1.9TDI quattro vs 2.5TDI quattro

[jojo]

Alright chaps, this has probably been covered loads of time before, but ASN's search engine won't let me search 1.9 or 2.5, so I may aswell ask you directly.

I'm looking at both as a replacement for my B5 Passat TDI 115PD, found one of each for similar money, age and mileage, the 2.5 has a few more toys, the 1.9 has less toys, but is a Sport model with half leather seats and in the colour I was after.

I'm very familiar with the 1.9 unit, but not so clued up with the 2.5. My Passat has done me proud in 10 years and just over 100k miles, with the ODO now sitting at 186k and still running well, bar a boost leak which started last week!

I don't really need a rocketship, I have an S3 for my speed thrills, but having some poke is better than none. I need it to carry around 200kg of stock/load twice a week, never struggle with my Passat.

I do wonder if I will miss the few inches of leg room and boot space I get with the Passat? But it's either get an A4 Avant or a Toyota Rav4 for the missus....

 

[quattrojames]

Hi Joe

As you know the 1.9 is a bulletproof engine, and with quattro drive a great combination. Rare too, so will hold it's value well.

If the 2.5 you looked at is the one I think it is then thats a Sport too?

 

[Mike B]

I have an 03 2.5tdi manual which is going to be replaced by an 04 Triptronic which my wife prefers and used to be my sons so have driven many times and before that his 1.9 Quattro all Avants .You will find a great diff between the two engines power torque and economy and if you go Quattro the 2.5 will be nearly twice as thirsty as your 115.I dont do a lot of miles so can indulge in the 2.5 which is adictive but I was happy driving his 1.9 before the 2.5s came along.On the otherhand he has gone back to an S3 again for more fun although hoping it doesnt hurt his back like the last one did!

 

[quattrojames]

I'd guess for the sort of driving you do, the 2.5q will be 5-10 mpg heavier than the 1.9q.

 

[jojo]

Hi Joe

As you know the 1.9 is a bulletproof engine, and with quattro drive a great combination. Rare too, so will hold it's value well.

If the 2.5 you looked at is the one I think it is then thats a Sport too?

Yes James, you are correct, it's a Sport model aswell, what the hell was I thinking? lol

Still undecided...

 

[quattrojames]

The V6 growl and torque would win it everyday for me.

 

[Broken Byzan]

The running costs of the 2.5 are a bit higher, lower MPG and bigger maint costs ( fuel pumps, chocolate cams etc)

I'd go 1.9, you know what you are getting as you have run one for 100000000 miles on the pissrat

 

[swarcup]

pissrat lol

 

[haytch75]

There's a lot more experienced than me on here but for what it's worth.....
I drove a few 1.9's when I was looking but I'm absolutely made up with my 2.5. The engine note, smooth delivery, torque and quattro make me smile every time I'm in it.......just wish I'd found them earlier.

 

[jojo]

pissrat lol

Don't knock the Pissrat, it's done me proud! lol, but like all things, it's time for a change... I think...... actually, I've been thinking about this a lot! I've never owned anything with more than 4 cylinders before, maybe that's swaying me.

 

[haytch75]

Just seen there's a tidy looking 2.5QS Avant on auto-trader for £3100 at 105k. No mention of any history but if it's not a moneypit or horror story someone's gonna pick up a bargain!

 

[mikeh126]

There's a lot more experienced than me on here but for what it's worth.....
I drove a few 1.9's when I was looking but I'm absolutely made up with my 2.5. The engine note, smooth delivery, torque and quattro make me smile every time I'm in it.......just wish I'd found them earlier.

I'll second that!!

 

[Yaseen1991]

Depends on where you gonnna drive mainly. Ive driven both and can say local roads the 1.9 feels more livlier (130bhp model neway) but on motorway the 2.5 comes into a league of its own, where the 1.9 will rev pretty high and feel strained at 80 to 100mph, the 2.5 will feel effortless.

That said if your gonna most ur driving on local roads then id go for the 1.9, but if its gonna be motorway miles then 2.5 all the way

As for costs, as you prob no 1.9s are fine. The 2.5s are a bit more xpensive, b vary of the triptronic boxes going bust and also the 2.5s tend to drink more oil and water, so keep on top of it

 

[adamss24]

The "chocolate cams" impression is the result of poor servicing from the owners, some people are that daft to use cheap oil just because it "meets" the VW spec ! Personally i would only use the best quality synthetic oil which will give you the best protection. The same issues have the pd engines IF you use the wrong oil. Apart from cams and injector pump contol unit there's not that much that can go wrong on the v6 tdi lump. On motorway the 1.9 PD tdi quattro will do a little better than the v6 but there's not much difference in town. Personally i would drive them both side by side and see which engine is more suited to your needs. I have had a few 1.9 tdi's and many v6 tdi and the v6 is a little more rewarding + that engine note really does it for me ! Here's the last one i done this week, messed up cambelt job by previous garage coupled with worn cams which resulted in 4 dropped valves and a scrap engine/heads...

