Too low for Tracking?

[B7Tourer]

So I just went to ATS Euromaster for a 4 wheel track, after I have had new front control arms and new camber rear tracking eccentric bolts fitted; this after I'd had the fronts done recently at Kwik-Fit (I know but finding people round here to do tracking is a headache). ATS use a different laser tracking machine - it clamps around the outer tyre, with another part resting on the top of said tyre, as opposed to the one at KF, that clamps on the wheel.

They told me the rear is too low for them to get the machine on, without causing damage. I've noticed recently that since I've been carrying a full size spare wheel, it does look a bit low, and I wondered if the springs need renewing. They are not broken, since I've checked this very recently, but maybe tired, I don't know? Thing is I can't really remember what they looked like before and it looks level, rides fine too. They are refunding me but I'm loathed to go back to Kwik-Fit, even though I know their machine will work, until I'm certain, we're tip mtop. What do you guys reckon?

 

[northpole]

That is a combo of tired shocks and springs mine sits a lot higher on stock s-line suspension. So much that i can put both hands flat ontop of the tire and still have some space left... this is with a full size spare wheel, a wheelchair, a socket set, a 12 inch subwoofer and 1500w rms amp in the boot (there is more in it to be honest) but you get the idea.

When i remove the lot it goes up just a tiny bit, just enough for me to notice it. The other half doesn't but she doesn't care about non classic cars full stop.

 

[PDLH]

Mine sits low on the back as well, especially on the drivers side with a full tank of fuel, full size spare and original springs.

 

[Charlie Farley]

So I just went to ATS Euromaster for a 4 wheel track, after I have had new front control arms and new camber rear tracking eccentric bolts fitted; this after I'd had the fronts done recently at Kwik-Fit (I know but finding people round here to do tracking is a headache). ATS use a different laser tracking machine - it clamps around the outer tyre, with another part resting on the top of said tyre, as opposed to the one at KF, that clamps on the wheel.

They told me the rear is too low for them to get the machine on, without causing damage. I've noticed recently that since I've been carrying a full size spare wheel, it does look a bit low, and I wondered if the springs need renewing. They are not broken, since I've checked this very recently, but maybe tired, I don't know? Thing is I can't really remember what they looked like before and it looks level, rides fine too. They are refunding me but I'm loathed to go back to Kwik-Fit, even though I know their machine will work, until I'm certain, we're tip mtop. What do you guys reckon?

View attachment 282458View attachment 282459

Is it 2wd or Quattro?

 

[Charlie Farley]

A bit low if 2wd but I had the same ride height on my Quattro, which all seem to be low on the rear for some reason.

 

[B7Tourer]

Mine sits low on the back as well, especially on the drivers side with a full tank of fuel, full size spare and original springs.

Mine looks a tad lower than yours, I was crouching really square on taking those photos; FWD; just over half a tank; fullsize Ronal/Michelin PS 4; a bit of luggage, nothing much; 36 psi Pirelli P zeros. I think it almost certainly could benefit from probably new springs and shocks; never changed them. It's the last thing on the chassis, having sorted wheels, tyres and brakes. Funny thing is, it handles better with that spare wheel weight, the back end feels very solid. It handles really good in any case, round the twisties, at speed.

A bit low if 2wd but I had the same ride height on my Quattro, which all seem to be low on the rear for some reason.

Probably the extra weight of the diff et al.

 

[northpole]

Trust me change them for new and you'll be surprised how much the rear comes up... my car now sits level not when you look at the gaps but when you take a waterlevel and put it on in the middle of the roof.. regardless of having a full tank and all the gear I stated before.

And like others the old tired shocks and absorbers didn't handle bad either... the car handled well but now way better since I changed the rear shocks and absorbers... I went for oem aftermarket s-line suspension...
I still got the fronts to do but they are still fine. As 8 bought the while lotbfor front and back as it was cheaper as a set than buying just the rears.

 

[northpole]

A bit low if 2wd but I had the same ride height on my Quattro, which all seem to be low on the rear for some reason.

2wd or quattro they sit at the same ride height both front and back as the shocks are set to the same height.

 

[Charlie Farley]

not so.

here at 29k miles.

 

[Charlie Farley]

Springs and dampers were in perfect condition and car was empty.

 

[Charlie Farley]

There are also numerous spring and damper options for the B7 weather s-line or non.

 

[northpole]

not so.

here at 29k miles.
View attachment 282465

Not oem equivalent dampers so will sit lower than an s-line on oem shocks and dampers... and that is the end of that discussion.

Trust me on this is shopped around for a long time to find the right replacements that are equally as long and had the exact same dampening quality as the oem ones.

