Porting my head will i.....

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paulypaul

S3 all the way Baby
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Hi all,
I have ported the oem exhaust manifold which has taken quiet a long time almost finished,but while the head is off and sitting on the bench looking at me there is a lot of dead flow i suppose you could call it on the exhaust ports and since the manifold is done why not a.
DO I DONT I will it be worth the work.

IMG_0854.jpg

IMG_0852.jpg
 
You want to do the rest ie inlet and full port and i'm happy to do it for you as i've done many now

Just opening the port at the end won't do much
 
I was thinking that alright,I know its very time consuming work if i was to send you my head stripped what sort of money would you charge and how long would it take.
PM please thanks
 
TBH, the cheapest option to a 'ported' head is to hunt down a large port head... already flows pretty much as well as a ported small port and you can then port that giving more flow again...

One thing to remember is that no matter what you do, the small port inlet mani on an S3 is restrictive... not just due to it being small port but the injector ports intrude into the runners squeezing flow...

Not quite sure how I am going to get around this on mine yet other than getting an after market inlet mani such as the SEM

Difference between a small port and large port inlet mani..
largeportvssmallport.jpg


Ported small port (back), non ported large port (front)
20100426_IMG00044-20100426-2007.jpg


<tuffty/>
 
That is one hell of a furking difference! I don't want to hijack the thread, but why aren't all the manifolds large port? Why did Audi change it? Cost?
 
audi upgrades
Small port = higher air speed = better low end torque... comprimise is high end flow but seeing as the K03/K04 isn't a flow monster then its the best head for most of the market... gives the car better drivability etc

<tuffty/>
 
There really is some difference in the inlet ports how about the exhaust side Tuffty?
I was looking for a agu,aeb head but gave up,i have started to port my AMK head looks a bit tricky but there is no turning back now with the right tools and lots of patience i reckon ill get it done to a standard ill be happy.
The head is in the dishwasher as i write this LOL
 
paulypaul said:
There really is some difference in the inlet ports how about the exhaust side Tuffty?
I was looking for a agu,aeb head but gave up,i have started to port my AMK head looks a bit tricky but there is no turning back now with the right tools and lots of patience i reckon ill get it done to a standard ill be happy.
The head is in the dishwasher as i write this LOL
Click to expand...

This should help....

AUDI 1.8T 20V SMALL PORT Stock valve size
Stock:
INT. 167cfm @ .380" valve lift
EXH. 162cfm @ .380" valve lift

Ported: (potential flow)
INT. 225cfm @ .380" valve lift
EXH. 191cfm @ .380" valve lift

AUDI 1.8T 20V LARGE PORT Stock valve size
Stock:
INT. 200cfm @ .380" valve lift
EXH. 184cfm @ .380" valve lift

Ported:
INT. 243cfm @ .380" valve lift
EXH. 212cfm @ .380" valve lift

<tuffty/>
 
What ya reckon Tuffty have i gained hp or lost it,a buddy of mine a mechanic also,thinks i have ruined the manifold still not finished but ya get the idea.
IMG_0847.jpg
 
Not sure there is enough metal on a K04 mani to really go to town on tbh... you appear to have broken through the casting too.... its looks like you have removed the partition of the 'collector'... this is designed to help channel exhaust gas to the turbine housing, reduce exhaust pulse collision and helps spool and flow etc.... on this mani its not in the best place but without one then exhaust gas pulses from each of the cylinders will collide and this will cause the pulse to loose energy...

While this is fairly irrelevant on a **** poor mani design like this and a small turbo like the K04, every little helps :)

Sadly there is not much else that can be done for the K04 and arguably the K03 mani has a better chance of flowing more than the K04 one... mani's for K03's are more obtainable, bigger market.

<tuffty/>
 
paulypaul said:
What ya reckon Tuffty have i gained hp or lost it,a buddy of mine a mechanic also,thinks i have ruined the manifold still not finished but ya get the idea.
IMG_0847.jpg
Click to expand...

well thats fcuked now is'nt it

added another hole too? (at 8 o'clock position)

yowza - thats some hideous butchery

you know they crack for a pasttime in std form let alone wafer thin ground away to within a micron of its life

scarey

good luck with that
 
Ya thats what my buddy said more or less.any how i have spent so long at it now i have to put it on see what happens i suppose.Its not the first time i broke through the casting ill build it back up again with weld.
Time will tell....
 
Port and polishing can give you very good performance increases and increase your volumetric efficient by a couple of % + higher the air flow speed (all pulse tuning).

It can be very easy to make things worse too. Air flow is very sensitive to direction changes and volume changes and you can actually direct the air flow to the wrong place if not done right.

Has anyone actually flow tested a standard and port and polished head or inlet manifold. I got some figures from a fiesta Zetec S head I done a couple years back in uni. Would be interesting to see.

Nathan
 
badger5 said:
well thats fcuked now is'nt it

added another hole too? (at 8 o'clock position)

yowza - thats some hideous butchery

you know they crack for a pasttime in std form let alone wafer thin ground away to within a micron of its life

scarey

good luck with that
Click to expand...

