Another hybrid conversion thread....

Byzan A4 said:
OMG

Very good post Bill.

Has issam been pointed towards this post?

My £100 Chinese cheapy log mani is better made than this £400 manim it's unbelieveable
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I must admit, it's disappointed everyone involved in this project.

I will NEVER buy another 034 product based on this experience.

Ever.
 
s3dave said:
It seems to me they want to disassociate with the manifold. but not the money people are paying for these.
They have obviously spent alot of cash designing it and skimpt out where it matters... on the quality of the metals.
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The thing is, a cast material change may well be whats required to fix the issue, but shrinkage rates post casting on another material may nett some other issues as yet unknown. It has porosity issues as is on the existing material, so gating and or the whole process used may be suspect. I have been thru casting sagas's an iterations in my day job previously, and its not uncommon teething issues, BUT, the material chosen looks to be as much use as a chocolate teapot. 30-40amps on my tig and this stuff was falling away like melted cheese, and outgassing/fizzing as the contaminants came to the surface. the Oe manifold I tried as a comparison had no such phenomena and needed higher amps to melt/weld. Crude test, but confirms my belief.

there are materials like what I googled below which are designed for the high temp dutys they will see.

http://www.cbmm.com.br/portug/sources/techlib/science_techno/table_content/sub_5/images/pdfs/053.pdf

Other comment on the replacement shows a build up of sand on the mould from the previous cast on the webs, which to me shows there are cleaning issues of the core at the foundry if this is not checked. All symptums at face value of a very cheap foundry process being employed.
 
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badger5 said:
The thing is, a cast material change may well be whats required to fix the issue, but shrinkage rates post casting on another material may nett some other issues as yet unknown. It has porosity issues as is on the existing material, so gating and or the whole process used may be suspect. I have been thru casting sagas's an iterations in my day job previously, and its not uncommon teething issues, BUT, the material chosen looks to be as much use as a chocolate teapot. 30-40amps on my tig and this stuff was falling away like melted cheese, and outgassing/fizzing as the contaminants came to the surface. the Oe manifold I tried as a comparison had no such phenomena and needed higher amps to melt/weld. Crude test, but confirms my belief.

there are materials like what I googled below which are designed for the high temp dutys they will see.

http://www.cbmm.com.br/portug/source...s/pdfs/053.pdf

Other comment on the replacement shows a build up of sand on the mould from the previous cast on the webs, which to me shows there are cleaning issues of the core at the foundry if this is not checked. All symptums at face value of a very cheap foundry process being employed.
Click to expand...
AKA Monkey metal...
Ive used brass rods in the past for cracked cast, then set in bucket of sand, as ambient air cools it down to quick, but you are not going to get anywhere if the thickness is all over the place, cast is to brittle for temp fluctuations on the same piece.
 
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audi upgrades
What an absolute load of crap, and to think a lot of us (myself included), were ready to buy these up. Why would they risk their reputation for the sake of a few crappy manifolds, crazy

Good investigation Guys, interesting read
 
s3dave said:
AKA Monkey metal...
Ive used brass rods in the past for cracked cast, then set in bucket of sand, as ambient air cools it down to quick, but you are not going to get anywhere if the thickness is all over the place, cast is to brittle for temp fluctuations on the same piece.
Click to expand...

thats good info for the future, not that repairing new cast manifolds is a good thing of course - lol
 
Barks said:
What an absolute load of crap, and to think a lot of us (myself included), were ready to buy these up. Why would they risk their reputation for the sake of a few crappy manifolds, crazy

Good investigation Guys, interesting read
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They (INA/034) have been very cagey about information on these for months now..... but in the same token also been selling them to folks.
*maybe* and this is pure speculation, is that the first batch was commissioned, of a qty of 30-50 or so, and initial samples let loose to some folks for "testing" (although only one set of test data has ever been seen, from the end user, not 034/INA) and subsequent to this, the balance of the batch have been sold on... *maybe* this is a batch problem off the 1st set, and the others are being sold off to recoupe some $ (if) the product is actually to frought with issue to continue. I would hope not, and INA sending a replacement (albeit a poor looking example as you can see) is a sign of supporting the product + their customers importantly.

