problems after chiptuning?

mve7

mve7

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Hallo, Got my Audi s3 8v facelift (2019) one week now. I really love the car! Its the perfect daily for me.
Now is my question that chiptuning is bad for the car? someone that did this and had problems after the tuning? For now my car is fast enough and I still got 3 years of warranty but I know myself and I can't wait 3 more years... .

ps : sorry for my english :D
 

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Then buy a JB4 use map 1 fit and forget (around 40hp) or start customising through map 6 (50-60hp if you push it) :)

Nice car btw, like the blacked out details.
 
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Lehn said:
Then buy a JB4 use map 1 fit and forget (around 40hp) or start customising through map 6 (50-60hp if you push it) :)

Nice car btw, like the blacked out details.
Click to expand...

thx bro! the JB4 isn't bad for the car? sorry I don't know much about it.
 
mve7 said:
thx bro! the JB4 isn't bad for the car? sorry I don't know much about it.
Click to expand...

No not at all, as long as you know what to do if you start to customise map 6. With that said I've been driving around today in map 1 (instead of map 6) and it still makes the car feel very much alive compared to stock. It's a very sophisticated tuning box and there's a lot of safety features to make sure it doesn't do something to the car that it wasn't supposed to.

@Ravs_78 was able to get his S3 sub 4s 0-100km/t with just map 1: https://www.audi-sport.net/xf/threads/jb4-info-and-discussion-thread.309046/page-8#post-3443384
img_20190526_003331_resize_83-jpg.183466
 
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Lehn said:
No not at all, as long as you know what to do if you start to customise map 6. With that said I've been driving around today in map 1 (instead of map 6) and it still makes the car feel very much alive compared to stock. It's a very sophisticated tuning box and there's a lot of safety features to make sure it doesn't do something to the car that it wasn't supposed to.

@Ravs_78 was able to get his S3 sub 4s 0-100km/t with just map 1: https://www.audi-sport.net/xf/threads/jb4-info-and-discussion-thread.309046/page-8#post-3443384
img_20190526_003331_resize_83-jpg.183466
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Is it already possible to buy for a 2019 s3? and if it is can you maybe tell me where I can buy it?

Kind regards!
 
mve7 said:
Is it already possible to buy for a 2019 s3? and if it is can you maybe tell me where I can buy it?

Kind regards!
Click to expand...

Yep, it's the same unit as I use on mine. I bought mine from Mlperformance: https://www.mlperformance.co.uk/col...-5-mqb/products/bms-vag-jb4-next-day-delivery

If you're not going to change a lot (e.g. settings in map 6) I'll recommend to just get the data cable and not the bluetooth kit.

Cable: https://www.mlperformance.co.uk/products/bms-bmw-vag-jb4-data-cable
Bluetooth kit: https://www.mlperformance.co.uk/products/jb4-connect-kit-rev-3

Take a look at this thread for more info: https://www.audi-sport.net/xf/threads/jb4-info-and-discussion-thread.309046/
 
I should mention I would choose a real stage 1 map over the JB4 any day except when we talk warranty (and keeping it), then the JB4 is the way to go.
 
Lehn said:
I should mention I would choose a real stage 1 map over the JB4 any day except when we talk warranty (and keeping it), then the JB4 is the way to go.
Click to expand...

great thank you for the info!! en yea true after my warranty I will go for a real stage 1. But if the JB4 is safe and you can keep your warranty it would be great!
 
mve7 said:
great thank you for the info!! en yea true after my warranty I will go for a real stage 1. But if the JB4 is safe and you can keep your warranty it would be great!
Click to expand...

Just remember to remove it before any dealer visits ;)
 
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mve7 said:
great thank you for the info!! en yea true after my warranty I will go for a real stage 1. But if the JB4 is safe and you can keep your warranty it would be great!
Click to expand...
Lehn said:
Just remember to remove it before any dealer visits ;)
Click to expand...

