Insurance Advice Needed

[S3GCN]

Hi all, if anyone has any knowledge of insurance I could do with some advice.

At weekend during storm Erik my neighbours 8’x6’ metal garden store blew over the fence from their garden into our drive, during which it whacked my front wing which is now goosed.

Neighbour initially said they’d pay for the repair but having received the two quotes I have obtained, the lowest of which was £700 they have changed their tune and want to claim on their house insurance. So I’ll have to make the claim on my car insurance.

I’m in a rage again now as I expect that’s going to push my premiums up going forward. In 22 years of driving I’ve never had a claim so I’m not sure what to do for the best now. If I claim will it affect me going forward? I have protected no claims but I’ve read a non fault claim puts your insurance up by 30-50%. I don’t want to phone my insurance to ask them as they will then know about the issue so it’ll be on file.

Cheers

 

[Adam14]

Wouldn't have thought with your age it'd affect your premium as much as us younger people. Can you not claim on your house insurance as well? (Not that familiar with the particulars of that).

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[TYb]

I’m not 100% sure but think they can initiate the claim through their house insurance without you commencing the claim via yours.

You’ll have duty to notify yours though.

 

[S3GCN]

I had wondered about house insurance but I’ll get shafted on that then rather than my car insurance.

Supposedly the neighbour has spoken to their house insurer and they aren’t interested about the damage to my car, they’ve said I’ll have to claim on mine and they’ll recover through the house insurance.

Could the house insurance refuse to pay out though I wonder?

 

[RichardT]

You need to talk to your insurance company. As said above, you will have to notify them anyway. If the neighbours insurance pays it should not affect your payments at all.

 

[Mikeso51]

Surely this is a straightforward claim against your neighbour’s insurance. You are in no way to blame.

I would contact them directly. I can’t see why you should need to claim on your own motor insurance.

Mike

 

[Kingfisher]

So what's wrong with them claiming on their insurance and giving you the money.
Or you claiming directly against them - presumably they then 'pass' it over to their insurance..../ but do try and keep your registration off all paperwork ;

( my experience, I claimed against somebody - some years ago - following similar damage - but somehow, probably the other party, it got back to my car insurance company and they tried hard to put up my insurance because of " my accident". I wasn't driving, I wasn't even on the highway......

 

[RichardT]

I had wondered about house insurance but I’ll get shafted on that then rather than my car insurance.

Supposedly the neighbour has spoken to their house insurer and they aren’t interested about the damage to my car, they’ve said I’ll have to claim on mine and they’ll recover through the house insurance.

Could the house insurance refuse to pay out though I wonder?

Presumable the neighbours claim will be via the public liability clause in their insurance.
Bottom line your neighbour is responsible for the damage. If their insurance won’t accept liability, then your insurance company will claim from them personally.

 

[AlS3BE]

Unfortunately even a non fault claim would affect your premiums going forward.
The way it works is if you have made a claim before then you are statistically more likely to make another whether it’s fault or not.
My wife was hit by an idiot a few years ago and it bumped up my premiums by around 10-20%.
The proper procedure will be you need to make a claim with your own car insurance and they will pursue the other party. Their insurance will try their best to avoid paying like them all.

 

[PhatGit]

Had a windscreen and £25k unrecovered theft claim on my insurance when a pillock drove in to the side of the new car last May. Renewal premium went up by £2.
If fully recovered it should have minimal impact on your premium.

 

[S3GCN]

My neighbour supposedly rang her insurance a couple of nights ago expecting them to sort the damage to my car on their home insurance policy but whe they said about sending an assessor out and she said she could arrange for the car to be there they asked why they would want to see the car, that would need to be handled by my insurance.

I’m annoyed about this for lots of reasons now, but I’m angry at myself for not thinking to get photos of the store upside down in my drive. When I was steaming mad at 6:00am on Saturday morning when I found it it didn’t cross my mind. My neighbour and I spent an hour dismantling it to stop it doing any more damage. There is no proof it was ever here and did the damage, which makes me think it more likely their insurance will refuse to pay out. Then I’ll be in a worse position still as I’ll be out of pocket for my excess and have the claim which hasn’t been recovered.

All I have is my dashcam footage in which the store is visible over the top of the fence when I pulled into the drive on Friday and was gone when I used the car on Saturday.

I’m considering just paying for the repair myself.

 

[Adam14]

My neighbour supposedly rang her insurance a couple of nights ago expecting them to sort the damage to my car on their home insurance policy but whe they said about sending an assessor out and she said she could arrange for the car to be there they asked why they would want to see the car, that would need to be handled by my insurance.

