now, the last time I looked the German climate was very similar to ours, as were the road conditions (although they probably have less traffic congestion). So this does not really answer my question. Also, another member here checked his vehicle with Audi Portugal and they have basically the same schedule as Germany. The climate in Portugal is not the same as Germany's. I did point this out to Audi Germany.

I still suspect a ruse by Audi UK in drumming up more business for themselves. Some on here will agree, others will have their belts changed regardless and decide that there must be a good reason for the vastly different service intervals. I'm considering pushing this a bit further but not sure what next to ask. Any ideas?

 

[HertS3]

Very interesting thread, my car will be 5 years old in February so quite relevant (though will have covered around 60k miles by then). Would be interested to hear some opinions on this

 

[RichardT]

My car just came up for it’s 5 year service. The recommendation from Audi dealer was to change the cambelt (plus water pump of course). Guidelines given are 5 years/120K miles (or something like that - can’t remember the exact mileage)
In the end I decided to switch to a local Audi independant. Their guidelines were actually the same. However, their recommendation was to leave it a year as I had only done about 30K miles. So I will most likely get it done next year.

 

[traindweller]

good work @6EGA3 - I will also be interested as like you I do not understand why the official guidance is so different.

On the My Audi site for my My2016 a3 it originally stated 140,000 miles and with no time limit, but that has since been removed although no new guidance posted.

Audi need to be clear about advice as always lots of opinion floating around but mostly subjective which just adds to the confusion. I can only assume from your replies that Audi are no longer confident to state that it is indeed a long life belt of 133/140K.

It seems this is what Audi are doing now to correct the range of times and mileage across the models, although the response they have given you could also be read that the belt should be inspected on each service as it may not even last for the 75k or 5 years!
[QUOTE="
" In principle, it is the responsibility of the Audi partner to check the timing belts and replace them if necessary. For further questions or information, please contact your local Audi partner of your choice. Your Audi Germany team."
[/QUOTE]

 

[AJB]

I still suspect a ruse by Audi UK in drumming up more business for themselves. Some on here will agree, others will have their belts changed regardless and decide that there must be a good reason for the vastly different service intervals.

Totally agree.

I'm considering pushing this a bit further but not sure what next to ask. Any ideas?

I don't think there's anything much you can do. Audi Germany have generated their official service schedule. Audi UK are free to recommend whatever they like (the same applies to an air con service including re-gas every 2 years, by the way). The customer is free to take either set of advice, or neither. With cambelts in particular, there isn't one "right" answer either. The longer you leave it the more chance of it snapping. Each time you get it changed there's a risk of damage, or of poor install leading to it snapping. So doing it every month is going to increase risk of failure. Leaving it 30 years is going to increase risk of failure. Somewhere between is the right compromise!

FWIW, my car is currently 6 years old, has done 52,000 miles, and I've got no intention of getting the cambelt done yet. Personally I think that if they'd found that the original advice wasn't conservative enough, and too many belts were failing early, then Audi Germany would have changed their official advice for new cars too, and would have the new advice printed in new cars' service books. As far as I'm aware this isn't the case, so I personally am waiting. For other people the peace of mind might be worth the cost/risk of an earlier belt change.

 

[6EGA3]

Mine is the same mileage (52000). It’s a little younger though at nearly 5 years old.

I’m going to reply to them and do what is currently the official requirement in Germany for my particular model/engine. Be interested to see their response.

 

[6EGA3]

Hi all, I asked the following today:
"Thank you very much for your answer. May I ask another question? If I was in Germany and had an A3 of the same type as mine (2015, 1.6TDi), what is the recommended timing belt change plan from Audi partners in Germany?"

This was the reply:
"You yourself have already given the answer to this question in your first question. Here in Germany, the timing belt is to be changed every 210,000 km - without a time interval. Many greetings from Ingolstadt "

Methinks a UK stitch up. Anyone agree with me?

This was all done via Audi Germany's Facebook messenger using translation software.

 

[Philip Davies]

Hi all, I asked the following today:
"Thank you very much for your answer. May I ask another question? If I was in Germany and had an A3 of the same type as mine (2015, 1.6TDi), what is the recommended timing belt change plan from Audi partners in Germany?"