I just read some info about the JB4 and a lot of people say you can lose your warranty. At the dealership they can see it when they connect the computer? :'(
 
mve7 said:
I just read some info about the JB4 and a lot of people say you can lose your warranty. At the dealership they can see it when they connect the computer? :'(
Click to expand...

Can you link to this info please?

Whilst no-one can be 100% sure, most stuff I've read and heard is that removing the JB4 and allowing a week or so of driving without it, will allow the ECU to overwrite any historical info that may have indicated the JB4's presence?!

I have also been advised to disguise any physical indication, by ensuring that the plugs the JB4 uses are not standout clean compared to other plugs in the engine bay.
 
FeDx_ said:
Can you link to this info please?

Whilst no-one can be 100% sure, most stuff I've read and heard is that removing the JB4 and allowing a week or so of driving without it, will allow the ECU to overwrite any historical info that may have indicated the JB4's presence?!

I have also been advised to disguise any physical indication, by ensuring that the plugs the JB4 uses are not standout clean compared to other plugs in the engine bay.
Click to expand...

And here you got the link bro : https://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1285614
 

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That post is referring to the guy actually leaving the JB4 installed whilst going in to the garage, no?
 
Either way, I'm not looking forward to removing the JB4 for my servicing.

The car actually feels weak now, when I switch the JB4 off :whistle2:

Never thought I'd say that about a 300PS car...:wtf:
 
Why should Audi honour warranty work on an engine and drive train when it has been operated outside factory set parameters? All well and good if you can get away with it without detection and to be fair the dealers will not normally be bothered as it doesn't affect them.
However you can't drive the car around "for a week or so" with a lunched engine or gearbox and the dealer will have to upload the recorded data to the manufacturer mothership to inspect the data before they agree to foot the bill for repairs.
If the manufacturer decides someone has been fiddling and refuse the claim, the main dealer will tell you how much money they want to fix your car or give it back to you and wash their hands of the problem and future drivetrain warranty claims. Up to you then to fight your corner.
You fit the box at your risk and all will probably be well - but the clues will be there if Audi are faced with a big bill and decide to look closely.
 
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mve7 said:
I just read some info about the JB4 and a lot of people say you can lose your warranty. At the dealership they can see it when they connect the computer? :'(
Click to expand...
@ABYSS of dtuk has stated not one of their boxes has been detected by Audi after returning test vehicles and he hasn't heard of any customer vehicles being detected either. That's after the ECU has been scanned so my guess is that it may well be the same for other tuning box versions as well.
Post #9 here https://www.audi-sport.net/xf/threads/2017-a3-2-0-tfsi-quattro-remap-options.394037/
 
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Matt Titanium said:
Why should Audi honour warranty work on an engine and drive train when it has been operated outside factory set parameters? All well and good if you can get away with it without detection and to be fair the dealers will not normally be bothered as it doesn't affect them.
However you can't drive the car around "for a week or so" with a lunched engine or gearbox and the dealer will have to upload the recorded data to the manufacturer mothership to inspect the data before they agree to foot the bill for repairs.
If the manufacturer decides someone has been fiddling and refuse the claim, the main dealer will tell you how much money they want to fix your car or give it back to you and wash their hands of the problem and future drivetrain warranty claims. Up to you then to fight your corner.
You fit the box at your risk and all will probably be well - but the clues will be there if Audi are faced with a big bill and decide to look closely.
Click to expand...

All fair points and well made...

Storming in like a rain cloud :crying:

I knew I should have just forked out the extra and got an RS3 instead...
 
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cuke2u said:
@ABYSS of dtuk has stated not one of their boxes has been detected by Audi after returning test vehicles and he hasn't heard of any customer vehicles being detected either. That's after the ECU has been scanned so my guess is that it may well be the same for other tuning box versions as well.
Post #9 here https://www.audi-sport.net/xf/threads/2017-a3-2-0-tfsi-quattro-remap-options.394037/
Click to expand...

So ABYSS of DTUK will be quite willing to underwrite any warranty claims refused in the future if you buy and fit one of their boxes?
 