I’m annoyed about this for lots of reasons now, but I’m angry at myself for not thinking to get photos of the store upside down in my drive. When I was steaming mad at 6:00am on Saturday morning when I found it it didn’t cross my mind. My neighbour and I spent an hour dismantling it to stop it doing any more damage. There is no proof it was ever here and did the damage, which makes me think it more likely their insurance will refuse to pay out. Then I’ll be in a worse position still as I’ll be out of pocket for my excess and have the claim which hasn’t been recovered.

All I have is my dashcam footage in which the store is visible over the top of the fence when I pulled into the drive on Friday and was gone when I used the car on Saturday.

I’m considering just paying for the repair myself.

Is there any paint transfer from your car on the store (or whatever the item was)? This may help prove that the store was the item that damaged the car.

I'd still go insurance route, not ideal I appreciate.

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[RichardT]

If both you and your neighbour say that the store caused the damage then I’m not sure why the insurance would think you are lying.
But I can understand the neighbour’s insurance saying that your car insurance would be expected to handle the claim - that is what comprehensive insurance is for.
There is always lots of talk about “claiming off the other’s insurance” , but the standard process is that your insurance company does that.
If you pay for your own repair I should think your neighbour would feel pretty bad

 

[surfer8210]

Your insurance company will contact the other insurance company and ensure that your insurance company won’t have to pay for it.
They in effect become your liaison.
That’s how it worked for me anyway, no raise in my premiums.
Your neighbors insurance company sounds like they’re coming up with BS excuses and giving you both the run around. As long as your not making the “claim” through your insurance your rates shouldn’t be affected at all.
Good luck.


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[S3GCN]

Is there any paint transfer from your car on the store (or whatever the item was)? This may help prove that the store was the item that damaged the car.

We had to pull to store completely to pieces to get rid of it. The neighbour put the bits in his summer house but I expect he’s got shut of it by now.

Your insurance company will contact the other insurance company and ensure that your insurance company won’t have to pay for it.
They in effect become your liaison.
That’s how it worked for me anyway, no raise in my premiums.
Your neighbors insurance company sounds like they’re coming up with BS excuses and giving you both the run around. As long as your not making the “claim” through your insurance your rates shouldn’t be affected at all.
Good luck.

I’m not sure I understand your meaning there, surely when I contact my insurance it will then become a claim, won’t it?

 

[RichardT]

Not necessarily. You can do a report only. This is what you have to do anyway if you pay for the repair yourself.

 

[HertS3]

Let me put my two pence in...I have been working in commercial insurance for over 10 years and I deal with claims daily.

Firstly, the damage to your vehicle should be covered under your neighbour's public liability insurance. I have seen instances before where a motor vehicle has been damaged and the car owner has submitted invoices for repair along with a covering letter directly to the owner of the property from where the damage emanated. In most circumstances, the car owners have gone through their own insurers and provided details of the third party they feel is to blame, insurers are obviously very keen to recover their outlay so they will gladly do so. Bear in mind, however, that your policy excess may not be recovered by the insurer and they would leave this up to you to recover.

Sounds like your neighbour is a decent person and I don't think that they would contest liability as you spent time together removing the offending article off your car.

I would suggest if you want to go down this route (pursuing directly with your neighbour's insurer) that you obtain at least two quotations (to ensure competitiveness) and then either go ahead with the repair using the cheaper quotation, or send it off to your neighbour's insurers and see what they say.

I would highly suggest that you contact your own insurer and let them know that your car has been damaged and that you are pursuing a direct recovery from your neighbour's insurers, you don't want to be left in a position where they find out that you didn't disclose this incident (insurers log claims on central databases, so your insurer may well pick this up at renewal and you could be in some bother over non-disclosure, or worse, this comes out when you want to claim and your policy is voided).

As I say, most people would put a claim under their own insurer and provide the third party's details - the choice is yours. I know it's frustrating that you have use your own insurance for a matter that isn't your fault (it could also be argued it's not even your neighbour's fault), we get customers with the exact same complaint every day. It's the way insurance works - it's there to protect the policyholder against unforeseen circumstances, the 'blame' is not always a factor, though you may well have good recovery prospects if your neighbour admits liability.

Hope this helps.

 

[Sparks43]

Let me put my two pence in...I have been working in commercial insurance for over 10 years and I deal with claims daily.