Not saying your choice was wrong just saying you had upgraded ones that are slightly different resulting in the car sitting lower in the back.

As I said when I replaced mine the car has leveled out and still sits the same way as when it was on brand new oem s-line sport shocks and dampers.

 

[Charlie Farley]

Just to be clear, that pic is when I brought the car home in june 2014 with the factory suspension on it, not aftermarket, 100% factory issue and option spec.
No sagging springs or leaking dampers, that was the factory ride height, and from my research over the last 11 years it is 100% correct for the fitted option pack.
But hey, I maybe wrong , its very hard to argue the point.
There are approx 30 different spring options for B7's depending on options fitted and year/variant fitting , the springs control ride height so there isn't just one off-the-shelf spring , well not based on the correct factory supplied item , so final ride height will not be universally the same across all b7 varaints when using factory springs.
Aftermarket will be different as they are a one size fits all situation.

 

[Charlie Farley]

Probably best we agree to disagree on this one.

 

[northpole]

You might not like my answer, but that is way to low and that is not oem s-line ride height. It is when the rear shocksabsorbers are done for. Thing is they are made so well you don't notice they are done for until you actually replace them and we have the springs to thank for that.

 

[B7Tourer]

That's encouraging Rob, even though mines the FWD, and in truth most I've ever seen are similar. But in my case the springs are, as far as I can know, original and it has looked ever so slightly lower since I've installed the full size spare, which would suggest they are weak, since we're not talking about a huge amount of extra load there. Since changing the front lower forward control arms and the rear camber bolts (we marked the old one's position before fitting) the tracking, which was done on the front just before, still seems bang on. The rear tyres have always been long wearing in any case. But I think I will get around soonish to a refresh at the rear at least.

I changed the rear shocks and absorbers... I went for oem aftermarket s-line suspension...

Have you got a link mate? I want to fit OEM too. The S-line is just about hard enough (and right for me), as it is.

 

[northpole]

@B7Tourer i need to dig through my phone for that...

shocks the springs i got from parts in motion and i can't find the link since i bought that straight of their own website plus you'll have to give them your registration no. so they can double check you ordered the right ones.

 

[B7Tourer]

Thanks! Just looked on their website - the springs for sports suspension don't seem to come in pairs; are they the same for both sides?

Rob, can you change the title of this thread? My miss-spelling is embarassing

 

[northpole]

Thanks! Just looked on their website - the springs for sports suspension don't seem to come in pairs; are they the same for both sides?

Rob, can you change the title of this thread? My miss-spelling is embarassing

Yes they are the same on both sides on the same axle... so rear springs times 2 and you are sorted. Ps buy the shocks as a complete set, when you buy them separately they are way more expensive... I still got the fronts with springs to fit, but I want new topmounts, with new top bearings before I will put them on...

Ps if a rear bumpstop is broken, now is your chance to replace it too. A set for the rears is about 20 pounds. I reused the top mounts on the rear as they were fine. But in the front I rather put new ones on. As it's a bit more work to do them than the rears..

Don't worry about the typo's I got loads of them... and tapatalk makes it even worse...

 

[PDLH]

Mine looks a tad lower than yours

I know it’s not a competition, but 1 speed hump later, a loud bang and I think I’ve taken the lead! What a difference in a week….What is the best OEM spring option?

 

[northpole]

AFAIK most of the aftermarket springs for the b7 are made better than the oem ones ( not often you hear that the springs have broken within 15 years) the problem is finding the right springs for the oem sport suspension. You can use autodoc or parts-in-motion to find the right springs for your car, you'll have to use your car's registration no. to list the right ones and when you order them they'll ask you for your reg and vin to make sure you get the right ones. Or you use the details on the part since they list the oem part number and find a retailer on ebay that can send them out with 24 hour free delivery (it might workout cheaper)

PS parts in motion has an eBay shop too and i found that some things are cheaper (sometimes on ebay, other times if you buy through their own online webshop) so double check the website of parts in motion if you find one of their offerings on ebay.

 

[Charlie Farley]

Also , don’t rely on the reg number alone, use in conjunction with the VIN number to ensure you get the PR code part for your car.
Sadly a lot of the online parts databases are not 100% accurate on the reg number alone.

 

[northpole]

Also , don’t rely on the reg number alone, use in conjunction with the VIN number to ensure you get the PR code part for your car.
Sadly a lot of the online parts databases are not 100% accurate on the reg number alone.

It's why I pointed out just those 2 shops as I have used them myself to pinpoint the right oem part numbers that I consolidated with etka (oem parts catalogue using the vin, and matched those results, with the codes in the owners manual)

It took me quite some time to find the right PR codes.

