Project B7 420-R: 2012 Seat Exeo ST Sport Tech As Base Car.
- Thread starter Nollywood
- Start date
I will dig out the part number.
I got mine through C&R Enterprises, the VW / Audi specialists in Nottingham. Vibra-Technics do not list any mounts for our cars, so I use the mounts made for a totally non-VAG model. Same dimensions as B5/6/7 just stouter studs. 17mm nut, as opposed to our 13mm ones.
It just required drilling the smaller stud holes in the lower mount platforms bigger. They are stout enough not to require a front snub mount on my B5 V8 swaps!
These will be the final pictures of my B6 A4 Avant 3.0 Quattro Sport.
Before she gets parted out. All I will be retaining will be the Quattro drivetrain - rear subframe, differential, rear axles, driveshaft, fuel tank. These will be required to bolt up to the Seat Exeo ST.
The early days, with the original 17” Sport wheels:
The later days, with original B7 S4 18” wheel:
Before she gets parted out. All I will be retaining will be the Quattro drivetrain - rear subframe, differential, rear axles, driveshaft, fuel tank. These will be required to bolt up to the Seat Exeo ST.
The early days, with the original 17” Sport wheels:
The later days, with original B7 S4 18” wheel:
Part of my rebuild involves replacing the crank.
The engine ran well enough, though there was a knocking at idle from the bottom end. Turns out #5 big end shell was worn, but not spun. I purchased a 2002 C5 S6 crank. This allows the use of 8-bolt flywheels, giving more options. This will be paired with an uprated, full-face B5 RS4 clutch.
I could have gone with a flywheel that takes a B7 RS4 clutch, and stayed with a 10-bolt crank, but it won’t provide the grip I need.
The engine ran well enough, though there was a knocking at idle from the bottom end. Turns out #5 big end shell was worn, but not spun. I purchased a 2002 C5 S6 crank. This allows the use of 8-bolt flywheels, giving more options. This will be paired with an uprated, full-face B5 RS4 clutch.
I could have gone with a flywheel that takes a B7 RS4 clutch, and stayed with a 10-bolt crank, but it won’t provide the grip I need.
Transmission mounts are often overlooked, due to their location. Engine mounts are often easier to see, and reach. Transmission mounts made of rubber get oiled up, go through several heat cycles, due to their close proximity to the CAT’s.
Most sloppy shifts are as a result of bad transmission mounts. I have sorted out the mounts to use here. Differential and subframe mounts will follow. I just need to purchase one stock mount of each, and get them made by Vibra Technics, or matched up from their current inventory.
Choice of transmission mounts from Vibra Technics:
Most sloppy shifts are as a result of bad transmission mounts. I have sorted out the mounts to use here. Differential and subframe mounts will follow. I just need to purchase one stock mount of each, and get them made by Vibra Technics, or matched up from their current inventory.
Choice of transmission mounts from Vibra Technics:
I run an Apikol mount. Been using it for years and works great.
https://www.apikol.com/index.php/products/audi-b6-b7-transmission-mount.html
https://www.apikol.com/index.php/products/audi-b6-b7-transmission-mount.html
Apikol make good stuff, only they’re US-based. I really don’t want to be paying customs charges, worse when you don’t know what it’ll be, until your parts arrive in the country.
But yeah, Apikol are great.
But yeah, Apikol are great.
As with all my V8 swaps, this one will be as OEM as possible.
I try to use as little aftermarket content as possible, and this includes wheels. I have a set of fully refurbished genuine 19” B7 RS4 wheels, but I don’t know how these will look with the B8.5 front end. I am looking at genuine 2016 RS7 20” wheels, or other Audi wheels in the size 20” range.
I have also located a printing firm, that handles wraps, screen printing, business stationery, car badges / decals etc.
I will be having my original data sticker reproduced, in the same VAG-style, down to the paper, size and font. I will have the options amended as required, to match the engine, interior options, color etc. So all the updated PR-codes will be relevant to my car and it’s build.
My only concession to a non OEM identification plate will be an anodised silver or gold plaque, which will be fitted to the front panel, alongside the original Audi stickers warning about sudden fan operation / high voltage ignition system. This will be unique to my car, as I doubt I will ever build another.