This was the reply:
"You yourself have already given the answer to this question in your first question. Here in Germany, the timing belt is to be changed every 210,000 km - without a time interval. Many greetings from Ingolstadt "

Methinks a UK stitch up. Anyone agree with me?

This was all done via Audi Germany's Facebook messenger using translation software.

I just checked on the Audi global website and it states toothed belt “check” (not replace) at 140,000mi


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[Ormesome]

I asked the same question here. Info is for 1.6tdi but it’s still the same argument for all Audi models. I still suspect Audi UK and UK manufacturers of shortening the life-length advice of the cambelt. No other country has the same timeframe as the UK. Weather or salty roads do not add to the argument!

https://www.audi-sport.net/xf/threads/1-6tdi-cambelt-water-pump-intervals.339984/

 

[B5NUT]

My A6 2.0TDi, states replace @140,00 but no age requirements, cannot believe the belts are any different than what is fitted to the A3.

 

[Mikeso51]

Out of interest, has anyone asked Audi UK to explain/justify the discrepancy between their advice and that of Audi Germany?

 

[roydonaldson]

Ok, so my pfl 2014 S3, I've been told has a chain and so has no belt that needs replaced ?

 

[Ormesome]

Just to make this very clear, it is not a discrepancy with Audi UK and Audi Germany. It is a discrepancy between Audi UKs advice and the rest of the Audi franchise system. UK Audi is the one that is different to all.

 

[6EGA3]

Just to make this very clear, it is not a discrepancy with Audi UK and Audi Germany. It is a discrepancy between Audi UKs advice and the rest of the Audi franchise system. UK Audi is the one that is different to all.

I think that sums it up well. I went to the Germans because, well it's the parent company. But as has been pointed out elsewhere, Audi Portugal offer similar advice to Germany.

The way I see it, all these cars come out of the same factory. The ONLY difference I can see is the position of the steering wheel. The engines are precisely the same. German and UK conditions (except for extremes like nth Scotland or the German Alps) are similar. This does seem to be a disingenuous attempt by Audi UK to squeeze more money from hapless motorists.

 

[Philip Davies]

I think that sums it up well. I went to the Germans because, well it's the parent company. But as has been pointed out elsewhere, Audi Portugal offer similar advice to Germany.

The way I see it, all these cars come out of the same factory. The ONLY difference I can see is the position of the steering wheel. The engines are precisely the same. German and UK conditions (except for extremes like nth Scotland or the German Alps) are similar. This does seem to be a disingenuous attempt by Audi UK to squeeze more money from hapless motorists.

I wonder if one of the motoring journals eg auto express or Autocar might be interested in this as a story? Anyone have any contacts there?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Ormesome]

Just to add, I went into my local Swiss Audi dealership. They gave me a slip that was apparently for my car specifically. It should also be taken in to account that I have a 10yr warranty with all servicing included. Make of that what you will.... but cambelt here is at 140,000miles with no time limit. 2.0tdi S-tronic, not sure if it is cambelt or chain so that should be considered too.

 

[Fatbloke]

How do I contact Audi in Germany directly?

 

[6EGA3]

How do I contact Audi in Germany directly?

I used their Facebook page and Facebook Messenger.

 

[Flying Scotsman]

Just to make this very clear, it is not a discrepancy with Audi UK and Audi Germany. It is a discrepancy between Audi UKs advice and the rest of the Audi franchise system. UK Audi is the one that is different to all.

Same as Audi UK to have the A/C serviced at 2 years. That is not the case in North America for Audi or any car other that I have owned. There is no recommended service interval, only if the A/C starts to malfunction. The A/C system is a sealed system and should not lose refrigerant, unless there is a fault. That UK service is a cash grab by dealers.

 

[6EGA3]

So, I have been emailing back and forth to Audi UK to see what they have to say about the whole issue. Below is the thread - it's quite clear they are still trying to justify this change of policy between the UK and Europe:


Hi,

I have a MY2015 A3 1.6 TDi with a rubber cambelt. According to the manual that came with the vehicle, it is to be replaced every 133,000 miles, with no time limit.

