TFSI 140 COD: vibrations in 2-cyl mode
- Thread starter LuisM
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Most of my driving is at low rpm (less than 2,500) and gentle driving so based on what you say I should experience it. .... but I don't.
I can induce a slight vibration in 4th at below 1200rpm on a light pedal, but I think that is due to asking too much as above 1200rpm it disappears.
I tend to drive it more like a diesel, exploiting the torque to keep the revs down, so when cruising it is mainly around or below 2000rpm. I've even tried deliberately increasing the throttle slightly, then backing off, which causes the cylinder mode to switch back and forth. Absolutely no change in noise, vibration or feel of the car can be discerned.
No, it's the COD alright. I've had an Audi Technician driving the car. He has confirmed the vibrations comes from the COD.
However if it was how come several of us aren't having the same. I cannot see how the technician is saying that when to have a vibration through the steering wheel that isn't really connected phyically to the engine as it is EPAS.
koder
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I drive a mix of high and low RPMs, usually accelerate quickly but then cruising at a low RPM and constant speed with light throttle and 2-cyl mode activated. How can I try to replicate the issue? Is it at a particular speed or gear?
LuisM
Registered User
To (try to) reproduce it:
1. Set the 2-cyl indicator on the screen. Not necessary but it helps.
2. Drive in any gear between 1500 and 2000 rpm.
3. Step moderately on the throttle. You should press the pedal as much as you can without entering 4-cyl mode (vibrations happen only in 2-cyl mode).
1. Set the 2-cyl indicator on the screen. Not necessary but it helps.
2. Drive in any gear between 1500 and 2000 rpm.
3. Step moderately on the throttle. You should press the pedal as much as you can without entering 4-cyl mode (vibrations happen only in 2-cyl mode).
LuisM
Registered User
At 1200 rpm it's not the same vibrations I notice. Mine (and others') are only in 2-cyl mode, and below 1400 or 1300 rpm the car is always in 4-cyl mode (my manual says below 1500, but it's more like 1300). What you notice at 1200 rpm is probably just the standard feel of a (4-cyl) engine pressed at too low revs
That was my point really, I can drive in a manner that induces some small vibration, however, from what you describe about your car mine doesn't have the same issue...
Same here, although I sometimes feel a slight vibration at around 2000rpm under light load, it happens regardless of whether I'm in 2 or 4 cylinder mode so not the COD specifically.
I came from a diesel so even a slightly vibrating petrol is way smoother!
No offence to the technician but how would he know? He may know that only COD-equipped engines produce the vibration but that's not the same as claiming it's the COD system which causes them. He's a technician at the end of the day, not an engine designer. Whilst no doubt possessing a great deal of knowledge, I very much doubt he has enough of a detailed knowledge of the engine design to be able to say for certain that the COD system is what's causing the issue.
LuisM
Registered User
He may know (or guess) because it's a known issue of the CoD engine (or at least some of them). In my case, for example, I'm completely sure the vibrations only happen when I'm in 2-cylinder mode and stepping lightly on the throttle. I know that because I drive and notice it every day, and every time the vibrations happen it's in 2-cyl mode, and as soon as I step harder the engine leaves 2-cyl mode and at the same time the vibrations dissapear. So, if someone says he has a similar issue, it would be natural for me to assume it's the same thing. I could do a drive test, and within minutes I could check whether the pattern is like mine or not.
LuisM
Registered User
That's very true. I drove an A1 TDI during some weeks, and I remember thinking "the vibrations of my engine are nothing compared to these" 
came from a diesel so even a slightly vibrating petrol is way smoother!
This is exactly the way to reproduce the vibrations every time. Tried it in two cars.
It's very easy to determine whether it's the COD that is causing the vibrations. The COD is only active when the engine is warm. When the outside temperature is minus 4 degrees (Celsius) it takes app. 10+ min. before the COD sets in. When plus 4 degrees its takes app. 5+ min.
Before the COD sets in the car is driving like a dream.
However if these 'vibrations' are less than can be felt as normal from a diesel engine then where is the problem. If there was some defect that might cause any damage then you have a warranty to fall back upon. If a technician is saying it is normal then just drive the car as normal and see if anything develops to prove them wrong...