Its not the £350-£400 cost of the manifold its the fitting costs and inconvenience which far outweighs the cost of failure. A replacement manifold does nothing to cover costs of having to refit one, and lets face it what guarantee is there it wont happen again..? Its not like the replacement looks like anything other than a 2nd rate cast off (no punn intended)

so close, yet so far..........
 
badger5 said:
Its not the £350-£400 cost of the manifold its the fitting costs and inconvenience which far outweighs the cost of failure. A replacement manifold does nothing to cover costs of having to refit one, and lets face it what guarantee is there it wont happen again..? Its not like the replacement looks like anything other than a 2nd rate cast off (no punn intended)
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This is precisely where my gripe lies. It's not just a bad product, it's a bad product that is extremely hard work to fit. To go through the hassle of fitting, and then have to go through it all again isn't a good thing - especially if paying a third party to do so.
 
Adding to this, whilst I am having a moan, I am thoroughly underwhelmed with JBS's customer service.

I have emailed and called requesting details of, and a firm date for their High Flow K04 manifold.

Both appear to have been shunned, as there was no-one available to talk to, and my email appears to have been completely ignored.

Not ideal. :think:
 
DaveA3 said:
tsr one too pricey mate?
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Yes dude, I simply cannot justify that amount of money for a manifold.

I can have a JBS Hi Flow Mani and WMI, and fit them for the ~£700 (£720 after VAT goes up) + delivery that the TSR costs.
 
Extremely useful post Bill, it can't wait to see 034's response, they are oh so cagey about this product and what a ball'O'***** the mani turned out to be.Interestingly enough when i fitted the 034 Mani i did expierence this Tink Tink sound after some power runs which i though was strange as i never heard the OEM mani doing this, at the time i had a lot of hardware fitted so i put it done to this.
Are you saying a cast manifold should not have the tink tink sound or as we know it now the tink tink dead rattle.
 
Even my mani looks like it's had a little patch up tbh, it hasn't crack (yet)! Don't think i've driven that hard to get it glowing though so time will tell.....one thing i have noticed is that there a lot more meat where it bolts down onto the turbo, which can only be a good thing

JBS mani
P5301216.jpg
 
Even for the photo sandip the JBS manifold looks of a 'better' quality material with fewer manufacturing defects. Time will tell !!
 
It does look a whole lot better but i guess the proof is in the pudding.Anyone fancy taking a blow torch to this one?LOL.
 
tsr one too pricey mate?
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I rang TSR they quoted me £650 + VAT + P&P almost £800 quid :sadlike:

thats just daqily light robbery!!
 
audi upgrades
problem is there are so many people out there that dont come on this site that will buy them same as with the xs power one its a real shame as the potential is there.
 
Speedy Steve said:
problem is there are so many people out there that dont come on this site that will buy them same as with the xs power one its a real shame as the potential is there.
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I totally agree, BUT, we can only do all we can to make the information as available as possible.

I did a Google search on the 034 manifold and Bill's post on SCN about the cracked on (034 Motorsport K04 manifold - Review or Cracked one - Page 2 - SEAT Cupra.net - SEAT Forum) came up as the second hit.

Hopefully people will do their research before buying one. If they don't research the product before buying, then they are the architect of their own destruction IMO.

I had the unfortunate experience of having the first one to go. Nobody knew before. Bummer.
 
I have sent another email to 034 currently, to another email address I had, and also asked INA for a refund on the manifold
 
badger5 said:
I have sent another email to 034 currently, to another email address I had, and also asked INA for a refund on the manifold
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If they issue a refund I will remove it from ebay immediately. I would fell 100% better about the whole situation, however I'm not holding my breath.

Thanks for taking the time to do that Bill. :thumbsup:
 
audi upgrades
RIGHT:

I am applying the brakes on this momentarily having spoken with 034 directly now. I have locked the SCN thread whilst discussions continue.

What I will say, is Javad Shadzi the owner of 034 is now aware of this, and will be responding to me. There is a US holiday these next 2 days (thursday/friday) however, so a full response may not be until next week, but something should be forthcoming by close of business today.

It is being taken seriously.

Lets see how it goes from here.
Over to 034 now.

thanks
bill
 
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Keep your head high welly! Hopefully it'll turn out better than you expected! Im here to lend a hand if you need! :) Good luck!
 
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