Audi UK have told me that this has now been superseded by new advice which says that the cambelt must be changed after 5 years unless reaching the 133,000 miles first (although some are quoting 140,000 miles).

I recently contacted Audi Germany and asked what the recommendation was there. I was told that it remains the same as the details printed in the manual, i.e. no time limit and 133,000 miles (210,000 km). In fact, it appears that throughout Europe this is pretty much standard.

Can I ask then why the discrepancy? The climate is fairly similar in both Germany and the UK if you ignore the extremes of the German Alps or the Scottish Highlands. The roads may be somewhat better in Germany but not markedly so. The cars come from the same factory with precisely the same engines. In fact, the only real difference is the position of the steering wheel.

Why then does Audi consider the cambelt more likely to fail in the UK after 5 years but not in the rest of Europe?


Dear 6EGA3,

Thank you for providing your vehicle registration as requested.

The importing company sets the interval at which the cambelt should be changed. In this case, this is Audi UK, who recommends every five years or 133,000 miles, whichever comes first.

I do hope this answers your query and please contact me again on the details below if you require any further assistance.


Dear Mr. Xxxxx,
Thank you for your reply. However you have not answered my query, merely told me that Audi UK has set the interval. I am obviously aware of this otherwise I would net have needed to contact you in the first instance.
So, can you now please answer my original query? This is what was asked:

"Can I ask then why the discrepancy? The climate is fairly similar in both Germany and the UK if you ignore the extremes of the German Alps or the Scottish Highlands. The roads may be somewhat better in Germany but not markedly so. The cars come from the same factory with precisely the same engines. In fact, the only real difference is the position of the steering wheel.

Why then does Audi consider the cambelt more likely to fail in the UK after 5 years but not in the rest of Europe?”

I look forward to a more detailed and considered reply and will need to escalate this if one is not forthcoming.


Dear 6EGA3,

Thank you for your recent email, I was sorry to learn that you were unhappy with my initial response.

As I am sure you can appreciate, the cambelt is one of the hardest-working parts in the engine and any component working this hard will eventually show signs of fatigue. A worn or damaged belt could become slack or even snap, often causing severe engine damage which is a costly repair. The rate of wear can be influenced by a number of factors including time, mileage and various sources of contamination.

As previously stated, the mileage replacement recommended by AUDI AG is not always relevant to conditions experienced by Audi customers in the UK which is why we also have a time-based recommendation. Stop-start journeys on congested roads may cause additional wear on parts compared to the optimum conditions experienced in some parts of Europe. The recommendation ensures consistency and protects customers with very low-mileage cars from cambelt failure. Cambelts are rubber-based components that can deteriorate over time and it could be many years before these customers reach the recommended mileage interval changes.

Full functionality of this component must be guaranteed as much as possible in all driving situations throughout its entire service life, recommending a time and distance interval helps us do this.

I hope this offers further clarity on the points you have raised, however, should you have any further queries please contact me on the details below.


So.......
How on earth is driving in say, London, Birmingham or a crowded part of the Cotswolds any different to the stop-start driving one might do in Berlin, Paris or Dusseldorf??

 

[Ormesome]

So, I have been emailing back and forth to Audi UK to see what they have to say about the whole issue. Below is the thread - it's quite clear they are still trying to justify this change of policy between the UK and Europe:


Hi,

I have a MY2015 A3 1.6 TDi with a rubber cambelt. According to the manual that came with the vehicle, it is to be replaced every 133,000 miles, with no time limit.

Audi UK have told me that this has now been superseded by new advice which says that the cambelt must be changed after 5 years unless reaching the 133,000 miles first (although some are quoting 140,000 miles).

I recently contacted Audi Germany and asked what the recommendation was there. I was told that it remains the same as the details printed in the manual, i.e. no time limit and 133,000 miles (210,000 km). In fact, it appears that throughout Europe this is pretty much standard.