 

[white.akita]

i have the 1.9tdi quattro estate remapped to around 170bhp and it is perfect around town and on the motorway.
around town my dis shows 44.5 mpg and on a long run around 50mpg,not sure how accurate the dis is but i put no more fuel in this than my other 2wd awx/avf engined cars i have owned.
if i had a choice i would prefer a 5 speed box over the 6 speed box.
the 1.9tdi uses less fuel, is more reliable and more desirable to the majority but it is a bit rough compared to the 2.5tdi.

 

[jojo]

OK, so the 1.9 quatty I was looking at has gone to a new home, I only just realised that later sport models have a different front bumper, earlier ones just look like SE's unless they have the optional GmbH kit fitted, is that correct?

Still undecided on the 2.5, I'm having doubts...

 

[quattrojames]

OK, so the 1.9 quatty I was looking at has gone to a new home, I only just realised that later sport models have a different front bumper, earlier ones just look like SE's unless they have the optional GmbH kit fitted, is that correct?

Still undecided on the 2.5, I'm having doubts...

Thats right yes, 'about' 53 plate the Sport's came fitted with the Gmbh or 'S-Line style' front and rear bumpers.

Be brave on a 2.5

 

[jojo]

OK, Automatic with the 2.5 unit, bad idea? Obviously the 1.9 quattro is not available in auto, so are these gearboxes reliable, do they kill the MPG, I'm reading 22mpg in urban traffic, is it really that bad!?

 

[white.akita]

2.5tdi auto quattro will be thirsty and personally i would not touch any vag automatic car, in my opinion they are a ticking time bomb that can cost thousands to repair.
if you dont mind fuel costs and the auto box doesnt break it will be a very nice car to drive.

 

[jojo]

One thing that's bugging me about looking for late B6's is the overlapping in price for a B7, for just 500 quid more, I can get a B7 S-Line, albeit, a 2wd one!

Do I really need Quattro? lol I've never needed it with my Passat, but then, I do have access to a 1995 Toyota Rav4, and this A4 can replace both cars!!

 

[white.akita]

Its not a case of needing quattro its just alot better than front wheel drive,if you can afford a tdi quattro get one.
the 2.0tdi in the b7 is unreliable and thirsty compared to the 1.9tdi.

 

[jojo]

Its not a case of needing quattro its just alot better than front wheel drive,if you can afford a tdi quattro get one.
the 2.0tdi in the b7 is unreliable and thirsty compared to the 1.9tdi.

I'm looking at 1.9's on the B7, I've done the research on the 2.0 units, I'm staying well away!

 

[quattrojames]

2.5q's came with Tiptronic boxes, they're pretty reliable in the main.

I think the 1.9 in the B7's only came in 115bhp flavour, don't know if that bothers you.

 

[jojo]

I think the 1.9 in the B7's only came in 115bhp flavour, don't know if that bothers you.

Not at all, my B5 Passat is PD115, I will just remap it, it's better than the unreliable 2.0 tdi unit.

 

[white.akita]

i think he means that the 130bhp tdi unit is not available in the b7.

 

[adamss24]

Not at all, my B5 Passat is PD115, I will just remap it, it's better than the unreliable 2.0 tdi unit.

The pd115 as fitted to the b7 audi is a lot better than the pd 115 you have in the passat. It has better (later generation design) turbocharger and 16 valves so it feel a touch more linear compared to the passat AJM/ATJ lumps. They are also not as ecconomical as the early engines but they look good. If you do most driving on motorways and town then the quattro will be wasted but if you go for one you'll thank yourself everytime you drive in bad weather or greasy B roads !

 

[jojo]

The pd115 as fitted to the b7 audi is a lot better than the pd 115 you have in the passat. It has better (later generation design) turbocharger and 16 valves so it feel a touch more linear compared to the passat AJM/ATJ lumps. They are also not as ecconomical as the early engines but they look good. If you do most driving on motorways and town then the quattro will be wasted but if you go for one you'll thank yourself everytime you drive in bad weather or greasy B roads !

Good info there, especially on the engine front!

I appreciate that quattro, or anything 4wd is wasted 90% of the time for my use, but in the last few snowy winters, I've seen quite a few cars get stuck on my road which is sloped downwards to my house, and last year specifically, my Toyota Rav4 saved my business, I could carry on buying stock and making deliveries with it, so that 10% I need 4wd ended up making me a couple of grand as opposed to losing it, it pays for itself...

 

[Springer*]

One thing that's bugging me about looking for late B6's is the overlapping in price for a B7, for just 500 quid more, I can get a B7 S-Line, albeit, a 2wd one!

Hi there, by the sounds of things I was working within a similar budget when I bought my 2003 A4 B6 1.9TDi in April. I was sorely tempted to find maybe another £500 and opt for a 2.0TDi B7 in S-Line spec. One small bit of advice... don't do it!

Having looked at dozens of different B6 and B7 models, for the money I ended up paying I could have either got a very nice and well looked after B6 with steady miles on the clock or an absolute dog of a B7.

There are millions of really tired and kn4ckered B7s out there dressed up by dealers as being tidy motors. The ads tell you they are in stunning condition and have full history etc but when you trail over to see them they tend to be crashed, rusting, scratched, poorly resprayed and/or dented externally and often have tears, stains, cracks and much more internally.