I will not be badging it as a Seat or Audi, as it will be neither. A new logo will be created, along with new custom model badges for the grille and right of the tailgate, where you usually find an S4 / RS4 badge. Font will be similar though...
I try to use as little aftermarket content as possible, and this includes wheels. I have a set of fully refurbished genuine 19” B7 RS4 wheels, but I don’t know how these will look with the B8.5 front end. I am looking at genuine 2016 RS7 20” wheels, or other Audi wheels in the size 20” range.
I have also located a printing firm, that handles wraps, screen printing, business stationery, car badges / decals etc.
I will be having my original data sticker reproduced, in the same VAG-style, down to the paper, size and font. I will have the options amended as required, to match the engine, interior options, color etc. So all the updated PR-codes will be relevant to my car and it’s build.
My only concession to a non OEM identification plate will be an anodised silver or gold plaque, which will be fitted to the front panel, alongside the original Audi stickers warning about sudden fan operation / high voltage ignition system. This will be unique to my car, as I doubt I will ever build another.
I will not be badging it as a Seat or Audi, as it will be neither. A new logo will be created, along with new custom model badges for the grille and right of the tailgate, where you usually find an S4 / RS4 badge. Font will be similar though...
Only just noticed your having a B8.5 front end 
fair play, blimey you really do like a challenge.
fair play, blimey you really do like a challenge.
Since I start doing B5 V8 swaps back in 2008, I have had a lot of enquiries, mostly regarding converting the C5 RS6 to manual.
As many may know, the C5 RS6 block is unique to it’s application to automatic transmission. It runs a much larger torque converter than regular V8 engines, similar to that fitted to the W12 engines.
This means a larger diameter flexi plate, and a larger rear mounting surface to bolt to the larger RS6-specific automatic transmission bellhousing. The RS6 block will bolt to a regular 01E 6-speed manual, but some machining, drilling and tapping is required, to ensure all bolt holes are used. Without this, only 4 bolt holes line up.
I encountered this issue with my last swap, a BFM 4.2 V8 40V from a 2005 D3 A8 into a 2000 B5 A4 2.8 Quattro, married to an 01E. A days worth of measuring, marking, machining, drilling and tapping got all 10 bolt holes used.
So, I will split the 077-series 40V blocks into 2 groups:
SMALL BLOCK.
D2 A8 3.7 / 4.2 V8, 1999 - 2002.
D2 S8, 1999 - 2002.
C5 A6 4.2 V8, 1998 - 2003.
C5 S6, 1999 - 2003.
BIG BLOCK.
D3 A8 3.7 / 4.2 V8, 2003 - 2005.
C5 RS6, 2002 - 2004.
Identification of the blocks are simple:
The starter motor aperture on the “small blocks” forms a continuous hoop.
The starter motor aperture on the “big blocks” forms a split hoop (like a “C”).
SMALL BLOCK.
BIG BLOCK.
As many may know, the C5 RS6 block is unique to it’s application to automatic transmission. It runs a much larger torque converter than regular V8 engines, similar to that fitted to the W12 engines.
This means a larger diameter flexi plate, and a larger rear mounting surface to bolt to the larger RS6-specific automatic transmission bellhousing. The RS6 block will bolt to a regular 01E 6-speed manual, but some machining, drilling and tapping is required, to ensure all bolt holes are used. Without this, only 4 bolt holes line up.
I encountered this issue with my last swap, a BFM 4.2 V8 40V from a 2005 D3 A8 into a 2000 B5 A4 2.8 Quattro, married to an 01E. A days worth of measuring, marking, machining, drilling and tapping got all 10 bolt holes used.
So, I will split the 077-series 40V blocks into 2 groups:
SMALL BLOCK.
D2 A8 3.7 / 4.2 V8, 1999 - 2002.
D2 S8, 1999 - 2002.
C5 A6 4.2 V8, 1998 - 2003.
C5 S6, 1999 - 2003.
BIG BLOCK.
D3 A8 3.7 / 4.2 V8, 2003 - 2005.
C5 RS6, 2002 - 2004.