LuisM
Registered User
It's true that the CoD vibrations are considered normal by Audi. But I don't agree with
The problem is that this is not a a diesel engine. You don't expect those vibrations from a petrol engine. Comparing it with a TDI engine is fallacious.
Imagine you had a TDI with unusually large consumption and someone said "Don't worry about that, my petrol engine has even greater consumption!". Would you be satisfied with that argument?
The problem is that this is not a a diesel engine. You don't expect those vibrations from a petrol engine. Comparing it with a TDI engine is fallacious.
Imagine you had a TDI with unusually large consumption and someone said "Don't worry about that, my petrol engine has even greater consumption!". Would you be satisfied with that argument?
So is this still an issue on Audi's bought today? I'm getting an A3 1.4 TFSI COD 150 S-Tronic on April 20th (wish I was saying February 20th...) so I'll be sure to try this out.
To be honest I'm fairly tolerant to vibrations like that so I may not notice but I'll post again if I do find it. I'm also a little spoilt by my Dad's 2006 A6 2.7 TDI Multitronic, which is ridiculously smooth. Don't think I've ever felt a gear change in the 8 years he's owned it (and I've driven a good 5000 miles in it). Feels like it has only one, very long, gear.
Separate but sort of related question - if you put it in "sport" mode, does that disable COD so it always remains on 4 cylinders?
To be honest I'm fairly tolerant to vibrations like that so I may not notice but I'll post again if I do find it. I'm also a little spoilt by my Dad's 2006 A6 2.7 TDI Multitronic, which is ridiculously smooth. Don't think I've ever felt a gear change in the 8 years he's owned it (and I've driven a good 5000 miles in it). Feels like it has only one, very long, gear.
Separate but sort of related question - if you put it in "sport" mode, does that disable COD so it always remains on 4 cylinders?
Yes but it is a petrol engine different from other petrol engines that are commonly used. I wasn't actually comparing it with a diesel engine per say, but suggesting that if the vibrations are much less than a diesel, and much smoother, then what is the problem if the techies are now saying it is normal. If it isn't and something goes wrong you can come back to them and prove they were incorrect.
LuisM
Registered User
Yes, I agree with you there. Still, it could do without those vibrations But yes, they are normal in a 2-cyl engine
But yes, they are normal in a 2-cyl engine
LuisM
Registered User
Here's my view. The vibrations are there. Some people notice them, others don't.
There are engine software updates that seem to reduce those vibrations (see earlier on this thread). Your new car will surely have those updates included. My advice: try not to focus on those vibrations. If you don't notice them, lucky you. If you do, think they are normal and try not to pay attention to them.
Apart from those vibrations, it's a great engine. Large power, large torque, proggressive. Low noise and consumption.
There are engine software updates that seem to reduce those vibrations (see earlier on this thread). Your new car will surely have those updates included. My advice: try not to focus on those vibrations. If you don't notice them, lucky you. If you do, think they are normal and try not to pay attention to them.
Apart from those vibrations, it's a great engine. Large power, large torque, proggressive. Low noise and consumption.
Just for the record, we have a 3 cyl ecoboost engine in our fiesta, yes it vibrates, yes you can feel it through the steering wheel. But it is all perfectly normal as the more cylinders you have the smoother the engine is. Another reason is that todays petrol engines have a far higher compression ratio than engines did about ten years ago, they will have a small amount of vibration, this is why a dual mass flywheel is fitted, such as diesel engines have, to absorb any vibration. As too not noticing it, I can assure you mine only vibrates when I induce it, it is completely absent from being there in the rev range as described.
To me the perfect car without the COD system.
But potential buyers should be given a fair warning and also consider the fact that when the time comes to sell, the demand could be lower and price less.
Please notice, there are no software updates that removes the vibrations in the AUDI A3 1.4 TFSI 150 HK manual.
Lars you seem to be the only person who has a problem with the 2 cylinder mode.
With respect, I don't think that will make any difference to demand for the COD engine, new or used.
With respect, I don't think that will make any difference to demand for the COD engine, new or used.
LuisM
Registered User
Come on guys, don't be so stubborn:
> Far wariing of what, that Audi have stated there is nothing wrong?
cuke2u: Fair warning that the engine vibrates. Some of us do notice, and do feel a little bothered by that, and by not having been told in advance. Not terribly bothered, but somewhat bothered, yes.