Firstly, the damage to your vehicle should be covered under your neighbour's public liability insurance. I have seen instances before where a motor vehicle has been damaged and the car owner has submitted invoices for repair along with a covering letter directly to the owner of the property from where the damage emanated. In most circumstances, the car owners have gone through their own insurers and provided details of the third party they feel is to blame, insurers are obviously very keen to recover their outlay so they will gladly do so. Bear in mind, however, that your policy excess may not be recovered by the insurer and they would leave this up to you to recover.

Sounds like your neighbour is a decent person and I don't think that they would contest liability as you spent time together removing the offending article off your car.

I would suggest if you want to go down this route (pursuing directly with your neighbour's insurer) that you obtain at least two quotations (to ensure competitiveness) and then either go ahead with the repair using the cheaper quotation, or send it off to your neighbour's insurers and see what they say.

I would highly suggest that you contact your own insurer and let them know that your car has been damaged and that you are pursuing a direct recovery from your neighbour's insurers, you don't want to be left in a position where they find out that you didn't disclose this incident (insurers log claims on central databases, so your insurer may well pick this up at renewal and you could be in some bother over non-disclosure, or worse, this comes out when you want to claim and your policy is voided).

As I say, most people would put a claim under their own insurer and provide the third party's details - the choice is yours. I know it's frustrating that you have use your own insurance for a matter that isn't your fault (it could also be argued it's not even your neighbour's fault), we get customers with the exact same complaint every day. It's the way insurance works - it's there to protect the policyholder against unforeseen circumstances, the 'blame' is not always a factor, though you may well have good recovery prospects if your neighbour admits liability.

Hope this helps.

I also work in insurance and I'm afraid he will have to claim off his car insurance with very little chance of a recovery from the neighbours home insurance because unless he had previously noticed that the neighbours garden store was unsafe and had mentioned this to them then they will deemed not to be negligent - They can't be held responsible if everything was ok and then it just got caught in a storm - It's the same as a neighbours tile falling off their roof which hadn't previously been loose

He also can't claim off his own home insurance because you can't be your own third party

Sorry I know this sounds harsh but you have to prove negligence on the other party which like you said could well be argued that it's not the neighbours fault either

 

[Sparks43]

Unfortunately even a non fault claim would affect your premiums going forward.
The way it works is if you have made a claim before then you are statistically more likely to make another whether it’s fault or not.
My wife was hit by an idiot a few years ago and it bumped up my premiums by around 10-20%.
The proper procedure will be you need to make a claim with your own car insurance and they will pursue the other party. Their insurance will try their best to avoid paying like them all.

My job is insurance but this is one thing that really annoys me because stats can show whatever you want them to and I don't see why you would be more likely to have a claim - Unfortunately this is the industry now - Lots of insurers at least don't reduce your bonus if it's a non fault claim these days

 

[HertS3]

@Sparks43 agreed, I did allude that it could be argued that the neighbour wasn't negligent, storms happen which dislodge things etc.

Are you an insurer or broker?

 

[Sparks43]

@Sparks43 agreed, I did allude that it could be argued that the neighbour wasn't negligent, storms happen which dislodge things etc.

Are you an insurer or broker?

Broker now but did work for an insurance company 20+ years ago and my wife works in commercial claims

 

[HertS3]

Excellent - I'm a broker (but used to be MGA so had underwriting authority)

 

[S3GCN]

Bear in mind, however, that your policy excess may not be recovered by the insurer and they would leave this up to you to recover.

I also work in insurance and I'm afraid he will have to claim off his car insurance with very little chance of a recovery from the neighbours home insurance because unless he had previously noticed that the neighbours garden store was unsafe and had mentioned this to them then they will deemed not to be negligent - They can't be held responsible if everything was ok and then it just got caught in a storm - It's the same as a neighbours tile falling off their roof which hadn't previously been loose

I don’t what is the best course of action here. From the sounds of things I’m getting shafted! I’ll notify my insurance who will claim from next doors house insurance, not be able to recover my excess and end up with increased premiums for my efforts. I can fully understand why people don’t bother with insurance as you pay a fortune and still lose out.

I might as well pay for it myself by the sounds of things.

 

[Mikeso51]

I realise that common sense sometimes goes out of the window where insurance is concerned, but I still find it fundamentally wrong that you should have to bear any costs. What if the car had not been insured? The damage, accidental or otherwise, would have still been the responsibility of the neighbour or his insurer. Or am I missing something?