Identification of the blocks are simple:
The starter motor aperture on the “small blocks” forms a continuous hoop.
The starter motor aperture on the “big blocks” forms a split hoop (like a “C”).
SMALL BLOCK.
BIG BLOCK.
Look at the line differences as well, I just can't see it being possible without either looking a mess or being held together with pretty much nothing. Difference in length may not sound all that hard to work with but that means cutting and merging the wings down to a tee, cutting the bonnet smaller, making the bumper support some how fit and much more or using a B8 front axel or something which sounds even more tricky in my books.
I don't want to be "that guy" who says just buy a xyz instead
I don't want to be "that guy" who says just buy a xyz instead
There’s one car that never failed to impress me with its handling, due to its rear wheel steering, was a pretty obscure, and underrated car from the 1980’s...
The Honda Prelude.
And I’m not referring to passive rear wheel steer, whereby the rear axle bushings are set up with compliance to allow some degree of movement. I’m talking about Active Rear Wheel Steer. The Honda Prelude was pretty advanced for its time. No other sport Coupé or Sedan had such a set up, not even cars from the premium sector.
The result of RWS on the Honda Prelude was three fold: Tire wear was greatly reduced, gas mileage improved due to less friction and tire scrub, and handling on the limit was sharper and more neutral than that of similar vehicles in its class.
I had long forgotten about this, until now, as I’m now an IRTEC-certified large goods vehicle technician, working on big rigs.
A lot of these trucks with more than 8 wheels have steering mid or rear axles. The mids I’m not interested in, as they utilise a mechanical connection between the front axle and the middle one (just behind the front one). This is just an extra drag link, cumbersome and crude, and steers the mid axle wheels in the same direction as the fronts, and with the same degree of steer.
The rear steering axles is my interest here. The struts are not mechanically linked to the fronts, they are linked by a fluid medium. So, hydraulics. There is a master hydraulic ram attached to the front steering axle, and a similar slave one at the rear. Linked by hydraulics, so steering the front axle forces fluid to the rear ram, extending or retracting the piston.
Think of a master and slave clutch cylinder arrangement, and you’ll get an idea how this works. Different front to rear cylinder ratios will produce different results and feel.
The rear wheels steer in the opposing directing to the fronts, just like the old Honda Prelude did. And with just about 20% of the front turn angle too.
I am looking at incorporating a similar setup in the rear of the 8E rear end. With the old type 85 / B2 Quattro models, it was much easier, due to the very simple rear arrangement. Effectively, a mirror of the front subframe, struts and trackrod setup.
Working on big rigs has its advantages.
The Honda Prelude.
And I’m not referring to passive rear wheel steer, whereby the rear axle bushings are set up with compliance to allow some degree of movement. I’m talking about Active Rear Wheel Steer. The Honda Prelude was pretty advanced for its time. No other sport Coupé or Sedan had such a set up, not even cars from the premium sector.
The result of RWS on the Honda Prelude was three fold: Tire wear was greatly reduced, gas mileage improved due to less friction and tire scrub, and handling on the limit was sharper and more neutral than that of similar vehicles in its class.
I had long forgotten about this, until now, as I’m now an IRTEC-certified large goods vehicle technician, working on big rigs.
A lot of these trucks with more than 8 wheels have steering mid or rear axles. The mids I’m not interested in, as they utilise a mechanical connection between the front axle and the middle one (just behind the front one). This is just an extra drag link, cumbersome and crude, and steers the mid axle wheels in the same direction as the fronts, and with the same degree of steer.
The rear steering axles is my interest here. The struts are not mechanically linked to the fronts, they are linked by a fluid medium. So, hydraulics. There is a master hydraulic ram attached to the front steering axle, and a similar slave one at the rear. Linked by hydraulics, so steering the front axle forces fluid to the rear ram, extending or retracting the piston.
Think of a master and slave clutch cylinder arrangement, and you’ll get an idea how this works. Different front to rear cylinder ratios will produce different results and feel.
The rear wheels steer in the opposing directing to the fronts, just like the old Honda Prelude did. And with just about 20% of the front turn angle too.
