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With the new Golf/Scirocco/Leon R's on the horizon, is the S3 due a final 8P refresh?

Discussion in 'A3/S3/Sportback (8P Chassis)' started by warren_S5, Jan 15, 2010.

  1. warren_S5
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    warren_S5 Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Jan 15, 2010]
    It seems of late that every hot model in the VAG range is being given a run through the workshop, having a few choice parts added to it, then a sprinkling of 'R' badges.

    All the VAG hot hatches now appear to be using the S3's engine unashamedly, and the new Haldexed Golf R has even decided to trump the S3 in the price tag stakes and rock up at £37,500 fully loaded.

    So where does this leave the S3 in the scheme of things? Much better value than the pricey Golf R, but I've been quietly holding out to see if a swan-song 8P S3 special edition comes in to ride out the 8P range into 2010. So far despite hunting on most of the major car sites I've found nothing.

    I remember in 8L days when the Leon Cupra R got 210bhp, the S3 got hiked to 225bhp (not sure if there were any other spec changes to the S3 8L). With the new crop of VAG 'R' cars, the Focus RS, the new Megane R250, the revitalised Mazda 3 MPS, and BMW's 130i, call me naive, but I'd have expected something a little fruitier than a black edition to come out of the traps from Ingolstad's S division. Whilst I'm not looking for vulgarity or excess, surely it could do with a run out special edition?

    Any thoughts, or do you think this will be it until it's facelifted?
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  3. smudge_don
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    smudge_don Active Member

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    [Jan 15, 2010]
    I'm sure when the RS3 comes out (if it ever does) it will rock the hatchback world once again, the S3 is definately the daddy of luxury hot hatches.

    I don't think Audi will call it a day on their most popular car, it wouldn't make sense to stop producing it, and i'm sure that in a couple of years time they will bring out a new shape, new engine and be top of the table again ;)
    #2
  4. lake_m
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    lake_m Soon to be S3'd up.

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    [Jan 15, 2010]
    I think Audi will do a RS3 as a 'run out' model as they did with the B7 A4. Not sure whether they will give the current S3 any more power now - it's about run it's course in current guise.
    #3
  5. warren_S5
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    warren_S5 Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Jan 15, 2010]
    I was hoping to see one at the last motorshow, but it never materialized, maybe they had to get the A5 sportback launched first. Just wondered whether they could sustain any more RS platforms with the RS6 in production, the 5 imminent, the TT-RS just out, and a new 4 can't be far away. Fingers crossed I guess.
    #4
  6. lake_m
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    lake_m Soon to be S3'd up.

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    [Jan 15, 2010]
    There is just something so 'right' about the thought of a fully fledged RS model A3. It will be a huge shame if they miss this opportunity.
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  7. N8
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    N8 Kowalski Details VCDS Map User

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    [Jan 15, 2010]
    Lake M's RS4 = win :wub:
    #6
  8. paddy
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    paddy Audi=No fault code, no idea

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    [Jan 15, 2010]
    I think the A3 will soldier on but attention will turn to a Scirocco RS !! that woulk be my choice. Audi like to make quick normal understated cars. you could hardly accuse a S3 or S4 of looking sporty :yes: Manafacturers are turning back towards sporty coupe's again now, something we havnt seen since the old Celica. I watched an old fith gear the other night and they were testing a Lamborghini Murciélago, Verdict...it dosnt need 4wd and you couldn't fully turn off the ESP.. It does make you wonder why people say the A3 is so much better in the wet yet you don't see 4wd Ferrari's ...or F1 cars :yes:
    #7
  9. smudge_don
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    smudge_don Active Member

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    [Jan 15, 2010]
    To be honest though, my cousin has just bought a brand new Scirocco GT with the 210PS engine

    Yes it's nice to look at, but the interior is gash in my opinion, you can see **** ALL out of the rear 3 windows and i prefer the looks of the Audi, not to mention VW being the poor man's Audi ;)
    #8
  10. paddy
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    paddy Audi=No fault code, no idea

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    [Jan 15, 2010]
    Well i will;l not buy a Audi because i want to look richer than the guy in the Scirocco !!lol....