 

[Sparks43]

I realise that common sense sometimes goes out of the window where insurance is concerned, but I still find it fundamentally wrong that you should have to bear any costs. What if the car had not been insured? The damage, accidental or otherwise, would have still been the responsibility of the neighbour or his insurer. Or am I missing something?

Unfortunately you have to prove that the neighbour is negligent otherwise it's not fair on them either.

Example: Fence all broken, only a matter of time before something happens- fair enough they've not resolved it and then bang hits your car they are negligent.

However tiles on your roof all secure but a big storm shifts them and they hit your neighbours car - Why should your insurance policy pay out - You've maintained them correctly and therefore are not negligent

Everybody wants to have ago at insurers, they don't pay out and I know it's my job and this seems unfair but sometimes things happen that just aren't someone else's fault and this is why you take out insurance to cover these situations as well

 

[Sparks43]

I don’t what is the best course of action here. From the sounds of things I’m getting shafted! I’ll notify my insurance who will claim from next doors house insurance, not be able to recover my excess and end up with increased premiums for my efforts. I can fully understand why people don’t bother with insurance as you pay a fortune and still lose out.

I might as well pay for it myself by the sounds of things.

You're not getting shafted you have to show that your neighbour has been negligent - Didn't secure it maybe, left it with the door open and nothing in it so light and this could easily happen

Best thing is you need to get your car repaired - Report to your car insurer, get it repaired and pay your excess and give them your neighbours details and they can try and recover - You will probably have legal cover/uninsured loss recovery as an add on your car insurance and they will go after your excess for you

With regards to premium increase even if a recovery is made unfortunately that's part of the insurance world I don't agree with but you need the car repaired

I'm just trying to explain the situation and to make you aware that you may not make a recovery, but this is exactly why you insure - If you go with your point of I understand why people don't insure then they would potentially be looking at nothing now whereas at least you will get your car repaired.

I know it sounds harsh but sometimes things just cannot be blamed on someone else - That is life I'm afraid

 

[KenL]

Even if your insurance ends up paying if you are paying extra to have protected no claims then surely your no claims is protected?

If not, is that not fraud from the insurance company?

 

[Sparks43]

Even if your insurance ends up paying if you are paying extra to have protected no claims then surely your no claims is protected?

If not, is that not fraud from the insurance company?

You are protected from your no claims bonus being reduced say from 5 years to 3 years thereby still enjoying a 65% discount rather than 50% but that doesn't stop the insurer applying a loading for the claim - And no it's not fraud and is explained in the policy wording against protected bonus or general terms

Some insurers offer Guaranteed bonus so you never lose your no claims bonus regardless of how many claims you have but a loading will still apply - The advantage being that a larger discount off a larger premium is better than the other way - Reduce bonus to 50% but claims loading also still applies

 

[S3GCN]

You're not getting shafted you have to show that your neighbour has been negligent - Didn't secure it maybe, left it with the door open and nothing in it so light and this could easily happen

Best thing is you need to get your car repaired - Report to your car insurer, get it repaired and pay your excess and give them your neighbours details and they can try and recover - You will probably have legal cover/uninsured loss recovery as an add on your car insurance and they will go after your excess for you

With regards to premium increase even if a recovery is made unfortunately that's part of the insurance world I don't agree with but you need the car repaired

I'm just trying to explain the situation and to make you aware that you may not make a recovery, but this is exactly why you insure - If you go with your point of I understand why people don't insure then they would potentially be looking at nothing now whereas at least you will get your car repaired.

I know it sounds harsh but sometimes things just cannot be blamed on someone else - That is life I'm afraid

So if I read you correctly it’s probably unlikely that they’ll be able to recover my excess and then I’ll have five years of increased premiums due to my claim?

 

[Sparks43]

So if I read you correctly it’s probably unlikely that they’ll be able to recover my excess and then I’ll have five years of increased premiums due to my claim?

If your insurers recover their outlay then there would be no reason that you wouldn't recover your excess, however I think its unlikely that you will be able to claim against your neighbour unless he admits that the Garden Store was unsafe in some way, which he may have done because you said they want to send an assessor round which actually is a positive start

Obviously I don't want to get your hopes up but it's worth going down that route.

I can't comment on how long you would be charged increased premiums but you do have protected bonus so you won't lose your bonus

 

[Kingfisher]

tongue in cheek ………… surely this is an act of God ( Him being in charge of weather etc...)
and unlikely therefore to be covered by any insurance

OK OK I'll get my coat......