Can I ask then why the discrepancy? The climate is fairly similar in both Germany and the UK if you ignore the extremes of the German Alps or the Scottish Highlands. The roads may be somewhat better in Germany but not markedly so. The cars come from the same factory with precisely the same engines. In fact, the only real difference is the position of the steering wheel.

Why then does Audi consider the cambelt more likely to fail in the UK after 5 years but not in the rest of Europe?


Dear PAL62V,

Thank you for providing your vehicle registration as requested.

The importing company sets the interval at which the cambelt should be changed. In this case, this is Audi UK, who recommends every five years or 133,000 miles, whichever comes first.

I do hope this answers your query and please contact me again on the details below if you require any further assistance.


Dear Mr. Xxxxx,
Thank you for your reply. However you have not answered my query, merely told me that Audi UK has set the interval. I am obviously aware of this otherwise I would net have needed to contact you in the first instance.
So, can you now please answer my original query? This is what was asked:

"Can I ask then why the discrepancy? The climate is fairly similar in both Germany and the UK if you ignore the extremes of the German Alps or the Scottish Highlands. The roads may be somewhat better in Germany but not markedly so. The cars come from the same factory with precisely the same engines. In fact, the only real difference is the position of the steering wheel.

Why then does Audi consider the cambelt more likely to fail in the UK after 5 years but not in the rest of Europe?”

I look forward to a more detailed and considered reply and will need to escalate this if one is not forthcoming.


Dear PAL62V,

Thank you for your recent email, I was sorry to learn that you were unhappy with my initial response.

As I am sure you can appreciate, the cambelt is one of the hardest-working parts in the engine and any component working this hard will eventually show signs of fatigue. A worn or damaged belt could become slack or even snap, often causing severe engine damage which is a costly repair. The rate of wear can be influenced by a number of factors including time, mileage and various sources of contamination.

As previously stated, the mileage replacement recommended by AUDI AG is not always relevant to conditions experienced by Audi customers in the UK which is why we also have a time-based recommendation. Stop-start journeys on congested roads may cause additional wear on parts compared to the optimum conditions experienced in some parts of Europe. The recommendation ensures consistency and protects customers with very low-mileage cars from cambelt failure. Cambelts are rubber-based components that can deteriorate over time and it could be many years before these customers reach the recommended mileage interval changes.

Full functionality of this component must be guaranteed as much as possible in all driving situations throughout its entire service life, recommending a time and distance interval helps us do this.

I hope this offers further clarity on the points you have raised, however, should you have any further queries please contact me on the details below.


So.......
How on earth is driving in say, London, Birmingham or a crowded part of the Cotswolds any different to the stop-start driving one might do in Berlin, Paris or Dusseldorf??

Nice try, but "fobbed off" is the word that springs to mind. Nothing really you can do I guess. If it's in warranty then you have to stick to the rules, if not then do what you like and go on instinct...

 

[B5NUT]

Personally I would not trust either Audi UK or Audi DE. I would be checking the belt once its at 4 years old or @80K miles the top plastic cover is easy enough to remove for a visual inspection, if it staring to crack or feeling brittle then change it if not it's a gamble.

My old man was told is 3P A3 was chain driven, however when he gave it to me this year to service it and do some work on it the first thing I noticed was the cambelt cover, the belt was almost 10 year old and done 180K miles and was in a bad way how the hell it lasted that long I have no idea.

I'm only doing around 7K miles a year so it would be 19 years on a single belt... Don't think so, I'll be getting it done after 5 years. Also if it does snap before the 133K miles you going to have a hell of a fight on your hand getting Audi to take responsibility and footing a bill to replace the engine.

Also don't like the idea of the water pump & tensioner not being changed in that many miles, read countless threads over the years about failed water pumps taking out the belt and destroying the engine.

 

[Ormesome]

Also if it does snap before the 133K miles you going to have a hell of a fight on your hand getting Audi to take responsibility and footing a bill to replace the engine.

Also don't like the idea of the water pump & tensioner not being changed in that many miles, read countless threads over the years about failed water pumps taking out the belt and destroying the engine.