Hypothetical question as, it would appear from @ABYSS answer, no warranties have been cancelled due to one of their boxes being fitted.
Thus, not being part of the company, I cannot answer. I suggest you direct any queries at DTUK..
 
This has been covered before.
Not saying anything bad about the dtuk boxes, I’ve had 2, but their test cars wasn’t going back to Audi with catastrophic failures so they won’t be looking that hard for signs of a chip box.
Even if the Audi mothership computer comes back clear there are physical signs of a chip box. Connecting/disconnecting the sensor plugs will show wear on a part that should not be disconnected/connected through everyday use/service.
If you mess with a car you should be prepared to cough up if Audi doesn’t. There shouldn’t be an expectation they should warrant the car after mods.
 
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Whilst this has been covered before this was before @ABYSS made this statement and I am sorry but I tend to believe someone who supplies this product, throughly tests then returns those tested vehicles back to the manufacturer, who in turn test them and find no issues with the vehicles.
Whilst I respect your opinion, and you are entitled to this, you seem to have little experience of this technology over that of @ABYSS or even myself...
 
cuke2u said:
Whilst this has been covered before this was before @ABYSS made this statement and I am sorry but I tend to believe someone who supplies this product, throughly tests then returns those tested vehicles back to the manufacturer, who in turn test them and find no issues with the vehicles.
Whilst I respect your opinion, and you are entitled to this, you seem to have little experience of this technology over that of @ABYSS or even myself...
Click to expand...

I’m not disagreeing that dtuk have managed to return vehicles and Audi dealership found nothing out the ordinary.
My question will be how many of these cars have needed a big warranty claim like failed gearbox or engine? Some of these things won’t be apparent till 5-10k or higher has been put on the car after its been fitted. When these things fail Audi will start digging hard looking for mods. When they don’t find anything electronic like a remap or strange stored values they start looking for physical evidence that it’s been tampered with. Doesn’t matter how good the chip is at hiding the data there will be physical marks on the sensor plugs like fuel rail and boost. A slightly bent clip or score marks on the plugs is a dead giveaway something has been tampered with.
I do not believe these chips should be sold in a fashion that “it’s undetectable, just remove it and claim on factory warranty”. What happens when a claim is rejected or you are broken down at the side of a motorway and can’t remove it. Doubt any chip manufacturer will do anything. It’s not Audi’s fault if it blows your car up and they shouldn’t be expected to warrant the car after a chip or remap.
Over the years I’ve seen these chips and remaps causing issues like excessive clutch wear, gearbox problen, melted pistons, dpf issues etc. Also seen/had these boxes working for 40-50k and no problems.
Trying to make this an informative post that way people can have more data to make an informed decision on whether or not to buy one of these boxes. It’s not a dig at dtuk or any other chip box maker. I’ve had one in most of my vag cars and had no problems but seen the same chip in others causing problems.
 
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Of course you are assuming that technicians go around snooping at the sensors when, clearly, the fact is they can't be bothered. All of what you are stating is really only a 'what if' not really based upon anything other than that. Even if my car was to break down I can have the box and its loom removed in 5 mins.
Like anything the risks are there, but then, if we took credence to every risk, we wouldn't get out of bed, get on a train, drive your car etc etc.
One can play at being the devil's advocate but to have any legitimacy it needs to be backed up with hard evidence.
I am enjoying this debate though and I thank you for this as this is what a forum should be about... :)
 
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I would struggle to think the dealers would become detectives to figure out if there is physical evidence but who knows.

My take on these things is.. It might not be detectable, but assume it will be.
 
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cuke2u said:
Hypothetical question as, it would appear from @ABYSS answer, no warranties have been cancelled due to one of their boxes being fitted.
Thus, not being part of the company, I cannot answer. I suggest you direct any queries at DTUK..
Click to expand...

Rhetorical - so I didn't expect an answer from anyone.
 