 

[Charlie Farley]

I use Opie oils as a good guide as the reg number shows up with the correct VIN number so parts are more likely to be the correct PR code for a specific car based on its year and specific variant.
Autodoc have been incorrect a few times with parts i ordered .

 

[B7Tourer]

And do NOT rely on eBay 'assured fitment' for correct parts, when you have entered your car details, ever. They have been totally wrong many times, in my case, so much so I never take any notice of it now.

 

[B7Tourer]

Little consolation for you PDLH, but I know now there is nothing wrong with my rear springs, at least I know they are definitely not broken. When they are they look like your pics and the video below. That website Northpole linked to is pretty good, because it is quite clear how to order S-line or standard springs, and the prices seem OK.


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4e0A5PHm0qs

 

[northpole]

you still need to check that they aren't tired though @B7Tourer mine weren't broken but definately tired so tired that having just my full size sparewheel and a subwoofer made it sit lower than it should. the reason why i noticed it was because the car wasn't sitting level in one corner... driving wise it reacted just fine and never bottomed out. I noticed it when i made sure the car was sitting in a level parking spot, driver side rear was sitting lower... i repaced both on the rear and the car now sits level ak i can put both my hands flat ontop of the rear tires without the wheelarch touching my the top of my hands. and yes that is the OEM ride height with sport suspension. ( before i could only fit one finger ontop of the left side rear wheel. the car doesn't have reverse rake either it sits level. although the front arch gap is bigger than the rear the car sits level ( i put a waterlevel ontop of the roof to check it in that same level parking spot)

 

[B7Tourer]

Just had a very heavy load in the boot over the last few days - no difference. I will be changing the springs and shocks at some point but as everything handles really well, just not top of my list at the moment, but point taken.

 

[Charlie Farley]

Thanks! Just looked on their website - the springs for sports suspension don't seem to come in pairs; are they the same for both sides?

Rob, can you change the title of this thread? My miss-spelling is embarassing

Just sorted out the title of this thread.
I have been meaning to do it for some time but it totally slipped my mind.

 

[B7Tourer]

Just sorted out the title of this thread.
I have been meaning to do it for some time but it totally slipped my mind.

Thanks Rob

 

[Matt275]

I've seen that Youtube vid a few times, very useful.
This is a useful sticky, a handy guide for some ideas too :

The Ultimate B7 Rear End Refresh Parts Guide

As some of you may be aware ive recently done a rear end refresh to my B7 DTM going with aftermarket Verkline bushings etc etc Now some people may want to renew some life in there B7 but not compromise the OEM drivability and feel as most our cars will be our daily’s. So ive done some digging...

www.audi-sport.net

That speed hump Paul is so nasty, I used to feel the back really sink down as the car climbed off it...I just go so slow over it now, I don't care what people think behind me lol

 

[Matt275]

Game on Rob

 

[Charlie Farley]

Matt , I Just realised I replied here instead of "what have you done today" oh well, thats life, moved it now..

 

[PDLH]

Well that would be the problem then…… Only one spring broken, but the other one being weak, it make it look like both had snapped!

 

[Charlie Farley]

yep, that's normal for B7 rear springs.
I had a pair of allmost new OE rears springs off my special edition in the garage, i'll have look and see if they are still there

 

[Matt275]

Let me know Paul if you need an extra pair of hands if you're doing this yourself

Yes I bet that was a very loud bang, I had a front one go on my Golf several years ago. I had let the jack down too quick I think whilst I was doing something with the undertray...50 yards down the road and bang....it literally sounded like a shotgun!

 

[PDLH]

Nah it’s going into Wiltshires and they can do it on their ramps, price they want for supply of the springs is a bit steep, but I cannot be bothered to source, and wait an extra couple of days for the repair, hopefully I can get the car back sooner if they do it all, not the cheapest option, but the least hassle

 

[B7Tourer]

AFAIK most of the aftermarket springs for the b7 are made better than the oem ones ( not often you hear that the springs have broken within 15 years) the problem is finding the right springs for the oem sport suspension.

I think this is very true. Almost every Avant has suffered this sooner or later on OEM rear springs; mine appeared to have been changed around the 100,000 mark; yet 175K later they still appear not to have severe rust. The coating on the OEM ones appear from Paul's picture to be plastic like, as opposed to powder coated. Possibly water gets in and behind that cracked 'plastic' coating weaking them over time.

Nah it’s going into Wiltshires and they can do it on their ramps, price they want for supply of the springs is a bit steep, but I cannot be bothered to source, and wait an extra couple of days for the repair, hopefully I can get the car back sooner if they do it all, not the cheapest option, but the least hassle

Hopefully they don't charge you too much on labour Paul, since it's a relatively quick and straight forward job.