    If VW make a Scirocco that pee's on a S3 then it will sell in bucket loads regardless of the badge status.
    #9
  11. RicoS3
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    RicoS3 Sprint Blue is the new Ibis!

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    [Jan 15, 2010]
    I don't think we'll see an RS3 until the next model is launched. I read somewhere about GMBH only working on 3 RS models at any one time (RS6.com I think). That would
    be the RS6, TTRS and the long awaited RS5.

    In all honesty, the 2.5l engine in the TTRS will go into a host of the Audi models and likely into VW's as well. I think you'll get an RS3, but not until 2012 when the new A3 is rumoured. By that time the 2.5l will be in the A4 and A5.

    The Golf R will eventually have the same engine, but who knows what it'll be called, Golf R Plus or Golf R+?

    Mules of both the Golf and A3 with the 2.5l engine have been out and about, but nowhere near ready for production, so at least a couple of years IMO. Look at the B7 RS4, it was released just after the A4 was out, but ok, the RS5 hasn't. The RS6 was soon after the revised A6. RS models used to come out towards the end of a model's lifecycle, but I thought that Audi were trying to bring that in, release sooner, cash in more.

    My thoughts anyhoo.
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  12. A3Bash
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    A3Bash Member

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    [Jan 15, 2010]
    I think Audi will let S3 go on until sales go south because of the Golf R (if it's any good) and other hot hatches in the VAG range. Once the sales fall and the Golf R's had a few sales then a new Audi to top the hot hatch range will come out again (maybe with a different engine to make customers think the 2 cars are completely different).
    #11
  13. PaulAr
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    PaulAr S3 (8P)

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    [Jan 15, 2010]
    The S3 deserves to go out with a bang rather than a wimper.
    Its a great car but its been around for a bit so a bit, so a little bit of chassis and engine tweaking with some nice std options would be nice. Then price it similar to the Golf R and milk the last few pennies out of the 8P platform.
    Everyones a winner.:icon_thumright:

    Cheers
    Paul
    #12
  14. S.
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    S. Well-Known Member

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    [Jan 15, 2010]
    maybe it's going to be something like s3+ with more bhp and better suspension, and maybe lightweight wheels (like seat cupra copa edition, or megane cup edition) ??? (IMHO that would be a good way for audi to sell few more s3's on 8p basis)
    #13
  15. A4CAB
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    A4CAB Member

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    [Jan 15, 2010]
    After speaking to a friend at Audi it seems the Golf R is more expensive as the pound/euro rate is very different these days to the time when the S3 was launched. So the next S3 is expected to be more expensive.

    They expect the S3 to go end of life late this year with the new A3 out in 2011, S3 probably late 2012. The rumour is that the RS range may never touch the A3 range and the next S3 may just use the TTRS engine etc. Audi have also announced that S models will change and no longer look like S-Line models with chrome mirrors, this is great news. The old MK1 S3 looked visually different from the A3 but the MkII doesnt look any different apart from a few tweaks.

    Roll on the next model that will need to have plenty of new features to keep it ahead of the game, oh and more power. 19" wheel offering, ideally ali bonnet and wings to keep the weight down too.
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  16. PaulAr
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    PaulAr S3 (8P)

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    [Jan 15, 2010]
    Pretty odd comparison, Rear Wheel drive Ferraris and Rear Wheel biased 4WD Lambos `V` FWD hatchback.?

    Worth mentioning that most of us will be pretty average drivers and benefit from 4wd a lot more than a Tiff Needell/Jason Plato/Vicky `Squeeker` Henderson.

    To compare apples for apples, I have owned MK5 Golfs (on which the Rocco is closely related) and S3 back to back.
    And I can tell you that the 4WD makes a HUGE difference in the wet my friend.

    In fact a mate of mine has a Rocco (in white, best colour IMO) and its a brilliant car. We both had a drive out and swapped cars. His first comment was you can "really feel the grip from 4wd".