I am looking at incorporating a similar setup in the rear of the 8E rear end. With the old type 85 / B2 Quattro models, it was much easier, due to the very simple rear arrangement. Effectively, a mirror of the front subframe, struts and trackrod setup.
Working on big rigs has its advantages.
Rear wheel steer is cool and I recall the new a8 has it among a few other more recent Audi's if you wanted to know where you could maybe nick components from.
Just want to point out allot of people in old Jap car's got rid of rear wheel steer due to common problems... personally think (like those people) that it's just one more thing to go wrong but each to their own.
Get the motor in a shell and think of these mad ideas later
Just want to point out allot of people in old Jap car's got rid of rear wheel steer due to common problems... personally think (like those people) that it's just one more thing to go wrong but each to their own.
Get the motor in a shell and think of these mad ideas later
Yes, some newer Audi’s have RWS.
Unfortunately, due to their electrical complexity and CAN integration, they won’t be an easy conversion to older Audi platforms. Not yet, st any rate.
The issue with older RWS on 1980’s Honda models was simple. Hydraulic leaks, and pump failure. I should know, I owned a 1984 Honda Prelude LX.
The best time to get suspension mods done, is with the subframe built up on the floor, especially when converting a B7 FWD to Quattro.
Unfortunately, due to their electrical complexity and CAN integration, they won’t be an easy conversion to older Audi platforms. Not yet, st any rate.
The issue with older RWS on 1980’s Honda models was simple. Hydraulic leaks, and pump failure. I should know, I owned a 1984 Honda Prelude LX.
The best time to get suspension mods done, is with the subframe built up on the floor, especially when converting a B7 FWD to Quattro.
Really like this build!!
Looking for a brake upgrade?
I'm selling this:
I could be interested.
What’s the spec? What car was it pulled from?
I've send you a PM
Thanks bud.
I’ll go through it once I get home. Stuck in traffic on M25.
KLBC
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My apologies, Bluepower. I completely forgot to get back to you.
Great price, but right now, there are certain things I need to get first - like a base car for my build! If you’ve still got it in the next 4 weeks or thereabouts, we’ll talk further.
Great price, but right now, there are certain things I need to get first - like a base car for my build! If you’ve still got it in the next 4 weeks or thereabouts, we’ll talk further.
You don't have that main part yet then, I thought you were already way ahead with the project and had the base rolling chassis in progress......I was looking forward to seeing it half done by now....
G’day ladies and gents!
I have been looking at different rear differential solutions, for my B7 build.
In the late 1980’s - early 1990’s, I was pretty much into the B2, B3 and B4 drag scene, going on to win trophies with my RS2-engine spec’d B2 Coupé Quattro. Final output of 420hp and 437 ft-lbs from a 2.5L built version of the Audi 2.2 20V I5 turbo. The “Big 5”!
Quarter mile times with the same power output, but different rear differential fitted:
017 locker, differential open - 12.38 secs.
017 locker, differential locked - 12.33 secs.
017 TORSEN - 12.26 secs.
The upper 2 differential were the stock B2 / B3 Quattro versions, with 4.11 FD.
The lower differential was the stock TORSEN D11 Quattro version, with 4.11 FD.
Launching with the stock rear differential, and the differential lock disengaged produced a lot of front and rear wheelspin, more at the front though. For those too young to remember, locking the rear meant the centre was locked too, though the centre could be locked independently, the rear could not, unless the vacuum lines to the actuators were reconfigured.
With the rear differential locked independently, after I reconfigured the vacuum-operated actuator lines, my times were better. Though I must say, I did not launch the car as hard as with the differential lock disengaged. I was conscious of the fact that the lock was mechanical, a simple pawl arrangement. I was not sure how it would react to a full launch with 437 ft-lbs of torque. It could have been quicker, but I never tried it.
When I installed the TORSEN / LSD rear differential foam a 1992 Audi V8, things were different. Besides being quicker on the drag strip, handling on the limit in corners was different too. Much more composed than with the stock 017 run in “open” mode.