Not Fcuked just yet,Thats a NO i take it on the gains then Bill :no:
 
paulypaul said:
Not Fcuked just yet,Thats a NO i take it on the gains then Bill :no:
Click to expand...

the manifold is too thin to cope with removing material imho, let alone the way and amount you have chewed off with the carbide bit bouncing about.
the runner themselves are small, not just where the collector is.
I fear it will end badly for you as the pictures make it look dire to me
 
badger5 said:
the manifold is too thin to cope with removing material imho, let alone the way and amount you have chewed off with the carbide bit bouncing about.
the runner themselves are small, not just where the collector is.
I fear it will end badly for you as the pictures make it look dire to me
Click to expand...

Do agree about removing material, may lead to a crack in the mani if you go crazy and remove too much as the material will become weaker.

Practise on a rubbish head/mani from the scrappy, thats what I done and made a mess at first lol.

You see why getting it done professionally is expensive lol
 
badger5 said:
the manifold is too thin to cope with removing material imho, let alone the way and amount you have chewed off with the carbide bit bouncing about.
the runner themselves are small, not just where the collector is.
I fear it will end badly for you as the pictures make it look dire to me
Click to expand...

Worst case scenario it cracks and i have to replace it,ya i did get a bit carried away but ill clean it up and build it back up with weld.If a performance mani was available for right money i'd jump on it.

You live and learn......
 
audi upgrades
S3 Nattie said:
Do agree about removing material, may lead to a crack in the mani if you go crazy and remove too much as the material will become weaker.

Practise on a rubbish head/mani from the scrappy, thats what I done and made a mess at first lol.

You see why getting it done professionally is expensive lol
Click to expand...

It was my first attempt i will admit,It is definitely a labour of love
 
Keep at it though Paul, I did say there are some great benefits couple of threads above when you get it right.

Its somewhere you do need patience to do and a lot of practice

Nathan
 
Well after getting slated last night i had to redeem myself some what,I realise now that i could be wasting my time but i have started so ill finish.
So i got up early while the missus was asleep and snuck off to the garage,
the Mani still Isn't finished i have only done it in the 60 the rest will follow when i get the right tools.
The darker spots in the middle is where i went through and welded the other side.
IMG_0938.jpg

Only done in 60 will go more though
IMG_0940.jpg

I know its not pretty but you wont see it.
IMG_1013.jpg
 
Fair play mate, hope it all holds together for yah... looks like the JBS mani is gonna be out soon, Sandip managed to bag one somehow!

<tuffty/>
 
tufftybloke said:
Fair play mate, hope it all holds together for yah... looks like the JBS mani is gonna be out soon, Sandip managed to bag one somehow!

<tuffty/>
Click to expand...

Thanks..
Ya the Jammy fcuker! I"d bin my one in the morning if i could get one.
 
well it looks better, but my fears for its longevity stand

i did explore extrude honing the k04 manifold last year, but seeing so many std ones cracked thru killed that idea, as its not a sound base to ask more of it from thinner wall thickness. It always cracks in the same place, which is stress related on its design,, simply making the wall thickness thinner, to me, just erodes it already poor reliability.

good luck tho.. a lot of work for you to replace it if it cracks
 
badger5 said:
well it looks better, but my fears for its longevity stand

i did explore extrude honing the k04 manifold last year, but seeing so many std ones cracked thru killed that idea, as its not a sound base to ask more of it from thinner wall thickness. It always cracks in the same place, which is stress related on its design,, simply making the wall thickness thinner, to me, just erodes it already poor reliability.

good luck tho.. a lot of work for you to replace it if it cracks
Click to expand...

I know what your saying but ill give it a try anyway,i dont mind the work its what i do.
I surprised you haven't made one up surly you have the equipment and know how there definitely is a market out there for one.
 
paulypaul said:
I know what your saying but ill give it a try anyway,i dont mind the work its what i do.
I surprised you haven't made one up surly you have the equipment and know how there definitely is a market out there for one.
Click to expand...

the k04 manifold is a big compromise in fitment vs airflow
TSR, INA and JBS both are coming out with something one day (dont hold ya breath mind, they have both been saying this for months now)

I investigated the extrude hone option myself, and shelved the idea when I kept seeing stock k04 manifolds cracked in the same location.

Cast option is the best for volume vs what you guys are prepared to pay.
I do BT conversions, which use merge collected tubular manifolds, but these are high end high power conversions.

good luck with yours.
Do you have logs from before to compare any differences?
 
badger5 said:
the k04 manifold is a big compromise in fitment vs airflow
TSR, INA and JBS both are coming out with something one day (dont hold ya breath mind, they have both been saying this for months now)

I investigated the extrude hone option myself, and shelved the idea when I kept seeing stock k04 manifolds cracked in the same location.

Cast option is the best for volume vs what you guys are prepared to pay.
I do BT conversions, which use merge collected tubular manifolds, but these are high end high power conversions.

good luck with yours.
Do you have logs from before to compare any differences?
Click to expand...

TSR are looking £700 for there one and JBS about £470,if i could get a jbs one id be happy as the price is reasonable.
No logs but i will be heading straight for Badger 5 when its done so you can remap it for me.
 
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