8V S3 Tuning Thread

veeeight

I am a very pretty girl
VCDS Map User
at home we have an S3 8V and an RS3 8V

S3 8V: 86.000km
RS3 8V: 5.000km

Engine:
RS3 that extra torque is fabulous.
S3: remap it or box it

DSG:
S3 : faster, smoother
RS3: 7th gear but jerky and not as fast as DQ250

Launch Control:eek:
RS3: don't know why but seems that RS3 needs more time to think and prepare itself when LC is engaged.
S3: LC with the MTM cantronic and it feels faster.
When I mean faster is when you have the 2 pedals down and you release the brake pedal, the execution is faster in S3.

Exhaust:
RS3: we have the sport option, we love it.
S3: so so

Brakes:
RS3: worst thing of RS3 , brake pedal feedback after heavy use is horrendous.
S3: better feedback after heavy use.

Handling:

RS3: mag ride but feels heavier.
S3: love its ride with new sway bars.

Fuel consumption in the same section 18km:
S3 following RS3 ( onboard computer )

RS3: 26L/100km
S3:19L/100km


Overall package:

RS3: emotional purchase
S3: best buy price / performance.


^ This is definitely the post of 2015! :D

As you were. :whistle2:
 

S3Alex

Rarely neutral
Gold Supporter
I was told it's just under 2 bar on the stock turbo, so not all bad.
Been running mine for over 10k miles and as you know I don't baby it and have done long road trips to Germany too!

I think that's very sensible.....running a turbo at it's ragged edge is all very well,but as you know,the bearings and seals will suffer,and even the shaft on occasions.

In the long term,a hybrid or big turbo is a good solution,and Simon's TTE turbos fit into that very well,without the costs of a big turbo kit.

APR's kit will be nice,and will be properly engineered,but we all know it will not be cheap,and a minimum of £7k seems likely.
 

DAZMC

Registered User
I think some of use will be surprised with the cost of Apr stage 3 kit .

It's a good bit under 7k is all I will say and can say at the moment....
 

S3Alex

Rarely neutral
Gold Supporter
Interesting as we do 470 at 1.7-1.5 bar redline so lower shaft RPM and intake temps

This is the thing....I'm getting a lot more power now,at lower boost than with the previous turbo.

The GTX3076 was running 2.2bar,to get just over 500bhp,whereas the GTX3582 is returning 540bhp at 1.9bar,and around 620+bhp at 2.1bar.
And,a lot less stressed into the bargain.
 

S3Alex

Rarely neutral
Gold Supporter
I think some of use will be surprised with the cost of Apr stage 3 kit .

It's a good bit under 7k is all I will say and can say at the moment....

OK....if that turns out,then that's great.
All I can say is to remember the cost of the S3 8P kit,and to remember the drip-feed cost estimates from that company on the RS kit.

Those of us around long enough to remember that know how far off it was.

On the other hand,I think it NEEDS to be less,as there is plenty of competition,but that will leave a lot of 8P customers who bought the other kit a bit miffed.
 

pepperisback

Registered User
I read on facebook that ATP Tuning is a Beta tester for the Stage 3 Kit. They are currently installing the kit and they are testing with stock internals. No fuel upgrade etc.
 

VtecAbuser

Registered User
Be interested to see what the gains are heading stage 2. Impressive over 400hp stage 1. Looks like the upgraded IC definitely makes a difference. I wonder what the stock turbo can do maybe 430hp stage 2, IC and E85 tune? Maybe 600nm too? Only guessing as nobody gone there yet, well Guy harding in Australia has, had BETA of all this on his car which won hot tuner challenge.

Dyno was 247 WKW which was on same dyno same day over 50WKW more than a stage 1.5 tuned A45.

That must of been a poorly tuned A45 then - given that well tuned Stage 1 A45's make on average around 40-50bhp (30-40kw) at the flywheel over a Stage 1 S3/7R. I would guess that this A45 in question was running a tuning box that (as most do) under perform on occasions.
 

