R TECH STAGE 2+ Helix organic or sachs clutch ?

Hookmonster · May 29, 2016

Had R Tech stage 2+ map done yesterday.. superb..

My standard clutch lasted about 5 seconds... lol..

Nicky recomended the Helix organic over the sachs organic both with luk dmf

Any opinions on that ??

And cheapest place to get them.. thanks guys.

LEE69 · May 29, 2016

Hookmonster said:
.

Nicky recomended the Helix organic over the sachs organic both with luk dmf

Any opinions on that ??

And cheapest place to get them.. thanks guys.

Yeah..listen to Niki lol

Alex Kerr at AKS

Gazwould · May 29, 2016

What's both clutches torque ratings ?

prt57 · May 29, 2016

Hookmonster said:
Had R Tech stage 2+ map done yesterday.. superb..

My standard clutch lasted about 5 seconds... lol.

Hi there,
Please could you tell us how many miles your car has done before your upgrade to 2+? Just wondering how long my clutch will last!

Cheers,
Peter

Hookmonster · May 29, 2016

59

prt57 said:
Hi there,
Please could you tell us how many miles your car has done before your upgrade to 2+? Just wondering how long my clutch will last!

Cheers,
Peter

59k mate.. perfect as standard.. but 380 torque made it slip instantly

Hookmonster · May 29, 2016

Gazwould said:
What's both clutches torque ratings ?

Good idea.. ill look

kash_v · May 30, 2016

Hookmonster said:
Had R Tech stage 2+ map done yesterday.. superb..

My standard clutch lasted about 5 seconds... lol..

Nicky recomended the Helix organic over the sachs organic both with luk dmf

Any opinions on that ??

And cheapest place to get them.. thanks guys.

Did he say why mate? Also, did he mention anything about spec smf setup?

S3Alex · May 30, 2016

Helix are usually quite shy about revealing their torque ratings.
Some people swear by them,and some do not,as with most clutches.

I used a Sachs organic and DMF up to 440lbs of torque,which is beyond it's nominal 400lb rating,so not a bad result,but as with all organic clutches,it will not tolerate a lot of abuse,as the organic compound tends to overheat and break up.

After the Sachs eventually gave up at that figure,i switched to a Spec Stg3+ carbon-metallic clutch with SMF,and for anyone thinking of a high torque,SMF setup,I would recommend this above anything else.

The advantage of this is it's a full face clutch,i.e.not a paddle type,and is much easier to use around town,whilst maintaining a reasonably stock feel,and can handle up to 570lbs without trouble.
Mine has finally started to slip at that sort of level after 40k miles,so you can see how tough it is.

Hookmonster · May 30, 2016

kash_v said:
Did he say why mate? Also, did he mention anything about spec smf setup?

Didnt get into a big discussion, but he deffinatly suggested i should aim down the helix route.. maybe hes just seen higher torque handled by one..

kash_v · May 30, 2016

@S3Alex thats a nice setup! I appreciate its a performance clutch, but how much harder is the clutch pedal with the sachs and now your spec? Did you source your spec?

@Hookmonster fair enough, general conscious I believe on this forum is the sachs (purely going on my searching).

S3Alex · May 30, 2016

kash_v said:
@S3Alex thats a nice setup! I appreciate its a performance clutch, but how much harder is the clutch pedal with the sachs and now your spec? Did you source your spec?

@Hookmonster fair enough, general conscious I believe on this forum is the sachs (purely going on my searching).

It almost feels like stock.....AMDTuning commented on how light it feels.
I did the basics of sourcing it,and AMDTuning are able to import and fit it.

kash_v · May 30, 2016

@S3Alex nice, was the sach heavier then your spec?

Hookmonster · May 30, 2016

kash_v said:
@S3Alex thats a nice setup! I appreciate its a performance clutch, but how much harder is the clutch pedal with the sachs and now your spec? Did you source your spec?

@Hookmonster fair enough, general conscious I believe on this forum is the sachs (purely going on my searching).

I agree mate.. the sachs was my plan.. just having Really good read up now on the helix too just before i put the cash down !