> Lars you seem to be the only person who has a problem with the 2 cylinder mode.
leosayer1: Have you read this thread? There are many of us who notice. You don't notice? Fine. Maybe your engine doesn't vibrate so much. Or not at all. Or you are lucky enough to be less sensitive to vibrations. But Lars is not the only person who notices the vibrations. Again, read this thread.
> Far wariing of what, that Audi have stated there is nothing wrong?
cuke2u: Fair warning that the engine vibrates. Some of us do notice, and do feel a little bothered by that, and by not having been told in advance. Not terribly bothered, but somewhat bothered, yes.
> Lars you seem to be the only person who has a problem with the 2 cylinder mode.
leosayer1: Have you read this thread? There are many of us who notice. You don't notice? Fine. Maybe your engine doesn't vibrate so much. Or not at all. Or you are lucky enough to be less sensitive to vibrations. But Lars is not the only person who notices the vibrations. Again, read this thread.
Luis, perhaps it is lost in the translation, but for you to keep stating you speak for the majority is incorrect, then, to add insult to injury, you than claim that because we're unable to notice it, it is because we aren't sensitive enough to feel it. Now I think I have been around cars long enough to know what is normal and what isn't, and I was a car technician for a number of years too, a trained one, so please don't tell me I cannot feel what isn't there. You know what people can get fixated about something that doesn't really exist, more perceived that factual, and convince themselves they have a problem.
As for it affecting resale values, you're joking right?
As for it affecting resale values, you're joking right?
My 1.4 COD is nearly one year old, with 9.2k miles, and the engine has vibrated between 1000 to 1500 rpm when running on two cylinders since new, and it's especially noticeable when pootling along in slow moving traffic. I have learnt to live with this, and can't be ar*ed to take it to a dealer for them to tell me this is normal, which, IMHO, it is.
LuisM
Registered User
cuke2u: No offense intended. Sorry if I made it seem that way in my previous message.
I don't claim to be speaking for the majority. But I do speak for LarsR, dkpeter, Muchas, and AllanG (all in this thread). See also what user hookoo reports in this other thread. It's from a car magazine, and the car testers also noticed the vibrations. Also Audi technicians have confirmed me (and others) there are vibrations.
So, are you saying we (some drivers, car magazine testers, Audi technicians) are all seeing things that don't exist?
As I said, maybe your engine doesn't vibrate. I've never put that in doubt. But, please, don't tell me mine doesn't vibrate.
leosayer1: good point. The vibrations may not be a problem. In fact, they are probably normal in an engine working on 2 cylinders only. I'm only saying that I (and others) do notice the vibrations. They are there, at least on some units. And even they may not a problem, I do find them a little annoying.
I don't claim to be speaking for the majority. But I do speak for LarsR, dkpeter, Muchas, and AllanG (all in this thread). See also what user hookoo reports in this other thread. It's from a car magazine, and the car testers also noticed the vibrations. Also Audi technicians have confirmed me (and others) there are vibrations.
So, are you saying we (some drivers, car magazine testers, Audi technicians) are all seeing things that don't exist?
As I said, maybe your engine doesn't vibrate. I've never put that in doubt. But, please, don't tell me mine doesn't vibrate.
leosayer1: good point. The vibrations may not be a problem. In fact, they are probably normal in an engine working on 2 cylinders only. I'm only saying that I (and others) do notice the vibrations. They are there, at least on some units. And even they may not a problem, I do find them a little annoying.
I notice the vibrations as well. They don't annoy me in the slightest in fact I find it gives the car some much needed character, along with rattle noises that come from S-tronic gearbox.
I like the fact that the engineering which has gone into making this car fuel efficient and lightweight occasionally makes it presence felt in the background, but it doesn't prevent half decent performance being a toe-flex away when the mood takes you.
I like the fact that the engineering which has gone into making this car fuel efficient and lightweight occasionally makes it presence felt in the background, but it doesn't prevent half decent performance being a toe-flex away when the mood takes you.
LuisM
Registered User
Well, that's an interesting observation, because
a) You notice the vibrations too (hear that, cuke2u?)
b) It provides a new perspective on the vibrations, which may help make them feel less annoying
a) You notice the vibrations too (hear that, cuke2u?