    I think that owning and driving a 4wd daily de-sensitizes us to the benefits you get from that set up, and if you drive a reasonably pokey fwd car, back to back you really do feel the difference.
    Honest.

    cheers
    Paul
    #15
  17. warren_S5
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    warren_S5 Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Jan 15, 2010]
    +1

    I drove a Leon Cupra (59 plate last week), and whilst for the money it was astoundingly good, you get back in the S3 (particularly on a wet day) and it earns its premium.

    When you think back the Golf Mk1 had the run out Campaign model
    The run out Golf Mk2 had the G60 supercharged & Rallye
    The Golf Mk3 / Corrado had the Storm edition & Anniversary
    The Mk4 Golf had the 25th Anniversary Ed
    The Leon Cupra R got the 225bhp power hike, oval electric mirrors etc..
    Even the S3 8L had a hike to compete with the TT lump

    It seems uncharacteristic to let the best S3 yet (dynamically, not visually; S-Line on steroids) go without something a bit interesting.
    #16
  18. Lee_R
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    Lee_R Active Member

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    [Jan 15, 2010]
    Have you seen the new Leon Cupra R? Doesnt look much different to the current cupra but had 20 more horses to match the S3. I'm suprised Skoda never hotted up the octavia and chose to stick with 200bhp to be honest, that would be a serious bargain!

    I know a bloke at work who just paid 16,200 for a brand new Octavia VRs. Working that out, he could have 2 of them for the price of a Golf R. Mad world!
    #17
  19. warren_S5
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    warren_S5 Moderator Staff Member Moderator VCDS Map User

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    [Jan 15, 2010]
    Only on web / in photos. Seems nice enough, but the XDS diff doesn't make up for Haldex.

    I went to the SEAT Press day at Farnborough in September 2009, and the latest cars have improved quite a bit, but they are getting pricey (Ibiza 1.4TSi Cupra Bocangera is over £20k specced up).

    Hence with all these cars knocking on 261PS, the S3 really could do with a lift.

    (Why don't the links show up on this new site?)
    #18
  20. cdco2
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    cdco2 New Member

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    [Jan 15, 2010]
    On the 4wd Lambo thoughts, for sumemr fun Ie for an S2 Elise in the garage, one of the sweetes handling mid engine rear drive cars you can get but its a git in the wet ./ slippery conditions therefore at that point I use the 4wd A3... half a second slower to 60 and alot les fun in the dry but loads quicker and safer in the wet.....
    #19
  21. paddy
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    paddy Audi=No fault code, no idea

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    [Jan 15, 2010]
    I'm sure you right Paul about the de-sensitize bit. I always find that with speed as well. Its very easy to get bored with a car when your used to it but having spent the last 3 weeks under 30mph because of the road conditions i just had a chance to open it up chasing an RS4 and an evo VII :) not surprisingly i lost but the old 3.2 put up a brave fight and i have to say that i chickened out before the car. suddenly after weeks of 30mph the old girl seems rather quick again. Off topic a bit but just been to look at a TTS but i have doubts because it seems cheap...08 plate 2800 miles only, all mod cons, heated leather, rnse etc DSG box. £30.8k ?
    Unfortunately i have a couple of bikes to sell first so if any one wants a 1975 Ducati 750SS @ £60k and a 1976 900SS @ £20k....feel free to PM me .
    #20
  22. auroan
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    auroan Active Member

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    [Jan 15, 2010]
    I think audi will be using the 5 pot engine from the TTRS in any new S tranverse lay'd out car. There's no way I can see the bean counters at VAG letting Audi develop a whole new engine for just one model.

    Oh and Audi's most best selling car is the A4 ... not the A3.
    #21
  23. Muneeb S3
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    Muneeb S3 Member

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    [Jan 15, 2010]
    I agree with PaulAr. Not really fair comparing the S3 to supercars. The fun factor & Performance you can get from the S3 compared to the value you spend on the car is amazing.

    I am stuck in 2 minds whether to modify the S3 or wait for the RS3 if it is ever going to come out. I wish Audi would confirm if they are going to bring it out but at the same time I am hoping they don't as it will devalue the current S3 and saves me buying the RS3!
    #22

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