Smirky · May 30, 2016

If you think you might add a bit more power I'd go for the spec as it will handle it with ease ,
Very easy to use around town so much so my 60+ mum can take it to waitrose and not even realize it's a performance clutch

S3Alex · May 30, 2016

kash_v said:
@S3Alex nice, was the sach heavier then your spec?

As Smirky will confirm,its probably lighter than the Sachs to be honest.

Mine was the first Spec Stg3+ on here,and has lasted for over 40k miles at not less than 450lbs,and over the last year at around 550lbs,without issues until now when it's finally beginning to slip.

kash_v · May 30, 2016

Smirky said:
If you think you might add a bit more power I'd go for the spec as it will handle it with ease ,
Very easy to use around town so much so my 60+ mum can take it to waitrose and not even realize it's a performance clutch

S3Alex said:
As Smirky will confirm,its probably lighter than the Sachs to be honest.

Mine was the first Spec Stg3+ on here,and has lasted for over 40k miles at not less than 450lbs,and over the last year at around 550lbs,without issues until now when it's finally beginning to slip.

Sounds like a decent clutch! Once I have all the hardware for stage 2+ on the car, I will order a clutch. Rather get the clutch done before it goes to Rtech then start slipping on the dyno lol. From both your replies, its given me a good insight into how good Spec is.

Probably also given @Hookmonster some more thinking to do, re Spec setup.

prt57 · May 30, 2016

[QUOTE="Probably also given @Hookmonster some more thinking to do, re Spec setup.[/QUOTE]

And me too ............

Smirky · May 30, 2016

I don't find the spec any harder to use than the standard clutch to be honest , a lot of people are put off ny the single mass flywheel but I get very little chatter from it unless it extremely hot or been idling for a prolonged amount of time ,
@Rob C drove it and think he was surprised at just how quiet and easy to use it was

Smirky · May 30, 2016

S3Alex said:
As Smirky will confirm,its probably lighter than the Sachs to be honest.

Mine was the first Spec Stg3+ on here,and has lasted for over 40k miles at not less than 450lbs,and over the last year at around 550lbs,without issues until now when it's finally beginning to slip.

A lot lighter than the Sachs I tried on a friends stage 1

XFi · May 30, 2016

prt57 said:
Hi there,
Please could you tell us how many miles your car has done before your upgrade to 2+? Just wondering how long my clutch will last!

Cheers,
Peter

I had mine changed at about 84K and I had been at Stage 1 for about 10K of that. The clutch was still fine although I did have it slip twice but then it never slipped again. I simply changed it as I did plan to go further power wise.

Rob C · May 30, 2016

Smirky said:
I don't find the spec any harder to use than the standard clutch to be honest , a lot of people are put off ny the single mass flywheel but I get very little chatter from it unless it extremely hot or been idling for a prolonged amount of time ,
@Rob C drove it and think he was surprised at just how quiet and easy to use it was

I was definately impressed with it and if I was to go Stage 2+ or TTE420 I wouldn't hesitate to go down this route!

Smirky · May 30, 2016

Rob C said:
I was definately impressed with it and if I was to go Stage 2+ or TTE420 I wouldn't hesitate to go down this route!

You mean when you go 2+ lol

Rob C · May 31, 2016

@S3Alex Do you know what the differences are between the Spec Stage 2+ and Stage 3+ other than torque rating? Do you think both would have the same driving characteristics as the Stage 3+?

S3Alex · May 31, 2016

Rob C said:
@S3Alex Do you know what the differences are between the Spec Stage 2+ and Stage 3+ other than torque rating? Do you think both would have the same driving characteristics as the Stage 3+?

To be honest all I can offer is an opinion that as it's a full-face clutch,it should be pretty easy to use around town etc,as with the 3+.

I've used paddle clutches before and liked the positive feel etc,but not the town or hill-start characteristics,which are not user friendly.

Smirky · May 31, 2016

Rob C said:
@S3Alex Do you know what the differences are between the Spec Stage 2+ and Stage 3+ other than torque rating? Do you think both would have the same driving characteristics as the Stage 3+?