)b) It provides a new perspective on the vibrations, which may help make them feel less annoying
This is what leosayer actually wrote in his first post, "
I do hear a slight change in engine noise when the 2 cylinder mode is engaged. You could call it a rattle but it's barely detectable and I wouldn't call it a vibration. This is with the s-tronic gearbox.
Annoying? Not at all. The engine is the most refined 4 pot I've ever driven, whether in 2 or 4 cylinder mode."
That isn't what you are claiming your engine does at all. I think you will find there are one or two that 'think' they have a vibration, vastly outnumbered but those who don't
I do hear a slight change in engine noise when the 2 cylinder mode is engaged. You could call it a rattle but it's barely detectable and I wouldn't call it a vibration. This is with the s-tronic gearbox.
Annoying? Not at all. The engine is the most refined 4 pot I've ever driven, whether in 2 or 4 cylinder mode."
That isn't what you are claiming your engine does at all. I think you will find there are one or two that 'think' they have a vibration, vastly outnumbered but those who don't
That quote was from quite some time ago and only a couple of months into my ownership of the car.
I think my perception of the 2 cylinder mode has changed as I’ve driven more miles in the car and become more attuned with it.
I’m not sure that the word rattle or vibration adequtely describe it, so let me have another go…..
At low speed, if the windows are closed and the stereo off then I can quite easily detect when the car is in 2 cylinder mode. I’m often surprised how soon it kicks in on a cold engine.
I can detect it by a number of ways:
· I get slightly less acceleration than I expect from a moderate increase pressure on the pedal. Easy to adjust for once you’re in tune with it.
· The ‘beat’ of the engine changes and the beats sound more prominent, in exactly the same way as the unmistakable beat of a Fiat twin air engine or a 2cv. The beats can be heard and felt but they’re so subtle that you need to make a concious effort to do so, with the windows closed, stereo off etc.
· At low speed, low revs but medium throttle opening the beats become more prominent and you can feel and hear them more than before. This doesn’t spoil my enjoyment of the car and I’ve never considered it a problem. My wife, who drives the car more than me, has never mentioned it and believe me, she would.. But then I’m a ‘car person’ and my wife isn’t.
I have few things in my mind that Audi could fix for the next A3 and the 2 cylinder mode isn’t on it. I’d buy the same engine again without hesitation.
I think my perception of the 2 cylinder mode has changed as I’ve driven more miles in the car and become more attuned with it.
I’m not sure that the word rattle or vibration adequtely describe it, so let me have another go…..
At low speed, if the windows are closed and the stereo off then I can quite easily detect when the car is in 2 cylinder mode. I’m often surprised how soon it kicks in on a cold engine.
I can detect it by a number of ways:
· I get slightly less acceleration than I expect from a moderate increase pressure on the pedal. Easy to adjust for once you’re in tune with it.
· The ‘beat’ of the engine changes and the beats sound more prominent, in exactly the same way as the unmistakable beat of a Fiat twin air engine or a 2cv. The beats can be heard and felt but they’re so subtle that you need to make a concious effort to do so, with the windows closed, stereo off etc.
· At low speed, low revs but medium throttle opening the beats become more prominent and you can feel and hear them more than before. This doesn’t spoil my enjoyment of the car and I’ve never considered it a problem. My wife, who drives the car more than me, has never mentioned it and believe me, she would.. But then I’m a ‘car person’ and my wife isn’t.
I have few things in my mind that Audi could fix for the next A3 and the 2 cylinder mode isn’t on it. I’d buy the same engine again without hesitation.
So its a 'beat' not a vibration, and a lower amount of power from an engine when only using half of its cubic capacity? So that's expected I guess from a engine designed in that way. Can't say I have noticed it myself, I just get in the thing and drive it in the same way I have driven every car. I guess some, not you, feel the need to drive their cars so as too deliberately create a perceived issue. Although, like any new technology, it can, after feedback, always be refined...
LuisM
Registered User
Why do you insist so much that the vibrations are only perceived (as opposed to them being real, I presume?). You can say your engine doesn't vibrate. But you can't say my engine (or Lars', or dkpeter's before the software update) doesn't vibrate. Why? Because you haven't driven my car! It's as simple as that.