Of course this does have to be said in context that you live in the UK! As we have seen, any country outside of the UK will have less trouble, but I agree with you, to keep the UK warranty intact and covered then you simply have to comply. No way around it.

 

[B5NUT]

Warranty is an issue, I've got 5 year warranty on both my Audi's, and to keep that it has to be serviced as part of the manufactures schedule. However regardless of where I lived, I'd be changing the belt. Even at Audi prices (UK) a belt and pump change would cost £12 a month for 5 years, and an indy would charge around the 4-5 mark so would work at around £7.50 a month. A replacement engine would be around the 4 figure mark depending on age, so not worth the risk in my eyes.

I don't even like long life servicing, its great for the sales rep or people that chuck their car back at the dealers every 3 year, as they would only have to visit the dealer once or twice while they own the car, saving them time, money and effort. However I don't think long life servicing is good for the engine long term, but once the car is over 5 years old or 90K miles Audi don't give a stuff about the car, they just want to sell a new one.

 

[6EGA3]

A couple more emails back and forth and I have finally been told to ****** off by Audi UK:

Dear Mr. Xxxxx,
I appreciate the more detailed email. Your answer though raises more questions than it answers, which I’ll explain here:

You say - probably quite correctly - that "Stop-start journeys on congested roads may cause additional wear on parts compared to the optimum conditions experienced in some parts of Europe.” I would have thought that in making any decisions in Germany, Audi AG would have taken into consideration the journeys that their customers make in crowded cities like Berlin, as well as those who may live in more relaxed areas of the country where long journeys on Autobahns are a major part of the car’s life. Not all conditions in Europe are ‘optimum’.

You also state that, "The recommendation ensures consistency and protects customers with very low-mileage cars from cambelt failure. Cambelts are rubber-based components that can deteriorate over time and it could be many years before these customers reach the recommended mileage interval changes.” I would say that it is highly likely that there are low-mileage drivers in Germany as well as the UK. Audi AG would have to take that factor into consideration too.

The point I am trying to make is that for any car manufacturer to come up with a set of guidelines for parts replacement and inspection, it must take a view on what works best for drivers of those vehicles in the wide variety of conditions that vehicle may be used. Therefore a driver in the congested streets of Berlin or Frankfurt is going to be covered by the same requirements from Audi AG as a driver in the rural areas. So it therefore stands to reason that those conditions met by a UK driver in a city environment will not be unlike those in German built-up areas.

The same argument can be said for low-mileage drivers who may take many years to reach the mileage required for a cam-belt change. That doesn’t change from Germany to the UK.

Therefore I am still puzzled by the differences in servicing requirements of Audi AG v Audi UK. Please don’t think I am doing this to be difficult. But as you may see from my point of view, here I am driving exactly the same vehicle in what would be conditions not unfamiliar to German drivers. The parent company recommends X and the UK importer says it’s Y. Vehicles and conditions are close enough to be identical and yet I am still trying to understand the UK’s requirements versus those throughout the rest of Europe.

I really would appreciate a replay that properly explains and supports the UK’s reasoning behind this.


Dear 6EGA3,

Thank you for allowing me time to investigate your case further.

Whilst I understand your points regarding the difference in guidelines between Audi UK and Audi AG , we can not comment on Audi AG guidelines. As previously stated in my emails, the importer sets these guidelines on components. Although there may be similarities between the two countries, there are also differences.

Audi UK recommends you get your cambelt checked for any wear and tear on this component every 133,000 miles or 5 years, this can be done when getting a service in one of our centres. The centres will advise you if there is any play or wear on the cambelt. We cannot confirm if your vehicle would require a cambelt change at 5 years or 133,000 miles as the vehicle is currently 57 months old.

Whilst we will acknowledge your response , this is our final response on the matter from Audi UK.

I cannot accept that the 'Importer' would have more knowledge about the car's components than the actual manufacturer. So, I want to now take this to the motoring press and see what their feeling/reaction is. Any suggestions which is the best one to go to? Autocar, Auto Express, a newspaper motoring editor, etc?