I spoke to spec and they said same weight etc as 3+ how ever it does need some bedding in where as the 3+ doesn't

Zakir883 · May 31, 2016

Hookmonster said:
59

59k mate.. perfect as standard.. but 380 torque made it slip instantly

I'm running stage 1 at 290bhp and 325lbs I'm looking to buy the helix too but will buy before going to stage 2 lol

Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk

Zakir883 · May 31, 2016

S3Alex said:
Helix are usually quite shy about revealing their torque ratings.
Some people swear by them,and some do not,as with most clutches.

I used a Sachs organic and DMF up to 440lbs of torque,which is beyond it's nominal 400lb rating,so not a bad result,but as with all organic clutches,it will not tolerate a lot of abuse,as the organic compound tends to overheat and break up.

After the Sachs eventually gave up at that figure,i switched to a Spec Stg3+ carbon-metallic clutch with SMF,and for anyone thinking of a high torque,SMF setup,I would recommend this above anything else.

The advantage of this is it's a full face clutch,i.e.not a paddle type,and is much easier to use around town,whilst maintaining a reasonably stock feel,and can handle up to 570lbs without trouble.
Mine has finally started to slip at that sort of level after 40k miles,so you can see how tough it is.

POWAAAAAH!

Sent from my SM-G925F using Tapatalk

Samy boi · Jun 1, 2016

S3Alex said:
I used a Sachs organic and DMF up to 440lbs of torque,which is beyond it's nominal 400lb rating,so not a bad result,but as with all organic clutches,it will not tolerate a lot of abuse,as the organic compound tends to overheat and break up.

Any recco on a good DMF Alex? I'll be going for the APR stage 2+ soonish and want the sachs organic, just a case of getting my other bits sorted soon.

Thanks

S3Alex · Jun 1, 2016

The LUK DMF is what is usually used.

Worked fine on mine.

Hookmonster · Jun 1, 2016

Ok booked in with Aks in bedford for helix organic and luk DMF inc slave cylinder, bolts, uprated pressure plate good for 420 torque...

Ill keep you updated on how it goes

Cambaines · Jun 1, 2016

Hookmonster said:
Ok booked in with Aks in bedford for helix organic and luk DMF inc slave cylinder, bolts, uprated pressure plate good for 420 torque...

Ill keep you updated on how it goes

What was the cost of this without labour mate?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Hookmonster · Jun 1, 2016

Pm sent mate

kash_v · Jun 1, 2016

Hookmonster said:
Pm sent mate

Could you drop me a PM too mate? Are they sourcing the parts?

@S3Alex You ever heard/read up on SMF conversions damaging the gearbox/crank at all? Just researched a little and few forums mention it.

Hookmonster · Jun 1, 2016

kash_v said:
Could you drop me a PM too mate? Are they sourcing the parts?

@S3Alex You ever heard/read up on SMF conversions damaging the gearbox/crank at all? Just researched a little and few forums mention it.

Pm sent mate

S3Alex · Jun 1, 2016

kash_v said:
Could you drop me a PM too mate? Are they sourcing the parts?

@S3Alex You ever heard/read up on SMF conversions damaging the gearbox/crank at all? Just researched a little and few forums mention it.

Well.....both of my Cosworths obviously had SMF clutches.
The S3 has run on this clutch for over 40k miles and the crank hasn't disintegrated......so probably not.

Hookmonster · Jun 25, 2016

Clutch goes in this week.. r tech the week after to get stuff turned up... lol

Ill keep you all informed on how the helix copes.. alex at Aks says no poblem..

Fingers crossed

MICHAEL PARKER · Jun 25, 2016

Cambaines said:
What was the cost of this without labour mate?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I would like to know the labour cost as well as i will be going down this road shortly .

prt57 · Jun 25, 2016

PM me as I have enquired at AKS and so I know the total cost for a Helix + dmf + fitting
Peter

MICHAEL PARKER · Jun 25, 2016

prt57 said:
PM me as I have enquired at AKS and so I know the total cost for a Helix + dmf + fitting
Peter

Ok Peter, if you could let me know that would be great , i emailed them this morning ref the RS4 fuel valve after your post on my thread .

Hookmonster · Jun 30, 2016

Helix organic / luk dmf fitted today at aks in bedford..
Taking it steady for a couple of hundred miles this week to bed her in..
Doesnt feel much different from oem.. a little heavier if i was sitting with the clutch pedal down but not by a huge amount..

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