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cuke2u said:
Of course you are assuming that technicians go around snooping at the sensors when, clearly, the fact is they can't be bothered. All of what you are stating is really only a 'what if' not really based upon anything other than that. Even if my car was to break down I can have the box and its loom removed in 5 mins.
Like anything the risks are there, but then, if we took credence to every risk, we wouldn't get out of bed, get on a train, drive your car etc etc.
One can play at being the devil's advocate but to have any legitimacy it needs to be backed up with hard evidence.
I am enjoying this debate though and I thank you for this as this is what a forum should be about... :)
Click to expand...

Think the main point is you are committing fraud if you try and claim on Audi warranty after fitting aftermarket tuning parts and remove it to hide the fact you did so.
You pretty much hit the nail on the head with your comment though it’s pot luck if you get the technician that knows what to check or what not to check.
I had engine issues on a new Audi a few years back and it was gonna be a big warranty claim or me rejecting the car. On top of the technicians at the dealership checking the car over it there was an Audi tech coming from hq to check the car over as well. I can only assume the tech from hq would know what to look for. They ended up taking it back and gave me a different car.
 
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oli356 said:
I would struggle to think the dealers would become detectives to figure out if there is physical evidence but who knows.
My take on these things is.. It might not be detectable, but assume it will be.
Click to expand...

I would guess most dealers wouldn't be bothered even if you took the car in with a tuning box fitted.
They make their money by selling you a car, servicing it, upselling aircon services etc. (plus a bit from repairs for anyone willing to pay their rates). Their objective is to keep the customer happy and coming back. The bill for the majority of warranty work is paid for by the manufacturer to the dealer -so they make money again.
The issue is that the manufacturer has to authorise this work for the dealer to get paid. There will be a list of cheap stuff they can automatically do but for bigger failures, the dealer has to present evidence to the manufacturer to support the claim - this is where the software upload kicks in and the data is scrutinised. If they smell a rat they could instigate further.
Overboosting and overfuelling may take more than 3/5 years cause issues and it's the poor sap down the line that will suffer the consequences on a car that has had components over-stressed/prematurely worn and fails big time at 60k instead of 100k miles.
So you takes your chance, but I wouldn't rely on the manufacturer footing a massive bill if it all goes wrong within the warranty period.
 
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Matt Titanium said:
I would guess most dealers wouldn't be bothered even if you took the car in with a tuning box fitted.
Click to expand...
When I had my mtm Cantronic fitted the car went into Audi with it fitted. It went in for something (I think was the gear stick replacement) but I didn't expect them to be opening the bonnet and I was short for time, so it didn't get removed.

The technician came out after I got my keys back, said nice car and quietly told me to try and put a bit more electrical tape around the connections into the ecu.

So yeah, for the individuals... I suppose they don't really care a whole lot. As you say, they aren't taking the bill.
Of course, if I needed a new gearbox and not just a gearknob, I'm sure it would be a different story!!
 
AlS3BE said:
Think the main point is you are committing fraud if you try and claim on Audi warranty after fitting aftermarket tuning parts and remove it to hide the fact you did so.
You pretty much hit the nail on the head with your comment though it’s pot luck if you get the technician that knows what to check or what not to check.
I had engine issues on a new Audi a few years back and it was gonna be a big warranty claim or me rejecting the car. On top of the technicians at the dealership checking the car over it there was an Audi tech coming from hq to check the car over as well. I can only assume the tech from hq would know what to look for. They ended up taking it back and gave me a different car.
Click to expand...
Your car was checked over because Audi refunds dealerships for any warranty work, thus they need to justify any cost and get a second opinion. As for committing fraud, lol, don't we all?

Never once made have I made any claim for any warranty work whilst having had a box, or a remap, installed. They don't over stress an engine anyway and again, with respect, you are showing a lack of knowledge on how these boxes work.

You are only committing a fraud if you are claiming for damage caused by a tuning box, so find me one? Even if you were too you would still need proof it was a box that caused mechanical failure, none of us are engineers after all. I think, again, you are bypassing real world experiences and making up hypothetical statements.
It all comes down to the individual's decision but please, let's keep to facts, not what if's.