I spoke to a bloke at a garage 20 miles from me who told me that he had an absolute minter of a B7 2.0TDi S-Line in Silver that was an ex-fleet car with full history and was a must see car. I trailed over there and saw the biggest pile of junk I'd ever seen.

Obviously the B7s carry a small price premium over the B6s due to being the newer model, but for that same money you can get one of the many well looked after B6s that still exist that really aren't that much different.

You still get the awesome Audi interior that still feels quite modern, you get the option of a decent BOSE stereo, the great seats and superb build quality. Its just whether or not you can live with the pre-facelift exterior. In my case I went for one with the GMBH bodykit and Quattro drivetrain

I've heard nothing but good things about the 1.9 8v 130 engine and an awful lot of nightmares about the newer 2.0 16v TDI engine and so I'm happy that I made the right choice.

Have to agree that whilst it is a punchy engine at lower speeds it does run out of puff on the motorway much above 80mph. Hopefully a remap will sort that though and improve driveability overall.

J

 

[swarcup]

you can always add another 500 quid but where do you stop. i went for a 2.5 tdi quattro sport in the end. The reason was simple as the costs of everything keep rising i thought ******** to it, if you want something with poke get it now and when your finally tired get something more economical like the 1.9. You can always remap a 1.9 and compare it to a 2.5 but remap a 2.5 aswell and theres no comparison. Some people are scared of the 2.5 as you here horror stories but every single car on the road could have a disasterously high bill. Test drive one and the smoothness and power will win you over.

 

[Seeker_UK]

IMO, for what it is, the 2.5 is way to thirsty and if (and it's a big if) I could find a similarly specced 1.9 or 2.0 quattro then I'd swap.

It's a nice car, makes a good noise and pulls like a train but 28mpg average and 38 if I'm lucky on a run takes the edge off the fun.

 

[Rsdene]

Give a 1.9 any day especially over a 2.5 tdi

Regards
Dene

 

[Mike B]

Had my 2.5Tdi tiptronic for a few weeks and it is a slight indulgence over the 1.9 but a smooth easy drive with ample power.The first caller came 100miles by train to see my 2.5Tdi Quattro manual last week and said its a must for another bad winter so we did the deal.They had never driven an Audi before so the Quattro has got a good reputation

 

[jojo]

Well, I'm still looking, the 1.9 is the more preferred choice, but the minute a decent one comes up, it goes within 24hrs! They are holding strong money also, so maybe the timing of the purchase is not that great! I actually was prepared to buy a local 2.5 auto last week, as it was the spec and colour I was after, but that went pretty sharply too! Aaaaargh!

Still I search on.....

 

[wazz]

Just bought my first Audi an A4 2.0tdi S Line.

After reading this thread I feel like sticking it up for sale. Is the 2.0 really that bad?

 

[Turkster]

its like most things, if you can afford it then have it, if you cant then don't,

when i got my 2.5TDI QS, i never even looked at the running costs, I just wanted a A4 Quattro that could handle the 4x4 system and the 1.9 just seemed over worked for the 4x4 system to handle, you would have to work the 1.9TDI engine to the extent that the fuel use and wear and tear on the engine would maybe give signs of a knackered 1.9TDI engine sooner than a non 4x4 system,

Power to weight ratio is what must be looked at, hence its very uncommon to see a 1.9TDI Quattro.

 

[Springer*]

I have to agree about the costs thing. Either you can afford it or you can't. The 2.5 V6 TDi is always going to be smoother and with a broader spread of torque than the 1.9 but at the expense of some fuel economy and a higher tax band. The 2.5 is always going to be a classier machine to drive.

I can't agree though that the 1.9 is strained and with higher mileage will be a lot more worn. The PD130 engine in my car does give plenty of low down grunt and decent acceleration despite the heavier Quattro drivetrain and rarely feels strained. Admittedly though it doesn't accelerate that strongly above 80mph.

My car has 102k miles on the clock and runs as sweetly as a new one with very little sign of wear according to the garages that have seen it. I've driven underpowered cars before and mine certainly isn't one - and it certainly won't be once I get it remapped

Like many have said though, it depends on what you need from a car. If out and out economy isn't an issue then a 2.5 is always going to be the nicer car (I'd have one if it worked for me) but the 1.9 certainly isn't a bad machine in 130 Quattro guise.

Are they really that rare though??

J

 

[Mike B]

Had a 1.9 before the 2.5 manual and it seemed fine and I think its not so rare as a 2.5 especially in Avant

 

[quattrojames]

Are they really that rare though??

Reasonably yes, especially in the seemingly desirable Sport spec. The 1.9TDi Sports alone aren't 'that' common, a quick Autotrader search for 1.9TDi quattro B6's showed 24, only 8 of which are Avants.

 

[white.akita]

I was looking for well over a year for a b6 1.9tdi sport quattro avant in black, they rarely come up for sale at a reasonable price.

 

[Mike B]

I was looking for well over a year for a b6 1.9tdi sport quattro avant in black, they rarely come up for sale at a reasonable price.

Thats why we made a decent profit when we sold ours over 2 years ago