TTE Si

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That must of been a poorly tuned A45 then - given that well tuned Stage 1 A45's make on average around 40-50bhp (30-40kw) at the flywheel over a Stage 1 S3/7R. I would guess that this A45 in question was running a tuning box that (as most do) under perform on occasions.
I'm interested also as originally our stage 1 hybrid (TTE400+) we marketed as 400PS (not HP !)turbo and about a year later some tuners was doing 430PS

Now I read 430HP(approx 435ps) on STOCK turbo!..... Shows how the tuners maybe catching up and getting to grips now with this ECU/motor
 

aussieR

Registered User
That must of been a poorly tuned A45 then - given that well tuned Stage 1 A45's make on average around 40-50bhp (30-40kw) at the flywheel over a Stage 1 S3/7R. I would guess that this A45 in question was running a tuning box that (as most do) under perform on occasions.

I agree completely, something amiss with the A45 result. It is a tuning box I believe on site of company says 305kw 560nm so should be close to stage 2 MK7R/S3 with IC.
 

VtecAbuser

Registered User
Sounds like Willall to me as their Phase 1 kit is advertised at 305kw (tuning box only). Their Phase 1.5 requires E85 fuel and is meant to pumping out 335kw.
I have been down the tuning box route on my A45 and when running perfectly, they produce some decent peak HP results (close to what a ECU tune gets). However, they can be so hit and miss and over time the ECU appears to 'fight back' and gains become less. I tested this on 2 different tuning boxes on mine with countless Vbox runs in all sorts of conditions. The same can be seen on a dyno - one run may yield good results, but when ran 3-4 times the difference in the runs can be as much as 20bhp. This isn't heat build up either, as the later runs actually produced the better results.
I have since switched to a proper ECU tune now and the car is 10x better. Vbox runs are so consistent it's scary and gains over the tuning box are seen across the board (1/4 miles times/traps, 0-XXX, 100-200kmh etc etc). Power delivery is much improved also.
Not sure if the same has been found on the VAG platform (ECU may work differently, I don't know?), but for me the results spoke for themselves and this was also backed up by 3 other A45 owners who did the same as me.
Tuning boxes are ok for extra ummphh/£, but for the best results, ECU flash every time for me.
 

aussieR

Registered User
Sounds like Willall to me as their Phase 1 kit is advertised at 305kw (tuning box only). Their Phase 1.5 requires E85 fuel and is meant to pumping out 335kw.
I have been down the tuning box route on my A45 and when running perfectly, they produce some decent peak HP results (close to what a ECU tune gets). However, they can be so hit and miss and over time the ECU appears to 'fight back' and gains become less. I tested this on 2 different tuning boxes on mine with countless Vbox runs in all sorts of conditions. The same can be seen on a dyno - one run may yield good results, but when ran 3-4 times the difference in the runs can be as much as 20bhp. This isn't heat build up either, as the later runs actually produced the better results.
I have since switched to a proper ECU tune now and the car is 10x better. Vbox runs are so consistent it's scary and gains over the tuning box are seen across the board (1/4 miles times/traps, 0-XXX, 100-200kmh etc etc). Power delivery is much improved also.
Not sure if the same has been found on the VAG platform (ECU may work differently, I don't know?), but for me the results spoke for themselves and this was also backed up by 3 other A45 owners who did the same as me.
Tuning boxes are ok for extra ummphh/£, but for the best results, ECU flash every time for me.

Yep, was the Willall kit. I totally agree with you regarding proper tune vs tuning box. There has just been thread on Oz AUDI regarding difference between ABT box and person removing and getting APR tune. Tune gained 45wkw and 80wnm over the box. But aparently the Box was pulled apart and investigated it's operation by Guy Harding Head of APR in Aust and found out that didn't link in to CANBUS and as such couldn;t control fuelling going against waht ABT states and up to 7deg timing pulled on dyno from Tuning box.

I understand people using Tuning Box as highly likely not to void warranty and still get gains and I've only heard and read good things about DTUK and JB1 etc. For me though I think less likely to have issues with proper tuned vehicle in long term, full control over AFR's etc.
 