 

[Mikeso51]

Interesting that the Audi Uk spokesman is saying that a “check” is recommended at the 5 year point, not an automatic change. I think this is disingenuous. No main dealer would carry out such a check and then implicitly take responsibility for a future failure by saying the belt is fine. Far more likely to take no risk and say “it may look ok now, but we recommend a change to be safe”.

 

[The_Ironist]

Need to get onto BBC Watchdog about this. They would love it.

 

[AJB]

A couple more emails back and forth and I have finally been told to ****** off by Audi UK:

I cannot accept that the 'Importer' would have more knowledge about the car's components than the actual manufacturer. So, I want to now take this to the motoring press and see what their feeling/reaction is. Any suggestions which is the best one to go to? Autocar, Auto Express, a newspaper motoring editor, etc?

I don't really see what you're trying to achieve, or how going to the press will help though... Other than, I suppose, letting more people know there's a decision to be made rather than a black and white requirement.

There's no right answer though. Just like there's no single right answer as to whether you should change oil every 5000 miles/6 months, every 10,000 miles/12 months, or every 20,000 miles/24 months.

Audi Germany are free to let their distributors make their own guidance if they want to, and Audi UK are free to recommend what they like.

It's really useful that you've confirmed that Audi Germany still have no time limit, as I suspected, and for me personally that means I'm totally happy with my original plan to completely ignore Audi UK's advice. Just like I'm ignoring their advice to re-gas the air con every 2 years - I'll do that if/when it stops blowing as cold.

But I don't particularly think there's a scandal... Especially as the controversial part is a 5 year change, by which time even extended warranties will have expired. So it's not as if you're having to do extra Audi UK dreamed-up work in order to keep the warranty - you've got a straight choice of whether to take their (in my personal opinion too-conservative and unnecessarily expensive) advice, or the manufacturer's advice, or anyone else of your choosing's advice.

For example Audi UK could perfectly reasonably argue that in their opinion UK customers are more risk averse than other countries, or have smaller cash reserves to pay for a new engine if the worst happens, or whatever, and therefore they've chosen to play it safe and advise that people get it done more often to reduce very small risk of failure even further.

I agree, I personally think they're mainly motivated by wanting extra work/income, but it's all a sliding scale or acceptable risk vs cost of reducing risk. It's not a black and white case of Audi Germany recommending the single "correct" interval and Audi UK recommending the wrong interval.

It could even be something as stupid as Audi UK being worried that even if a very small number of belts fail between 5 years old and 133,000 miles, then one of those customers might post on forums, and then go to the motoring press complaining that the interval was too long and that Audi deliberately increased it to look better and get more sales - perhaps other countries are more ready to accept that these things happen once in a while and so they can take a more reasonable compromise of risk!

 

[AJB]

Interesting that the Audi Uk spokesman is saying that a “check” is recommended at the 5 year point, not an automatic change. I think this is disingenuous. No main dealer would carry out such a check and then implicitly take responsibility for a future failure by saying the belt is fine. Far more likely to take no risk and say “it may look ok now, but we recommend a change to be safe”.

Granted they'll never say "it doesn't need doing". But they might say "it may look OK now but we recommend a change to be safe", or they might say "it looks like it's beginning to fail, we strongly recommend a change now". That'd let me decide how to play it if I were the customer.

I'm pretty sure there are various intervals on things that even Audi Germany say "check every x miles, after y miles".

 

[6EGA3]

I think you probably sum it up best @AJB with your take on all this.

I might see if any motoring publications are interested though as, although it's not a scandal as you rightly point out, Audi UK do seem to be maximising profits on the back of customers who wouldn't know better. They have no real defence on this - I gave them plenty of opportunity to offer something and in the end they have grabbed their bat and ball and gone home.

 

[Gilly86]

I have just changed mine at 106000 miles out of precaution, no issues at all.

 

[6EGA3]

I have just changed mine at 106000 miles out of precaution, no issues at all.

What is the age of the car?

 

[Gilly86]

What is the age of the car?

2012 2litre TDI

 

[CanadaA3wales]

Regardless of what any manufacturer says to me I do mine every 60-65 thousand miles.

Its either £350.00 for belt and pump or £8,000+ for a new engine rebuild.