I have a spare V8 torsen rear differential, for my build. I am now wondering if I should acquire an 017 lockable differential from a B2 Quattro. And try beating on it with the rear differential lock engaged? Just try it closer to home, in case it breaks. And have a stock 8E (01R) and tools in the trunk to swap back in if the mechanical locking pawl in the 017 snaps.
So, have any of you guys tried a different rear differential, even if it’s an aftermarket LSD? How was the experience?
Thanks all.
I have been looking at different rear differential solutions, for my B7 build.
In the late 1980’s - early 1990’s, I was pretty much into the B2, B3 and B4 drag scene, going on to win trophies with my RS2-engine spec’d B2 Coupé Quattro. Final output of 420hp and 437 ft-lbs from a 2.5L built version of the Audi 2.2 20V I5 turbo. The “Big 5”!
Quarter mile times with the same power output, but different rear differential fitted:
017 locker, differential open - 12.38 secs.
017 locker, differential locked - 12.33 secs.
017 TORSEN - 12.26 secs.
The upper 2 differential were the stock B2 / B3 Quattro versions, with 4.11 FD.
The lower differential was the stock TORSEN D11 Quattro version, with 4.11 FD.
Launching with the stock rear differential, and the differential lock disengaged produced a lot of front and rear wheelspin, more at the front though. For those too young to remember, locking the rear meant the centre was locked too, though the centre could be locked independently, the rear could not, unless the vacuum lines to the actuators were reconfigured.
With the rear differential locked independently, after I reconfigured the vacuum-operated actuator lines, my times were better. Though I must say, I did not launch the car as hard as with the differential lock disengaged. I was conscious of the fact that the lock was mechanical, a simple pawl arrangement. I was not sure how it would react to a full launch with 437 ft-lbs of torque. It could have been quicker, but I never tried it.
When I installed the TORSEN / LSD rear differential foam a 1992 Audi V8, things were different. Besides being quicker on the drag strip, handling on the limit in corners was different too. Much more composed than with the stock 017 run in “open” mode.
I have a spare V8 torsen rear differential, for my build. I am now wondering if I should acquire an 017 lockable differential from a B2 Quattro. And try beating on it with the rear differential lock engaged? Just try it closer to home, in case it breaks. And have a stock 8E (01R) and tools in the trunk to swap back in if the mechanical locking pawl in the 017 snaps.
So, have any of you guys tried a different rear differential, even if it’s an aftermarket LSD? How was the experience?
Thanks all.
Just ordered these BiXenons. Comes with ballasts and bulbs. Left hand headlamp was back ordered from Audi, with the expected delivery date being the 6th of December.
I’m not willing to wait that long, so I found an alternative source:
I’m not willing to wait that long, so I found an alternative source:
Just ordered these BiXenons. Comes with ballasts and bulbs. Left hand headlamp was back ordered from Audi, with the expected delivery date being the 6th of December.
I’m not willing to wait that long, so I found an alternative source:
These are for the B7? Where did you get those at? They’re probably out of my price range but please share if your willing to.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Still not sure how that's going to work... I admire your ambition and will be interested to see what does/doesn't make the final cut.
I’ve just dropped a deposit on a 2012 Seat Exeo ST Sport Tech, thanks to EA. I’m away on vacation, so I won’t be seeing it in the metal until I get back home.
It’s a black on black, and being a 2012, it’s a facelift model, which gives different wheels, honeycomb grille, LED DRL’s and Xenon headlamps.
It’s a black on black, and being a 2012, it’s a facelift model, which gives different wheels, honeycomb grille, LED DRL’s and Xenon headlamps.
I haven’t owned a 2WD VAG model in the last 20 years. Besides, deploying 700hp / 720Nm through the front wheels would be akin to driving on ice.
Phase 1 will be the installation of Quattro AWD, using the rear subframe, gas tank, differential, rear axles, driveshaft from my B6 Avant, and my built 01E.
This is an 01E I have never let go. It has been in 2 of my cars till date. 6th ratio is geared to do 37.2 mph in per 1000 rpm in 6th. It was originally in a 2003 C5 A6 2.5 V6 TDI Quattro.
Phase 1 will be the installation of Quattro AWD, using the rear subframe, gas tank, differential, rear axles, driveshaft from my B6 Avant, and my built 01E.