VtecAbuser

Registered User
Exactly mate.. Canbus integration is essential IMO and the likes of JB4 for BMW do show that some boxes do give great gains. Not sure if the JB1 has anywhere near the same capabilities as the JB boxes on the BMW 35i engines? Some of the features on these make ECU flashes look old school!! I still feel that the power delivery can/will be unpredictable though.
 

Dandanfings

Well-Known Member
Bronze Supporter
Think it would be a great idea if someone was to do a video review of the TTE turbo back to back with a standard turbo s3 aling with data/times for both :whistle2:
 

aussieR

Registered User
Dan, I think you need to upgrade IC and get the e85 set up once released and you can do the tests on stock turbo. See how much better/faster that is compared to stage 2 now!

At least then you will be fully ready for the TTE500 once released too!!
 

VtecAbuser

Registered User
Ethanol isn't available at the pump in the UK unlike it is in Aus :-( Would be a PITA to run as a daily and would need to be bought in 25ltr drums etc.
 

Dandanfings

Well-Known Member
Bronze Supporter
Would be nice... Id sponsor you Dan :happy:
Haha I'm more than happy to break... I mean test it :)

Intercooler will make its way onto my car when I have time to take it off the road to have the work done.
As for E85 we don't get it here unfortunately, mainland Europe does though.
 

Dandanfings

Well-Known Member
Bronze Supporter
I must point out my car seems to be much keener and feels more responsive since updating my APR TCU software to v1.2.
If you have the software I recommended updating to this version, if you are unsure of what you have, call your tuner as they will know.
 

aussieR

Registered User
I must point out my car seems to be much keener and feels more responsive since updating my APR TCU software to v1.2.
If you have the software I recommended updating to this version, if you are unsure of what you have, call your tuner as they will know.

Dan, did it fix the minor issues you had before? also are you now happy with stage 2 file you have? I've been reading the stage 2 US version having issues and they will be releasing updated version soon. Maybe they rushed release there. I don't believe that stage 2 fully released in Australia yet I believe it's now ready though. I struggle to understand why it's taken more than 12 months since relase of stage 1 to get stage 2 file working properly.
 

PanamaS3

Registered User
I must point out my car seems to be much keener and feels more responsive since updating my APR TCU software to v1.2.
If you have the software I recommended updating to this version, if you are unsure of what you have, call your tuner as they will know.
I had TCU DQ250 done a week or so ago...very impressed with it...my car is as keen as mustard now! I would say to anyone doing APR Stage 1 that in my opinion it is essential to also do this mod as it completes Stage 1, having driven just Stage 1 for several months. I am also reliably informed ....although I'm not sure if I have heard anyone here mention it....that Stage 1 provides the best acceleration results but runs out of puff at higher speeds, whereas Stage 2 gives better lower down torque, gives less initial acceleration in return for epic higher speed power/acceleration further up the gears....so better for longer trips.
 

Dandanfings

Well-Known Member
Bronze Supporter
Dan, did it fix the minor issues you had before? also are you now happy with stage 2 file you have? I've been reading the stage 2 US version having issues and they will be releasing updated version soon. Maybe they rushed release there. I don't believe that stage 2 fully released in Australia yet I believe it's now ready though. I struggle to understand why it's taken more than 12 months since relase of stage 1 to get stage 2 file working properly.

Yep the update cured it so I am very happy!
The stage 2 file will be a problem and I don't believe it's the tuners faults, they are able to squeeze out almost the same peak power from just stage 1 which just doesn't make stage 2 worth it for the majority of owners!
I'm sure they will get it all sorted out soon though and find other ways to find power.
 

Steph67

Renowned philanthropist and pathological liar
I must point out my car seems to be much keener and feels more responsive since updating my APR TCU software to v1.2.
If you have the software I recommended updating to this version, if you are unsure of what you have, call your tuner as they will know.

Cheers for that Dan, I'll get mine updated asap now. Has it cured the jerkiness in 'S' mode?