Obviously these devices are not for you, this is clear, and you seem to have made this decision. All is well and good then, we beg to differ with the only difference being I have tried the products, on different vehicles, and I have researched them thoroughly..
 
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cuke2u said:
Your car was checked over because Audi refunds dealerships for any warranty work, thus they need to justify any cost and get a second opinion. As for committing fraud, lol, don't we all?

Never once made have I made any claim for any warranty work whilst having had a box, or a remap, installed. They don't over stress an engine anyway and again, with respect, you are showing a lack of knowledge on how these boxes work.

You are only committing a fraud if you are claiming for damage caused by a tuning box, so find me one? Even if you were too you would still need proof it was a box that caused mechanical failure, none of us are engineers after all. I think, again, you are bypassing real world experiences and making up hypothetical statements.
It all comes down to the individual's decision but please, let's keep to facts, not what if's.

Obviously these devices are not for you, this is clear, and you seem to have made this decision. All is well and good then, we beg to differ with the only difference being I have tried the products, on different vehicles, and I have researched them thoroughly..
Click to expand...

Guess you just reading what you want.
I’ve had 2 dtuk boxes and a mtm box combined done over 150k, as stated in my above comments. All I am saying do it at your own risk and don’t rely on factory warranty when it goes wrong. Just because you remove the box doesn’t mean there’s no evidence of its existence. If the OP bought one of these boxes based on your comments and his car blew up are you gonna pay for it when Audi doesn’t ? Was merely saying there’s a risk element of getting caught and having to pay for expensive repairs. These boxes have been around for ages trying to circumvent the td1 flag so Audi and all other manufacturers have caught on to this and developed new ways to catch them out.
These boxes from it’s primitive days of a resistor in a box to fool the ecu it was cold so it overfuelled to the more sophisticated modern ones they all are doing the same thing. They are intercepting a signal and telling the ecu some fibs so it over boosts and over fuel. Maybe even make it adjust some timing as well but that’s all they are doing telling fibs so the factory parameters react to it. Even seen some that all the do make it overboost and rely on the factory safety parameters to achieve enough fuelling as when egt goes up the ecu will dump fuel to cool engine thus you won’t be running lean. There’s thousands of these parameters than these boxes rely on to achieve more power.
It might not be bad or detrimental to the car but there’s a risk. Think that’s where some of us are saying. You might not have had problems but other have. I’ve seen it myself, more transmission related issues more than anything.
Turbos spoiling for longer and harder will wear faster. Gearboxes/clutches taking more torque than what it came out factory will create more wear. Its simple physics don’t need to be an engineer to understand that. It’s ok if you only give it some beans now and again but some folk drive like they stole it all day long and these cars are gonna wear very quickly.
These boxes have came a long way but like anything it’s not perfect.
If you are prepared to modify you should wave goodbye to factory warranty that’s all I’m saying.
I’m no expert or engineer and I’m not saying the dtuk boxes are bad as I’ve had 2 but I’m prepared to repair the car if warranty doesn’t most aren’t.
 
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Surely this says it all:

The Audi UK warranty only covers defects in manufacture. Your warranty does not cover damage or defects caused by factors outside the Manufacturer’s control or which are the result of normal wear and tear. Examples of this include:
• Damage or defects as a result of repairs or incorrect installation of parts or accessories by an unauthorised workshop.
• Damage or defects as a result of the installation of parts, components, software or accessories not authorised by Audi UK.
• Damage or defects which may be attributable to accident damage.
• Damage to components, equipment or software which were not part of the vehicle at the
point of original manufacture.
 
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DaveM said:
Surely this says it all:

The Audi UK warranty only covers defects in manufacture. Your warranty does not cover damage or defects caused by factors outside the Manufacturer’s control or which are the result of normal wear and tear. Examples of this include:
• Damage or defects as a result of repairs or incorrect installation of parts or accessories by an unauthorised workshop.
• Damage or defects as a result of the installation of parts, components, software or accessories not authorised by Audi UK.
• Damage or defects which may be attributable to accident damage.
• Damage to components, equipment or software which were not part of the vehicle at the
point of original manufacture.
Click to expand...