This is an 01E I have never let go. It has been in 2 of my cars till date. 6th ratio is geared to do 37.2 mph in per 1000 rpm in 6th. It was originally in a 2003 C5 A6 2.5 V6 TDI Quattro.
My original plan was to replace the entire Seat Exeo ST wiring harness, with one from a B6/7 A4 Avant, as the Seat is a 2.0 TDI. This will make the integration of my custom C5 RS6 engine harness much easier.
But...
After spending an hour poring over the 2012 Seat Exeo ST dash (main) harness, this will really complicate things. If it was a pre-facelift car, built 2009 - 2011, it would be easy to yank the entire harness out. But not the facelift from 2012 - 2013. Especially as it’s a Sport, with the Tech Pack. It’s just too highly-specified.
This car has:
Bi-Xenon headlamps.
LED DRL’s.
LED tails.
240V AC socket in the centre console.
AUX input in the centre console.
iPod input in the centre console.
Power folding mirrors.
Rear PDC.
And more I’m still trying to get my head around.
I’m fully aware that most modern vehicles have separate harnesses, connected to the central system (in the case of the B7, the dash harness) making them easy to replace. But the dash harness of the 8E chassis cars is unique to the original customer’s order. This means the RNS-E, and most of the audio options are incorporated in the central system.
Slapping in a B7 A4 harness will require a lot of reworking, a B7 S4 / RS4 with Bi-Xenon headlamps and a similar spec level to the Seat would be ideal, but they don’t come up for sale often, and I don’t really want a heavily-reworked dash harness.
Interestingly, the B7 Seat Exeo ST is a mixture of B6 and B7. The early cars up to mid 2010 have RB6 instrument clusters, while later cars, including mine are RB8. The CCM is also the same as fitted to all B7 S4 models. Dual-stage airbags too.
So overall, it would be easier to incorporate the gasoline-specific wiring into the Seat Exeo ST’s harness. This includes the fuel pump relay socket. It’s in the diesel-engined cars too, but a couple of the slots are vacant. Same goes with adding the secondary fuel level sender, which will reside in the quattro’s fuel tank.
I love wiring!
But...
After spending an hour poring over the 2012 Seat Exeo ST dash (main) harness, this will really complicate things. If it was a pre-facelift car, built 2009 - 2011, it would be easy to yank the entire harness out. But not the facelift from 2012 - 2013. Especially as it’s a Sport, with the Tech Pack. It’s just too highly-specified.
This car has:
Bi-Xenon headlamps.
LED DRL’s.
LED tails.
240V AC socket in the centre console.
AUX input in the centre console.
iPod input in the centre console.
Power folding mirrors.
Rear PDC.
And more I’m still trying to get my head around.
I’m fully aware that most modern vehicles have separate harnesses, connected to the central system (in the case of the B7, the dash harness) making them easy to replace. But the dash harness of the 8E chassis cars is unique to the original customer’s order. This means the RNS-E, and most of the audio options are incorporated in the central system.
Slapping in a B7 A4 harness will require a lot of reworking, a B7 S4 / RS4 with Bi-Xenon headlamps and a similar spec level to the Seat would be ideal, but they don’t come up for sale often, and I don’t really want a heavily-reworked dash harness.
Interestingly, the B7 Seat Exeo ST is a mixture of B6 and B7. The early cars up to mid 2010 have RB6 instrument clusters, while later cars, including mine are RB8. The CCM is also the same as fitted to all B7 S4 models. Dual-stage airbags too.
So overall, it would be easier to incorporate the gasoline-specific wiring into the Seat Exeo ST’s harness. This includes the fuel pump relay socket. It’s in the diesel-engined cars too, but a couple of the slots are vacant. Same goes with adding the secondary fuel level sender, which will reside in the quattro’s fuel tank.
I love wiring!
There are diagrams of the b6 and b7 headlight wiring differences on my conversion thread: https://www.audi-sport.net/xf/threads/jakes-b7-conversion-progress-thread.190651/
What happened to this (never been done before) b8.5 front end conversion anyway
What happened to this (never been done before) b8.5 front end conversion anyway