 

[Gilly86]

I work in aviation maintenance so I’m very familiar with preventative maintenance and time limited parts. If a manufacturer is advising you replace a part at x miles the part will have been tested to failure numerous of times with the average taken then a percentage taken off to be safe. Replacing a part at half of its age limit seems overly cautious to me. I would have replaced mine later but had some time off work and was giving the car a full service anyway.

 

[6EGA3]

I work in aviation maintenance so I’m very familiar with preventative maintenance and time limited parts. If a manufacturer is advising you replace a part at x miles the part will have been tested to failure numerous of times with the average taken then a percentage taken off to be safe. Replacing a part at half of its age limit seems overly cautious to me. I would have replaced mine later but had some time off work and was giving the car a full service anyway.

I assume you read my long posts earlier about my to and fro with Audi Germany. Did you happen to know whether the belt showed any signs of obvious wear? I'm wondering just how likely it is that the parent company recommendations are still valid, given the similarities between UK and German conditions

 

[Gilly86]

I assume you read my long posts earlier about my to and fro with Audi Germany. Did you happen to know whether the belt showed any signs of obvious wear? I'm wondering just how likely it is that the parent company recommendations are still valid, given the similarities between UK and German conditions

I did and was surprised that Audi UK have lowered the recommended mileage for replacement so much without informing Audi owners that the limit set in the service manual is no longer valid and letting us know why. I’ve always serviced the car myself and have used the service schedule as my guide.

the cam belt was obviously used after 106000 miles but it was still tight, with no signs of fraying or cracking and the engine always started fine

 

[traindweller]

Regardless of what any manufacturer says to me I do mine every 60-65 thousand miles.

Its either £350.00 for belt and pump or £8,000+ for a new engine rebuild.

So about 8 years for you?

 

[PJG]

A while back I (and others) have asked the eternal question about why the PFL has such a discrepancy between what the manual says and what Audi UK say is the required time between cambelt changes.

As a reminder, the manual gives no time limit and a maximum mileage of 133,000 miles. Audi UK have revised that themselves and suggest 5 years or 75,000 miles.

I messaged Audi in Germany last week and asked them what the reason was, given that the cars are all made on the same production line, etc. Here is their response:

"The information in the manual is only recommendations, which may vary from country to country for different reasons, such as weather conditions, road conditions, geographical location, warranty conditions and other factors. These factors affect the service life of timing belts, so there is no general and fixed replacement interval for all countries. In principle, it is the responsibility of the Audi partner to check the timing belts and replace them if necessary. For further questions or information, please contact your local Audi partner of your choice. Your Audi Germany team."

Now, the last time I looked the German climate was very similar to ours, as were the road conditions (although they probably have less traffic congestion). So this does not really answer my question. Also, another member here checked his vehicle with Audi Portugal and they have basically the same schedule as Germany. The climate in Portugal is not the same as Germany's. I did point this out to Audi Germany.

I still suspect a ruse by Audi UK in drumming up more business for themselves. Some on here will agree, others will have their belts changed regardless and decide that there must be a good reason for the vastly different service intervals. I'm considering pushing this a bit further but not sure what next to ask. Any ideas?

Elsewhere much talk about "rubber" cambelts.
This is what the Audi Germany site says about them:

Timing belts from Audi Genuine Parts
During their product life, Audi Genuine timing belts cover an immense distance in the engine. They are made of high-strength glass and plastic fibers and have a wear-resistant coating to withstand high and at the same time changing loads. In this way, they enable precise control of the motor.
The essentials at a glance
Timing belt...
Ensure precise control of the motor.
Due to their structure made of high-strength glass and plastic strands and their wear-resistant coating, they can withstand even very high and strongly changing loads.
are also resistant to extreme temperature fluctuations and humidity.
achieve a longer service life in excellent interaction with tensioning and deflection pulleys from Audi Genuine Parts.
are usually replaced when changing them together with the tensioning and debris pulleys in order to keep costs lower: there are only one-time labor costs. In addition, timing belts and rollers are cheaper in the set.

I hop this is useful.