If you take the risk, you must pay the consequences if it all goes wrong.

As some will know, my engine (totally standard) has gone pop. It's just out of warranty, and I'm awaiting Audi's response to my dealers request for a brand new engine. Audi Germany, will be going over the car's ECU data with a fine tooth comb, and no doubt instructing my dealer to do the same with the engine. Luckily for me, it won't show up anything, as the car is standard.

Now, imagine if my car had of had a chip? Or anything fitted to it that Audi realised was none standard? They wouldn't even consider giving me a new engine. Worse still, if it was your brand new car, you had it chipped, and it went pop. Even if the Part failed due to manufacturing error, and not the fault of the chip, you'd be looking at Audi saying "Tough Sh*t" (but in German)

Chances are, most engine will be fine when chipped / modified. After all they build / test these things to run in the worse conditions using the worst fuels. And I'm sure every engine has a factor of safety, and what you get in the showroom is an engine detuned from what it's easily capable of.

What you need to consider, is `what if?`. What if it goes pop and I lose my warranty. Can I afford a new engine? Shoving a used engine in might be fine if you own the car outright. Though still costly. But what if you car is on PCP? Don't think the finance company will be that impressed. You then leave yourself open to court proceedings.

But it's the chance you take.
 
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I'm with the doomsayers on this one. I've learnt the hard way that Audi will do anything to avoid paying up when its a big bill. If you go in there with a broken piston Audi HQ will demand to know why its broken and will have the garage go over the car with a fine tooth comb and send them all sorts of logs etc to work out how it broke. This is a process that they have to follow.
Even if the tuning box creator guarantees that it leaves absolutely no trace you are still taking a risk with the potential to void your warranty. Same with anyone who says "naah, it will be fine" since neither them or the tuning box company will be coughing up 10 grand for a new engine if you blow a piston and Audi tell you to get lost. That's just how it is.
 
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Ah the good old remap/chip/tuning box discussion. Went through two packets of popcorn reading the related comments.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion but we all have to agree that if ANY company sees a way to get out of paying, they will try their hardest to succeed. We all know we have to service our cars as per manufacturers instructions but if we didn't then wave bye bye to your warranty.

The answer is very simple without people being at each others throats;
Want more power ??
Option one: buy a more powerful car.
Option 2: chip your car and accept the risk of maybe voiding your warranty and big bills.

Or don't take the risk and be happy with what you have got. I must admit that when I had my S3 I never thought "if only this had a bit more grunt"
Just my opinion peeps
 
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Well we are all entitled to make a choice aren't we? We're all, hopefully, adults and we are all entitled to think our choice is correct weighing in up the pros and cons. As far as I'm concerned, given historical evidence of the devices I choose, the risks I feel are low enough.
But then some will always have their soap box moment, and not aiming this at anyone here. However many many owners modify their cars, from fitting different air filters and upwards to vehicles that are still under warranty. We know the 'risks'...
 
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Jcbmally said:
Ah the good old remap/chip/tuning box discussion. Went through two packets of popcorn reading the related comments.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion but we all have to agree that if ANY company sees a way to get out of paying, they will try their hardest to succeed. We all know we have to service our cars as per manufacturers instructions but if we didn't then wave bye bye to your warranty.

The answer is very simple without people being at each others throats;
Want more power ??
Option one: buy a more powerful car.
Option 2: chip your car and accept the risk of maybe voiding your warranty and big bills.

Or don't take the risk and be happy with what you have got. I must admit that when I had my S3 I never thought "if only this had a bit more grunt"
Just my opinion peeps
Click to expand...

Agree @Jcbmally

I get both sides of it but why should Audi cover claims where there was a deviation from their spec due to a tuning box by a non-approved 3rd party. I don’t see tuning box manufacturers guarantee/underwrite for the same reason; why should they cover something that *may* be an engine manufacturing fault and not necessarily proven to be caused by their box.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro
 
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