 

[Mikeso51]

Rather straying off the original topic, but maybe relevant. My wife was involved in a no-fault accident in a multi-lane city centre road. The chap concerned hadn’t checked if anyone was alongside, and changed lane, colliding with her. He was full of remorse, admitted full liability, and the claim was paid with no loss of ncb. However, when renewal time came around she had a 10% loading for having been involved in an accident. When pressed for an explanation, the argument was that she had placed herself in a situation (being alongside another car in multi-lane city centre traffic) where an accident was more likely than for someone who was more cautious and anticipated other drivers unpredictably changing lane, and therefore she was an above average risk! No amount of arguing would change the companies position, so I changed insurers (and as it happened got a lower premium than the previous year).

 

[S32B]

Presumable the neighbours claim will be via the public liability clause in their insurance.
Bottom line your neighbour is responsible for the damage. If their insurance won’t accept liability, then your insurance company will claim from them personally.

Exactly what I was going to say

 

[Sparks43]

Exactly what I was going to say

You still have to prove negligence - there’s enough comments on here about cost of insurance, imagine what it will cost if they pay for everything

I do feel for the guy on here but sometimes things happen that just aren’t someone else’s fault - sorry to break that news to everyone

 

[surfer8210]

We had to pull to store completely to pieces to get rid of it. The neighbour put the bits in his summer house but I expect he’s got shut of it by now.



I’m not sure I understand your meaning there, surely when I contact my insurance it will then become a claim, won’t it?

You are not filing a claim with your insurance company. In other words you’re not asking them to pay.
You are asking for their assistance to contact the neighbors insurance company and help you expedite your claim with the homeowners insurance company. I’ve gone this route and my agent was very helpful. They contacted the offenders insurance company and my claim was paid.
Your neighbors insurance company is liable and will pay this claim whether or not a previous unsafe condition was brought to their attention or not.
They are still liable, if a roof tile fell off and damaged your property they would be liable also.
Their property caused damage to yours that’s a proven fact. This shouldn’t be as difficult as others are making this out to be, in fact; its rather cut and dried.


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[Kingfisher]

and my argument would also be, if there were to be any difficulties, that it couldn't have been safely/sufficiently secured - otherwise it wouldn't have blown over in such a way.

 

[Sparks43]

You are not filing a claim with your insurance company. In other words you’re not asking them to pay.
You are asking for their assistance to contact the neighbors insurance company and help you expedite your claim with the homeowners insurance company. I’ve gone this route and my agent was very helpful. They contacted the offenders insurance company and my claim was paid.
Your neighbors insurance company is liable and will pay this claim whether or not a previous unsafe condition was brought to their attention or not.
They are still liable, if a roof tile fell off and damaged your property they would be liable also.
Their property caused damage to yours that’s a proven fact. This shouldn’t be as difficult as others are making this out to be, in fact; its rather cut and dried.


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Why are they liable then? Because they own some property and it’s caused damage that they couldn’t have known would - Sorry been down this road before with a tile and insurers didn’t pay because I’m sorry to say this again you have to be negligent

Plain and simple that’s the basics of insurance - copy from insurance site confirming what I said

Its not the insurers getting out of paying.
Public liability cover is designed to pay out for your liabilities to your neighbours / visitors etc under English (or Scottish) law.
Your neighbour has to prove you were negligent and that they suffered a loss as a result. They can prove a loss, but they would be hard pushed to prove you were negligent if your roof was in good repair prior to the storms.

 

[Sparks43]

and my argument would also be, if there were to be any difficulties, that it couldn't have been safely/sufficiently secured - otherwise it wouldn't have blown over in such a way.

So you put your wheelie bin out like you’re supposed to a storm occurs and it hits your neighbours car - are you liable?

 

[Kingfisher]

But this wasn't a wheelie bin it was an 8 x 6 metal shed/store.

My personal style is that if it's likely to be a hassle and under £500 I'd just pay for it.
£1k I'd think harder about it -
but life can sometimes be a bitch and then you die!

 

[Sparks43]

But this wasn't a wheelie bin it was an 8 x 6 metal shed/store.

My personal style is that if it's likely to be a hassle and under £500 I'd just pay for it.
£1k I'd think harder about it -
but life can sometimes be a bitch and then you die!

Which makes even more unlikely to move on it’s own without anything in it but a high storm category anything can happen but that doesn’t make the neighbour necessarily negligent

It really is just bad luck sometimes

I’ve been doing this for over 30 years and it’s horrible having to tell clients when things like this happen but like you say life can be a bitch sometimes and this is why you make sure you have your own insurance in place to
cover you