Ta
 

Dandanfings

Well-Known Member
Bronze Supporter
Cheers for that Dan, I'll get mine updated asap now. Has it cured the jerkiness in 'S' mode?

Ta

Need to hit the Nurburgring to be sure as it only happened on the second onwards lap when it was really hot!
Never happened during regular driving or in manual mode.

Really tempted by the 450 turbo but need to wait and compare with the 500, if it spools the same then obviously consider the bigger one!
 

aussieR

Registered User
Yep the update cured it so I am very happy!
The stage 2 file will be a problem and I don't believe it's the tuners faults, they are able to squeeze out almost the same peak power from just stage 1 which just doesn't make stage 2 worth it for the majority of owners!
I'm sure they will get it all sorted out soon though and find other ways to find power.

Glad it's fixed for you! I heard the same very min gains adding DP/Stage 2 over stage 1 with intake. I guess main reason for adding DP better low end torque, response and exhaust note. At least they fixed it so it's a gain across board, would have been horrible for you when you lost power and torque on beta files!!

Totally agree about the TTE500 will be fantastic option if spools similar!
 

Rogier140

Registered User
I spent quite a lot of time in Germany also and the highest octane I could easily find was shell 100, 102 is much harder to find.

ROW and most of Europe the highest available is 99-97, so are you suggesting this is a turbo marketed towards the German market only?

In the Netherlands only available at firezone, but clean 98 ( BP ) with 10% - 15% ethanol added will workshop just als well.
Germany rocks (fuel wise) , 102 at every Aral station
 

Dandanfings

Well-Known Member
Bronze Supporter
is the 1.2 dsg map a lot better dan ? will need to get mine updated
Yes yes much better, pulls away quicker and smoother too.
Get it updated!
 

Nealey080

Registered User
hi there im new to this so hello everyone, i am having to compromise the spec of my s3 due to push back of building time and cant wait until build week 25, i am looking to have the brake callipers painted red does anyone know of any good places willing to travel so any suggestions welcome, thanks in advance
 

S3Alex

Rarely neutral
Gold Supporter
Which tuner is now going up to 420hp with stock turbo?

Bear in mind that wringing the neck of a small turbo in pursuit of figures isn't always the best route in the long term.

Easy for a tuning company but more of a gamble for a longer term owner.
This is when a good hybrid starts to make sense.

Wrung out,the EGTs rise and at high rpm the turbo starts to simply blow hot air.
 

Richy_C

Registered User
I'm tempted to start getting a little more power out of my car now it's coming unto a year old, but no one seems to mention the Superchip route? Am I missing something here that it's pants? Seems cheaper so that's my assumption.

Value your thoughts.
 

S3Alex

Rarely neutral
Gold Supporter
None yet but I'm guessing the APR stage 2 with IC and running E85 should.

Just remember what i said above.....there is little point in running a small turbo at it's limits.

They simply blow hot air,torque rolls off at high rpm,and then you have lifetime to think about as well.
You've got hybrids,and bigger turbos for this.
 

aussieR

Registered User
Just remember what i said above.....there is little point in running a small turbo at it's limits.

They simply blow hot air,torque rolls off at high rpm,and then you have lifetime to think about as well.
You've got hybrids,and bigger turbos for this.

I completley agree, there is no point pushing the turbo to extreme. I heard that APR stage 2 runs about 26psi. I'm not sure if that's an increase or decrease over stage 1? I was thinking/hoping that stage 2 wouldn;t have any boost increase, just spool slightly faster.

I forget who it was on here but remember seeing their custom tune was running 22psi with exhuast, intake, IC and they got 410ps. That's more impressive than top end numbers. Hitting efficiency, long gevity, good boost control preventing surge. Much more important things than head line numbers.

Reality is stage 1 more than enough power/torque for street car. Stage 2 Mods mainly to get better induction and exhuast notes improving the overall driving experience, that's my thoughts anyway.

If it was a track car then I would want more and in that case TTE 500 turbo with supporting mods fantastic option!
 
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